Volts

In this episode, I dig into the just-released Global Electricity Review from the think tank Ember, with founder Bryony Worthington and lead author Nicolas Fulghum. Clean electricity surpassed 40 percent of global generation in 2024, driven by record solar deployment. We explore solar's rapid doubling, the pace of demand growth, and the way China's clean energy decisions shape global trends. This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.volts.wtf/subscribe

In this episode, I talk with Antoine Vagneur-Jones, head of clean energy, trade, and supply chains for BloombergNEF, about the messy world of global clean energy supply chains. We explore China's manufacturing dominance, the faltering quest to "onshore" production in Western countries, and why blanket tariffs often undermine the very goals they're supposed to achieve. This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.volts.wtf/subscribe

In this episode, I sit down with my old friend Sean Casten for a frank insider's take on the precarious state of clean energy policy amid our ongoing constitutional meltdown. We dive into the political knife fight over IRA tax credits (some Republicans support them), why transmission reform remains frustratingly partisan despite economic logic, and the fossil industry's fear of competition. Despite the dire political landscape, Casten makes a compelling case for why clean energy developers should keep building through the storm. This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.volts.wtf/subscribe

This is a free preview of a paid episode. To hear more, visit www.volts.wtfIn this month's mailbag, I rave about my new EV (despite my lifelong aversion to cars), explain why our political system would never permit a "decarbonization Trump", wrestle with solar geoengineering, and share my thoughts on why home batteries are so much pricier than the ones rolling around in our cars.

In this episode, I talk with Patrick Robbins of Public Power NY and Johanna Bozuwa of the Climate and Community Institute about New York's groundbreaking Build Public Renewables Act, which empowers the state's public utility to build clean energy at scale. We explore how this surprising legislative victory happened, the challenges of implementation, and why public ownership might be the key to making renewable energy both politically resilient and economically accessible. This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.volts.wtf/subscribe

In this episode, I'm joined by Toms Lumsden and Young (development manager and urban planner, respectively) to explore Blatchford, an ambitious sustainable community being built on the grounds of a former municipal airport in Edmonton, Alberta (Canada’s most conservative province). We dig into how this city-led, mixed-use development is creating a carbon-neutral community with pedestrian-first streets, a variety of housing forms, and a district energy system, right in the heart of oil country. This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.volts.wtf/subscribe

In this episode, I talk with Devrim Celal from Kraken about ensuring all our smart home energy devices can actually talk to the grid. We discuss how Mercury will certify devices to create reliability standards, preventing your fancy EV charger or heat pump from becoming useless if a manufacturer disappears while helping utilities manage load growth. This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.volts.wtf/subscribe

In this episode, Harvard Law's Eliza Martin and Ari Peskoe join me to unpack how data centers' skyrocketing electricity demand could leave ordinary customers subsidizing Big Tech's power bills. Most chilling is the potential alliance between utilities and tech giants that threatens to derail much-needed utility reforms while entrenching fossil-fueled infrastructure. This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.volts.wtf/subscribe

Why are housing and urban land use so central to climate policy? In this episode, I try to answer the question squarely, in dialogue with Matthew Lewis of California YIMBY. We discuss why EVs alone can't decarbonize transportation fast enough, how the climate-driven insurance crisis will bankrupt states, why the climate movement’s own internal NIMBYs are its greatest impediment, and when green philanthropists and leaders will finally catch up. This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.volts.wtf/subscribe

In this episode, I'm joined by Albert Gore to discuss the fate of the electric-vehicle tax credits under the Trump administration. Gore explains how the consumer credit provides a demand-side signal to complement the supply-side manufacturing credits, and why eliminating either would primarily benefit Chinese manufacturers. This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.volts.wtf/subscribe

This is a free preview of a paid episode. To hear more, visit www.volts.wtfIn this episode, I speak with Canary Media journalists Clare Fieseler and Julian Spector to assess the early impacts of Trump's executive orders on clean energy. We explore what's actually happening with offshore wind projects, manufacturing investments, and tax credits from the Inflation Reduction Act.

In this episode, I speak with Mustafa Amjad and Waqas Moosa about Pakistan's extraordinary solar boom -- nearly 30 gigawatts of panels have flooded into the country since 2020! We explore how punishingly high grid electricity prices combined with dramatically cheaper Chinese solar panels have created a bottom-up energy revolution that could become the blueprint for energy transitions worldwide. This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.volts.wtf/subscribe

In this episode, I'm joined by James Van Nostrand. He is the top utility regulator in Massachusetts, the first state to explicitly tell gas utilities to plan their own phase-out. We explore this complex transition, including the fate of existing gas infrastructure, the potential of networked geothermal as an alternative, and protections for both workers and ratepayers. This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.volts.wtf/subscribe

In this episode I'm joined by Annemarie Gray and Felicity Maxwell to discuss how the YIMBY movement is finally cracking the code on housing reform in major American cities. We examine the recent groundbreaking victories in New York City and Austin, exploring how pro-housing groups are learning from each other through networks like Welcoming Neighbors Network, and wrestle with the challenge of increasing housing supply while protecting existing communities. This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.volts.wtf/subscribe

At this live event in Austin, Texas, I was joined by Austin Energy executives Lisa Martin and Michael Enger to discuss how a progressive municipal utility charts a course to clean energy in Texas. We explore their multi-pronged approach to reaching 100 percent carbon-free electricity by 2035, from expanding distributed energy resources and battery storage to piloting first-of-its-kind geothermal technology. This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.volts.wtf/subscribe

In this episode, recorded at a live event in Houston, I catch up with Tim Latimer, the CEO of Fervo Energy. Since the last time I interviewed him, almost two years ago, the company has proven out its technology, reduced its costs, started construction on a large-scale commercial power plant in Utah, and signed contracts for many more. We discuss enhanced geothermal’s benefits, its momentum, and its bipartisan support. This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.volts.wtf/subscribe

In this episode, I talk with climate scientist Zeke Hausfather about how enhanced rock weathering (ERW) turbocharges a natural process to permanently store CO₂. We dig into how it profits from existing infrastructure, and the big questions around measuring and verifying the carbon captured. Zeke also explains why farmers might actually benefit from spreading all those rocks — and why ERW could become a key, if limited, piece of the broader climate puzzle. This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.volts.wtf/subscribe

In this episode, I speak with Harry Krejsa of Carnegie Mellon about why cybersecurity experts and clean energy advocates need to work together. Drawing from his White House experience, Krejsa explains how a modernized clean energy grid could actually help defend against China's cyberthreats — for the benefit of both peaceniks and natsec hawks. This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.volts.wtf/subscribe

Chris Hayes — author, MSNBC host, and previous guest on Volts — is just out with a new book, The Sirens Call, about the corrosive effects of the modern attention economy. In this episode, he and I dive deep into attention: what it is, when it became commodified, why it is so easy to steal, where industry is looking for new supplies, and how the harried and distracted can defend themselves from the onslaught. This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.volts.wtf/subscribe

In this episode, I talk with Erik Steimle of Rye Development about the new wave of "closed loop" pumped-hydro storage projects. Unlike traditional systems that rely on rivers and dams, these projects use two artificial reservoirs — providing reliable long-duration storage without impacting natural waterways. We explore the economics of these billion-dollar facilities, their 100+ year lifespans, and how they compare to lithium-ion storage. This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.volts.wtf/subscribe

I'm joined by Eric Gimon to discuss "energy parks" — essentially large-scale microgrids that combine renewable generation, storage, and industrial loads behind a single grid connection. We explore how this model could accelerate clean energy deployment while creating new economic opportunities, despite some complex regulatory hurdles. This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.volts.wtf/subscribe

In this episode, I talk with Matt Traldi, co-founder of Greenlight America, about the fight for clean energy at the local level. We discuss how small groups of opponents are successfully blocking renewable projects across the country, and how his organization is working to turn the tide by mobilizing local supporters and giving them the tools to advocate effectively at critical government meetings. This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.volts.wtf/subscribe

In this episode, I revisit thermal energy networks with HEET's Zeyneb Magavi and Eversource's Eric Bosworth. What was once a novel concept - replacing gas networks with shared ground-source heat pumps - is now being piloted across the country. We explore the technology's remarkable efficiency and its potential to revolutionize heating and cooling — and give gas utilities a second life as thermal utilities. This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.volts.wtf/subscribe

In this episode, I speak with Ben Brown, CEO of Renew Home, about the company's groundbreaking 1-gigawatt virtual power plant deal with NRG Energy in Texas. It will be the nation’s largest VPP, leveraging existing smart thermostats to control millions of residential HVAC systems. We discuss customer experience, data privacy, and the ability of VPPs to rapidly scale to meet rising electricity demand. This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.volts.wtf/subscribe

In this episode, I speak with Pier LaFarge, CEO of Sparkfund, who challenges the traditional antagonism between utilities and distributed energy advocates. While investor-owned utilities have long been seen as obstacles to clean energy adoption, LaFarge argues that they're actually essential to scaling DERs in an era of explosive electricity demand. This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.volts.wtf/subscribe

In this episode, I speak with Malcolm Woolf and Connor Nelson about hydropower's underappreciated role in America's clean energy landscape. While providing most of our energy storage and thus supporting solar and wind deployments, hydropower faces significant challenges, with a decade-long relicensing processes and inadequate market compensation. We discuss why preserving and expanding this reliable, clean firm energy source is crucial as we transition to renewables. This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.volts.wtf/subscribe

In this episode, I chat with author Cory Doctorow about "enshittification," his viral term for how digital platforms and smart technologies inevitably get worse over time. We explore how monopoly power, aggressive IP protections, and lax privacy law enable companies to capture and exploit users — and what that might mean for the clean energy transition as our homes and vehicles become increasingly software-dependent. This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.volts.wtf/subscribe

In this episode, I talk with Kate Gordon, CEO of California Forward, about how climate change is breaking the insurance industry. We discuss why insurers are fleeing high-risk states, the limitations of government backstops, and the looming political and financial crisis as communities face hard choices about where people can safely live. This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.volts.wtf/subscribe

In this episode, I talk with Caroline Spears of Climate Cabinet about the results of the state and local climate races her organization tracked in 2024. We discuss the importance of these often-overlooked state and local races for climate progress, the challenges of the current political information environment, and Climate Cabinet's strategy for building power at the state level through 2030 and beyond. This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.volts.wtf/subscribe

In this episode, I talk with Ray Minjares of ICCT and Jacqueline Torres of Forum Mobility about the electrification of heavy trucks, from drayage at ports to long-haul big rigs. We dig into charging challenges, innovative financing models, and the massive pollution cuts possible by transitioning fleets. Electric trucks are here — but they need the right policies and partnerships to scale. This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.volts.wtf/subscribe

In this episode, I talk with activist, sex advice columnist, and progressive journalist Dan Savage about the legacy of “The Urban Archipelago,” a groundbreaking piece he commissioned and edited two decades ago in the wake of GW Bush’s reelection, urging Democrats to embrace cities as their political base and future. We explore how NIMBY-captured Democratic city leadership has stifled urban potential — and why improving and growing cities isn’t just policy; it’s party building. This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.volts.wtf/subscribe

In this episode, I chat with Sunrun CEO Mary Powell about how residential solar is evolving into much more than just panels. We dive into Sunrun’s expansion as a “clean energy lifestyle” brand, Mary’s belief in a customer-led energy transition, and alternatives to the tech bros' virile obsession with nuclear power. This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.volts.wtf/subscribe

In this episode, I talk with Bill Moyer, founder of the Reconnect America campaign, about the huge, untapped potential of U.S. railroads to support the clean energy transition. Bill makes the case that our privately owned rail system, focused on short-term profits, is missing out on big public benefits—like shifting freight from roads to rails, reducing emissions, and even using rail corridors to carry high-voltage transmission lines for renewable energy. This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.volts.wtf/subscribe

In this episode, I chat with Ari Matusiak, co-founder and head of Rewiring America, which recently received a $2 billion grant from the feds to take home electrification mainstream. We dig into the practical challenges — getting local contractors on board, simplifying rebate access — and the enormous opportunities. This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.volts.wtf/subscribe

In this episode, we’re diving into the wonky but vital topic of performance-based utility regulation (PBR) with Cara Goldenberg and Laura Gonzalez. We discuss how traditional utility regulation creates perverse incentives for utilities — and the tools PBR offers to better align incentives with modern priorities to like resilience, equity, and decarbonization. Dozens of states have adopted some form of PBR or other, and Virginia might be next. This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.volts.wtf/subscribe

In this episode, I sit down with Dr. Vanessa Chan, DOE’s Chief Commercialization Officer, to discuss the challenges of commercializing new clean energy technologies. Her office has helped develop a common vocabulary among stakeholders (“adoption readiness levels”) and concentrated the attention of public and private capital on certain key technologies (“pathway to liftoff” reports). It’s wonky stuff, but it has transformed and turbocharged DOE’s commercialization efforts. This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.volts.wtf/subscribe

In this episode, Ylenia Aguilar joins me to discuss her candidacy for the Arizona Corporation Commission. We examine the ACC’s history of rubber stamping rate hikes, dismantling renewable energy initiatives, and generally pandering to utilities. Three ACC seats are up for election this year and the outcomes could have a profound impact on the state's energy future. This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.volts.wtf/subscribe

In this episode, I sit down with Allison Clements, former FERC commissioner, to discuss her time at the commission and the challenges of grid modernization. We dive into the complexities of integrating clean energy, reforms to interconnection queues, and how the commission can take a more active role in the energy transition. This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.volts.wtf/subscribe

In this episode, I explore the controversial Texas Railroad Commission with Virginia Palacios of Commission Shift. We discuss the commission's history, its misleading name, its cozy relationship with the oil & gas industry it's meant to oversee, and its role before and after the devastating Winter Storm Uri, where lax regulation contributed to widespread power outages and deaths. This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.volts.wtf/subscribe

In this episode, I explore the political landscape of Pennsylvania with state Rep. Leanne Krueger. We discuss the state's nail-biting elections, the outsized political influence of fracking, and the uphill battle for clean energy legislation in a divided legislature. Krueger provides a boots-on-the-ground perspective on climate and energy politics in this key swing state. This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.volts.wtf/subscribe

In this episode, I geek out with David Goldstein, founder of Hydronic Shell Technologies, about a novel building retrofit technology that wraps old multifamily structures in insulated panels with built-in HVAC systems. Goldstein's approach allows for energy-efficient upgrades without interior disruption, potentially solving a major challenge in building decarbonization. We dive into how the system combines exterior insulation, air sealing, and centralized heat pumps with individual window units to dramatically reduce energy demand and emissions. This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.volts.wtf/subscribe

In this episode, we explore the Biden administration's ambitious industrial investment strategy with Heather Boushey, a member of the President's Council of Economic Advisors and chief economist for his Invest in America Cabinet. This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.volts.wtf/subscribe

California homeowners face a complex puzzle in decarbonizing their homes: electrification without rooftop solar could increase bills due to expensive electricity, while installing solar first risks oversizing or underutilizing the system. Balto Energy, a startup founded by James Quazi, uses AI to analyze utility bills and recommend the most cost-effective clean energy strategy. In this episode, we discuss Balto's tool, its potential to empower contractors, and what California's situation reveals about the future of clean energy policy nationwide.(PDF transcript)(Active transcript)Text transcript:David RobertsHello everyone. This is Volts for September 13, 2024, "A tool that enables solar first home electrification." I'm your host, David Roberts. Californians who want to decarbonize their homes face something of a conundrum. If they electrify their cars and appliances without getting rooftop solar, they could end up paying higher overall bills thanks to California's notoriously expensive electricity and cheap natural gas. If they install rooftop solar before electrifying their cars and appliances, they could either undersize the system for their eventual needs or oversize it and over-produce and export solar power to the California grid. Thanks to California's recent NEM 3.0 decision on rooftop solar compensation, utilities pay much less for that exported rooftop solar power than they used to.The most economical strategy for most homeowners is likely to be some mix of electrification, batteries, and rooftop solar. The more a California homeowner stores and consumes their own cheap rooftop solar power, the more value they get out of that solar and the lower their total bills. It is a complex calculation, though, that most homeowners are in no position to make. That's where the startup Balto Energy comes in. Founder James Quazi, a longtime energy modeler and entrepreneur, has built a tool that can use a home's utility bills to create a model of its consumption patterns, predict what they will be as appliances are electrified, and recommend the maximally economical approach.It's part of a larger effort to help contractors and solar companies navigate a post-net-metering world. I'm excited to talk to Quazi about why his tool is needed and how it works, how it will empower contractors, and what California's present says about the future of clean energy policy in the rest of the country.With no further ado, James Quazi, welcome to Volts. Thank you so much for coming.James QuaziThank you for having me. That was a great intro.David RobertsThanks. So, you know, I sort of went over it a little quickly in the intro there. But let's talk a little bit about this conundrum for Californians who are trying to decarbonize. So, just by background — I don't even know if everyone's been following the California rooftop solar wars, I kind of assume everybody has — but just by way of background, California recently basically issued a new policy on rooftop solar, and the long and short of it is that they're going to compensate homeowners much less. It used to be that basically you could get paid the retail rate for your excess solar, and now they're just going to pay much, much less than that.On the surface, this really damages the economical case for solar for homeowners, they'll get compensated much less. This has resulted in a huge blow to the solar industry in California. There are solar companies shutting down, jobs being lost, etcetera, etcetera. So, talk a little bit about the conundrum and how you think about solving it.James QuaziYeah, so about a year ago, the net energy metering policy in California changed from NEM 2.0 to NEM 3.0, now called Net Billing Tariff. The difference is, as you mentioned, that now customers get paid on a schedule. Each hour per year is a different rate. But generally, you can think of it as between like $0.05 and $0.08 for exported energy, while imported energy for me in San Diego is between $0.38 and $0.52 an hour. So it degrades the value proposition for residential solar for a homeowner. For contractors, it's also proven really difficult. So in the past, it was really easy to have rule of thumb sizing or heuristics, or if you took annual energy over the last twelve months and you designed a system that produced around that same amount of energy, it was generally going to be a good value proposition for the homeowner.But now, what you need to understand is, like, how much of that solar production is actually coincident with the load on the house, because the export of energy is devalued.David RobertsRight. So, the economics now have shifted to make it so that, I mean, maybe this was true already, but more true now that the ideal thing for Californians with rooftop solar to do is to consume as much of the generated power as conceivably possible.James QuaziThat's absolutely correct. So, if you can think of it as, and I'm sure your listeners are familiar with the terminology, like LCOE. So, the

Public utility commissions (PUCs) wield enormous influence in the US energy transition — they regulate the monopolistic utilities at the heart of America's electricity system but face little public scrutiny. Now, energy analyst Charles Hua is launching PowerLines, a nonprofit that aims to pull PUCs into the spotlight. In this episode, we discuss the problems with PUCs, opportunities for reform, and the coalition the group aims to organize. This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.volts.wtf/subscribe

There has been an epic battle over the past 20 years between two types of lithium-ion batteries: nickel manganese cobalt (NMC) and lithium iron phosphate (LFP). While NMC still boasts better energy density, LFP is making a major comeback thanks to its safer, more accessible materials and improving performance. However, China still dominates the LFP supply chain. In this episode, CEO Vivas Kumar of startup Mitra Chem weighs in on why America needs domestic production of LFP materials. This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.volts.wtf/subscribe

The Environmental Voter Project has a unique approach: rather than convincing people to care about climate change, it identifies people who already do, but don't consistently vote, and works to get them to the polls. In this episode, EVP founder Nathaniel Stinnett discusses how to find these voters, keep them engaged, and measure their impact. This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.volts.wtf/subscribe

Access to charging is a barrier to EV adoption for folks without a driveway or a garage, but what if charging your car in an urban area was as easy as charging your phone? Enter startup Itselectric, which has developed curbside level-2 chargers that connect to building electric panels, making installation quick and efficient. In this episode, co-founder and COO Tiya Gordon discusses the company’s award-winning charger design and vision for a future of ubiquitous urban charging. This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.volts.wtf/subscribe

Through the passage of IRA and CHIPS, the Biden administration has invested billions of dollars and created more than 100,000 manufacturing jobs in purple and red districts that have been hard-hit by globalization and disinvestment. In this episode, Julian Spector of Canary Media, reporting from these communities, shares about local reactions to this influx of new money and opportunities, and the reality that Trump’s Project 2025 wants to roll back the tax credits fueling this growth. This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.volts.wtf/subscribe

After decades of talk about offshore wind, California seems closer than ever to actually supporting an industry. But to meet the state’s goal of five gigawatts of offshore wind power by 2030, a lot of as-yet-nascent pieces need to fall into place. In this episode, Adam Stern of Offshore Wind California and Jocelyn Brown-Saracino of the US Department of Energy discuss California's recent policy efforts and the state of floating-wind technology. This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.volts.wtf/subscribe

Most electricity ratepayers in the US have a smart meter generating real-time data about their power usage, which could theoretically be used to reduce consumption and save money, but in most cases, utilities have locked up the information in inaccessible formats. In this episode, Michael Murray, leader of business coalition Mission:data, describes the potential value of smart meter data and the group’s ongoing efforts to pry it from utilities. This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.volts.wtf/subscribe