Typology

There's a lot going on in the world right now and we're all feeling different types of pressures. Each of us handle stress in different ways, and if we're not careful, we can let our unhealthy behaviors take the lead. So, how do we work through seasons of stress to become the best, most helpful, most loving and compassionate expression of ourselves. I believe the Enneagram can help. It's not a cure-all, but the Enneagram recognizes and takes into account the fluid nature of the personality, which is constantly adapting as circumstances change. There are times when your personality is in a healthy space, times when it's in an average space, and times when it's downright nuts. We all teeter on the continuum between healthy and unhealthy multiple times per day. But when we take the time to recognize our triggers and automatic reactions, we're able to stop, pivot and intentionally change our response. In this 3-part series, Anthony and I cover how each Enneagram Type typically deals with stress and offer practical tips to mitigate self-defeating behaviors and remain emotionally balanced. Today, we tackle Enneagram types One, Two, and Three.

Grief is not something you do. It's something you go through. All of us experience different types of grief and each of us grieve in different ways. But if we allow grief to consume us, if we don't grow through grief, it locks us in the past and keeps us stuck. The recent loss of my mother has been an invitation for me to reflect on the ways I process my own grief. So today, Anthony and I wanted to bring this topic to you and offer some useful insights on how each Enneagram type expresses grief and what they need in that season so you can love, care for, and serve that type better in periods of grief. Tune in then share this episode with your friends, family and coworkers so they too can learn how to support others well based on what they need. Don't forget to follow @typologypodcast on Apple, Spotify, and Instagram to get the latest episodes each week.

Our greatest legacies are not just in what we achieve, but in the indomitable spirit we demonstrate and pass on to the ones we love. Living a life of purpose could be the greatest gift you can give to the people you love. In today's episode, pastor and motivational speaker, Jay Hewitt shares his deeply personal journey of facing a terminal brain cancer diagnosis at thirty-seven and opens up about the big questions that challenge him and the profound lessons his diagnosis has taught him about vulnerability, deep connections, resilience, fatherhood, and faith. Tune into this powerful conversation that reminds us of what truly is important – our connection to others. ------------- Learn more about Jay Hewitt at https://www.jayhewitt.org or follow him @jayhewitt on Instagram and YouTube. P.S. Don't forget to follow Typology Podcast on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or your favorite podcast player to get weekly episodes in your feed.

How can we use the Enneagram to understand and navigate our emotions? Each of us has a unique emotional wiring that has shaped our personality. But oftentimes, we undervalue the importance of our feelings. "Feelings are just as much a gift from God as thoughts," explains Dr. Bill Gualtiere, "[...] our thoughts influence our feelings. But our feelings influence our thoughts also, and our feelings and emotions are very biological." Drs. Bill and Kristi Gaultiere join me for an Enneagram-filled conversation about the significance of empathy for emotional and spiritual development. They share the emotional alarms and soul care practices for each type, and offer a unique map that uncovers the core feelings associated with each Enneagram type. To learn more about Drs. Kristi and Bill Gaultiere, visit their website here, connect with them on social media @soulshepherding, listen to their Soul Talks podcast, or grab a copy of their new book, Healthy Feelings, Thriving Faith: Growing Emotionally and Spiritually through the Enneagram.

The metric of success is not tied to money or fame, it's living up to what you're called to do. Founder and CEO of The Cupcake Collection, Mignon Francois, joins us for a delightful conversation about how she turned her last $5 into a $10 million dollar cupcake empire. Now she's helping other people learn what they can do if only they believe in themselves. "Everything is already here that will allow you to become or to create whatever it is that you decided in your heart that you want to do," says Mignon. "It's about finding joy in the process of being who you were called to be." Not only does she offer a bit of wisdom gleaned from her life experiences, but she shares her love for the Enneagram and how she uses it in her personal and professional life. We help her hone in on her type by digging into the similarities and differences between an Enneagram 2 and Enneagram 4. To learn more about Mignon Francois, order your own cupcakes, or grab a copy of her new book, Made From Scratch: Finding Success Without A Recipe, visit www.thecupcakecollection.com

As human beings we're wired for connection – to be seen and known fully – yet loved anyway. When we lack this true connection, we begin to drift into a feeling of loneliness or isolation, both of which have been proven to impact our physical and mental health. Today's guest, Justin Whitmel Earley, explains the difference between social isolation and loneliness, then implores us to prioritize healthy, deep connections with others stating, "The difference between those of us who are persevering or getting crushed by life is whether or not you're walking through life beside close friends, people who really deeply know you. Because we all experience hard things, we all experience suffering, we all have mental health struggles. But if you walk through it alone, you will be crushed." He also shares a few strategies we can all use to foster deep friendships from his new book, Made for People: Why We Drift into Loneliness and How to Fight for a Life of Friendship. I hope this episode encourages you to stop and take an inventory of your own connections.

Philip Yancey is an award-winning author, renowned theologian, and influential speaker who has written 13 Gold Medallion award-winning books and won two ECPA Book of the Year awards for What's So Amazing About Grace? And The Jesus I Never Knew. Today, I had the wonderful opportunity to celebrate the 25th anniversary of the bestselling book, What's So Amazing About Grace? with author Philip Yancey. The question is just as relevant now as it was when the book was first published. It still holds true that the most important things in life are love, forgiveness and grace. Regardless of your religious or spiritual beliefs, Philip invites us to question how we understand grace and how we extend it to ourselves and others. Learn more about Philip Yancey and his works at: www.philipyancey.com www.facebook.com/philipyancey www.instagram.com/philipyanceyofficial/ www.twitter.com/philipyancey What's So Amazing About Grace?

"We have three energetic engines of what it means to be human. One is our feeling, one is our thinking, and one is our behaving. When those three things are integrated, the way that we're kind of wired, when we kind of again walk into the party and we're really behaving and thinking and feeling all in alignment, this is the fullest expression of a human being." explains Dr. Julia DiGangi. Our new friend. Dr. Julia DiGangi brought the conversation today! We dig into the emotional, cognitive, and behavioral structure of the personality and what it means to live in alignment with all three. She is the author of the amazing new book Energy Rising: the Neuroscience of Leading with Emotional Power. If the content and the spirit of this episode has not convinced you to go by her book, please rewind to the beginning of the interview and listen more carefully because it has been such a privilege and a pleasure to have this time with Dr. DiGangi. ----------------------------------- Learn more about Dr. Julia DiGangi https://www.neurohealthpartners.com/dr-jdg https://www.linkedin.com/in/juliadigangi https://www.instagram.com/drjuliadigangi

Sixes have excellent analytical minds, are great strategists, troubleshooters, problem-solvers, and of course, see worst-case scenarios that other people don't see. The passion of the Six is fear which is often experienced as anxiety…anxiety that the unexpected could happen at any time. But once they launch a mental narrative in their head of all that could go wrong, these fictional stories can take on lives of their own and can grow and crowd out what's actually happening. Today, we revisit my conversation with Jeff Chu to explore the complexities of The Loyalist, and how knowing his Enneagram type has allowed him to identify those aspects of his personality that are responses to things he's been through in the past and work through them. ---------------- Jeff Chu is a writer, reporter, Editor-at-large at Travel + Leisure, and Teacher in residence at Crosspointe Church. His reporting and writing has appeared in The New York Times Magazine, Travel+Leisure, the Wall Street Journal, the Washington Post, and Modern Farmer. When big publishers were still starting magazines and pouring millions of dollars into them, Jeff was an editor on the launch team of the now-defunct Conde Nast Portfolio. And before that, he spent seven years at Time magazine, where he really received his journalistic education. Jeff was a London-based web producer and staff writer. In 2021, Jeff helped turn Rachel Held Evans' latest work-in-progress into a finished book titled, "Wholehearted Faith." He wove the words of her partial manuscript with other unpublished writings to create a rich collection of essays that ask candid questions about the stories we've been told—and the stories we tell—about our faith, our selves, and our world.

There's no such thing as a pure personality type. We're all a mash up of two types – your dominant type and your dominant wing. Knowing your wing is important because they reveal a whole different side of your personality and can explain contradictory elements within your personality. Enneagram Fives are edged between the passionate, intense Four on one side and the loyal but anxious Six on the other. Depending on their dominant wing, these two can look very different. Today, we explore how an Enneagram Five with a dominant Four wing processes and experiences things very intensely on both the intellectual and feeling planes. Jason Adam Miller describes this complicated relationship as "as a civil war between the two." Tune in for an inside look through the lens of an Enneagram 5w4 and how Jason has learned to balance the two. --- Jason Adam Miller is the founder and lead pastor of South Bend City Church, an eclectic Christian community known for its thoughtful teaching, inclusive vision, and commitment to its city context. An advocate for artists and peacemakers, his work beyond South Bend focuses on cultural headwaters and conflict zones, where he serves an international constituency of leaders. He holds a master's degree in theology from the University of Notre Dame. https://www.jasonadammiller.com/ https://www.instagram.com/jasonadammiller/ https://southbendcitychurch.com/ When the World Breaks: The Surprising Hope and Subversive Promises in the Teachings of Jesus

Burnout is more common than you think and the rates continue to rise. So, what constitutes burnout and how do we combat it? First, we need to understand the stressors that lead to burnout in the first place. According to physician, executive coach, and speaker Dr. Neha Sangwan, "burnout is due to prolonged stress and an ongoing net drain of energy on one or more of five levels: physical, mental, emotional, social, and spiritual. When we burn out, our productivity suffers, our health declines, and we're more reactive in our relationships." In today's episode, Dr. Sangwan shares the story of her own wake-up call, breaks down the phases of burnout, and provides examples from her new book, Powered by Me: From Burned Out to Fully Charged at Work and in Life, of how to assess the five levels of burnout so you can take practical steps to replenish your energy and heal. To learn more about Dr. Sangwan, visit her website or grab a copy of her book on Amazon.

What is the gut-brain connection, and what role does it play in living a healthy and fulfilling life? Functional medicine expert Dr. Will Cole joins us to talk about his newest book, Gut-Feelings: Healing the Shame-Fueled Relationship Between What You Eat and How You Feel, and how to heal our bodies through nutrition. Versed in the Enneagram, Dr. Cole shares how it has helped him educate and empower others by learning to communicate with others in a way they can receive it. "My Enneagram Five-ness as far as being a researcher really does suit me well, and I think that's why I've been such a voracious consumer of health information and research [...] but, there's this duality, bidirectional relationship between what I do as science and the art," explains Dr. Cole. "The art part of what we do is holding the space in between the words and really understanding how can I get this health information and help them to understand it, to empower them, to give them agency over their health, and to really help them apply these things so it's sustainable and practical, for them to reclaim their quality of life?" Tune into this fascinating conversation, then jump over to Amazon to grab your copy of "Gut Feelings."

To be human is to suffer. Most people try to bypass suffering or live with it in isolation. But true healing happens when you acknowlege its presence, learn to be with it, and allow others to come alongside you in your pain. "Suffering is this whole notion of my perception that, 'I'm alone with my pain.' So suffering is a direct function of the degree to which I am isolated with my pain," explains Dr. Curt Thompson. "If I practice allowing others to be with me, it changes the nature of how I practice anticipating the future. And this is how 'I' don't form hope for me…'we' form hope for me." In today's episode, Dr. Curt Thompson returns to discuss his incredible new book, The Deepest Place: Suffering and the Formation of Hope. We explore the intersection of faith and neuroscience, unraveling the profound impact of suffering and the formation of hope. To learn more about Dr. Curt Thompson, visit his website or grab a copy of his new book.

Does your internal world align with your external world? If not, how can the Enneagram help you harness the vast treasures of instinctual insights and inspirations on a regular basis to realize personal and professional success? Liz Tran, Executive Coach and author of The Karma of Success, joins me for a wonderful conversation about tapping into your inner genius in order to capitalize on what you're truly capable of. She shares the four spiritual strategies that foster reflection and help you infuse intuition and creativity into a career of purpose and joy. ---------- Liz Tran is the founder of Reset, an executive coaching company to CEOs and founders. Before founding Reset, Liz spent over a decade working in the tech industry, most recently as the only female executive at a leading venture capital firm. She is a trained meditation teacher and Reiki Master and studied yoga at the Samyak Ashram. She lives in New York City and Norfolk, Connecticut with her husband, Dev, and their dog, Grover. To learn more about Liz Tran and The Karma of Success, visit her website or follow her on Instagram.

We live in a world where we are faced with profound suffering on the news all day long and we see too much suffering of the world. But how do we take the unexpected things that happen to us and somehow breathe new life into them? Author of The Gift of the Unexpected: Discovering Who You Were Meant to Be When Life Goes Off Plan, Jillian Benfield believes, "No matter what your unexpected circumstance is–you don't have to classify it as good–but I do think that good can come out of it and that [good] is that we can change through our unexpected circumstances if we're willing to go all the way through it." Listen as Jillian shares the unexpected gift that helped shift her perspective and find true self-worth. ----------------- Jillian Benfield is a former journalist and news anchor. She holds a broadcast journalism degree from the University of Georgia. As a freelance writer, her essays about living an unexpected life have appeared on sites such as TODAY, Good Morning America, Yahoo! News, and ABC News. Jillian regularly advocates for the full inclusion of people with disabilities in her writings, community, and as part of the National Down Syndrom Congress's National Down Syndrom Advocacy Coalition. Jillian and her husband, Andy, and their three children make their home on Florida's Space Coast.

We're kicking off Season 7 with a topic I've not yet discussed on the show: Holy Ideas. Holy Ideas remind us of the powerful spiritual roots of the Enneagram. They are great, universal, spiritual truths that we forgot or lost touch with, as the ego created an overlay of personality. It's a challenging concept, but today's guest, renowned Enneagram teacher Renée Rosario walks us through the Holy Ideas for each type and reminds us to "relax with awareness into this idea that there is a power greater than us, that is actually taking care of all the things we think we have to take care of in our type." Renée Rosario is a Core Faculty member of The Narrative Enneagram and a transpersonal, body-centered psychotherapist in Boulder, CO. She has facilitated workshops and classes for over 20 years and loves to work in the Narrative Tradition where all are students and teachers of one another. Renée has been a mindfulness instructor at Naropa University and a peacemaker trained in contemplative social action through the Peacemaker Institute. Her upcoming two classes, Narrative Enneagram Intensive Part 1 and Narrative Enneagram Learning Community will take place on August 4-6 in Menlo Park, CA or you can attend online. Learn more at www.narrativeenneagram.org.

As Richard Rohr says, Ones are childlike and full of joy and wonder at the world and creation. But for Ones, that sense of joy has been lost. Instead, they suppress their own feelings and focus on being good and doing what is right. They feel a sense of duty and responsibility and may harbor resentment toward others who don't see things the right way – their way. But what would it look like if Ones reclaimed their childlike wonder? When Ones move toward health, they begin to let judgments go and become more at ease with imperfection. They begin to truly quiet that inner critic and turn it into an inner encourager. Our guest today, Julianne Cusick, shares how her journey toward self-awareness and self-knowledge as an Enneagram One has allowed her to prioritize relationships over perfection and has given her permission to have fun dancing in the kitchen. Julianne Cusick is a Licensed Marriage and Family Therapist, a Certified EMDR Therapist (Maiberger Institute), and an AANE Certified Neurodiverse Couples Coach. She thrives on personal and professional growth. A dynamic and engaging communicator, Julianne speaks to Christian organizations, women's groups, and retreats – all from the voice of hope and her own story of healing and redemption. She is a mother of two who enjoys gardening, reading, and spending time with her family and friends. For more about Julianne or Restoring the Soul, visit www.restoringthesoul.com.

Enneagram Threes focus on outstanding performance, being perceived as successful, and avoiding failure at all costs. They believe that love comes from achievement, image, and status and have the tendency to neglect or ignore the personal needs of self and others. But when Threes move toward health, they move to the high side of Six. When that happens, they no longer need to "drive the bus" or flaunt success. They are so good at helping others live to their full potential and be successful in their own right and not have it be all about their own success. In this episode, Lisa Whelchel discusses her journey toward being a healthy Three. Listen in as she touches on her subtypes, how she identifies her True Self, and how the Enneagram has impacted her life as an introverted Type 3 with a 2 wing. Lisa is an actress, author, international speaker, and life coach. Perhaps best known for her starring role as Blair Warner on NBC's "The Facts of Life" for nine years, she's also the author of "Creative Correction," which has sold over 200,000 copies and has written more than a dozen books. Currently, Lisa is a certified CoActive Life Coach and focuses most of her time these days coming alongside others on their transformational journey to remembering their True Self. For more information please visit www.LisaWhelchel.com and www.ContigoLifeCoach.com.

Have you ever wondered why you like sad music, find comfort or inspiration in a rainy day, or react intensely to music, art, nature, and beauty? If so, you may identify with the bittersweet state of mind. Bestselling author Susan Cain joins Anthony and I in a deep exploration of the important topic of bittersweet. She explains that "as humans, we enter this world with a sense of longing and separation from a more perfect and beautiful world. We come into the world with this knowledge and with these kinds of holy tears, you could call them, and this is one of the best and most beautiful things about us, the fact that we feel this [..], the fact of wanting to glimpse it and occasionally glimpsing it is that that's actually the secret fuel behind our creativity and our capacity for love." Tune in for this incredible conversation that puts words to the pining and longing of Enneagram Fours. Susan Cain is the author of the bestsellers Bittersweet: How Sorrow and Longing Make Us Whole and Quiet: The Power of Introverts in A World That Can't Stop Talking, which spent eight years on the New York Times best seller list and has been translated into 40 languages. Susan's TED talks have been viewed over 40 million times. LinkedIn named her the Top 6th Influencer in the World, just behind Richard Branson and Melinda French Gates. Susan partners with Malcolm Gladwell, Adam Grant and Dan Pink to curate the Next Big Idea Book Club. They donate all their proceeds to children's literacy programs.

Some of my favorite interviews on Typology happen when a guest comes on thinking they're one type but they present differently. Today is one of those conversations. We start the show by talking to author, speaker, and social media personality, Carlos Whittaker, exploring how he determined his type and what struck him the most about being an Enneagram 9. Not long into our conversation, we begin to unravel the lines between Enneagram 3s, 6s, and 9s and dig into a brief typing interview. It's an engaging conversation you don't want to miss. We also pivot to talk about his new book, ​How to Human: Three Ways to Share Life Beyond What Distracts, Divides, and Disconnects​, where Carlos shares the transformative power of embracing human connection and learning to navigate difficult things with a little more grace. To learn more about Carlos and his new book, visit his website ​here​. Listen ​now​ on your favorite podcast player.

When human language can no longer carry the freight of an idea or a spiritual truth, you have to default to metaphor or to another language that can do that job. That language might be sculpture, film, music, or art…whatever medium can express things that discursive analytical language cannot. No other Enneagram type can match the Enneagram Four's creative gift for giving language to ideas others of us can't find words for. Today's guests, Craig Lamar Brown and Andrea Summer share how they used their strengths to inspire others to find common ground and have healthy conversations about race, gentrification, and interracial dating in the church through their new movie, Between Mercy and Me. Tune in as we unpack the challenges they faced while working together, how and why Fours can self-destruct, and using art as an outlet for processing emotions.

Let's face it, relationships are complicated. But the more you know about yourself and your partner, the easier it is to communicate and navigate conflict. This week, Mike Alexander, Enneagram Six returns along with his wife, Enneagram One, and psychotherapist Cheryl, for a powerful conversation about the dynamics of their relationship and their own journey of healing within their types. We dig into a few of the challenges they face and learn how figuring out the inner workings of themselves and each other helped salvage their marriage. You don't want to miss this powerful conversation. ----- ABOUT MIKE Mike Alexander is a nationally recognized expert in ethics, integrity, leadership development, and coaching. This specialty began and flourished during his 41-year career in law enforcement and has defined the years following his retirement from service. Through the U.S. Department of Justice Community Policing Divisions, the thirty-six (36) Regional Community Policing Institute, the Multi-jurisdictional Counterdrug Task Force Training Center, the Federal Law Enforcement Training Center, the Texas Municipal League, the International Law Enforcement Administration, and the Texas Police Chiefs Association, the Carruth Policing Institute, he has traveled the nation training officers and community members on leadership development, ethics and integrity. In 1999, he founded the LION Leadership Institute, with workshops focused on leadership engagement, employee wellness, cost of conflict, psychological safety, emotional intelligence, healthy work environments, and socialization. He is currently working as an adjunct professor and leadership and curriculum development consultant with Austin Community College. Instagram: @thelion_institute LinkedIn: @thelion-organizational-development-instituteTwitter: @LION_Institute Facebook: @thelion.institute ABOUT CHERYL Cheryl is a native Texan, born in Waco, Texas, and reared in San Antonio, Texas. She is the daughter of the late LC and Dorothy Christman. She has one sister, Debbie Grady. Cheryl lived in San Antonio, Texas, until she graduated from Incarnate Word High School. After graduating from high school, she attended Southwest Texas State University (now known today as Texas State University) in San Marcos, Texas, where she received her bachelor's degree in Criminal Justice and a master's degree in School Psychology with a minor in Special Education. She is currently working on her dissertation for the Ph.D. Marriage and Family Counseling program at Northwestern University. She worked 13 years in the law enforcement field as a prison guard, an adult probation officer, and a Texas Youth Commission parole officer. She worked 22 years in the education field … 15 years as a school counselor. She is currently in private practice as a Christian Licensed Professional Counselor at Plan C Consultation and Counseling Services.

Whether we're watching it play out on social media or experiencing it in our relationships and workplaces, all of us know someone who is addicted to drama. But how do you recognize a drama addiction in yourself or others? And once you recognize it, how do you break the cycle and live more peacefully? Today on Typology, clinical psychologist Scott Lyons, Ph.D., reveals how he learned to navigate generations of trauma and identifies what a drama addiction is. "Like all addictions, it is looking at how do we fill the void? How do we prevent further pain? How do we fill the void? And when you have a void, you don't exist. There isn't a sense of existence on this plane. So you fill it with things that give you a sense of aliveness or purpose," explains Dr. Lyons. Tune in to hear his advice on how to break free from the damaging effects of living lives consumed by chaos. Follow @typologypodcast on Instagram, Facebook, and Twitter. -- ABOUT SCOTT LYONS, Ph.D. Dr. Scott Lyons is a holistic psychologist and educator. As a renowned body-based trauma expert, Doctor of Osteopathy and Mind-Body Medicine specialist, Scott helps people to break free of cycles of pain, limited beliefs, and trauma. Scott is an innovator in transformative wellness and trauma therapy, teaching over half a million people internationally over the past twenty years how to relieve stress and restore vitality. Scott has worked with many of the country's top leaders and CEOs as an executive coach and wellness consultant. Scott is the creator of The Embody Lab—the largest online learning platform for body-based trauma therapies—and developer of Somatic Stress ReleaseTM, a holistic process of restoring biological resilience taught in over 20 countries. Scott is also the founder and progressive designer of Omala, a wellness brand dedicated to creating sustainably sourced tools for transformation. Find Dr. Lyons online: Instagram, Facebook, LinkedIn, TikTok and website

What roadblocks keep you from reaching your true potential? How can you shift your mindset to find true inspiration and fulfillment? CEO of SelfHelp(ful) and host of the SelfHelp(ful) podcast, Kevin Miller believes the key to motivation is understanding what it is that you truly value. "If it wasn't anybody else, if it was just for you, what do you really want, that you can own?" asks Kevin. For a lot of people, when they really become clear on that value, they find it bumps against their existing lifestyle or relationships, and that's hard. But getting to the core of what drives you, and why, is what leads to personal and professional success and fulfillment. Kevin Miller is a former pro cyclist and founder of 19 businesses, with a common thread and devotion throughout all he's done to enhance personal performance and live an inspired life. Today he is CEO of Self-Helpful, Inc., a personal development organization which curates and produces self-help content. Kevin hosts the Self-Helpful podcast (Glassbox Network), which has over 60 million downloads and is routinely visited by today's most influential changemakers. His book, What Drives You (McGraw Hill, May 16, 2023) challenges today's myths on "driven people" and serves as a guide for clarity and conviction in what you authentically value and are motivated by. To learn more about Kevin, listen to the Selfhelp(ful) podcast, or pick up a copy of his new book, What Drives You: How to Discover Your Unique Motivators and Accelerate Growth in Work and Life.

Last week David Gungor shared his struggle in determining his type, how he embraces his "chaotic intentionality," and what it means to need others to "get out of his face." Today we continue the conversation using the Enneagram to help Enneagram Eights grow in self-awareness through spiritual practices and leaning into the people they do trust to gain true intimacy. David Gungor is a member of The Brilliance, the American worship music duo of David Gungor and John Arndt. The band started making music in 2010 under the Integrity Music label. Their latest album was "All is Not Lost" released in January 2017. David is also an associate pastor at Trinity Grace Tribeca. For more information about David, visit www.thebrilliancemusic.com

Enneagram Eights are called The Challenger for a good reason. Eights don't like to feel controlled and avoid any appearance of vulnerability. They are naturally confrontational and their combative energy can feel intimidating to others. But what feels like intimidation to others actually feels like connection to an Eight. Eights express their anger freely, are fueled by high levels of stimulation, and react very strongly against challenging injustices. And, as you'll hear from our guest, David Gungor, the "circle of trust" is small but tight. So what does it sound like when an Eight acknowledges their weakness or vulnerability? What does it look like when you break through that tough exterior? Listen to today's replay from Season 1 as David Gungor shares his struggle in determining his type, how he embraces his "chaotic intentionality," and what it means to need others to "get out of his face." David Gungor is a member of The Brilliance, the American worship music duo of David Gungor and John Arndt. The band started making music in 2010 under the Integrity Music label. Their new album was "All is Not Lost" released in January 2017. David is also an associate pastor at Trinity Grace Tribeca. For more information about David, visit www.thebrilliancemusic.com

The Enneagram is complex and dynamic and is itself, this act of self-curiousity, a portal to growth. With that in mind, how do we use it in an intentional way to achieve more integration and balance in our lives? In today's episode, we dial into the importance of Stances with Enneagram master Dr. Jerome Wagner. Stances are a way that we move through the world in order to get our needs met, but "they can also be a defensive strategy so they work in both ways," says Dr. Wagner, "They protect us and get us what we need." Dr. Wagner provides a comprehensive explanation of the Hornevian Stances and how we can use this knowledge to consciously adapt to life's circumstances in a manner that best serves ourselves and others. ----- Dr. Jerome "Jerry" Wagner, Ph.D. is a clinical psychologist, psychotherapist, supervisor, consultant in private practice, and emeritus faculty member in the Department of Psychology and Institute of Pastoral Studies at Loyola University, Chicago. As one of the earliest students of the Enneagram in the United States, Dr. Wagner has been researching and teaching the Enneagram since 1980 and began the Enneagram Spectrum Training and Certification Program in 1995. He has presented Enneagram workshops for business consultants and coaches, human resource directors, counselors, therapists, spiritual directors, educators, and personal growth audiences throughout the United States and in Canada, England, Spain, Finland, Australia, Hong Kong, Singapore, and South Africa. His books, Nine Lenses on the World: the Enneagram Perspective and The Enneagram Spectrum of Personality Styles: an Introductory Guide, 25th Anniversary Edition are both available through Amazon.com.

Discovering the Enneagram was the key to helping Kelli Thompson get out of her head, move through doubt and rumination, and take action. "It was really just a journey of how do you bring your life back into alignment with your values, learn to trust your heart and your gut, and that they have just as much merit as your brain, and then how do you use that to speak up and set boundaries, and take next steps forward and to make confident decisions," says Kelli. In this episode, Kelli shares the importance of bringing the three centers of intelligence into balance and how to navigate gender stereotypes as an Enneagram 5 in the workplace while not losing yourself in the process. ––– Kelli Thompson is a women's leadership coach and speaker who helps women advance to the rooms where decisions are made. She has coached and trained hundreds of women to trust themselves, lead with more confidence, and create a career they love. She is the founder of the Clarity & Confidence Women's Leadership Program, and a Stevie Award winner for Women in Business—Coach of the Year. Her thought leadership has been featured in Forbes, MarketWatch, Parents Magazine, HuffPost, and FastCompany. She is the author of Closing The Confidence Gap: Boost Your Peace, Your Potential & Your Paycheck. Website Instagram LinkedIn

Are an Enneagram 4 and an Enneagram 8 compatible? While both bring a fierce intensity to the world, they each bring different gifts to the table. Helen Palmer describes their match up, as "a partnership of intensity acted out by fight, flight fascination, and flare. Each feels somewhat awed by the other. Eights feel themselves to be coarse and blunt in comparison with the elegant and socially adept romantic. From their side, Fours can be utterly magnetized by the socially shameless boss. It can be a real cliffhanger." In today's episode, artist and author Makoto Fujimura and his wife, Haejin enter the Typology studio to talk about the importance of establishing their friendship first, their different approaches to battling darkness, and how they are putting together a partnership that is greater than it's individual parts. You'll learn: What they admire most about each other How they navigate and balance their individual intensity Ways they've learned to utilize their individual gifts to honor their partnership Makoto Fujimura is a world-class contemporary artist whose process driven, refractive "slow art" has been described by David Brooks of New York Times as "a small rebellion against the quickening of time". Robert Kushner, in the mid 90's, written on Fujimura's art in Art in America this way: "The idea of forging a new kind of art, about hope, healing, redemption, refuge, while maintaining visual sophistication and intellectual integrity is a growing movement, one which finds Makoto Fujimura's work at the vanguard." Haejin has extensive litigation and courtroom experience defending and prosecuting over 400 civil lawsuits in both federal and state courts. She is admitted to practice in NY, NJ and PA. She has represented manufacturing, insurance, software, e-commerce, franchise, real estate, hotel, restaurant, design, automobile, and transportation companies, nonprofit organizations, and individuals in matters involving contract, partnership dispute, directors/officers liability, corporate governance, business formation, trademark, personal injury, general/premises liability, and subrogation. She also has represented various companies as Outside General Counsel. Haejin is actively involved in the legal and local communities and serves on multiple charities. In 2015, Haejin was invited by Ministry of Health and Welfare of South Korean government to speak on U.S. nonprofit corporation law. She has also spoken at various community and legal organizations to encourage the youth and promote professionalism. To learn more about Mako or to find the exact date and location of his new exhibit coming to Nashville this fall, follow him on social or visit his website at https://makotofujimura.com. https://makotofujimura.com - [email protected] YouTube - @makotofujimura3020 Culture Care Creative Academy Kintsugi I Am Culture Care Instagram - @iamfujimura Facebook - @makotofujimuraart Twitter - @iamfujimura Haejin Shim Fujimura Website LinkedIn Instagram

What is an Instinctual Stack? Do you know yours? We all have three instincts. None of us are absent one. However, one does tend to be dominant. But what are instincts and how do they influence how each type shows up in the world? Today's guest, Elan Benami, creator of the EnneaApp and author of Enneagram Patterns & Poetics, provides a great overview of Instincts, Subtypes, and the Instinctual Stack and shares how they play out for him in his personal and professional life. – Elan is an LPC with a MA in Transpersonal Counseling Psychology and BA in Philosophy. In addition to his own private counseling practice, Elan is the Clinical Director of People House - a non-profit that provides affordable counseling in Colorado. Elan was introduced to the Enneagram in 2008 by his first therapist. He then did intense studying with Lori Ohlson, who was his supervisor. Claudio Naranjo was Lori's primary teacher, so there is a deep kinship with his work. Other major Enneagram teachers who have shaped Elan include Helen Palmer, Russ Hudson, Don Riso, and Sandra Maitri. Elan and Lori Ohlson have co-facilitated many Enneagram classes/workshops, most of them in the narrative tradition. Through Lori's Enneagram material (of over 25 years of teaching the Enneagram), Elan created the EnneaApp, initially for the purpose of having something to quickly reference between sessions. Through the years, he has adapted the content to be more reflective of his own experience while also preserving Lori's lineage. The app has over 1.5 million downloads. Follow the Typology Podcast on Apple, Spotify, or your favorite podcast player to hear the latest episodes. You can also follow us @typologypodcast on Instagram, Facebook, and Twitter. Learn more about Elan BenAmi: https://www.linkedin.com/in/elanbenami/ EnneaApp Enneagram Patterns & Poetics: A guide to understanding personality

How has your past uniquely prepared you to experience more joy? In today's replay of one of my favorite episodes, Dr. Dan Allender and I explore this question in an insightful conversation about healing the heart from trauma, rewriting the broken stories we adopt as children, and the overlap with the Enneagram. Professor of counseling psychology at The Seattle School and founder of The Allender Center, Dr. Dan Allender has pioneered a unique therapy centered around his innovative theory and training in transforming betrayal, ambivalence, and powerlessness into faith, hope, and love. He's a popular podcaster on The Allender Center Podcast and the author of Healing the Wondered Heart, The Wounded Heart, The Healing Path, To Be Told and God Loves Sex, and Redeeming Heartache: How Past Suffering Reveals Our True Calling. Learn more about Dr. Allender at https://theallendercenter.org or follow him @allendercenter on Facebook and Instagram. -- Follow the Typology Podcast on Apple, Spotify, or your favorite podcast player to hear the latest episodes. You can also follow us @typologypodcast on Instagram, Facebook, and Twitter.

Research has shown that Emotional Intelligence (EI) is one of the biggest predictors of personal and professional success. But how do you develop it? Today's guest, expert in global leadership and organizational development and co-host of The Evolving Leader Podcast, Scott Allender joins Ian to discuss what emotional intelligence actually is, how the Enneagram aligns with the five essential skills needed to cultivate it, and shares the importance of reclaiming our lost parts for true healing and wholeness. Scott Allender is an expert in global leadership and organizational development. Along with co-hosting The Evolving Leader podcast, he regularly teaches Enneagram workshops and conducts typing interviews and emotional intelligence assessments for individuals and teams who seek to become more radically self-aware and cognizant of the impact they have on the world. To learn more about your personality-specific path toward lasting emotional intelligence and health, pre-order your copy of The Enneagram of Emotional Intelligence today. Follow the Typology Podcast on Apple, Spotify, or your favorite podcast player to hear the latest episodes. You can also follow us @typologypodcast on Instagram, Facebook, and Twitter.

This week, my dear friend and gifted songwriter, Cindy Morgan, joins me for a great conversation about Enneagram Fours, including the push-pull dance of fours in relationships, the well of suffering we can get trapped in, and the importance of authenticity. We also discuss the story behind her debut novel, The Year of Jubilee, and explore how she integrated the Enneagram into the main characters' development. About Cindy Morgan Singer/songwriter Cindy L. Morgan is a two-time Grammy nominee, a thirteen-time Dove winner, and a recipient of the prestigious Songwriter of the Year trophy. An East Tennessee native, her evocative melodies and lyrics have mined the depths of life and love both in her own recording and through songwriting for noteworthy artists around the globe, including Vince Gill, India.Arie, Rascal Flatts, Amy Grant, Sandra McCracken, and Glen Campbell. Cindy is the author of two works of adult nonfiction—the memoir How Could I Ask for More: Stories of Blessings, Battles & Beauty (Worthy Inspire, 2015) and Barefoot on Barbed Wire: A Journey Out of Fear into Freedom (Harvest House Publishers, 2001)—and of the children's picture book Dance Me, Daddy (ZonderKidz, 2009). The Year of Jubilee is her debut novel. Cindy is a co-creator of the charitable Hymns for Hunger Tour, which has raised awareness and resources for hunger relief organizations across the globe. Cindy has two daughters and splits her time living between a small town near Nashville and Holly Springs, North Carolina, with her husband Jonathan. To learn more about Cindy Morgan, follow her on Instagram, Facebook or visit her website. Pre-order her new book, The Year of Jubilee. ----- Follow the Typology Podcast on Apple, Spotify, or your favorite podcast player to hear the latest episodes. You can also follow us @typologypodcast on Instagram, Facebook, and Twitter.

As the New York Times bestselling author of 23 books and lead pastor of National Community Church, Mark Batterson believes that the foundation of all healthy relationships and successful careers stems from our proficiency in these three words: Please. Sorry. Thanks. All three of these words require a posture of humility. All three of these words unlock the law of reciprocity and foster connection and understanding. As Mark puts it, "to me, 'please' is a way of being others-focused and honoring others. It's going against the tide of entitlement. I don't want to operate in that way. I want to operate in a way that honors others." This week, Mark Batterson returns to Typology to discuss how these three powerful words impact leadership, relationships, and a healthy mindset. We also explore the distinction between self-awareness and self-consciousness, and the role self-awareness plays in allowing us to give a timely "please," a sincere "sorry," and a heartfelt "thanks." — Mark Batterson is the lead pastor of the National Community Church (NCC) in Washington, D.C. One church in multiple locations, NCC owns and operates Ebenezers Coffeehouse and the DC Dream Center. NCC is currently developing a city block into The Capital Turnaround - this 100,000-square-foot space will include an event venue, child development center, and mixed-use marketplace. Mark holds a doctor of ministry degree from Regent University and is the New York Times bestselling author of 23 books, including Please Sorry Thanks: The Three Words That Change Everything (Multnomah/Penguin Random House; on-sale 4/4/23) and Win the Day, as well as several books for children, including The Best Worst Day Ever (on sale 2/21/23; Multnomah/Penguin Random House), written with his daughter Summer. Pre-order his latest book, Please Sorry Thanks: The Three Words That Change Everything. To learn more about Mark Batterson, follow him on Instagram, Facebook, and Twitter or visit his website. Follow the Typology Podcast on Apple, Spotify, or your favorite podcast player to hear the latest episodes. You can also follow us @typologypodcast on Instagram, Facebook, and Twitter.

When Kate Bowler was diagnosed with Stage IV cancer, she was forced to grapple with the cultural scripts that box us into a tidy story about how we "earn our lives and get what we deserve," and that "anything is possible." But what if those scripts aren't true? She joins me for an open conversation about her chronic sadness, suffering, and pain, and invites us to be honest about the lives that can't be fixed. She reminds us that "we are people to be loved, not problems to be solved." Kate Bowler is the New York Times bestselling author of Everything Happens for a Reason (And Other Lies I've Loved), No Cure for Being Human (And Other Truths I Need to Hear), and Good Enough. She is the host of the popular podcast, Everything Happens. A Duke University professor, she earned a master's degree in religion from Yale Divinity School and a Ph.D. from Duke University.

What actually makes a fulfilling and meaningful life? Today, Dr. Robert Waldinger, Director of the Harvard Study of Adult Development, reveals the key to real happiness is the strength of our connections and relationships with others. "The people who stay happiest, healthiest, and live the longest have the warmest relationships with other people, "explains Dr. Waldinger. Dr. Waldinger shares the findings of the longest scientific study of happiness, shedding light on the common misconceptions of happiness, how meaningful human connection impacts our health, and what we can do to strengthen existing or forge new relationships. Dr. Robert Waldinger is a professor of psychiatry at Harvard Medical School, director of the Harvard Study of Adult Development at Massachusetts General Hospital, and cofounder of the Lifespan Research Foundation. In The Good Life, Dr. Waldinger teaches you how to proactively create happiness by focusing on what keeps you healthy rather than what makes you sick.

What are your parenting goals? What does a "win" look like for you? Andy and Sandra Stanley determined years ago that their primary goal as parents was to build strong, healthy relationships with their children that continue into their adulthood. "Our legacy is the relationships, the health of the relationships, and the healthy people in the relationships we leave behind," says Sandra. "We wanted to lay a foundation for our kids early of understanding that life is relationships. And, we wanted them to understand how to restore a broken relationship." This week, Andy and Sandra join me to discuss their latest book, Parenting: Getting It Right, and we share an honest conversation about the importance of intentional parenting, equipping our kids for relational success, and the art of restoring a broken relationship. ---- Communicator, author, and pastor Andy Stanley founded Atlanta-based North Point Ministries (NPM) in 1995. As host of Your Move with Andy Stanley, which delivers over 10.5 million messages each month through television, digital platforms, and podcasts, and author of more than 20 books, Andy is considered one of the most influential pastors in America. Sandra Stanley received her bachelor of science degree from Georgia Tech and master of arts from Dallas Theological Seminary. Sandra has a heart for foster kids and foster families, as she and Andy have been foster parents since 2010. Her ministry passion is promoting foster care in the local church. Much of her time these days is spent working on various writing projects and continuing her involvement with Fostering Together, the foster care initiative at North Point Ministries. In their new book, Parenting: Getting It Right, Andy and Sandra combine their experience and wisdom into a guide that helps readers understand and live by essential parenting principles. Visit Andy's website and Sandra's website to learn more about both of them and their new book.

Several years ago we had Lysa TerKeurst on our show and discussed not confusing the desire for peace with the disease to please. Today, Lysa joins us again for a deep conversation about learning to set good boundaries and where she notices her struggle to maintain them. "It's not that I don't want to be clear," Lysa says, "it's that sometimes I care so much about what the other person is feeling, that I forget it's not my job to own their feelings or manage their feelings. It's my job to be kind but clear. It's their job to manage their feelings." Listen as Lysa demonstrates the immense amount of work she has done over the past few years to establish solid boundaries and find groundedness as an Enneagram Nine. ---------------- Lysa TerKeurst is a New York Times bestselling author of more than 25 books with more than 6 million books in print. Her most recent books include Good Boundaries and Goodbyes, Forgiving What You Can't Forget, and It's Not Supposed to Be This Way. She is president and chief visionary officer of Proverbs 31 Ministries. Lysa writes from her family's farm table in North Carolina. In her recent book, Good Boundaries and Goodbyes, Lysa helps you stop the dysfunction of unhealthy relationships by showing you biblical ways to set boundaries--and, when necessary, say goodbye--without losing the best of who you are. To learn more about Lysa visit her website or follow her on social @LysaTerkeurst and @Proverbs31Ministries. Hear similar episodes here: Lysa TerKeurst episode in 2019, Panel of Nines, Type 9s with Beatrice Chestnut, Andy Gullahorn on Forming Own Opinions

As President of Belmont University, Dr. Greg Jones sees the importance of connection and community and puts a strong emphasis on molding character through storytelling. "I think that people are yearning for that sense of hope and that sense of community," says Dr. Jones, "and, I think, to be able to hear one another's stories, share one another's stories, and find a story worth living." This week, we talk to Greg about whole-person formation, learning to share our stories well, and looking toward a future full of possibilities. --- Dr. Jones is an author, gifted speaker, media contributor and thought leader in higher education, social innovation and theology. His most recent book, Navigating the Future: Traditioned Innovation for Wilder Seas outlines his perspective on traditioned innovation as "a habit of being and living that cultivates a certain kind of moral imagination shaped by storytelling and expressed in creative, transformational action." To learn more about Dr. Greg Jones, view his profile at LinkedIn or Belmont University.

As a former at-risk foster kid, Shipp found it difficult to trust adults: "The way I defined trustworthiness was: are you gonna not give up on me when I show you what I'm capable of? When I show you all my ugliness and all of my past and everything you didn't cause, but now you're gonna be dealing with…can you handle all of that?" Josh Shipp wants to pass that experience on to as many others as he can, so those adults can care for the kids in the way he needed: "Every kid is one caring adult away from being a success story." This week, we talk to Josh Shipp about how growing up in foster homes and being a counterphobic six has impacted his current work as a global youth empowerment expert. Josh Shipp is an author & youth advocate, and television producer of a documentary TV series on A&E that follows his groundbreaking work with youth and families. He has written two national bestsellers, "The Grown-Up's Guide to Teenage Humans," winner of the Nautilus Gold Award for Parenting & Family – and "The Teen's Guide to World Domination. Episode Links: YouTube Apple Spotify

Two years following his departure from the band, NEEDTOBREATHE, Bo is releasing a candid look at his past with childlike wonder and self-realization under a new name, Coy Roy: "I got into therapy and began to dig into my childhood and why the trajectory of my life took a different path. I left my six-year-old self back there, and we went different places. [Now I'm] recognizing that I'm not going anywhere and that I'm gonna have to face this. I'm gonna have to deal with it." This week, we talk to Bo Rinehart about emotional depth, his ability to bare his soul to his listeners, and what it means to take an honest look at his past while diving head first into his future endeavors. Bo Rinehart is a founding member of the Grammy Nominated band NEEDTOBREATHE. He is also an accomplished visual artist. To learn more about Bo Rinehart follow him on Instagram, check out his artwork at Bo Rinehart Studio and listen to his latest single as Coy Roy, "I'm Right Here". Episode Links: YouTube Apple Spotify

Throughout her 20+ years of teaching, Professor Bonnie Smith Whitehouse, has seen a significant change in her students' ties to religion. "I've seen them completely abandon spirituality because that drug of certainty has just gotten too toxic for them," says Whitehouse. "And so, what is really powerful to me is wonder. It's always been really powerful to me, as an Enneagram 2." This week, we talk to Bonnie Smith Whitehouse about how being an Enneagram 2 has opened her eyes to an alternate posture toward spirituality. — Bonnie Smith Whitehouse, PhD, is a writer and professor who studies storytelling, creativity, contemplation, and wonder. Check out her book, Seasons Of Wonder To learn more about Bonnie Smith Whitehouse, follow her on Instagram, or visit her website.

As the director of adolescent counseling at Daystar Counseling in Nashville, TN, Sissy Goff has seen first-hand how anxious behavior in children has been fueled by unrealistic social expectations. But according to Goff, one way to address that worry in kids is by teaching them self-talk: "I have them give the worry a name, because we all think of the voice in the back of our head as truth until we learn differently. And so to separate it out. I'll call it the worry monster. I have one girl who named her's, Bob. But adolescents come up with their own names. [So they can say] I'm not listening to you. You're always wrong. You always make me feel incapable." This week, we talk to Sissy Goff about how being an Enneagram 1 helps her in her work with young girls. — Sissy Goff, MEd, LPC-MHSP, spends most of her days counseling girls and their families alongside her assistant/pet therapist, Lucy the Havanese. Sissy serves as the director of child and adolescent counseling for Daystar Counseling Ministries(Nashville, TN) where she has worked with girls and their families for more than 25 years. Check out her book, Raising Worry-Free Girls: Helping Your Daughter Feel Braver, Stronger, and Smarter in an Anxious World. To learn more about Sissy Goff, follow her on Instagram, or visit her website.

No matter where we fall on the Enneagram, intentionality is a crucial posture to take into the new year. This week, we model how you can think ahead in the new year by drawing a few questions out of a hat and reflecting on the year to come.

A special offer for our podcast listeners: sign up for the Typology Institute today to get access to all 3 courses and other monthly perks. Go to typologyinstitute.com/workplace and use the code TYPOLOGYPODCAST for 30% savings through the end of 2022 only. The Enneagram is all about self-knowledge, self-reflection and learning about ourselves. We close out the year with today's episode, and talk through some questions that will help us reflect on our year and look back on what we learned.

A special offer for our podcast listeners: sign up for the Typology Institute today to get access to all 3 courses and other monthly perks. Go to typologyinstitute.com/workplace and use the code TYPOLOGYPODCAST for 30% savings through the end of 2022 only. This week, we take a phone call from a friend. Also: the benefits of the Enneagram for those in recovery. Tune in to hear our discussion on these topics, plus a few more. And for a chance to have your questions answered on-air, leave us a comment on social or email us at [email protected].

A special offer for our podcast listeners: sign up for the Typology Institute today to get access to all 3 courses and other monthly perks. Go to typologyinstitute.com/workplace and use the code TYPOLOGYPODCAST for 30% savings through the end of 2022 only. Every month, we record a secret ad-free podcast episode exclusively for Typology Institute Members. This week, we're giving you special access to a conversation between Ian and Anthony about the nature of anxiety and how it relates to the Enneagram. In addition to the Enneagram in the Workplace Course and monthly podcast episodes like this, the Typology Institute Membership includes: A monthly live Town Hall Q&A session with Ian about a specific topic. A monthly newsletter from Ian that shares thoughts around personal development, Enneagram insights, and spiritual formation. The "Hidden Gems of the Enneagram" video series (more video series coming soon).

A special offer for our podcast listeners: sign up for the Typology Institute today to get access to all 3 courses and other monthly perks. Go to typologyinstitute.com/workplace and use the code TYPOLOGYPODCAST for 30% savings through the end of 2022 only. I receive so many questions from our listeners via email and social media that I don't get to respond to them all. But I want you to know I'm paying attention! So, this week, Anthony pulls a few more audience questions for me to answer. I share some thoughts about how "right action" works for an Enneagram 9, the ins and outs of meditation, and how to tell whether you are a 1 or a 5. Tune in to hear our discussion on these topics, plus a few more. And for a chance to have your questions answered on-air, leave us a comment on social or email us at [email protected].

Podcast listeners: sign up for the Typology Institute today to get access to all 3 courses and other monthly perks. Go to typologyinstitute.com/workplace and use the code TYPOLOGYPODCAST for 30% savings through the end of 2022 only. Hey folks! Last week, I shared one of my favorite episodes in which the host of The Andy Stanley Leadership Podcast, founder of North Point Ministries, and author of Better Decisions, Fewer Regrets, Andy Stanley and I talked about how your type makes decisions. This week we continue our conversation and cover how each Enneagram type responds when decisions are made for them that impact their life circumstances.

We're off for Thanksgiving, but while we're gone, I wanted to share one of my favorite conversations I've been a part of about the Enneagram. Make sure to check us out next week for part two! In this episode, The host of The Andy Stanley Leadership Podcast, founder of North Point Ministries, and author of Better Decisions, Fewer Regrets, Andy Stanley takes over as host and interviews me on how each type makes decisions. To learn more about the Enneagram and how to use it in the business world, visit typologyinstitute.com/work/