Josh Bersin

How has Deel grown from zero to 4,500 employees in 100 countries in less than five years? It’s an amazing story of hyperscale growth and passionate customer focus. In today’s podcast Alex Bouaziz, CEO of Deel, talks with Kathi Enderes about his own journey from environmental engineer to founder of an HR tech company. Alex explains how he started Deel as an EOR (Employer of Record) company, and how the company has expanded into HCM and payroll around the world. He explains the EOR market and what global employment providers do, and also discusses their AI assistant, Deel AI, which can help answer any question by pulling from Deel’s knowledge base. Additional Information EOR Provider Deel Expands into HCM HR Tech Workshop Certificate Program | Josh Bersin Academy AI HR Tech Trailblazers, 2025 HR Tech Outlook  

In this conversation I share insights from my recent trip to Europe, focusing on the Workday Rising event, the current state of talent acquisition, and the evolving role of CHROs in strategic workforce planning. I discuss the importance of systemic talent acquisition, the emergence of “Precision Talent Acquisition” and the entire redefinition of this function. And I also explain why the term “Hiring Manager” is such a terrible concept. Finally I share my amazing conversation with one of the most high-powered, inspiring CHROs I’ve ever met. Takeaways Workday is integrating its products into a cohesive solution. The hiring cycle is slowing down due to economic factors. AI is increasing the value of existing workers, creating ‘super workers’ Talent acquisition should be viewed as a growth function. Precision in hiring is essential in a tight labor market. Cultural fit is as important as technical skills in hiring. Strategic workforce planning should align with business goals. The role of CHRO is evolving to include strategic planning, not “workforce planning” alone. Additional Information Klarna CEO Explains How AI-Driven Headcount Reduction Fuels Superworkers and Growth How To Make Productivity Soar: Four Stages of AI Transformation How AI Will Revolutionize The HR Department, In Detail. Galileo Professional, The Essential AI Assistant for Everything HR AI in HR Certificate Program: The Josh Bersin Academy Irresistible 2025: Sign Up Early

I know most of you have used ChatGPT, Galileo, or other AI tools in your job, but you haven’t seen anything yet. In this podcast I walk through a complete end-to-end scenario to show you precisely how AI agents will automate, scale, integrate, and vastly improve the process of hiring, onboarding, performance management, internal mobility, and more. As you’ll hear in this scenario, AI agents are going to revolutionize the talent process. Recruiters, HR Business Partners, and CHROs watch out. And this is just the beginning. Our upcoming “100 Use-Cases for Galileo in HR” will explain this in greater detail (Galileo is designed for all these use-cases and more.) Every HR professional should listen to this podcast to see the future of HR. Join our certificate program to learn more! Additional Information Become an AI Expert: AI in HR Certificate in The Josh Bersin Academy How To Make Productivity Soar: Four Stages of AI Transformation Digital Twins, Digital Employees, And Agents Everywhere Introducing The AI Trailblazers! HR Technology Outlook 2025. Galileo Professional, The Essential AI Assistant for Everything HR

What do we do about the American Dream? This week I discuss the explosion of employee and citizen activation (NYC UHG CEO, for example) and how the US economy has not been delivering for 2/3 of the workforce. And in that discussion I challenge HR and business leaders to re-engineer jobs and work around what we call Superworkers, all with a goal of using AI to increase customer service, scale, quality, and value. I try to warn and give examples of what happens when companies use technologies like AI to eliminate jobs and simply reduce labor costs. Employees will give you feedback, they can “rage quit.” Automation to reduce labor can backfire. Our job as leaders is to help build a company of Superworkers. Additional Research and Reading Donald Trump Will Do Nothing to Bring Back Our Dying American Dream (NYT research column) What Gives Poor Kids a Shot at Better Lives? Economists Find an Unexpected Answer (Raj Chetty’s research on lack of upward mobility in the US) How To Make Productivity Soar: Four Stages of AI Transformation Digital Twins, Digital Employees, And Agents Everywhere Galileo Professional, The Essential AI Assistant for Everything HR

Linda Kirchhevel, Director, Talent & Leadership Development at Sanford Health talks with Kathi Enderes about their leadership development program. Linda discusses how the organization’s frequent mergers caused them to prioritize creating a unique leadership framework centered around the mission of the organization. (Sanford Health is the largest rural healthcare provider in the United States.) The Sanford Leader Framework (“The Sanford Leader”) is applicable to anybody in the organization, focused on developing behaviors and capabilities at scale for all 45,000 employees. Built in collaboration with FranklinCovey, the leadership development model, assessment, orientation, and development plan delivers a customized leadership program at all levels. (Leading self, leading others, leading mission.) As Linda explains, this program has driven a 13 point increase in employee engagement measured through NetPromoter. And the program continues to drive high levels of employee engagement, retention, and alignment during a series of acquisitions. It exemplifies the “Irresistible Leadership” model we highlight in our research. Additional Information Human-Centered Leadership, Certificate Program in The Josh Bersin Academy (Join today!) Why Are Some Companies More Dynamic Than Others? The Surprising Facts About Leadership Development (podcast)

AI tools are rapidly sweeping across our companies in every job function, and most of us see them as “productivity tools.” Well, that’s a very limited view of the future. While AI may make you 15-20% more productive, the big payoff comes when we rethink work entirely and let AI systems take over as “autonomous agents,” albeit with our support. In this podcast I discuss the four stages of AI adoption, and help you think about the important job-redesign work we’ll do in 2025. And I would argue that “doing existing work faster” is going to become a commodity quickly. And at levels 3 and 4 we will be re-engineering jobs and work, developing new skills, improving pay, and empowering people to do more! You can read more about this in our upcoming 2025 Predictions report, but the best next step is get your hands on Galileo, the AI Expert Assistant for Everything HR. (And Join the Josh Bersin Academy!)

Companies have been investing in People Analytics and Industrial Psychology since the late 1800s, going back to Fredrick Taylor (time and motion studies) and Carl Jung (psychological types). The original idea was to scientifically manage work, using data to measure labor, strength, motion, and later engagement, skills, and leadership. All this effort resulted in thousands of books and tools to measure employee engagement, employee experience, productivity, and organization design. Ultimately where we landed was a new domain we call People Analytics: using people-related data to monitor, improve, and optimize business outcomes. And this journey, which I’ve been a part of for 30 years, resulted in a massive investment in HR technology platforms, engagement surveys, sentiment analysis tools, and more and more models for trust, leadership, management, wellbeing, and employee growth. All that energy, deep thinking, and investment now lands in a new world, one we call “Systemic Business Analytics.” We use this name because it’s time to stop isolating people data from business data and running this domain as “projects,” rather think about it as an integrated analytics system. In other words, as I explain in the podcast, let’s move forward and take all the people data we capture and embed it right into our existing business measurement systems. Instead of creating a “people data warehouse” to run reports and analysis on HR information, we can use that valuable information and put it right in the hands of business leaders and managers. Our new research, “The Journey to Systemic Business Analytics,” details this journey and shows you our four level maturity model. (You can view the maturity model here.) Today fewer than 10% of companies are doing this well, but that’s still a large number. And as I describe in the podcast, AI is going to light a bonfire under this space and rapidly accelerate this direction. Additional Information People Analytics, A Complex Domain, Is About To Be Transformed by AI. People Analytics Certificate Course in The Josh Bersin Academy Systemic Analytics: A New Approach Galileo, The AI Assistant for Everything HR

This week I summarize my meetings and discussions with clients in NYC and you can see we covered many topics. Here’s the AI summary, which is pretty good. In this conversation, Josh Bersin discusses the evolving landscape of AI platforms, particularly focusing on Microsoft’s positioning and the challenges of creating a universal AI agent. He delves into the complexities of government efficiency, emphasizing the institutional challenges faced in re-engineering government operations. The conversation also highlights the automation of work tasks and the need for businesses to decompose job functions for better efficiency. Bersin stresses the importance of expertise in HR, advocating for a shift towards full stack professionals who possess a broad understanding of various HR functions. Finally, he addresses the impending disruption in Learning and Development (L&D) due to AI advancements, predicting a significant transformation in how L&D professionals will manage knowledge and skills. Additional Information Inside Microsoft’s struggles with Copilot (Business Insider Exclusive) Hyper-Growth Through Efficiency: Theme For The New Era Digital Twins, Digital Employees, And Agents Everywhere Chatbot Architecture: MS Copilot, Joule, Galileo, and The Future of L&D

In today’s podcast I discuss the organizational, institutional, and societal impacts of AI. And I’m not predicting what “could happen” but rather sharing “what is happening now.” As you’ll hear, AI plays a role in our political issues but an even greater role in our careers, pay, rewards, organization structure, and culture. A recent AI adoption study by McKinsey found that 74% of companies have at least one AI application in place, and 20% have 3 or more. So we’re already seeing the impact. As you’ll hear, this is a technology that people are worried about at the moment, so we need to consider many levels of change management throughout our organizations. Chapters 00:00 The Rapid Rise of AI and Automation 05:13 Job Transformation and AI Impact 08:56 Privacy Concerns in the Age of AI 12:47 Organizational Design and Talent Density 20:48 Leadership in the AI Era 29:54 Embracing AI: The Path Forward Additional Information Hyper-Growth Through Efficiency: Theme For The New Era How To Create Talent Density Were These Layoffs Inevitable? Perhaps, But Here’s How It Happened. People as Competitive Advantage: Certificate Course In The Josh Bersin Academy

After decades of effort and growth, only around 10% of People Analytics teams deliver strategic business value. Many are still focused on traditional analysis of engagement, retention, leadership pipelines, and other HR measures. In this WhatWorks podcast I talk openly with Paul Rubenstein, the Chief Customer Officer at Visier, about how this market has evolved. And in the conversation you can learn about Visier and the role of integrated, AI-platforms for the important topic of managing corporate HR and work data. Our newest research on People Analytics is coming out this month, stay tuned for much more detail on this topic. Additional Information People Analytics, Evolved: A Systemic Approach Certificate Course in People Analytics from The Josh Bersin Company    

This week I discuss the issue of DEI (must it DIE?), inclusion, and corporate culture in the Trump Era. We just completed a 1.5 hour discussion with 30+ companies on the impact of the 2024 election and regardless of your political position, some people are worried. It’s clear to me that DEI (or whatever you call it) is not going away, but in this podcast I reframe the topic and give you perspectives from some of the largest companies in the world. Additional Information Are Diversity And Inclusion Programs Going Away? Elevating Equity: A Certificate Program From The Josh Bersin Academy Chief Diversity Officer: The Toughest Job in Business

In this episode of the WhatWorks podcast, Paul Walker, CEO of FranklinCovey, talks with Kathi Enderes about FranklinCovey’s history, his own journey of 25 years with the company from frontline employee to CEO, and how the company helps large organizations like Marriott enable transformational change through individual behavior change, execution excellence, creating a culture of trust and performance, and developing new leadership capabilities. FranklinCovey (FC) is one of the only publicly traded learning and leadership companies in the world. Learn about how FC helps Marriott deliver one of the most highly esteemed customer experiences in the hospitality market. Interviewee: Paul Walker, CEO FranklinCovey Additional Information The Surprising Facts About Leadership Development, Human-Centered Leadership, Why Are Some Companies More Dynamic Than Others?

This week I discuss how major new AI use-cases have emerged. Imagine if every employee had a personal AI assistant? It’s going to happen. I also discuss LinkedIn Hiring Assistant, Galileo, SuccessFactors Joule, AI for performance management, and a big question: what are you going to do with the 35% productivity you gain? Coming back from multiple weeks on the road with clients and vendors, this podcast will expand your thinking and help you build your own business case for AI tools and agents in your own HR organization. While many of us believe AI is a productivity tool, I explain how AI use-cases in HR are for expansive than you realized. Watch this YouTube to learn about the two ways to think about AI applications. Keywords: AI in HR, recruitment, productivity, coaching, job descriptions, LinkedIn, generative AI, HR technology, innovation, use cases Additional Information LinkedIn Enters AI Agent Race With LinkedIn Hiring Assistant Digital Twins, Digital Employees, And Agents Everywhere SuccessFactors Leapfrogs HCM Capabilities: AI, Skills, Talent Intelligence, And More Introducing Galileo Pro, Your Personal AI Assistant for HR a9W3O0GjMWKbGryeXy5J  

In this week’s podcast I discuss the trend (and need) for job task re-engineering: breaking down our jobs into tasks, so we can effectively use AI and Agents to speed things up. As more and more vendors announce AI Agents to assist with work, our best opportunity for massive improvement is to “re-engineer” how we do things, not just “add agents” to our current jobs. As I describe, most companies build job titles in a “mashed potato” approach where we squash a bunch of things into one job description. Thanks to AI we can now think about work differently, and this will impact sales, marketing, HR, engineering, and just about every other function in our companies. In some ways this is a return to the old ERP model of “designing work around the software” but this time the Agents are smart, programmable, and learning! So if we do this well we’re going to see massive improvements in productivity. I talk about Rolls Royce, EPAM, and the PR battle between Salesforce and Microsoft for “Agent-Tech.” Plus I talk about why Chief Learning Officers have a new role in 2025! Lots of new ideas to think about here. Please watch this video for more on this topic. Additional Information Get your hands on Galileo Professional: your personal AI assistant for HR Digital Twins, Digital Employees, And Agents Everywhere Redesigning Work with AI Vendors Mentioned Agentforce by Salesforce Copilot Agents by Microsoft Sana Labs (the platform under Galileo)  

In this episode of the WhatWorks podcast series, Nick Benaquista, SVP, People and Capability Partner, Chief Administration Office and Strategic Growth at Mastercard, shares how Mastercard has transformed HR from a static, siloed, overlapping model towards the product and consulting-oriented model of Systemic HR. Now in year 2 of the ongoing transformation, the company is continuing to change HR roles, jobs, operating models, and skills, and is using technology and AI to elevate the employee experience and its continuous business transformation. Interviewee Nick Benaquista, SVP, People and Capability Partner, Chief Administration Office and Strategic Growth at Mastercard Company Mastercard, a leading US-based global payment solutions provider with 33,000 employees Additional Information The Systemic HR Operating Model Why The World Needs A New Operating Model for Human Resources The Mastercard HR Transformation Story Keywords: Employee Experience, HR Technology, Systemic HR, AI in HR, HR capabilities, HR roles

White collar robots have arrived: digital twins, digital assistants, and AI-powered agents. In this podcast I discuss what I learned about at Unleash, Sana, and Spotify this week. My big message is this: AI in HR is even more powerful than we expected. And AI platforms and tools are transforming HR right this minute – across every domain in HR. Digital Twins in the insurance industry. AI-powered L&D and change management solutions. AI-powered candidates battling it out with AI-powered selection and recruiting platforms. Scheduling bots unleashing energy in healthcare. End-to-end employee knowledge and learning systems at Spotify. For two years we’ve watched AI evolve from predictive analytics to AI assistants to AI agents to Digital Twins. And these tools are now here for you to use, as long as you just get your hands dirty trying these tools out. Bottom line: this is no longer a market of waiting for just the right solution – many of the new AI tools in HR can already do much more than you expected. Get your hands on Galileo and you’ll see what I’m talking about. Additional Information Introducing The AI Trailblazers! HR Technology Outlook 2025. Introducing Galileo Professional, Your Personal AI Assistant for HR Can AI Do Performance Reviews? Rippling Says Yes.

Delta Air Lines understands the importance of its employees, managers, and leaders, so the company has built one of the airline industry’s most advanced “skills-first” strategies. Built on its investment in SAP technology (Talent Intelligence Hub) and a focus from the top, the company fully embraces an agile cross-functional career model, all built around skills. In this episode Tim Gregory, Managing Director of HR Innovation and Technology at Delta, walks Kathi Enderes through the company’s strategy, describing how Delta uses skillstech and AI to help employees advance their careers across job families in the company (we call this The Dynamic Organization). Delta is a pioneer in this effort: most airlines fall far behind in their talent and HR strategies. As Tim describes, this strategy not only helps employees grow and develop, it gives Delta a foundation of sustainability and customer service others only emulate. Delta is rated the #1 airline for passenger service in the US, and we believe this HR strategy is foundational to its market success. Join our course Career and Talent Mobility to learn more. Additional Information Delta Now Rated As Customers’ Favorite Airline SAP SuccessFactors Delivers on HXM and The Promise of AI Career and Talent Mobility: Certificate Program from The Josh Bersin Academy    

I just finished a long meeting with 15 senior HR leaders in Silicon Valley, so in the context of AI, I discuss the themes of forgiveness, growth, and leadership these organizations are facing. And these issues are acute right now. 2025 is shaping up to be a “Year of Redesign” throughout business, and as we do this we have to rethink about how we think about people. Are we ready to support, forgive, and help our people adapt? Leadership trust is at an all time low, so we definitely have some work to do. I also describe how Satya Nadella embraces this idea of continuous growth as a very senior leader. I also discuss the growing value of “Vertical AI” solutions and how they will complement and add value in a world of large AI providers, and give you a sense of where I believe the AI market is going. Takeaways: Forgiveness and growth are essential for business transformation. Personal reinvention is part of embracing AI. Company skills strategies may fail if people don’t feel safe and empowered. Vertical AI solutions will outperform horizontal solutions. “Always learning” is a necessary part of building a high-performing company. Additional Information Corporate Citizenship Redefined Leadership Trust Is Dropping (PwC) The Value of Values As Organizations Build on Trust Introducing Galileo Professional, Your Personal AI Assistant for HR    

This week we are so excited to launch Galileo Professional, the personal AI platform designed for HR professionals, consultants, vendors, and investors in the global Human Resources industry. As you’ll hear in my introduction, Galileo Pro is Your Personal AI Assistant for everything HR. For $39 per month you now have access to the most trusted corpus of HR research in the world, including every research study, maturity model, case study, vendor profile, and benchmark we’ve done for 26+ years. This corpus is powered by the Sana advanced AI platform to give you personalized advice, education, and tools to help you in every area of HR. Our trusted content providers (Lightcast, Oyster, Visier, Heidrick & Struggles) add global data on regulatory practices, skills, salary and turnover benchmarks, and leadership models, and we are adding more trusted content every week. And best of all, Galileo Pro is an open Gen AI platform for you to add your company’s policies, procedures, hiring guides, and other internal tools so you have your own personal (or company) Gen AI system to help with every HR topic you face. Listen to the podcast, along with an AI-generated (thanks to Google Notebook LLM) Q&A on Galileo Professional, including a discussion of the Galileo Success Center, your place to learn about AI and share world-class ideas, innovations, and solutions built on the Galileo Platform. You can purchase Galileo Professional today for yourself, your team, or your organization. Join us on this exciting journey of AI-powered HR, leadership, and management solutions in the decade ahead.

In this week’s podcast I give you some insights on HR tech in 2025, perspectives on jobs, and what you’ll be dealing with in 2025. We just had two weeks of HR Tech announcements and next week you’ll see a big one from us! (The biggest product announcement in my career, to be a little hyberbolic!). Topics include: the verticalization of AI, whey OpenAI will compete with Microsoft, how agents will change our jobs, and the implications of the low unemployment rate on pay equity, DEI, talent density, recruiting, and organization design. For those of you who agree with me on Organization Design in 2025, here is the Org Design SuperClass, which is a “must consume” offering for the coming year. Watch this space for our Big Reveal Next Tuesday! Additional Information Understanding The Job Market (video) The Org Design SuperClass How To Create Talent Density The Definitive Guide to Building a Dynamic Organization Galileo, the world’s AI-powered expert assistant for HR.    

Aimbridge manages 1100 hotels around the US and employs more than 45,000 employees. In this podcast, Conrad Riddle, VP of HR Shared Services at Aimbridge Hospitality, discusses how the company empowers employees (“Uberizing the Workforce”) and delivers a flexible, highly engaged workforce with dynamic workforce scheduling. The company leverages UKG Workforce Management to give employees a centralized app that lets an employee manage their schedule dynamically. As you’ll hear, Ambridge employees can now “bid and ask” for new shifts without going through management. Through schedule sharing across locations and bidding on shifts in an online platform, employees have more flexibility in their schedules and empowers them to manage their own shifts. It also enables managers to easily approve requests and effectively manage labor to avoid costly contractors. Additional Information Employee Experience: The Definitive Guide New Research: Cloud-Based HCM Can Redefine Employee Experience Join The Employee Experience Workshop: A Certificate Program In The Josh Bersin Academy  

In this week’s podcast I go through the 30 HR Technology AI Trailblazers in some detail. You’ll hear about all the companies in the Trailblazer Report, as well as some of my personal thoughts on their leadership teams, centers of innovation, and differentiating capabilities. My keynote at HR Tech was 75 minutes long and you can hear it or get access to the materials if you join our corporate membership (or come back to HR Tech 2025 next March). For those of you in Europe, I will be speaking at Unleash Paris on Thursday October 17 and I will also be discussing many of these topics at Workday Rising EMEA on Wednesday December 11 at the RAI Conference Center in Amsterdam. In the meantime, I hope you enjoy hearing about these 30 amazing companies, each of which is delivering on AI in high-value, high-ROI solutions. I also spent some time talking about the COST of AI and why and how you can work on a business case for these new AI capabilities and make sure you have a clear use-case and implementation plan for these new, exciting, high-value innovations. AI in HR has reached a tipping point: it’s here and it’s delivering real value. Now we all have to figure out what to buy, which major players to standardize on, and which use-cases to address first. Vendors Discussed ADP Lyric HCM, Arist Creator and Teammate, Cornerstone Galaxy, Disprz Learning System, Draup Talent Intelligence, Deel Employment of Record Platform, Docebo Creator, Eightfold Career Navigator and Talent Intelligence, Galileo: The Expert AI Assistant for HR, Gloat Workforce Agility, Growthspace Precision Skilling, Heidrick & Struggles Navigator, HiBob, Lattice, LinkedIn Learning, Lightcast Skills, Medallia, Oracle HCM, Oyster Global Employment Platform, Paradox, Rippling Talent Signal, Sana Labs, SAP SuccessFactors and Joule, SeekOut, ServiceNow, SHL Global Assessments, UKG Bryte, Visier Vee, Workday Illuminate AI Platform (and HiredScore), Workera Skills System. Additional Information The Trailblazer and HR Tech 2025 Report Josh Bersin Company Announces 30 AI HR Tech Trailblazer Vendors the CHRO Really Needs to Know About  

This podcast details what Workday’s new AI platform, Workday Illuminate, and also describes Workday’s momentum coming out of Rising. I also discuss why Salesforce slams Microsoft, the new tsunami of Agents, including Microsoft, Salesforce (who is charging $2 per conversation), SAP, Workday, UKG, ServiceNow, and others. I also discuss the near-term job disruption we’re seeing from Agents and what you should do to prepare. Then I discuss the strikes at Boeing and why “growth at any cost” is such a dangerous business strategy, and how we may avoid this problem in our companies. Read Irresistible to learn more. Additional Information What Is Workday Illuminate? Galileo Selected As Workday Innovation Partner Benioff Slams Microsoft as he Promotes Salesforce Agents Irresistible: The Seven Secrets of the World’s Most Enduring, Employee-Focused Organizations

In our latest WhatWorks podcast, Samantha Garvie, HR Safety and Compliance Director at Rowley’s Wholesale, speaks with Kathi Enderes from The Josh Bersin Company. Rowley’s Wholesale, a Michigan-based distributor of automotive and industrial products, has been in business for over 100 years and is currently in its third generation of ownership. With 125+ employees across three locations, the company utilizes UKG-Ready for its HRIS system, covering benefits, timekeeping, payroll, succession planning, and learning management. The mobile app has been widely adopted by employees, enabling them to access important information and complete tasks remotely. Samantha shares insights on how they deployed this important platform and discusses her plans to explore AI to improve fatigue management, stress management, retention, and succession planning. This episode offers valuable lessons on leveraging HR technology to support a distributed workforce. Interviewee: Samantha Garvie, HR Safety and Compliance Director, Rowley’s Wholesale Company: Rowley’s Wholesale, a US-based distributor of automotive and industrial products with 125 employees

This week Klarna, a buy-now pay-later company in Sweden, announced plans to terminate its Workday and Salesforce relationships and build it themselves. A bunch of tech pundits are big fans, but I have my doubts. As you’ll hear in the podcast, many big companies (much bigger than Klarna) have tried this, only to retreat to vendor solutions. And I do question the business strategy of putting high-powered engineering talent on mature, enterprise products like HCM and CRM. Obviously AI is getting smarter and more capable by the minute. As I explain in the podcast, there are better ways to think about this problem, and this conversation opens up the door to a big discussion about the future of enterprise apps, agentic AI, and the role of large-scale incumbent vendors in our corporate IT stacks. Additional Information Klarna Cuts 50% of Workforce, Ends Partnerships with Salesforce and Workday Amid Generative AI Overhaul Klarna Plans to ‘Shut Down SaaS Providers’ and Replace Them With Internally Built AI. The Tech World Is Pretty Skeptical AI Agents, The New Workforce We’re Not Quite Ready For (Agentic AI)

Agentic AI is the next big wave in AI, where AI systems and chatbots can take actions on our behalf. These agents can perform tasks such as composing emails, creating documents, building courses, and even recruiting. They can be seen as virtual employees or teammates that can be trained and managed. These agents will change the technology landscape and the stack of tools in our organizations. They will require onboarding, training, and governance to ensure they are effective and secure. And Agentic AI has the potential to improve productivity and provide measurable ROI. Keywords agentic AI, AI systems, chatbots, virtual employees, virtual teammates, training manager, recruiting agent, technology landscape, productivity improvement, measurable ROI Takeaways Agentic AI allows AI systems and chatbots to take actions on our behalf, performing tasks such as composing emails, creating documents, building courses, and recruiting. These agents can be seen as virtual employees or teammates that can be trained and managed. Agentic AI will change the technology landscape and the stack of tools in organizations, requiring onboarding, training, and governance. These agents have the potential to improve productivity and provide measurable ROI. Chapters 00:00 Introduction to Agentic AI 01:11 Agentic AI in Training Management 05:56 Agentic AI in Recruiting 09:03 Onboarding and Training Agentic AI 12:08 Changing the Technology Landscape with Agentic AI 16:31 Measuring the ROI of Agentic AI Additional Information AI Agents, The New Workforce We’re Not Quite Ready For Artificial Intelligence in HR: Certificate Course From The Josh Bersin Academy Introducing Galileo, The World’s First AI-Powered Expert Assistant For HR Autonomous Corporate Learning Platforms: Arriving Now, Powered by AI    

In this podcast I discuss the ever-changing role of Labor in our economy, our companies, and our own personal lives. The word “labor” is really an old-fashioned idea, but we still have the US holiday, so I wanted to unpack what it now means. As you’ll learn Labor Day is a time to think about hiring, pay, development, and diversity as well as productivity, labor unions, the impact of tips and income inequality, and the enormous role of HR as an ombudsman between “labor” and “management.” And yes, AI is going to force us to think deeper about what “people” do in our companies. Remember that we’re all “labor” and every employee is a human being. So while US Labor Day was originally a way to celebrate unions and organized labor, let’s also think broader about all the value-based investments we make in every person in our companies. Keywords: Labor Day, labor movement, workers, economy, automation, technology, labor shortage, skills shortage, investment in employees, unions, fair pay, benefits, working conditions, income inequality, HR professionals, Boeing, Starbucks, employee activation Chapters: 00:00 The Importance of Workers in the Economy 02:11 Automation and the Changing Labor Force 04:07 Investing in Employees to Attract and Retain Talent 14:37 The Role of Unions in Advocating for Fairness 17:48 Addressing Income Inequality 20:08 The Role of HR in Supporting Employees   Additional Information When Will The Trillions Invested In AI Pay Off? Sooner Than You Think. With Thoughtful Design And Culture, Dropbox Proves Remote Work Is A Winner AI in HR Certificate Program in The Josh Bersin Academy Learn about Galileo: The World’s AI Assistant for HR

In this WhatWorks podcast I interview Andy Bradshaw, the CEO of SHL. SHL is one of the world’s largest psychometric assessment vendors, bringing together psychology, skills assessment, and other forms of measurement to identify the capabilities, and potential of an individual at work. These highly scientific assessments are widely used for pre-hire screening, job-fit analysis, development planning, leadership development, and succession planning. But in a world of AI, where large HR platforms are “inferring” skills and capabilities, where do they fit? Andy, who has led SHL for many years, explains how psychometric assessment fits into the new world of AI and Talent Intelligence. He also shares how SHL itself has amassed a large data set on skills and roles that makes SHL a big data vendor as well. Keywords SHL, talent intelligence, assessments, AI, talent acquisition, talent management, leadership assessment, benchmarking, data-driven decisions Episode Chapters 00:00 Introduction 00:57 SHL: A Talent Intelligence Business 02:21 Psychometric Assessments and Tailored Solutions 03:47 Customization and Defensibility of Assessments 06:37 Consolidation in the Assessment Market 07:07 The Complementary Role of AI and Assessments 08:56 Assessments vs. AI: The Value of Insights 12:49 Assessing Leaders: Experience, Ability, and Potential 16:09 Benchmarking and Data-driven Decisions 19:03 Talent Intelligence: Aggregating Data for Better Decisions 21:17 Conclusion Additional Information Introducing the HR Career Navigator The Talent Intelligence Primer When Will The Trillions Invested In AI Pay Off? Sooner Than You Think.

In this week’s podcast I describe the HR Career Navigator and the role of HR skills and capabilities in HR and business transformation. Then, as we approach HR Tech season, I give you my three steps to evaluating HR Tech vendors. Additional Information Introducing The HR Career Navigator Why Is It So Hard To Be A Chief HR Officer (CHRO)? Research Shows That High Growth Large Companies Have Distinct HR Skills

This week I recap the idea of a “Corporate Learning Architecture” and give you some of my historic perspectives on why this is so important in the age of AI. A Learning Architecture is a constrained approach to corporate L&D that gives employees a clear and memorable approach to learning, and also gives you the “freedom within a framework” to use AI without creating chaos. We are in the middle of deep interviews, case studies, and vendor research on the impact of AI on L&D, so as I discuss here if you’d like to talk with us please let us know. Some of this podcast will be a good overview of the basics, but this is important because we don’t want our business training environments to look like TikTok! Contact us at https://joshbersin.com if you’d like to join in our Pacesetter Program for Corporate L&D. Additional Information Oldie: The Need For A Learning Architecture Autonomous Corporate Learning Platforms: Arriving Now, Powered by AI The $340 Billion Corporate Learning Industry Is Poised For Disruption AI in HR Certificate Program in The Josh Bersin Academy

In this episode, Susan Podlogar, former CHRO at MetLife, talks with Kathi Enderes about the transformative impact of an AI-based talent marketplace (powered by Gloat). You’ll learn what a talent marketplace is, how to implement, and why these solutions are rapidly growing around the world. Podlogar explains how they implemented this solution and how it unleashes energy for individuals and the organization. MetLife’s talent marketplace democratizes access to projects, mentoring, and roles, fostering an inclusive culture and enhancing skill development. She also explains how this HR solution drives critical skills development (ie. actuaries) for competitive advantage. As Susan explains, today 60% of employees participate and more than 400,000 of work hours have been saved – driving productivity, engagement, and financial returns. Additional Information The Mad Scramble To Lead The Talent Marketplace Market The Definitive Guide to Building a Dynamic Organization Career and Talent Mobility: Certificate Program In The Josh Bersin Academy

The NYT published an article explaining how hard it is to be an HR professional. “The job has become an exasperating ordeal. People hate us.” While many people don’t know this, HR is a complex, difficult, and highly strategic profession. And given that HR professionals are caught between leadership and employees, it can often be very frustrating. Despite the challenges, HR is more important than ever. I hope this podcast (and the NYT article) is an inspiration for HR professionals to build your sense of confidence and professional capabilities. (Learn more about Systemic HR.) Additional Information NYT Article “So, Human Resources Is Making You Miserable?” Redefining HR’s Role As A Consultant, Value-Driver, And Center of Innovation: Systemic HR The Josh Bersin Academy: Upping The Game of Thousands of HR Professionals Every Day Read About Systemic HR in Action

In this conversation, I discuss three main topics: the battle in the enterprise chatbot space, the transformation of talent acquisition, and the new “sticky” state of the job market. How to make sense of enterprise AI Copilots? Workday and Salesforce team up, Apple Intelligence is coming, how do you make sense of it all? In talent acquisition, there is a shift from a thin model focused on speed and efficiency to a thick model focused on growth and strategic decision-making (Systemic Talent Acquisition). Finally, to address the more “sticky” job market, companies need to improve their workforce planning to navigate the changing economic landscape and leverage alternative sources of talent. Additional Information Workday Salesforce Partnership: Teaming Up For Enterprise AI Here Come The Copilots! Artificial Intelligence in HR Certificate Course The Organization Design SuperClass

In this podcast I summarize a series of high-level meetings I’ve had with HR leaders in the EU, where companies are very focused on preparing for tectonic shifts in employee expectations, skills, and work rules. While articles and podcasts continue to talk about “the future of work,” I believe that narrative is over. The industrial work model has ended and the future has arrived, and I describe it clearly in this episode. Takeaways The industrial model of work is decomposing, and the traditional job structure is being replaced by more flexible and agile work arrangements. Employees are changing jobs and industries frequently, and skills have become transportable. Gig, contract, and part-time work is now mainstream, and the 4-day week is coming. Companies need to focus on reskilling employees and promoting learning agility to adapt to the changing workforce. Continuous performance feedback and accountability are becoming more important than annual performance appraisals. High-performing companies have a clear mission, strong leadership, and a focus on employee development and support. AI is transforming the workplace, and HR professionals need to upskill in AI to stay relevant. Additional Information Welcome To The Post-Industrial Age Understanding Galileo, The World’s AI-Powered Expert for HR AI in HR: Certificate Courses in The Josh Bersin Academy  

Today I broadcast again from Ireland, where I discuss why I disagree with SHRM’s position on DEI, how DEI is undermined and why it remains important, the unfortunate decline in civility in the American workplace, and how we afford the $2 Trillion investments in #AI. (Read our research report Elevating Equity to understand the real-world business case for DEI and pay equity.) Keywords DEI, equity, fairness, civility, values at work, political discourse, ROI of AI, SHRM Takeaways Equity is a crucial aspect of DEI, representing fairness and justice in the workplace, and lives on for many business reasons. Civility is essential for effective communication and collaboration at work. The lack of civility in the United States is a concerning issue that needs to be addressed. The ROI of AI is still uncertain, and organizations need to carefully evaluate the value it brings. Already AI provides time-saving benefits, enables new capabilities, and enhance learning and problem-solving. Additional Resources SHRM’s Problematic DEI Pivot Elevating Equity: Josh Bersin Academy Certificate Course on DEI Civility in the Workplace (research) Goldman Sachs MIT ROI of AI Analysis Checking In On AI Reality With Chevron’s CIO    

In this podcast I discuss the recent layoffs at UKG and Intuit and how AI played a role quite different than we expected. In both cases the CEOs tell us that AI is the future and that they need large amounts of capital to invest in this new capability, thus they are “pre-replacing” human capital with technology. In addition to this, as I discuss, both companies (Intuit in some detail) describe how “underperformers” were the first to go. So these are somewhat strategic moves to “re-hire” their teams and upgrade skills. And this also points out the very large cost of AI, which forces CEOs to redeploy financial resources from labor to capital. Lots of subtle implications here, and I have to believe other CEOs will look at this and consider the same moves. Additional Information UKG and Intuit Reductions In Force: Both Growth Moves AI in HR Professional Certificate Program, from The Josh Bersin Academy  

This is the inaugural podcast in our new WhatWorks Series, focused on stories and case studies of the world’s most interesting and creative HR teams. In this podcast, Kathi Enderes, SVP and Global Analyst, interviews Allan Calonge, Chief People Officer, and Levi Loverkamp, Chief Workforce Planning Officer, who describe how Bon Secours Mercy Health’s systemic HR integrates cross-functional collaboration, data-driven decisions, and career pathways through a partnership with Guild. Led by CHRO Joe Gage, the HR team emphasizes trust, long tenures, and a robust people insights and analytics capability, transforming talent management and organizational culture. Listeners can learn about Systemic HR and how to transform HR in this podcast. The WhatWorks Series will include interviews with pacesetter HR leaders, teams, and vendors. If you have a story you’d like to share, please contact us. Additional Information The Systemic HR Initiative Why Is It So Hard To Be A Chief HR Officer (CHRO)? Learn about Galileo, the World’s AI Expert Assistant for HR Special Josh Bersin Academy Course: AI in HR (highly acclaimed)    

In this podcast I discuss the four huge transformations taking place in corporate learning & development, all driven by AI. Join me in the discussion here and you can learn more in The Josh Bersin Academy, where we just launched our AI in HR Course and two mobile-learning micro-courses on AI use cases and Generative AI best-practices. Outline: The learning and development industry is going through a significant reinvention driven by AI and other emerging technologies. AI is disrupting the traditional instructional delivery paradigm by automating content creation and personalizing learning experiences. The learning and development technology stack is undergoing radical changes, with learning management systems being commoditized and learning experience platforms struggling to define their role. The consumption of learning is becoming hyper-personalized, and learning and knowledge management are converging. The roles in L&D will totally change. Additional Information Introducing Galileo, The World’s First AI-Powered Expert Assistant For HR HR Predictions for 2024: The Global Search For Productivity Why Do Companies Hire Too Many People?

In this podcast I walk through a few of the findings from our CHRO Insights® research, explaining why the CHRO role has become more complex and difficult than ever. This podcast episode discusses the challenges, issues, drivers, success factors, and derailers of being a head of HR or CHRO. I share early insights from a massive research project that studied 47,000 heads of HR from various industries and sectors. The research reveals that many CHROs did not come from their own company, indicating a lack of succession management and internal development. It also highlights the complex and multifunctional nature of the CHRO role, requiring HR domain expertise, C-level executive skills, systemic thinking, comfort with data and technology, and a good understanding of human nature. If you are hiring a CHRO or aspiring to a senior HR role, listen in. And read my in-depth article on the topic. Chapters 00:00 Introduction: The Success and Frustrations of Being a CHRO or Head of HR 04:10 Insights from a Massive Research Project on CHROs 09:21 The Challenges of Moving into a CHRO Role 16:06 The Complex and Multifunctional Nature of the CHRO Role 21:53 Conclusion: Opportunities for CHROs to Learn and Connect Additional Information The Ever Expanding Role of the CHRO (YouTube) Introducing The Systemic HR Initiative Learn about Galileo, the World’s AI Expert Assistant for HR Special Josh Bersin Academy Course: AI in HR (highly acclaimed)

Arist, a fascinating new company in corporate learning, is reinventing how we develop, deliver, and consume content. And yes, these guys are bringing Autonomous Learning to companies today, in a very special format. In this podcast I interviewed Michael Ioffe, Ryan Laverty, and Maxine Anderson, the three founders. Not only is the technology fascinating, this is also an example of how a strong, integrated management team can build a business quickly. Arist was founded in 2019 and is quickly becoming a category leader in micro-learning and what I call “learning in the flow of work.” If you’re trying to reinvent your slow, clunky, expensive, training process, this podcast will give you some amazing new ideas. And you can experience this amazing experience in the two free courses below! Additional Information (And Experience the Content!) Autonomous Corporate Learning Platforms: Arriving Now, Powered by AI Arist Course: Becoming a Gen AI Savvy HR Professional (Free) SMS: Text “GENAI” to 20202 via SMS (US only) WhatsApp: Text “GENAI” to +1 903-459-6893 Arist Course: Josh Bersin’s HR Predictions for 2024 (Free) SMS: Text JBA2024 to 20202 WhatsApp: Text JBA2024 to +1 903-459-6893 Join The Josh Bersin Academy for more!      

In this episode I explain what’s happening in the Chatbot or “Intelligent Agent” market as vendors produce Copilots and we start to figure out how they’ll work together. I discuss our own plans for Galileo and explain how SAP Joule is partnering with Microsoft to integrate these agents. It’s early days and vendors like ServiceNow, Workday, and others are actively working here. Then I give you some insights on our massive new research program in corporate L&D. Yes, AI is the big disruptor hitting corporate training and I explain why this is far bigger than the e-learning era we experienced 24 years ago. Additional Information Learn about Galileo, the World’s AI Expert Assistant for HR Special Josh Bersin Academy Course: AI in HR (highly acclaimed) Autonomous Learning Platforms: Arriving Now, Powered by AI Galileo Availability With Four New Trusted Content Partners  

In this podcast I describe the new, transformed role of HR Business Partner. This pivotal position, which was defined 25+ years ago as an “HR Generalist,” has now become pivotal to a company’s successful people strategy. If you want to learn more, check out our most popular course in the Josh Bersin Academy, the HR Consulting Masterclass, or call us for advice. Of all the things we deal with in business, none are as important as having the right level of management, leadership, and HR expertise at the point of need. This is the new role for the HRBP, and this podcast gives specific examples. This topic is part of our complete Systemic HR advisory program, which has been rolling out over the last year. If you’re trying to make your HR team or HR department more effective, please give us a call. Additional Information Introducing the Systemic HR Initiative Introducing Galileo, The World’s First AI-Powered Expert Assistant For HR Overview of Systemic HR: The Four Levels Of Maturity (podcast)  

Globalization Partners (G-P), a company specializing in global employer of record services (EOR), discusses the complexities and opportunities in the global employment market. They emphasize the importance of compliance, automation, and the human touch in their approach. In this podcast I interview Nicole Sahin, Founder and CEO, and Nat Nataranjan, Chief Product Officer. The EOR space is massive: including providers like G-P, Deel, Oyster, Remote, Papaya Global, Rippling, and others. In this interview Nicole and Nat explain the history of the market and how G-P has built its highly service-centric, technology-agnostic, partner-centric approach to global hiring and growth. Additional Information The Global Workforce Intelligence Project EOR Provider Deel Expands Into HCM (and Payroll)    

Given this week’s political news, I wanted to share my thoughts on “Citizenship,” the way we as employees and individuals work together to help our company and our society make decisions the benefit everyone. We live in a world of shatteringly fast change, with two global wars, a rising sense of mistrust of political systems, and enormous changes to our working and family lives. Despite all this change, and the difficult decisions we must make, there is a process for continuous improvement. And this process, which I label Citizenship, applies to our companies, our teams, as well as our cities, states, and societies. This podcast discusses this issue and is here to convince you that you, as an individual manager, employee, or leader, have an enormously important role in creating a positive, high-performing community in your company. Citizenship: the character of an individual viewed as a member of society; behavior in terms of the duties, obligations, and functions of a citizen: e.g. an award for good citizenship. (Dictionary.com, based on Oxford English Dictionary.) Sound Bites “The reason we have political systems in the world is to find a way for individuals and businesses to legislate, debate, argue, and negotiate the resource allocation of a country, of a state, or a city.” “A company is essentially a small society. We have to make decisions on how we allocate resources as well.” “Citizenship to me is a really wonderful word because what it tends to mean is you as an individual, we as individuals have two fundamental roles in society.” Keywords politics, citizenship, resource allocation, organizations, internal citizenship, diversity, financial performance, Workday, DEI, Starbucks, society, government Additional Information World-Class Diversity and Inclusion: Elevating Equity (Josh Bersin Academy Certificate Course) The Voice of the Employee (Certificate Course) Giving Voice to Values (Certificate Course) Citizenship On The Rise: What This Means To Business and HR

This week, coming off our amazing Irresistible 2024 conference, I recap what we learned and discuss the evolution of enterprise talent intelligence. I explain the Skyhive-Cornerstone deal, update you on SAP and Workday’s AI efforts, and give you a preview of what’s going to happen as we get our hands on OpenAI GPT4o (Omni). Next year’s Irresistible will be May 19-22, 2025 so put it on your calendar. And if you’re ready to revolutionize your HR team and entire HR function, Galileo is now fully available – you can learn more here. Additional Information Galileo Goes Live, Expands Its Power With New Trusted Content YouTube video of Galileo Launch    

In this podcast I discuss Microsoft’s exciting new internal skills strategy, with a focus on Viva Skills, the role of the Microsoft Copilot, and how Microsoft is “inventing new products for HR” as Customer Zero. Customer Zero is Microsoft’s way of “eating their own dogfood” and making sure their new products are well designed before the hit the streets. Video version of podcast: https://youtu.be/6VuOYUBT2KA Takeaways Microsoft is a role model for HR, with an innovative and experimental approach. They are leveraging the Microsoft Graph to gather skills and HR data for better decision-making. Viva Skills and Eightfold are being used to build a skills infrastructure and provide personalized recommendations. Microsoft is integrating AI agents like Galileo into the Microsoft Copilot, showcasing the importance of AI in HR. Companies need to develop their own AI strategies to stay competitive in the evolving HR technology landscape. Chapters 00:00 Introduction to Microsoft and their HR Function 02:06 Building a Skills-Based Employee Experience 05:34 Challenges of Skills Platforms in HR Technology 10:38 Integrating AI Agents into Tools and Systems 15:36 The Significance of AI Technologies in HR Redesign Additional Information: Building A Skills-Based Organization: The Exciting But Sober Reality Enterprise Talent Intelligence Arrives, Disrupting The HR Tech Market Here Come The Copilots!

Today’s podcast, recorded in Vegas after a series of conferences (ServiceNow Knowledge and Unleash), talks all about how ServiceNow is making a major play to dominate the space and how Enterprise Talent Intelligence is going mainstream. I also discuss what we covered in our AI in HR workshop and how to evaluate the massive number of tools are coming (including Galileo® from us). I also give you my thoughts about why Business Insider was a bit unfair to Workday and how the HCM market will soon change existentially. Additional Information Enterprise Talent Intelligence Has Arrived: Disrupting The HR Tech Market ServiceNow Boldly Introduces AI Solution For Skills, Learning, And Growth Why I’m Still Bullish On Workday Here Come The Copilots: Microsoft’s GenAI Strategy For The Enterprise AI in HR: Certificate Course in The Josh Bersin Academy (join the more than 30,000 people who love it!)

This conversation explores the concept of employee experience and its evolution from employee engagement. The case studies of the BBC and Schiphol Airport demonstrate innovative approaches to creating inspiring employee experiences. The discussion emphasizes the operational aspects of employee experience, including training, inclusion, belonging, pay, and benefits. It also introduces the concept of employee activation, where employees are empowered to make local changes to improve their work experience directly. Keywords employee experience, employee engagement, case studies, operational aspects, training, inclusion, belonging, pay, benefits, employee activation, BBC, Schiphol, T-Mobile, AirBNB, Kaiser Permanente Takeaways Employee experience is a more expansive and refreshed approach compared to traditional employee engagement. Understanding the specific needs and experiences of different employee groups is crucial for creating inspiring employee experiences. Operational aspects such as training, inclusion, belonging, pay, and benefits play a significant role in employee experience. Employee activation empowers employees to make local changes to improve their work experience. Sound Bites “Employee experience is the core mission of HR” “Self-directed and coach-oriented career development is a massive driver of organizational performance” “Be careful not to threaten employees inadvertently with AI” Additional Resources Employee Activation: An Essential Big Idea For 2024 Why The 4-Day Week? Because 33 Year-Olds Now Run The World. Surprising Results From The World Happiness Report: What It Means To You  

Microsoft’s Co-Pilot, powered by AI, is being widely used by Fortune 500 companies and has become the largest and most prevalent corporate AI tool in the world. A research report by CompTIA shows that 94% of professional users have used some form of AI, including Microsoft’s Co-Pilot. The company is deploying AI at a massive scale, which is improving productivity and saving users hours per day. And there’s more. The integration of AI into enterprise applications, such as Workday and SAP, is transforming the way users interact with these systems. Talent intelligence, powered by AI, is becoming an enterprise-class system that goes beyond sourcing and selecting candidates to include internal mobility, pay equity, and performance management. The learning and development space is also experiencing a significant transformation with the use of AI to generate and personalize content. The implementation of AI in the HR tech market is expected to disrupt the industry and companies that adapt quickly will thrive. Keywords Microsoft, Co-Pilot, AI, Fortune 500, CompTIA, productivity, enterprise applications, Workday, SAP, talent intelligence, learning and development, HR tech market Takeaways Microsoft’s Co-Pilot, powered by AI, is the largest and most prevalent AI tool in the world, used by Fortune 500 companies. AI is being integrated into various applications, improving productivity and saving users hours per day. Enterprise applications, such as Workday and SAP, are incorporating AI to transform user interactions. Talent intelligence, powered by AI, is expanding beyond sourcing and selecting candidates to include internal mobility, pay equity, and performance management. The learning and development space is undergoing a significant transformation with the use of AI to generate and personalize content. The implementation of AI in the HR tech market is expected to disrupt the industry, and companies that adapt quickly will thrive. Sound Bites “Microsoft’s Co-Pilot is now in use by 60% of the Fortune 500.” “61% of companies are already using AI in their corporate infrastructure.” “Microsoft is deploying AI at a scale that’s just spectacular.” Additional Information Why I’m Bullish On Workday: News From The Innovation Summit Enterprise AI At Work: The Talent Intelligence Primer Will Chatbots Take Over HR Tech? Paradox Sets The Pace. A Peek Under The Covers Of SAP SuccessFactors’ AI Strategy

This week I attended the Workday Innovation Summit and there’s a lot to discuss. Having just celebrated its 19th birthday, the company is embarking on a major transformation. And it’s not just product innovation that’s happening, the company is greatly expanding its business model. Additional Information Workday Innovation Summit: What’s New and Workday’s AI Architecture Enterprise AI At Work: The Talent Intelligence Primer Will Chatbots Take Over HR Tech? Paradox Sets The Pace. The Labor Market Has Totally Changed: Are You Really Ready?