The Gist

For the past 25 years, Bill Kristol of the Weekly Standard and Bill Galston of the Brookings Institution have been debating the meaning of presidential elections. But in 2016, they found themselves agreeing much more frequently on issues such as immigration, the tech industry, and tax reform. These men, on opposite sides of center, decided to develop a plan to recenter American politics. Galston and Kristol's new project is the New Center. In the Spiel, a librarian rejected books donated by Melania Trump. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

It's time for Vexillology Corner: Last month, the city of Pocatello, Idaho, presented a new city flag to replace their previous one, known for being one of the ugliest flags in the United States. But what makes a flag ugly? Vexillologist Ted Kaye describes Pocatello's new flag and reminds us why a kid should be able to draw it. Kaye is the author of Good Flag, Bad Flag. In the Spiel, a brief word from economist Tyler Cowen, who summarizes the grim outlook for Puerto Rico. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Mark Lilla made a lot of liberals bristle with his New York Times op-ed, "The End of Identity Liberalism." But Lilla insists that what he's suggesting should not make the bleeding hearts clutch their hemp necklaces in horror. His premise is simple: To make meaningful gains, Democrats need institutional power (i.e., election wins). And far too often, Lilla says, liberals have sacrificed such ends for what he calls "noble defeats." Lilla's book is The Once and Future Liberal: After Identity Politics. In the Spiel, Saudi Arabia will allow women to drive. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Working in the White House sounds impressive, but speechwriter David Litt says it's not like The West Wing. Some days you just find salmon in a toilet, or have to tell the president that he looks like Hitler. Litt shares his experience as a self-described unimportant person working in the most important place in America. Litt's new book Thanks, Obama is out now, and you can find him on Twitter. In the Spiel, it's a sports talk hot take. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

The chart-topping hits of 2007 featured Beyoncé at peak pop and Kanye West ahead of the curve with electronic dance music. Why do the hits of 2007 have such impressive staying power? Chris Molanphy says it might be because the 2007 Billboard charts were more comprehensive than ever, marking the first time that digital music sales were incorporated into a song's ranking. Molanphy writes Slate's Why Is This Song No. 1? column and hosts the podcast Hit Parade. In the Spiel, John McCain just keeps on delivering. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Dylan Moran is a comedian from Ireland, a resident of Scotland, and a worried observer of politics in America. He talks to Mike about his way with words and why he thinks satire might bring down the 45th president. Moran is touring the U.S. now with his latest stand-up show, Grumbling Mustard. In the Spiel, democracy is exacerbating international tragedy. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

This much we know: The Equifax data breach is bad. How can the credit bureaus, who have been described as the "plumbing" of our financial system, show so little regard for the people whose data they collect? New York Times columnist Gretchen Morgenson says it's simple: We are not their customers, we are their product. Morgenson writes the Fair Game column. Her most recent book is Reckless Endangerment: How Outsized Ambition, Greed, and Corruption Led to Economic Armageddon. In the Spiel, the Jimmy Kimmel test. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Sigma Alpha Epsilon was already the country's deadliest fraternity when it became famous in 2015 for its racist chants. But Bloomberg News senior editor John Hechinger says SAE's response to its scandal was unusual, as leaders used his reporting to try to reform members. Even so, the rising costs of insuring national fraternities might cause local chapters to shut down before reforms can take root. "The leaders of SAE know they are a legal judgment away from oblivion," writes Hechinger. His book is True Gentlemen: The Broken Pledge of America's Fraternities. In the Spiel, Trump's speech at the United Nations. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Why does the movie Revenge of the Nerds continue to resonate today? Because, aside from how funny it is, it stands up for outcasts. Actor Curtis Armstrong explains what he took away from the film playing Booger, who was accepted by the nerds despite not really being one of them. Armstrong is the author of Revenge of the Nerd: Or… The Singular Adventures of the Man Who Would Be Booger. In the Spiel, health care for all! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

On The Gist, Mike talks to one of his favorites: Musician Ted Leo discusses letting his political frustrations fuel his songwriting (see his song, "William Weld in the 21st Century") and explains how he finds solace in the tarot card image of the hanged man, which inspired the name of his new album. The Hanged Man is available now. For more on Ted Leo, read Michael Tedder's story in Stereogum, "Ted Leo Is Like You." In the Spiel, why it's silly to say that speech equals violence. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

On The Gist, Gretchen Rubin explains why her system of sorting people into four personality types (Rebel, Obliger, Questioner, and Upholder) will make your life easier. Rubin is the author of The Four Tendencies and host of the podcast Happier. In the Spiel, what happens when politics seeps into sports. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Late-night talk shows adhere to a form: a host behind a desk, pre-produced interviews, and tightly choreographed bits. Chris Gethard wants to break that form apart. With absurd gags like getting dunked in ice water or staying awake for 36 hours, Gethard wants to disarm his celebrity guests and put his viewers in charge. Gethard's new season of The Chris Gethard Show airs Thursday nights at 11 p.m. Eastern on truTV. In the Spiel, the fatberg of London. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Do germaphobic parents doom their kids to a lifetime of allergies and irritable bowels? This sounds like a question for our favorite game, "Is That Bullshit?" Returning champion Maria Konnikova helps us sort good bacteria from bad. Konnikova writes for the New Yorker and is the author of The Confidence Game. In the Spiel, what should we consider before changing the definition of sexual assault? Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Former NFL cornerback Nnamdi Asomugha sees his time in football as a prep course for acting. On The Gist, he explains how he learned to study other people while developing his own style. Asomugha stars in Crown Heights, a film based on the true story of a Brooklyn man trying to prove the innocence of his imprisoned friend. Crown Heights is in select theaters and will be available nationwide starting Friday, Sept. 15. In the Spiel, why does anyone listen to Ivanka Trump? Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Standup comic Ms. Pat is used to getting follow-up questions about her jokes. Did your mom really shoot a gun in the house? Did you really get pregnant when you were 13? Did you really have fleas? It's all true, and now it's even been fact-checked. Patricia Williams tells Mike about what it was like to write her book, Rabbit: The Autobiography of Ms. Pat. In the Spiel, a special statement from the president of Equifax. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Hurricane Harvey has caused a huge amount of property damage, but so far the death toll remains remarkably low. Why? Mike talks to John Mutter, a Columbia University professor who studies how natural disasters affect the poor. Mutter is the author of The Disaster Profiteers. In the Spiel, the deal-making wizardry of President Trump. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Did the sexual revolution inspire rock 'n' roll or vice versa? Was Elvis Presley a knowing sex symbol or a total innocent? Is it true that there are still blue laws on the books against playing "Tutti Frutti" after dark? NPR's music critic Ann Powers tackles these and other questions in her book, Good Booty: Love and Sex, Black and White, Body and Soul in American Music. In the Spiel, the perfect late-summer sports scandal. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

The nation has weathered another major natural disaster, and the Army Corps of Engineers once again finds itself under scrutiny. NPR's national desk correspondent Wade Goodwyn says the corps made a choice to open the floodgates of two major reservoirs in southeast Texas, flooding certain neighborhoods and sparing others. Mike Pesca is back to take his rightful place as spieler in chief. Tuesday's topic: Jeff Sessions finally gets to stick it to the Deferred Action for Child Arrivals program. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Hosting today's Gist is Robert Smith from NPR's Planet Money. On the show, he'll talk to Lina Khan, whose research encouraging tighter regulations on Amazon caught some heat from the company's general counsel. Khan works at the Open Markets Program, formerly housed under the New America Foundation. And in the Spiel, Robert Smith observes a new trend in broadcast news: reporters becoming heroes on live television. What could possibly go wrong? Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Today's guest host is Dan Savage, from the Savage Lovecast. Dan is the internationally syndicated columnist of "Savage Love" and the author of several books. With his husband Terry Miller, he cofounded the It Gets Better project and edited the It Gets Better collection. On The Gist, Dan talks to author Peggy Orenstein about the lack of sexual education for young women and how book tours can change the writing process. Orenstein is the author of Girls & Sex: Navigating the Complicated New Landscape. In the Spiel: the clueless conservatism of the Nashville Statement. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Question: What's the best way to take a vacation in a Communist society? Answer: With utmost utilitarian seriousness, and possibly without your family. On this last week before Labor Day, guest host and Slate writer Leon Neyfakh talks to historian Diane Koenker about how the Soviet Union came to embrace personal holidays and reconcile them with the Communist doctrine. Koenker is the author of Club Red: Vacation Travel and the Soviet Dream. In the Spiel, the cautionary tale of Taylor Swift's latest single. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Slate's Henry Grabar explains how rampant building in the Houston suburbs have made the area worse for wear during Tropical Storm Harvey. And in the Spiel, guest-host Osita Nwanevu breaks his self-imposed moratorium against criticizing columnist David Brooks. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Al Letson was just trying to cover a demonstration – an anti-hate rally in Berkeley. When he saw a group of balaclava-clad men descend on an apparent right-wing agitator, he jumped into the fray, using his body to defend the man from kicks and punches. Letson is the host of Reveal from the Center for Investigative Reporting and PRX. And for the Spiel, is "#whaboom" the worst of our culture today? Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

The hype surrounding the Saturday night fight between boxer Floyd Mayweather Jr. and MMA fighter Conor McGregor is overtly racially charged. Why? Because people are eating it up, says Wesley Morris, critic-at-large for the New York Times. Morris and Mike talk about the role of race in the NFL's treatment of Colin Kaepernick, Dana Schutz's Open Casket painting of Emmett Till, the closing of the Broadway show The Great Comet, and more. Morris is the co-host of the Still Processing podcast. In the Spiel: We live in interesting times. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Understanding sexual consent is complicated. Colleges are working to clarify this issue while also policing sexual assault. But when does this cross over into legislating feelings versus facts? Vanessa Grigoriadis helps us understand the current iteration of the sexual consent debate happening on campuses today. Grigoriadis is the author of Blurred Lines: Rethinking Sex, Power, and Consent on Campus. In the Spiel: Should we tear down statues? Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

The antifa movement is resurging. It started in 1920s Europe to fight Hitler and Mussolini and has returned to oppose the current wave of xenophobia in the United States. Author Mark Bray walks us through the history of the antifa movement. Bray is the author of Antifa: The Anti-Fascist Handbook. In the Spiel: Trump's campaign speech in Phoenix. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Filmmaker Bryan Fogel had a simple hypothesis: The worldwide anti-doping system is a joke. To test his theory, Fogel wanted to dope himself and evade detection. A Russian anti-doping lab director agreed to help. Months later, Fogel's personal doping coach was blowing the whistle on Russia's piss-swapping scam to get around anti-doping rules. Fogel's documentary, Icarus, is available on Netflix. In the Spiel: The Instagram drama of Louise Linton, wife of Treasury Secretary Steven Mnuchin. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Malcolm Gladwell's hit podcast Revisionist History spits out neat, distilled theories in every episode. Some of them are careful, others are reductive. But Gladwell says his theories aren't all meant to be airtight: They just help him organize his stories, or merely spruce them up. "In some of them I'm trying to make a very, very serious, moral point. Sometimes I'm just—I'm making intellectual mischief." In the Spiel: the parallels between the Obama administration and the Trump administration on race relations. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

In 1982, MTV started guiding Billboard's taste in music. The year was filled with elaborate videos and cheesy ballads. Chris Molanphy takes us through all the hand claps and synth vibes of that year's Billboard hits. Molanphy writes Slate's Why Is This Song No. 1 column and hosts the podcast Hit Parade. In the Spiel: The last time anything good happened to Donald Trump. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Did Steve Bannon really misunderstand the meaning of off the record during his now-infamous "interview" with the American Prospect? "Yup," says Joshua Green, author of Devil's Bargain, a book about Bannon's influence on the Trump presidency. Green addresses the latest rumors of Bannon's political demise, and tries to sort out why, exactly, Trump's chief strategist always wears three shirts at once. In the Spiel, a nuclear war with North Korea no longer feels inevitable. So what now? Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Political scientist Moshe Maor says Donald Trump's policy ideas are very, very over-the-top. But that's exactly the point. On issues like immigration and transgender service members, bold overreactions are the only kind of policies that speak to cynical voters. "People want immediate action," says Maor. "Morality aside, Trump is playing his cards right." Maor is a professor at the Hebrew University in Jerusalem. In the Spiel, is Donal Trump a smart racist or a stupid racist? Join Slate Plus! Members get bonus segments, exclusive member-only podcasts, and more. Sign up for a free trial today at Slate.com/gistplus. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Guest host Leon Neyfakh speaks with retired Boston cop Tom Nolan about the politics of police unions. While unions in other industries put on a progressive face to the world, police unions tend to be defensive of everything from disrespecting the mayor of New York to rough treatment of prisoners. But Nolan says he's encouraged by their recent condemnation of President Trump's comments about police violence. "I think they know the speaker of those words does not know what the hell he was talking about," says Nolan, who now teaches at Merrimack College. In the Spiel, Google is a massive company. It's also an increasingly bad search engine. Join Slate Plus! Members get bonus segments, exclusive member-only podcasts, and more. Sign up for a free trial today at Slate.com/gistplus. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Typically Congress has an order to follow when creating bills and passing them into law. There's committee writing, revisions, and a bipartisan back-and-forth. In recent years that order has broken down and caused major divides inside both parties. Georgetown senior fellow Joshua Huder details this process and how it went wrong. Huder's writing can be found on the blog Rule 22. In the Spiel, Mike heads to the Bobby Fischer museum in Iceland and explores the tricky balance of memorializing the controversial star. Join Slate Plus! Members get bonus segments, exclusive member-only podcasts, and more. Sign up for a free trial today at Slate.com/gistplus. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Brandt Tobler has had a crazy life. His stand-up comedy is the sum of his stories as a small-town wayward kid busting out of Wyoming. He was the don of a criminal syndicate he called the "mallfia," he ran the Las Vegas strip placing bets for gambling titans, and he plotted to kill his estranged father. He's also kind of a sweetheart. Tobler's book is Free Roll. In the Spiel, how cynicism breeds fake news. Join Slate Plus! Members get bonus segments, exclusive member-only podcasts, and more. Sign up for a free trial today at slate.com/gistplus. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Google's reputation for openness took a tumble when its CEO fired James Damore, the author of a memo questioning the company's efforts to achieve gender parity. Amy Webb, founder of the Future Today Institute, blames the internet. She says easy access to data is allowing us to make dumb arguments. In the Spiel, Mike has more thoughts on the Google memo. Guess what? He dislikes it. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Muhammad Ali was one of the greatest athletes of the 20th century, but he didn't spend his entire life in the ring. During the Vietnam War, he spent his time trying to avoid the draft as a conscientious objector. Journalist Leigh Montville says the struggle changed Ali's life—and the country. Montville's new book is Sting Like a Bee. In the Spiel, a closer look at the CV of the most important soil-health civil servant in the news. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Over the last few years, the meaningful fault line between political camps has separated people rooted to certain places and people rooted to certain ideas. David Goodhart says the anywheres have become too dominant, and the somewhere have rightly felt excluded. How can we bridge the divide? Goodhart's book is The Road to Somewhere. In the Spiel, speak loudly domestically and you might hurt your credibility. Speak loudly internationally and you might end civilization. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Be bold, but not arrogant. Apologize when wrong, but don't accept blame. Stay calm in a crisis. These are some of the lessons Mike Richards has learned hosting GSN's Divided, the social experiment masquerading as a game show. In the Spiel, why the Dow is for fuddy-duddies. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Maria Bamford has been making top comedian lists for years, but she knows her stand-up isn't for everyone: "I can bomb any moment of the week, any day." On The Gist, she rebuts Mike's assertion that comics are more likely to struggle with depression. Bamford also explains why she wishes ESPN's postgame analysis were swapped out for televised confessional booths for the athletes. Her new Netflix show is Lady Dynamite. In the Spiel, Mike reads some of the mail responding to his takedown of the term white privilege and names another Lobstar. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

It's a special combo Gist, with an interview and Spiel rolled into one segment: Zoe Chace, producer for This American Life, digs up some old audio from one of her conversations with Anthony Scaramucci. The tape is from 2016, when the Mooch was pondering whether to support Donald Trump's presidential campaign. What Scaramucci said back then may indicate what he'll do next. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

What would you expect from a video game inspired by Henry David Thoreau's sojourn in the woods? In Walden, a game, players can contemplate the forest, go boating with Ralph Waldo Emerson, and practice civil disobedience. The game was developed by the Game Innovation Lab at the University of Southern California. Lab Director Tracy Fullerton explains why she thinks Thoreau might have liked the game. In the Spiel, our faith in the military might not be blind, but it is blinkered. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Psychologist and neuroscientist Lisa Feldman Barrett is the grand inquisitor of human emotions. Her book, How Emotions Are Made, inspired a big chunk of the latest season of NPR's Invisibilia. Barrett says scientific research shows that emotions are highly variable and utter creations of our minds. Some of her resulting conclusions may surprise you. In the Spiel, Mike goes there: white privilege and rape culture. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

A few years ago, an unassuming young woman named Kelly Sun teamed up with Phil Ivey, the world's most famous poker player. Using some questionable strategies, the two managed to win millions of dollars from casinos across the world. Now the casinos are saying what they did is cheating, and they're trying to get their money back in court. Reporter Rose Eveleth tells Sun and Ivey's story in a new audio documentary, A Queen of Sorts, part of the ESPN podcast series 30 for 30. In the Spiel, yeah, no, #NoConfederate. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Alan Alda's new book is called If I Understood You, Would I Have This Look on My Face? The title comes from his own bad experiences talking to doctors and other science professionals, including one that screwed up his smile for years. "We need to get people talking like people…it's all about empathy," says the actor, who also founded the Alan Alda Center for Communicating Science at Stony Brook University. In The Spiel, why we should actually care about the bizarre Scaramucci–New Yorker interview. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Tom Jennings dug through hours of archival media footage to tell the story of Son of Sam, the serial killer who terrorized New York City in 1976 and 1977. The resulting documentary is part of the Smithsonian Channel's Lost Tapes series. The Lost Tapes: Son of Sam airs Sunday on the Smithsonian Channel. Also, a breakdown of the Boy Scouts' apology for Donald Trump's jamboree speech. Join Slate Plus! Members get bonus segments, exclusive member-only podcasts, and more. Sign up for a free trial today at slate.com/gistplus. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

According to Joan C. Williams, about a third of the country feels talked down to. These are the white working class folks, the people who went for Trump, the people who feel that terms like disruption just mean more hassle and pain. "We can't expect people to have elite values if we don't give them elite lives," says Williams. She's the author of the book White Working Class. For the Spiel, why does everyone sound like Goodfellas while doing an Anthony Scaramucci impression? Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

After the G-20 Summit, Ian Bremmer broke the news to Americans about Trump's secret second meeting with Vladimir Putin. He says he did it because so many American allies were commenting on the rendezvous in private. "The people in the room, they found it disconcerting that the person Trump was more comfortable with is their adversary," says Bremmer. He joins us to discuss Russia, Rex Tillerson's future in the White House, and the decline of American power. Bremmer is an author and risk analyst at the Eurasia Group. For the Spiel, did you know the Washington Post is owned by Amazon? Trump really wants you to know that. Join Slate Plus! Members get bonus segments, exclusive member-only podcasts, and more. Sign up for a free trial today at slate.com/gistplus. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

When Kevin McDonald moved to New York, his sketch troupe, Kids in the Hall, had a deal with Lorne Michaels to make a new comedy show. But these were during some lean years for Michaels. "We were in a closet," says McDonald, "and he was being audited, so it was us and a bunch of auditors. Once in a while, if we said something really funny, we could hear the auditors giggling on the other side of the room." While Kids in the Hall was never as famous as Saturday Night Live, the show became legendary for a discerning subset of comedy fans. "It's like unsweetened lemonade—only 20 percent of people like us, but those who do really love us." McDonald is now hosting a podcast with live shows across the U.S. For the Spiel, a not so surreal end for Salvador Dalí's remains. Join Slate Plus! Members get bonus segments, exclusive member-only podcasts, and more. Sign up for a free trial today at slate.com/gistplus. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

If things had gone well, America would still be in the Paris Agreement on climate change, green energy would be spreading across the country and Al Gore wouldn't have needed to make a sequel to An Inconvenient Truth. But it didn't work out that way. With his new movie hitting theaters next week, Gore remains hopeful during these depressing times. "If somebody told me five years ago, marriage equality would be the law in all 50 states, I would have asked what they were smoking," says the former vice president. "But it did happen, because it became a choice between right and wrong. That's where the climate movement is now." For the Spiel, why persuading doubters is so hard when it comes to climate change science. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Mike Sacks is not just a comedian; he's also a comedy historian. This summer, he's unearthed a rare artifact, the cult classic, Dixie-fried action movie Stinker Lets Loose. "Some famous people have cited this movie as a big influence on them," says Sacks, citing Nirvana frontman Kurt Cobain. "You can hear it in some of his lyrics, for sure." A 40th-anniversary novelization of Stinker is available now, with an intro by Sacks. For the Spiel, why does Donald Trump keep saying stupid things to the New York Times, a newspaper he purports to hate? Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.