The Trailhead

Ryan Goodman grew up on a cattle ranch in Arkansas, studied beef cattle science at Oklahoma State University, and now manages WSU's beef cattle research program as Beef Cattle Operations Manager in Pullman, Washington, where he also teaches hands-on lab courses to the next generation of pre-veterinary students. Online, he goes by @BeefRunner. He also runs a lot of 100-mile races. In this conversation, Zoë and Brendan talk with Ryan about what six weeks of calving season: sleepless, high-stakes, completely indifferent to your training plan, taught him about finishing a hundred-miler, and why "one thing at a time" works as well in the Crazy Mountains of Montana as it does on a ranch at 2 a.m. They get into the complicated but more negotiable than you'd think relationship between ranchers and trail runners, the farm-versus-ranch distinction (I-35 is the line, roughly), why the heifers following you on BLM trail are curious not threatening, and Red Dirt music as the ultrarunning soundtrack you didn't know you needed. Also: cow tipping, the correct post-ultra meal, and whether Pullman counts as a town. This week's featured race is Mujeres and Marigolds, a women's only event with a 5k, 10k, 25k, 50k, and 100k relay! Thanks to TrailCon for supporting the podcast. Register now to attend!

C. Thi Nguyen is a philosopher at the University of Utah, a former food writer for the Los Angeles Times, a rock climber, and one of the world's leading thinkers on the philosophy of games. His new book, The Score: How to Stop Playing Somebody Else's Game, argues that games are the defining art form of our era, and that the scoring systems that make them so joyful turn quietly destructive when institutions and apps wield them instead. In this conversation, Zoë and Brendan talk with CT about why ultrarunning is a game in the deepest philosophical sense, his concept of value capture and why it explains your relationship with Strava better than you'd like, what carbon plates and trekking poles reveal about game design, and why Bernard Suits, the philosopher who defined play as "voluntarily taking on unnecessary obstacles", thought games might literally be the meaning of life. Also: fly fishing pickup artists, the shot clock, elite yo-yoing, and Zoë's Smash Mouth Strava segment situation. This episode is brought to you by Running Warehouse, the best place to find shoes, kit, and gear from top brands, with honest reviews and filters that actually help. Our featured race is the Baker Trail Ultra Challenge, a 50-mile point-to-point through the Cook Forest stretches of the North Country Trail in Western Pennsylvania with 6,200 feet of climbing and a three-part commemorative medal — complete all three sections and you get the full set. Registration closes August 28. Sign up at UltraSignup.com. The Trailhead is part of the UltraSignup Podcast Network.

Pavel Cenkl is a climate writer, ultrarunner, and Dean of Academics at Prescott College who has run hundreds of miles across Iceland, Scandinavia, and the Arctic through his project Climate Run. He grew up in the White Mountains, worked the AMC huts, started one of the first collegiate trail running teams in the U.S., and built a master's program combining movement, environmental philosophy, and ecology. In this conversation, Zoë and Brendan talk with Pavel about what happens when you push yourself to the edge of exhaustion in landscapes that are literally shifting beneath your feet — disappearing glaciers, the vulnerability of being utterly alone in midnight sun, why "resilience over resistance" is a better framework for running and life, and the moment he screamed so loud on day three of his Iceland crossing that he scared a goose into flight and accidentally had a paradigm shift. This episode is brought to you by Precision Fuel and Hydration, use code TRAILHEAD26 for 15% off at PrecisionHydration.com. Our featured race is the White Lake Ultras on May 2nd in Tamworth, New Hampshire, a two-mile lakefront loop where you pick your poison: 6, 12, or 24 hours. Costumes encouraged. Register at UltraSignup.com. The Trailhead is part of the UltraSignup Podcast Network.

Christie Aschwanden is a New York Times bestselling author, former lead science writer at FiveThirtyEight, and one of the sharpest science journalists working today. She's also a former elite Nordic skier for Team Rossignol and a national collegiate cycling champion, so when she set out to investigate the multibillion-dollar recovery industry for her book Good to Go, she brought both a scientist's rigor and an athlete's bullshit detector. In this episode, Zoë and Brendan talk to Christie about why cold plunges might actually delay your recovery, how your sleep tracker could be making your sleep worse, and why the most effective recovery strategies are boring, cheap, and unsexy. They dig into the rise of the "recovery industrial complex", from Tom Brady's infrared pajamas to cryotherapy chambers that NBA teams bought just because other teams had one, and what the research actually says about inflammation, ibuprofen, HRV, and the post-workout "window" myth. Christie also makes a compelling case for radical acceptance, situational awareness for your body, and trusting your own perceptions over your Garmin readiness score. Plus: the beer mile, knitting as recovery, and why pizza might be the most underrated performance fuel.

Brad Stulberg co-wrote Peak Performance with Steve Magness and has spent over a decade studying what excellence actually requires. He joins Zoë and Brendan to dismantle the myths of hustle culture and explain why genuine excellence isn't about optimization, it's about caring deeply about something worthwhile. We dig into "zombie burnout" (exhaustion from doing too little of what lights you up), what Brad learned from studying Courtney Dauwalter and powerlifter Layne Norton, and why chasing flow states prevents you from experiencing them. A grounded, research-backed conversation about pursuing excellence without losing yourself. Brad Stulberg is the author of The Way of Excellence, Master of Change, and The Practice of Groundedness. He's on faculty at the University of Michigan and hosts the podcast Excellence, actually. Sponsor: This episode is brought to you by LMNT—electrolytes with no sugar, no BS. Try their chocolate flavors heated up for the ultimate winter hydration hack. Get a free sample pack with any order at drinklmnt.com/ultrasignup. Featured Race: The Devil Makes Three 50k and 10 Miler — May 16th in Waxhaw, North Carolina. Technical singletrack, prairie grass, lake views, generous cutoffs, and a low entry fee because trail running should be accessible. Cupless race, so bring your own hydration. Registration closes May 13th at ultrasignup.com.

What happens when you strip away sleep, ego, and every external measure of success for 330 kilometers? Doug Mayer, founder of Run the Alps, former Car Talk producer, and three-time Tour de Géants finisher, has spent years trying to answer that question. His new graphic novel, Last of the Giants, is his best attempt yet. In this episode, Doug joins Zoë and Brendan to talk about leaving a 25-year career in radio to build a trail running tour company in Chamonix, why he kept going back to one of the world's most grueling ultramarathons, and how he translated the experience of hallucinating in a snowstorm at 3am into a visual story. He shares what he learned from interviewing neuroscientists, a Buddhist monk who specializes in suffering, and the world's leading expert on pilgrimages, all in service of understanding why we do hard things and what we bring back from them. The conversation touches on "meeting the dragon" (a Buddhist concept for the moment when your usual tools stop working), the hero's journey, why Tour de Géants feels like "the PhD of ultrarunning," and how Doug accidentally started dating someone mid-race because her prefrontal cortex was too exhausted to know better. Links: • Last of the Giants by Doug Mayer, available at Bookshop.org, Amazon, and wherever books are sold •Run the Alps – trail running tours in the European Alps •Running Warehouse – gear guides and the Salomon Genesis •Salt Lake Foothills Trail Races – May 30, 2026 (10k, half, 50k, 50 miler) More from UltraSignup Podcasts: •The Buzz with Buzz Burrell – deep dives into ultrarunning culture and philosophy •Between Two Pines – A trail running podcast that doesn't take itself too seriously

Pat Cade has a PhD in mathematics, coaches high school cross country in Leadville, Colorado, and has finished the Leadville 100 six times. In this conversation, he explains what years of research math taught him about endurance: small steady progress compounds, inspiration only strikes if you're showing up every day, and sometimes the breakthrough comes when you stop following the plan and just go climb the mountain because it's beautiful outside. Pat shares how he and his wife landed in Leadville after leaving academia in New York, and how they decided to pour their energy into coaching and teaching after facing infertility. He breaks down what actually makes a good coach (hint: it's not yelling), why training at 10,000 feet requires rethinking everything you learned about recovery, and what the Leadville 100's Dream Chaser program is all about. He also attempts to explain his dissertation, including whether the universe might be shaped like a donut, in terms anyone can follow. Zoë and Brendan are mostly able to keep up. This episode is brought to you by LMNT, the tasty electrolyte drink mix with sodium, potassium, and magnesium. Pro tip for winter: heat up their chocolate salt or chocolate caramel flavors for a hydration hack that doubles as hot cocoa. And if you missed it, the fan-favorite lemonade salt is back full time. Get a free sample pack with any order at drinklmnt.com/ultrasignup. Featured Race: The Salt and Sulphur 420 is a 420-mile journey run from Salt Lake City to West Yellowstone, traversing the Wasatch Range, Bear Lake, Jackson Hole, the Tetons, and finishing at the doorstep of Yellowstone. This isn't a stage race—it's a test of resourcefulness and mental grit across four states, with all proceeds benefiting the Women's Center in Salt Lake City. Registration closes February 1st. Learn more and sign up at ultrasignup.com/register.aspx?did=118718.

For the final episode of 2025, Zoë and Brendan share their own year-end reflections, summits, snacks, and slogs, including Zoë's experience hitchhiking to the start line of a 78-mile race in Italy, arriving 90 seconds before the gun went off to stand between Kilian Jornet and Jim Walmsley in a downpour that would last 15 hours. Then they pull their favorite moments from this year's interviews. You'll hear coach Mario Fraoli explain why the marathon is where racing ends and insanity begins. Steve Magness on why running might be the healthiest cult you can join. Alex Hutchinson on the effort paradox, why we value things because they're hard, not in spite of it. Sabrina Little on running as a laboratory for virtue. And Dan Lieberman, who co-authored the original "Born to Run" research, telling Zoë and Brendan to their faces that ultra running is absolutely, completely, and totally bizarre. Thanks for spending 2025 with The Trailhead. See you on the trails in 2026. Featuring: Mario Fraoli, Steve Magness, Alex Hutchinson, Sabrina Little, and Dan Lieberman This episode is brought to you by Victory Insoles. Get carbon fiber energy return without changing your stride. Try them risk-free for 90 days and get 25% off with code TH25 at checkout. Featured Race: SoCal Ultra Trail at Tejon Ranch — Run 270,000 acres of California's largest private land, normally closed to the public. Oak-filled canyons, the legendary Grapevine climb, and distances from 11K to 100K. February 28, 2026.

Romy Ancona is a DJ, trail runner, and the force behind Broken Arrow's famously joyful finish line. Born in Cozumel and now based in Colorado's Roaring Fork Valley, Romy learned to mix on a trackpad on their mom's Windows laptop before somehow landing their first gig at a Maxim Magazine party in Hollywood. These days, they split time between spinning tracks on the mountain and chasing vertical on skis and trails. In this conversation, Romy talks about shedding DJ ego, their work on Broken Arrow's inclusivity advisory council (think glitter, bubbles, and rainbow slip-and-slide dreams), and how a 2022 accident that broke their back reshaped their relationship to running. As they put it: as much as moving hurts, not moving hurts more. Plus: the lost art of the mixtape, why they watch pro paintball on the treadmill, and a running playlist spanning Celia Cruz to Limp Bizkit. This episode is brought to you by Running Warehouse, your source for jackets, gloves, headlamps, and reflective gear to get you through the dark, cold months. Race Spotlight: Registration is open for the Mount Mitchell Heartbreaker—50 miles and 12,000+ feet of climbing through stunning North Carolina single track. Sign up at ultrasignup.com.

Lindsey Freeman is a sociologist, writer, and lifelong runner whose book Running offers a feminist and queer reading of the sport. In this conversation, Zoë and Brendan talk with Lindsey about what it means to treat running as a practice, becoming yourself through repetition, staying soft, and trusting that showing up matters even when outcomes don't. The conversation moves through ideas like the magic circle that makes it acceptable to try really hard in public, the growth of queer run clubs, and the strange emotional math of caring deeply about things that often disappoint you. There's also a delightful tangent about Stuart Murdoch of Belle and Sebastian being a serious runner. Lindsey's advice for writer's block and bonking alike? Have a snack and come back tomorrow. Get her amazing book here. This episode is brought to you by Fast Pickle—grab-and-go pickle juice shots at fastpickle.com—and Tantrums, makers of the Crest 6 hydration pack at tantrums.run. Plus: Ultra Trail Drakensberg in South Africa is now open for registration at ultrasignup.com.

Raziq Rauf didn't set out to become a running writer, he set out to avoid burnout as a music journalist covering London's metal and hardcore scene. Now, through his newsletter Running Sucks, he brings that same critical eye to the running industry, asking where authentic culture ends and brand activations begin. We talk about his transition from music journalism to running writing, how to spot the difference between meaningful community and manufactured hype, and discover there's exactly one death metal cowboy concept album in existence, the perfect metaphor for niche subcultures like running. This episode is brought to you by Running Warehouse, helping you stay warm and visible through winter with jackets, headlamps, and gear that keeps you honest about getting out the door. Our featured race is the Zion Ultras on April 11th, 2026, five distances through desert mesas with thousand-foot sandstone cliffs. Registration closes April 8th at UltraSignup.com. The Trailhead is part of the UltraSignup Podcast Network.

Nick Thompson has spent his life chasing big stories and finish lines. The CEO of The Atlantic and author of The Running Ground joins Zoë and Brendan to talk about running through life's hardest moments, from a cancer diagnosis at 30 to balancing elite training with parenthood and a high-powered media career. Together, they explore why running became Nick's anchor through chaos and change, the strange parallels between journalism and endurance sports, and the lessons he learned from his father, and why he runs to not become him. They talk about what aging athletes get wrong about decline, the emotional threshold of a "real" ultra (and the world's shortest one), and how Nick manages to fit sub-three-hour marathons into a 60-hour work week. Along the way, Zoë and Brendan share their own thoughts on parenting as endurance training, finish-line family moments, and why run commuting deserves a comeback. The Running Ground: A Father, a Son, and the Simplest of Sports is out now from Penguin Random House. Sponsored by: LMNT, stay hydrated year-round with a free sample pack at drinklmnt.com/ultrasignup. Featured Race: Peacock Gap Trail Run — a love letter to Bay Area trails at China Camp State Park.

What kind of person dreams up the hardest race on earth, and then follows it up with one of the weirdest? This week on The Trailhead, Zoë and Brendan dive deep into the mind of Lazarus Lake, the man behind both the Barkley Marathons and Big's Backyard Ultra. Our guest, author Jared Beasley, joins to talk about his new book on Laz, unpacking the mystery, mischief, and mythology that made one man's backyard into a global endurance phenomenon. We explore what drives people to suffer on purpose, why Laz's races capture our collective imagination, and what they say about the culture of ultrarunning itself. 🏃‍♀️ Featured Race: Yankee Springs Winter Challenge — 50K, 25K, 10K, and 5K distances in Middleville, Michigan on January 3, 2026. A beautiful, snowy loop through Yankee Springs State Recreation Area. Fast course, frosty singletrack, and plenty of aid. 👉 Register now on UltraSignup. 👟 Presented by: UltraSignup, check out all our podcasts! 💥 Sponsored by: Running Warehouse — your source for the best shoes, gear, and deals in trail and ultrarunning.

Harvard evolutionary biologist Dan Lieberman is the scientist whose work reshaped how we understand running. His research on human evolution helped popularize the idea that we're born to run, that our bodies, from our toes and tendons to our oversized glutes, are uniquely adapted for endurance. In this conversation, he joins Zoë and Brendan to explore what running reveals about being human. This week's featured race is the Naughty Hog 100k, 50k, 25k, 10k, and 5k! Dec 20. Register now! We dig into why ultrarunning is evolutionarily bizarre but still deeply natural, what persistence hunting really looked like, and how belly fat, treadmills-as-torture-devices, and even the barefoot craze all tie into our running story. It's part science lesson, part reminder that while we didn't evolve for nipple tape, running is still one of the most human things we do. Thanks to LMNT for supporting The Trailhead!

Joe Grant has always blurred the lines between athlete and artist. From racing UTMB and Hardrock to biking between Colorado 14ers, Joe's career has evolved into something bigger than competition—projects that fuse endurance, place, and creativity. In this conversation, Joe joins hosts Zoë Rom and Brendan Leonard to talk about his journey from racing to FKTs to local San Juan projects, why he ditched the watch, and how he balances gear geekery with poetry and film photography. If you've ever wondered how running can fuel creative work—or vice versa—this episode goes deep into what it means to truly be present on the trail. Thanks to Running Warehouse for sponsoring The Trailhead! And check out the Best Day Ever Ultra, register now to reserve your spot! 👉 Subscribe to The Trailhead wherever you get your podcasts. 📺 Watch full episodes on YouTube. 🎧 Check out other shows on the UltraSignup Podcast Network: The Buzz with Buzz Burrell — grounded takes on the big ideas shaping trail and ultrarunning. Between Two Pines — conversations that connect trail running with culture, community, and the outdoors.

This week on The Trailhead, Zoë Rom and Brendan Leonard sit down with one of ultrarunning's most quietly legendary figures: Junko Kazukawa. A two-time Leadwoman, breast cancer survivor, and one of the few athletes to complete both the Grand Slam of Ultrarunning and the Leadwoman series in a single year, Junko's story is a masterclass in resilience and joy. Born in Sapporo, Japan, and now based in Denver, Junko shares how she started running in the U.S. after coming over as a student, how she trained through cancer treatments, and why she still lines up for 100- and 200-mile races at age 62. She talks about the identity and community she's built through the sport, how her view of fitness has evolved over decades, and why she believes "glutes are everything." We also hear about her favorite races around the world, from the Tour de Géants to Mount Fuji, and what keeps her motivated to take on new challenges even as recovery gets harder with age. Whether you're chasing your first ultra or your 26th, Junko's joy and perspective will make you want to lace up and keep going. Thanks to Running Warehouse for supporting The Trailhead. Check out their great selection of everything from shoes to nutrition, packs and socks, with free two-day shipping. Register now for the Antelope Canyon Ultras! These desert classics always sell out, get your spot now!

Take our listener survey! It takes just five minutes, and your input helps shape the future of UltraSignup! Take it here: https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1FAIpQLSeCgLdj8-92G_pLDxkPfuJ0-r477MzZPieRx_qlj1cmP2oybA/viewform?usp=header This week on The Trailhead, Zoë and Brendan sit down with writer, runner, and trail storyteller Sarah Lavender Smith. Sarah has been chronicling the culture of trail and ultrarunning for more than 15 years, from writing for early trail mags to her popular Substack newsletter Mountain Running and Living. She joins us to talk about how she went from journalism to the trails, and how running became not just a sport but a second career. Sarah opens up about what it means to write honestly about midlife and aging, how she's rethinking her relationship with alcohol, and why acceptance is sometimes the hardest training block of all. She also shares the story of finishing Hardrock at 56 and why stage racing like the Grand to Grand Ultra has become her true test of endurance. Along the way, we get into parenting at aid stations, practicing maximum enthusiasm, and how she's turning all of this into her next big project: a memoir. It's a conversation about resilience, storytelling, and the strange joy of chasing meaning in the mountains, sometimes through suffering, sometimes through laughter, but always through a love of the trail. Thanks to Running Warehouse for sponsoring The Trailhead! This week's featured race, Go Wild! Marin Challenge.