Saved by the City

We're back! Hang on to your WWJD bracelets, and strap in for Season Two! We'll be tackling everything from Christian fame, to making friends and fighting loneliness, and an oral history of modern evangelical culture - complete with seashells! Join us every Wednesday as we tromp through the ups and downs of Big City Christianity. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Put on your fancy pants and join us at the Grand Ole Opry! We're headed south to Nashville, Tennessee: country music Mecca and Christian hipster capital of the world. In a bonus summer series, Roxy goes on a journey to see what's what for seekers in other great cities, exploring the spiritual side of four favorite metropolises. Our final city is Nashville and our master of ceremonies is Kat Armas. Kat is a fresh transplant to Nashville and gives us her first impressions of the Music City. We talk about the significance of place and what it takes to put down roots in a new one — from getting to know the literal dirt to intentionally building community. Plus, we are joined by a special guest and host our own neighborly "meet cute." GUESTS: Kat Armas is the author of the new book "Abuelita Faith" and the host of Protagonistas, a podcast highlighting the stories and experiences of Black, Indigenous and other women of color among communities of faith. Tyler Huckabee is the senior editor of Relevant magazine and the co-host of CapeTown, a podcast about superheroes and superhero things. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

In a bonus summer series, Roxy goes on a journey to see what's what for seekers in other great cities, exploring the spiritual side of four favorite metropolises. This week we're off to Melbourne with Devi Abraham, who gives us the lowdown on the Land Down Under. Devi takes us on a tour of the oft-voted "most livable city in the world" and its richly diverse population — and food scene. We compare notes on evangelicalism, purity culture and finding community in a new city. And, yeah, we talk Hillsong. GUESTS: Devi Abraham is a writer, thinker and podcaster. She is co-host of "Where Do We Go From Here?," a weekly podcast untangling sexual ethics for a generation of Christians detoxing from purity culture. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Let's head west — on the iconic American road trip over the mountains and through the desert to that magical land of the silver screen and the swaying palms: Los Angeles. In a bonus summer series, Roxy goes on a journey to see what's what for seekers in other great cities, exploring the spiritual side of four favorite metropolises. This week we hit up Hollywood, and the star of our show is Laura Tremaine. Laura takes us behind the scenes of one of America's most storied cities as we explore both the myths and realities that shape her City of Angels. Plus, our hosts switch roles and Laura wastes no time getting to the good stuff. GUESTS: Laura Tremaine is the author of the new book "Share Your Stuff: I'll Go First" and the host of the podcast "10 Things to Tell You." Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Take a trip with us across the pond to the Swinging City, the Old Smoke, London Town. In a bonus summer series, Roxy goes on a journey to see what's what for seekers in other great cities, exploring the spiritual side of four favorite metropolises. First up is London, hosted by our top-notch tour guide, Chine McDonald. Chine takes us through some of the twists and turns (and down a few of the dark alleys) of Christianity — and evangelicalism — in England. She gives us a glimpse into navigating race and racism in London as a Black woman and Nigerian immigrant. And we get a front row seat at a poetry reading. Oh, yeah, and naturally we spill some tea on Harry and Meghan. GUESTS: Chine McDonald is the author of the new book "God Is Not a White Man" and is the head of community fundraising and public engagement at Christian Aid. Azariah France-Williams is a priest in the Church of England and is the author of "Ghost Ship: Institutional Racism and the Church of England." He is also a co-host of the podcast "(G)race." The poem below is featured on the show and is written by Azariah France-Williams, who performs and writes under the name BraveSlave. There is an old Jewish tale, Which enriches my own of Honi the circle maker, who sees, A man who planting the seed of a carob tree. Honi the circle maker asks why, why plant something which will benefit those who live after you have expired? The man replied, I received the fruit for which my ancestors fought, so for my descendants this seed, this thought will feed them when I am its soil, Hence I plant, I labour, I toil ... The government's racial disparity report, Arrived on April first, but I am not a fool, The African child is divided from the Caribbean, in their school, Just another example, of divide and rule. An separation of an undivided identity ... leads to split personalities ... Altered destinies ... broken harmonies ... Racial crimes of the past are said only to haunt black people, So we should stop reciting, stop inviting .... the ghouls of yesteryear! That’s gaslighting! The problems of racism are still evidently here. The authors argue against terms like white privilege, And white fragility, instead it is simply, a bias of affinity. The power imbalance, is hidden from the light, As white dominance and prominence are hidden out of sight If whiteness becomes an airborne pathogen, black and brown folx gonna need some anti-racist Sanatogen, The report indicates we can see the upside of slavery, Because look at the product, it produced me. The new narrative of how we came over to make Britain Great, the empire! It is that which should inspire, so Let’s air brush, the gold rush, for the sugar rush, Black gold, were the authors of the report Stone cold sober? This was no mere foreign exchange, Transatlantic slavery only one side gained. The report says institutional racism is not a big factor, In the heart of the matter, Geography, religion, socio-economics is the cause, job done, racism gone, cue the applause, Except My mother could not freely choose the place where she could reside, Her qualifications nullified, so diminished what she could provide, As for the church this is where it hurts, religion simply lied, It said she was welcome, but left her outside, This report leaves black and brown people's deeper needs unattended, The state shield is removed, and we are all left undefended, But my faith is in the ones whose pursuit of justice may led to their execution, martyrs for the cause, Of a cosmic solution, a pride of lions prepared to roar, exit every tomb, walk through walls and locked doors. The universal energy, love defeats all enemies. Even if they kill you, and you never get to see How the seed of your courage became a Carob tree. —Azariah France-Williams, 2021 Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Life is long. Spiritual journeys are winding. Sometimes there are mushrooms. Plenty has been written about the rise of the so-called nones, those who are unaffiliated with any faith tradition. Many of them were once Christians. But behind the stats are millions of stories and spiritual journeys. Behind the stats are more than a few of our friends. In this episode, we reflect on those who have left the faith: why they left, how to learn from them and what it takes to stay friends. Audrey Assad joins us to share her own spiritual journey from Plymouth Brethren, to Catholic, to no longer a practicing Christian. GUEST: Audrey Assad is a multiple Dove Award nominee singer-songwriter based in Nashville, Tennessee. Her newest album, "Eden," explores "the distance between Audrey’s old ideas about God and her freshly gained perspective." You can find more of her music on iTunes, Amazon, Spotify or wherever you listen to music. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

We pledged the pledge. We made the promise. Purity culture failed to deliver. What now? Purity culture was at its height while we were growing up — and the teachings made an impact. But what to do now, decades later, when the promises and threats of purity culture no longer hold the same sway? And when the harms appear to so dramatically outweigh any good? In this episode, we wrestle with what a "Christian" sexual ethic really looks like — long after the teenage hormones have abated. Christine Emba joins the episode to unflinchingly look at the impacts of purity culture — but also to imagine where to go from here. Purity culture felt like an end all. So how do we imagine what's beyond? GUESTS: Christine Emba is an editor and columnist for the Washington Post. She is the author of the forthcoming "Rethinking Sex: A Provocation" Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

How come nobody has a 'meet cute' anymore? Gone it seems are the days of accidentally brushing a stranger's hand while you both reach for the single copy of the same book at the library, only to lock eyes and "just know." Algorithms have replaced butterflies. And swiping right so rarely leads to starry eyes. In this episode, Katelyn and Roxy ask: is it even possible to meet someone in real life anymore? Enter: Heather Thompson Day, the "queen of matchmaking," who weighs in with some much needed optimism and more than a few surprising stats. And Katelyn and Roxy play a round of their own matchmaking game. GUESTS: Dr. Heather Thompson Day is an associate professor of communication and rhetoric at Colorado Christian University. She is the author of six books, including the forthcoming It's Not Your Turn: What to Do While You're Waiting for Your Breakthrough. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Christians will listen to a woman on TV but not a woman in the pulpit. What's up with that? We grew up seeing plenty of examples of women in power suits — from Hollywood to Wall Street, they were shattering glass ceilings and defying expectations. This new cultural norm fed big dreams and big ambitions for girls coming of age in the 1980s and '90s. But the 2000s have revealed a darker reality — from wage gaps to sexual harassment, the workplace for women is still far from ideal. Beyond that, the myth women can have it all — domestic bliss and career success — has proved as much paralyzing pressure as endless potential. Not to mention the conflicting messages we hear from church and culture. After all, one place many women are still not allowed is the pulpit. What's an ambitious woman to do? In this episode, Fox News host Shannon Bream joins us to talk ambition and devotion — and how the women of the Bible have offered her guidance and inspiration. And The Rev. Dr. LaKeesha Walrond offers a glimpse into her journey from small-town Texas to big-city pastor. GUESTS: Shannon Bream is an American journalist and lawyer. She is the host of FOX News @ Night and author of The Women of the Bible Speak The Rev. Dr. LaKeesha Walrond is president of New York Theological Seminary and the executive pastor and chief of staff at First Corinthian Baptist Church in Harlem, New York Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Wife? Nope. Mother? Nope. Great cook? Well ... working on it. We both grew up in homes that felt more egalitarian — there wasn't an emphasis on gender roles or an elevation of a "traditional" family model. However, somewhere along the way, we began to encounter ideas from church and Christian culture about what a "godly" woman looked like. This maven of domesticity kept a clean home, a well-fed brood and a satisfied spouse. She was queen of her home but submissive to her husband. And she was smoking hot. In this episode, we unpack some of our own lingering baggage around this female Christian ideal and talk to author and historian Beth Allison Barr about why "biblical womanhood" isn't really all that biblical. Plus, a special appearance from a fan-favorite guest. Feminism and Christianity are often pitted against each other. But the Bible isn't the reason why. GUESTS: Beth Allison Barr, author of "The Making of Biblical Womanhood" and professor of history at Baylor University The Rev. Ben DeHart, vicar of The Parish of Calvary-St.George’s and co-host of the podcast "Our Triune Pod" Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Things NYC is: fast, impatient, loud, exciting, sparkly, instantly gratifying. Things it is not: a monastery. When we moved here, we heard from a lot of evangelical friends and family that New York City could be damaging to our faith. Most of their warnings had to do with how secular and hedonistic the city is — all those worldly temptations. But, honestly, what we've found most wearing on our faith is the pace and noise of the city. Both of us long for and value a robust interior spiritual life. But New York is such an exterior city — a show-off city. Who has time for devotions amid all this distraction? We talk to fellow New Yorker Father James Martin about how he manages to cultivate quiet, spiritual disciplines that seem so at odds with the energy of the city. Plus, we learn all about the practice of "sound bathing," from religion journalist Liz Kineke. Talking to God in Gotham isn't impossible. It just takes a lot of intentionality. And maybe a gong. Our guests this week: The Rev. James Martin: Jesuit priest, editor at large for America Magazine, author of "Learning to Pray" and "Jesus: A Pilgrimage," consultor to the Dicastery for Communication Liz Kineke: Broadcast and print journalist on the faith and religion beat, formerly with CBS Religion. Read Liz's article that inspired her interview on the podcast: Joyful noise or meditative hum, sound resets the mind for faith. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

NYC is an incredibly diverse city — it's also an incredibly divided one. In the wake of so much racial reckoning in this country, Katelyn and Roxy wrestle with their role as white women. What does it mean for white women to be good allies in anti-racist work (without centering themselves)? The hosts speak with author, activist and teacher Lisa Sharon Harper about how to “show up” for conversations on race and Katelyn and Roxy take on her assignment to understand their own family history. Every step toward anti-racism is an important step. Lisa Sharon Harper has wisdom to hear, and Roxy and Katelyn have whiteness to explore. Honored Guest: The Ruby Woo Pilgrimage — a sacred journey through the intersectional story of the struggle of women for equality in the U.S. Check it out: @RubyWooPilgrim and the #RubyWooPilgrimage Also Lisa Sharon Harper of Freedom Road — former chief church engagement officer of Sojourners and prolific writer, speaker and grass-tops organizer. She founded Freedom Road in 2017 and set out to assemble an equally prolific and diverse team of leading experts, advocates and trainers dedicated to shrinking “The Narrative Gap” And David Favarolo — Director of Curatorial Affairs at Lower East Side Tenement Museum There are so many voices to learn from as you seek to understand racism and the role of whiteness in society — and in our own lives — here are 15 BIPOC Christian women Katelyn and Roxy have been listening to and learning from: Austin Channing Brown Anthea Butler Kaitlin Curtice Karen Gonzalez Marlena Graves Lisa Sharon Harper Kathy Khang Jacqui Lewis Latasha Morrison Trillia Newbell Sandra Maria Van Opstal Michelle Ami Reyes Micky ScottBey Jones Heather Thompson Day Nikki Toyama-Szeto Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

In New York, it's easy to feel behind on all the fashion trends. (Even during a pandemic, some people out walking their dog have way cooler sweats than you.) NYC fashion is certainly fabulous, but is it as meaningless as chasing after the wind? Fashion journalist Whitney Bauck tells us why clothing is about so much more than the runway — and why thrifting might be the future. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

There's a stereotype out there that NYC is a secular, godless, pothole. The 80 percent of New Yorkers who believe in God would disagree. We talk to two women, one Jewish, one Muslim, about how they embody their own faiths, before nerding out on some numbers. Check out this exploration of the markers that attend women of faith - and how deeply misunderstood they are. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

From Jesus Freak to freaked out. In this episode, we grapple with "the e-word" and why we struggle to claim the evangelical label. Having grown up fully immersed in that culture and going on to dedicate much of our careers to the movement, we examine our disillusionment and disappointment with its trajectory — and where we go next. The past five years revealed fractures and hypocrisies that betrayed so much of what we — and a generation of millennial Christians — grew up being taught. Now we wonder: Is evangelicalism worth saving? Plus: We go on an adventure to Washington Square Park to hear what some of our New York City neighbors think about the word "evangelical." Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

It's a question both of us have gotten sometimes on dates! But it's a good question, one we ask ourselves a lot. We hear Robert Monson's quite unusual path into Christian faith (hint: a voice speaks) and unpack the problem of Christianese. In the end it’s about how a condescending question asked in a less than kind way can still lead to a bit of soul-searching. GUESTS: Robert J Monson - co-host of the 3 Black Men Podcast Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

We've had our fair share of first dates in NYC--some good, some kind of terrible. We talk to journalist Jon Birger about why women like us might need to ditch the online dating apps. Then we talk to a priest about *his* dating life. This episode addresses the natural tension between a culture that encourages experimentation and adventurousness, with an upbringing of ingrained reticence and 'purity'. GUESTS: Jon Birger, author of Make Your Move, The New Science of Dating and why Women Are In Charge The Reverend Ben DeHart, Associate Pastor of The Parish Of Calvary-St.George's Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Katelyn and Roxy talk about the messages they received from fellow Christians when they decided to move to NYC. They heard fear… that they’d lose their faith or be indoctrinated with secular progressive culture. What they found in NYC as Christians is more complex. This episode addresses deep-seated beliefs among evangelicals, about big cities, secular culture, and their neighbors. GUESTS: Dr. Phillip Jenkins, Distinguished Professor of History and Co-Director, Program on Historical Studies of Religion Rev. Dr. LaKeesha Walrond of the New York Theological Seminary Karen Beaty & Sharon Stone Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

A sneak peek at the upcoming podcast from RNS Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices