285: On Botox and Fillers

Overtired 285

[00:00:00] Jeff: Hello and welcome to overtired. I am Jeff Severns Guntzel and here with me today are Christina Warren and Brett Terpstra and, um, and I can see them, but you can’t y’all look great. It’s good to see ya. Let’s let’s do a podcast.

[00:00:23] Christina: Thank you. It was great to see both of you as well and hear you, um, for, for the listeners. We’re not trying to be, you know, like exclusionary, we just don’t want to Polish a video podcast. We just don’t. We, we talked about it.

[00:00:33] Brett: of these, one of these days, I’m going to get you guys to do a video podcast, but I understand the reservations.

[00:00:41] Jeff: I did shower today.

[00:00:42] Brett: We do fucking look good though.

[00:00:44] Jeff: There’s

[00:00:44] Christina: too. But like, yeah, I’m at this weird angle with where my laptop is. So

[00:00:49] Brett: why? Why are you like your camera’s going up your nose? Why is

[00:00:54] Christina: yeah, because I’m using the camera that is on my laptop rather than using the other camera, which is better positioned because I [00:01:00] wanted to stare at the screen and it’s on my lap. So.

[00:01:02] Brett: I appreciate the eye contact. I will say like when you’re looking off screen and it feels like you’re just giving us the cold shoulder, just cause you’re reading your screen. It feels weird.

[00:01:14] Christina: though I’m actually giving you eye contact, but it looks like

[00:01:16] Jeff: Yeah. Yeah. And, and Brett, Brett listeners looks like he always does on zoom, which is like the elevator got stuck between floors. Like your head is in the lower half and there’s a whole, top half.

[00:01:29] Brett: well, so cause, cause below, below my torso I’m I’m I, I’m still not comfortable with how much weight it, but on,

[00:01:39] Christina: This is terrible audio.

[00:01:40] Jeff: it. Sorry everybody. Sorry about that. Everybody just know that breaths just know that breaths a new headphone covers matches hoodie.

[00:01:48] Brett: Oh yeah. My socks match too. I would show you, but nobody on a podcast cares what my socks look like. They’re NASA socks.

[00:01:58] Jeff: You know, what’s weird is I looked over at my phone [00:02:00] just now and there are sponsors calling off the hook and that people that don’t even work with us yet, the one I get a sponsorship on this show right now, they’re just hearing this here and they’re going, you know,

[00:02:09] Brett: some. What, what sponsors are calling Jeff?

[00:02:12] Jeff: uh, it looks like I’m getting a call from, uh, is that ARP?

[00:02:17] That’s one of them. Um,

[00:02:20] Brett: Do you guys, do you guys get letters from the ARP?

[00:02:24] Jeff: no.

[00:02:25] Brett: I do regularly on the reg I get letters congratulating me on my retirement and offering me like platinum level membership with all of the perks that come for. What is it? 54 plus I’m 40 I’m 43. I’m

[00:02:45] Christina: I was going to say, I was, I was like, as like, you’re not in any way, shape or form on their target list. I will say if I start getting things from them, that is when, you know, despite like my commitment to only being 29 forever. That that is when I will like, [00:03:00] be very upset and I will

[00:03:01] Jeff: It’s not going to feel good.

[00:03:03] Christina: No, it’s not.

[00:03:04] Cosmetics are people too

[00:03:04] Brett: can we skip way down our topic list to talk about Christina’s Botox and fillers?

[00:03:09] Christina: We totally can.

[00:03:10] Jeff: Yeah, sure.

[00:03:11] Christina: If you want

[00:03:12] Brett: So, so on our list, it says Christina spent $2,500 on Botox and fillers ask me anything. So Christina,

[00:03:20] Christina: Yeah.

[00:03:20] Brett: a billboard just went up in my town, my town of 30,000 people, uh, with like average Botox and fillers come in today for your consultation.

[00:03:31] And like, I don’t see Wynnona having high enough beauty standards to really sustain a practice of Botox and fillers. But here’s my question. Here’s my AMA, what the fuck is the.

[00:03:46] Christina: Yeah. So it is, um, some sort of like gel substance. Sometimes it can be other things that they basically put in. Like I got some of my chins, my chin now looks a little bit more like pointed, like again, I’m at a

[00:03:58] Brett: I wasn’t going to say anything, but yeah, [00:04:00] it’s a beautiful Chan.

[00:04:01] Christina: Thank you. Um, so I got some there and I also got some in my cheekbones to add.

[00:04:04] Um, and I have, uh, according to the doctor, who’s super hot. She was like, you have very good bone structure. And I was like, thank you. And, um, uh,

[00:04:12] Brett: You have very good bone structure, but here, let me fix that for.

[00:04:15] Christina: well, I mean, she was like, it’s really honestly that the stuff in my cheekbones, it’s more preventative rather than anything else. Um, and, and so, but, but it’s, the idea is like, as you age, like you lose fat deposits in your face, which can make you.

[00:04:30] You know, more, more jelly and, and more like angular and, and older. And so the idea with fillers is that you can re add in kind of that, that, you know, it fills things to give you like a more full appearance. Um, and, um, and they can do other things too, like for people who might have, again, like if you wanted to add more like contouring to, again, like your, your chin or, or if you didn’t have like high cheek bones, or if you wanted to, um, uh, add in some areas where you have a lot of wrinkles, it can be useful.

[00:04:59] Whereas [00:05:00] Botox is botulism that basically gets rid of wrinkles.

[00:05:06] Brett: So, okay. You can see my face right now. None of our listeners. But what do I need? Like if you were giving me a consult

[00:05:14] Christina: I have no idea.

[00:05:15] Brett: and filler place, it’s not, that’s not your profession.

[00:05:19] Christina: is not my profession.

[00:05:20] Brett: just, you receive it

[00:05:22] Christina: I receive it. I trust them. And I’m like, what will keep me looking as young as possible, as long as possible? Like what will make me continue to look as good as possible? And like the fillers will last two years, so they’re expensive, but it’s a good investment.

[00:05:35] Whereas Botox is like, I don’t know. It depends on if you get Botox or Dysport because their competitors and they last, I don’t know, four months, five months, it varies. But, um, my one regret. As that I didn’t start getting Botox in my twenties. Um, and I would have started earlier because it it’s, it’s preventative.

[00:05:55] So if you do it earlier, for instance, like, I naturally don’t have a lot of lines in my face and stuff, [00:06:00] but as you get older, like everybody, it happens. And so if you start doing it earlier, then you can prevent like the wrinkles and shit from coming. Um, so it’s, it’s preventative. Um, people can go way overboard completely, but if you do it in moderation, like I would have started doing it at like 25, 26.

[00:06:17] If, if I could go back in time, that’s what I would’ve done. And it, and I wouldn’t have gone like every three or four months, I probably would’ve gone like every six, every seven. And it would have been small amounts, but it, it would have been the case. And like now, I mean, again, the, the listeners can’t see, but like I have movement, you know what I mean?

[00:06:33] Like my face isn’t

[00:06:34] Jeff: Yeah. Yeah,

[00:06:34] Christina: but, but, but when I smile, when I smile, like I don’t have lines on my eyeline’s like, it’s, it’s just a different, it’s just.

[00:06:43] Brett: That’s weird. So

[00:06:45] Jeff: was not,

[00:06:46] Brett: oh, go

[00:06:47] Jeff: go ahead. Oh, No,

[00:06:48] Brett: Jeff, please, please.

[00:06:49] Jeff: I was not until we talked, we talked about this a little before the show last week, and like, I was not aware of. Uh, Botox and moderation. And though, as the way you describe it, [00:07:00] and especially just generally I wasn’t aware of its use as you describe it. And it’s super interesting to me and it makes me think it must be much more common than I realized, because I think I still have as an old man who remembers the early days of Botox.

[00:07:11] Like I think I still have that impression like that. And it’s clearly a way outdated sense of things.

[00:07:17] Christina: Yeah. Well, the thing is, is that most people who get it, you wouldn’t know that they have it, you know, when they have like the Botox face, most people who have it. Um, it’s not one of those things that a lot of people openly admit I will cause I don’t care. Uh, and I think I look great, but, um, uh, also like reduce the stigma, um, you know, of that sort of thing.

[00:07:37] Um, but I think that like a lot of people, like if you get it done well, and that’s the same, I think with any sort of like plastic surgery or anything, the idea is that people can’t tell like the goal should be not to. Someone’s like, oh my God, you know, you look so different, but oh yeah, you look really good, you know?

[00:07:54] Jeff: right, right, right. Totally. Yeah. That’s cool.

[00:07:57] Brett: My girlfriend is five years old, [00:08:00] older than me. And I’ll let you do the math. I won’t divulge her age on air, but, uh,

[00:08:06] Jeff: dummy.

[00:08:06] Brett: she like, she’s a, she’s a hippie she’s, she’s taking care of her face with like pippy facial products, her whole life. And, uh, she is just now starting to get maybe some like laugh lines, but she has almost no wrinkles on her face.

[00:08:24] But I have to say as someone, you more in the vicinity of 50 than 20 myself, uh, like I just, I kind of expect that in a woman, I, I, I love every line on her face, not to be overly Moshi about it, but, but I, at what age do you think it, it becomes pointless to try to keep avoiding wrinkles.

[00:08:50] Christina: I mean, I don’t know if it’s about avoiding wrinkles of it. It is. You just don’t want to feel like you look not like yourself. I don’t know. I mean, and it’s up to everyone. I mean, there are some people who have no problem with the aging process [00:09:00] and who are really happy to do it. I’m not

[00:09:02] Brett: excited about my wrinkles. I love my wrinkles. Like every time I see one I’m like, oh, I look distinguished. I’m

[00:09:08] Jeff: dude, who lives in podcasts from his basement?

[00:09:11] Christina: I was going to say, but you’re also, you’re also a man, which

[00:09:14] means that society judges you completely differently. Uh, you also don’t have, uh, like a public facing on camera job. Um, not that anybody has ever commented on me looking old at all. In fact, most people think that I’m at least a decade younger than I am, which is

[00:09:27] Brett: 29.

[00:09:28] Christina: right, exactly.

[00:09:29] But, but, but I, I want that to continue to be the place, right? Like it’s, it’s competitive. And, and if you look, if you don’t, you know, like youth sells, it just is what it is. And not everybody has that approach. Right? Like I’m, I’m completely open to people who are like, I have. Interest in doing this me, my personal white whale is I want to find out who Reese Witherspoon’s person is.

[00:09:51] And I’m like, I I’m, I’m not even joking here. Like I’m, I’m trying to like work my contacts in Los Angeles to try to figure it out. Uh, if I do find out, I obviously [00:10:00] won’t be able to share publicly. Um, but like, cause I would pay whatever amount of money it would cost to have whoever her person is. Cause she looks great.

[00:10:08] Like she looks older, but she doesn’t look old and she looks, she’s still playing roles of characters in her thirties when she’s in her mid forties, which is not common. Jennifer Lopez is a whole other thing. She claims she’s never had Botox or anything. I don’t know if I believe that I don’t really care, but Jennifer Lopez looks fucking stunning, you know?

[00:10:28] Jeff: like for you to get to this information about Reese Witherspoon’s person, you would have to play a game. I, I call, I only played in LA. I call it how many questions does it take me to break the NDA? And so you sit with, because everyone you meet in LA LA is on some sort, right? And you just start asking questions and going.

[00:10:48] I tell you the funniest example. Because it wasn’t technically a break, but I think it’s kind of fun. And it’s almost a ghost story. I was sitting with someone who was in charge of Tupac’s [00:11:00] archives and, um, and I said, I said, okay, okay, let’s play this game. I call break the NDA. I think I want to see how many questions it takes me to get to the point where you’re actually uncomfortable.

[00:11:11] Right? Like if you’re willing, if you’re willing to play, you don’t have to answer when I get to that point. But I want to, I see how quick we can get to that point. Right. so I’m like, where is Tupac’s archive now? Like can’t say, okay. Okay. Okay. Do you have a big office or a small office? Can’t say, then I said, does Tupac ever come by? And they stopped and went? I can’t say No, I was like, yes. Two bucks a lot. Anyway, I highly recommend the game. It’s fun.

[00:11:48] Christina: no, that’s okay. That’s a really good game.

[00:11:50] Jeff: Goes better with alcohol. And I’m not, if you, if you’re not a drinker out there listening, I’m not trying to encourage that sort of thing. But I found that it goes better.

[00:11:59] Christina: I love it. [00:12:00]

[00:12:00] Jeff: And I I’m careful, like if I, since I’m about to break the NDA, I don’t go any further. I just try to get, try to get using less obvious questions.

[00:12:09] Try to get to the point where they’re like, okay, we gotta stop. Everyone’s a willing participant,

[00:12:14] Brett: So this has been a really roundabout way to get to our mental health corner.

[00:12:20] Christina: It has been, but it’s

[00:12:21] Jeff: but here we are in the corner.

[00:12:22] Christina: I was going to say, but it actually fits. Cause like for me, I got that stun when I was in Atlanta and I won’t lie. Like it does help my mental health. Also. Not that there is, this is not my excuse for getting Botox. My mom likes to use this as my excuse for getting Botox.

[00:12:36] She’s like, oh, it helps your migraines too. And I’m like, well, yeah, but like, let’s be very clear why I’m doing.

[00:12:42] Jeff: But it does help migraines.

[00:12:44] Christina: Yeah, at least, I mean, for a lot of people, it does. And in fact, and I don’t because I don’t get it for that reason, I would feel weird. I’m trying to go through the insurance process, but insurance will to a certain degree to Padana until you have, [00:13:00] and how many hoops you jump through. If you have like chronic, chronic migraines, they will, at this point, I’ll actually cover Botox treatments because, um, they’re not sure why, but there’s something about, you know, like whatever is, um, I guess like in, in the botulism or whatever, however it’s released that does something that really helps a lot of people who have like chronic migraines

[00:13:22] Jeff: Interesting.

[00:13:23] Brett: Speaking of insurance before we go to mental health, I got to tell you this great news I got. So I currently, I have no teeth on the bottom, right of my jaw. I

[00:13:33] Christina: Oh, wow.

[00:13:34] Jeff: You

[00:13:35] Brett: easy from their back, no teeth. And my, my dental insurance had said they were going to cover $1,000 of the $6,000 bill. It was going to take to, to have these teeth removed, have the implants put in and have new teeth.

[00:13:54] And I just got a letter from insurance with I’d never appealed. [00:14:00] Like I have a flex spending account that was going to cover it. So I never appealed. But all of a sudden I got her letter that said, we plan to pay $5,000, which leaves me with like one grand out of pocket on, on these new teeth. I’m going to be able, I haven’t been able to chew on the right side of my mouth for almost a year now.

[00:14:20] Christina: That’s amazing. That’s so good.

[00:14:23] Jeff: Now that

[00:14:23] Brett: It is awful because

[00:14:24] Jeff: strong, left side.

[00:14:26] Brett: if you really enjoy the flavor of something, you want to taste it with your whole tongue and you don’t realize how much that matters until you’re not chewing on one side of your mouth. And you’re only tasting with half your tongue. It

[00:14:38] Christina: no, totally. I am. I had a root canal, um, a couple of years ago. It’s how I found my, my current dentist who is great. Cause she, she looked at and she was like, you need a root canal, go to this guy, get it done. I was like, awesome. And I had, um, I guess leading up to that, I thought before it got bad enough, like, I guess I’d just been kind of naturally only eating on one half of my face.

[00:14:58] And it was a similar sort of thing [00:15:00] where I had to kind of get used to again. I was like, oh right, okay. So I can chew on both sides of my mouth now.

[00:15:05] Brett: Yeah. Yeah. I’m looking forward to it. It’ll be nice.

[00:15:08] Jeff: That’s awesome.

[00:15:09] Brett: Anyway, mental health. Hey, speaking of doctors though, Christina, D do you want to do a quick address?

[00:15:16] Christina: Yeah. I was going to say let’s let’s let’s do a quick ad break before we get into our mental health corner.

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[00:16:54] Brett: Uh,

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[00:17:18] Brett: Check it out today.

[00:17:20] Race and Jake from State Farm

[00:17:20] Jeff: A couple of notes on that, not the read, but the words itself. And I know we’re not really supposed to do That. but I heard docs in a row and immediately in my head, I went quack, quack, but then you don’t want to associate the word quack with, uh, any kind of healthcare. And that’s just a little note for the sponsor.

[00:17:37] It goes both ways.

[00:17:39] Christina: Honestly, it really does. And, and then when I hear quack, quack, I, I hear Aflac, which is a completely different type of insurance, which is not a sponsor of our podcast. Although, you know what, we would take their sponsorship because as classic overtired visitors know Brett and I have spent an inordinate amount of time talking about our favorite advertisements, which are usually insurance company [00:18:00] ads.

[00:18:00] Brett: always insurance ads,

[00:18:01] Christina: Always.

[00:18:02] Jeff: bring us the lizard. Bring us the duck.

[00:18:04] Brett: men. Do you, do you remember when Jake from state farm was white? had totally, I

[00:18:12] Jeff: like when they replaced the data on good times

[00:18:15] Brett: had totally forgotten, like at some point that the actor that played Jake from state farm had to have just been told everyone loves Jake from state farm, but Hey, take.

[00:18:29] We’re getting someone younger and blacker than you to just take over this name that we’ve created for you. And we all, we, we all, it was easy. Like I never thought twice about it.

[00:18:43] Jeff: the overlords knew it would be easy.

[00:18:49] Brett: yeah. Jake from say farmers way hotter. Now I gotta say

[00:18:53] Jeff: We

[00:18:53] Brett: that he’s a handsome man.

[00:18:55] Jeff: the

[00:18:55] Christina: He is a handsome man also I’m now like going through, uh, an ADHD, like, [00:19:00] um, Wiki K whole spiral, because you said replace the dad on good times. And I was like, did they replace them or did they kill them off? And I couldn’t, I can’t.

[00:19:07] Jeff: Right? Well, I think the dad at some point had a heart attack and died on the sh in the show

[00:19:13] Christina: No that’s no, no, no, no. That’s a different show.

[00:19:16] Jeff: That’s a different, that’s funny. Cause I, I feel bad about this because good times was an important show to

[00:19:20] Christina: It wasn’t a very important show, but, but, but, but then you’ve had like the famous Sr roll down damn damn scene when, when he died. Yeah, no, I think there was a different show where they replaced the dad, but it was on good times. What I think happened was that John Amos, who was famously in roots, he was upset by the direction of the show because it went all JJ centric and he was like, this is becoming buffoonery.

[00:19:42] And I don’t think that the important message that it’s spreading is good. And then he left.

[00:19:47] Jeff: I just saw an interview with him about that. In what context though, was I on a rabbit hole? Not on you. Go into a rabbit hole, not on a rabbit hole.

[00:19:55] Christina: Brett. So board let’s let’s let’s let’s let him talk about

[00:19:57] Jeff: Good.

[00:19:58] Brett: it’s just, I’ve never, I’ve never [00:20:00] seen good times. I have

[00:20:01] Jeff: Oh my God.

[00:20:02] Just started episode

[00:20:03] Brett: It’s not a show I grew up with.

[00:20:05] Jeff: Just started episode

[00:20:07] Christina: Wow. How did you never did? So did you watch any of the Norman Lear

[00:20:10] Brett: I did not watch TV as a kid, so I started watching TV, like for real, in like 1995. I never good times was never on my radar.

[00:20:21] Christina: I mean, it ended before I was born, but like, I, I washed it in reruns probably around 95. It w they would have it, there

[00:20:28] Brett: I was busy catching up on a decade of the Simpsons at

[00:20:32] Christina: Totally. No, I had to say, like, you had better things, newer things to watch, but I as like, like, like, like a 12 year old, I was like watching, um, the, all the Norman Lear stuff.

[00:20:42] Cause that was like when like TB land became a thing. And, and so,

[00:20:47] Jeff: because I was watching it when it was first year.

[00:20:49] Christina: but it was a great show. Is Janet Jackson’s first show Janet Jackson was on good times.

[00:20:52] Jeff: and a and Lenny Kravitz is

[00:20:54] Brett: You know who I just

[00:20:56] Christina: no, no. She was on, she was on the Jefferson’s.

[00:20:58] Jeff: Damn it. the Jefferson’s.

[00:20:59] God, I’m [00:21:00] doing it all over the place. Edit, edit, edit, edit.

[00:21:03] Brett: No, no. We’re keeping that last night, I was watching star Trek the next generation, and there was a little girl and I was like, I recognize those eyes and those cheekbones. And it took me a second, but I had just watched, uh, the original trilogy. Uh Spider-Man like a week before. And it immediately dawned on me that it was Kirsten Dunst in star Trek, the next generation playing a little girl, like young little girl.

[00:21:35] It was, it was weird.

[00:21:37] Christina: That’s amazing. No, I didn’t know. She was, I remember her an interview with the vampire, cause she’s like a year older than me and I was like, I want to kiss Brad Pitt. Um, I was very jealous. Um, but, but I didn’t realize she was that like, that’s awesome.

[00:21:52] Brett: I had no idea and, and I could not believe it was her. I had to go through her whole filmography to find. [00:22:00] We at the end star Trek TNG, but anyway, Christie, and I’m curious about your mental health.

[00:22:07] The Mental Health Corner

[00:22:07] Christina: Well, as I alluded to beforehand, like it’s, it’s pretty good. Um, I, I’m glad to be back home. I was in Atlanta for a long time. That was stressful on a lot of levels. I’m glad to be back. Um, uh, my Botox and my fillers, you make me feel better. And, um, yeah, work is work is going well, which helps. Um, not everybody’s job is tied to their mental health, but mine certainly is.

[00:22:29] So I’m in a good place.

[00:22:32] Brett: Cool. That’s good to hear. I’m really happy. I’m really happy that other people are doing well. I’m doing fine, but Jeff, how are you?

[00:22:42] Jeff: Um, I’m doing okay. I was so glad for, I didn’t get to say officially goodbye last episode. Cause I, I cut, I cut scenes to get dressed. Um, but it was really nice to have Alex on and have a conversation about mental health and medication and all that stuff. [00:23:00] And I’m pretty much in the same place I was where I’m trying to kind of work my way to the right, right medications and right.

[00:23:05] Balance of medications and, and um, and I think I’m heading in the right direction. Like I’m ditching one next week for, uh, for a different one. And um, but it’s just been, uh, like I’ve said a few shows in a row it’s like, it’s such a focus of my day. Um, because I’m, I’m not like complacent about it, right?

[00:23:27] Like I’m kind of, but on the other hand, I’m almost like overly vigilant about. What I’m feeling or experiencing based on the medications, but that’s because, I mean like the medications I’m taking and the words of my psychiatric nurse practitioner was like, these Can, hurt you really quickly if you’re not kind of monitoring, you know, what is it doing to your blood sugar?

[00:23:46] And are you retraining retaining water? And is it because of this or this and all of this stuff? And it, it really like puts me in this circle where I’m just like trying, sometimes I’m just left kind of trying to remember how I get to this point in the first [00:24:00] place. Right. Like, you know, I started with no ma’am, I hadn’t taken any medications until pretty much right.

[00:24:05] At the beginning of the pandemic coincidence. Um, before that I had taken no medications for anything really loved that first couple of years of it was, uh, sertraline and then Vyvanse together. But then that started to clearly be aggravating, other aspects of like undiagnosed parts of my mental illness.

[00:24:24] And so that’s what led me to my current sort of cocktail that I’m working through. And man, it’s exhausting,

[00:24:30] Brett: can we acknowledge that last week with, with Alex Cox, you very smoothly came out of the closet. As a bipolar person, like we have never discussed that on the show previously, it has always been tiptoed around. Um, because you, you, you, you were hesitant to mention that, but it came up very cleanly in the last episode.

[00:24:58] And I just want to say welcome to the world [00:25:00] of bipolar people, man.

[00:25:02] Jeff: you’ve already welcomed me. Brett was like the first person I consulted, but yes, I have a late diagnosis of bipolar one and it’s something that I’ve sort of been able to. Basically control my whole life, um, and have just generally sort of avoided conversations that lead towards that diagnosis or like therapists.

[00:25:23] So just kind of missed it a little better, misunderstood it as something else. And I, part of the reason I don’t talk about it a lot is it’s still pretty new to me. And so I, I have a risk myself of like over pathologizing myself. And so the more I talk about it, the more I set into stone, a certain narrative, and it feels so fluid right now because I’m just trying to figure out how.

[00:25:45] Um, sort of treated, I mean, the one thing that I, I was told multiple times after the diagnosis was that it’s like, Hey, good news. This is a very treatable thing. Right. And that seems totally true. I haven’t had any issues. I mean, it was like seven months ago was, [00:26:00] was the period of my life that led me towards this diagnosis.

[00:26:03] I haven’t had any issues since taking medication that are related to like specifically like very manic or very depressed, or, you know, the kind of cliched things people think of when they think of bipolar, which of course is actually an infinite number of experiences for an infinite number of people.

[00:26:20] Um, but I, I worry. That if I talked about it too much, early on, as I was still trying to understand it, that I would sort of set a narrative in stone that even I got trapped into, right. Like that it would limit, it would limit the way in which I think about our sort of, or sort of try to assess what my mental health situation is.

[00:26:40] And so, so it was very easy with Alex talking about it, to just say, well, it makes sense for me to say that I knew at least Brett, I knew you were in there going, he did it.

[00:26:48] Christina: No, I was so proud of you for, for doing that. And, um, and maybe it’s one of those things, like, because like the topic comes up, you pay more attention to it. But, um, Andy Dunn, who’s the, he was the [00:27:00] founder of Bonobos, um, which, you know, is like the clothing, um, uh, like men’s kind of clothing. He just wrote a book, um, where he talks publicly about, um, his bipolar diagnosis and, um, and how, I guess he found out when he was in his twenties and he was founding various startups.

[00:27:17] And, and so his it’s actually a really good MRR, but I can’t recall. We talked before, like the last episode about how this isn’t discussed enough and we don’t see, I guess maybe public examples of people who are really successful and have connections, like talking about it. And, and he just published a book.

[00:27:36] So. That’s good, but I also, I’m just really proud of you for feeling comfortable enough to be vulnerable and share that. And,

[00:27:46] Jeff: Oh, it’s an easy space to do it in. Thanks to you too.

[00:27:50] Brett: I, uh, I almost contacted you after to ask if you did it on purpose because it was so you just slipped it in there. So,

[00:27:58] Jeff: well, I knew from listening to [00:28:00] Dubai Friday, that Alex had was, you know, kind of talking about. Their own diagnosis. So it was like kind of assumed it would come up, um, or just thought it might come up. I guess that’s what I mean to say, but you know, it is, and with this, you shared a clip, Christina, um, of that dude and talking about how, as we talked about in the podcast last week, there were like different kinds of mental illness that are now okay.

[00:28:25] To talk about. Like they don’t make anybody go, Hey, we should have just, uh, let’s just debrief on that interview with console. Uh, you know what I mean? Like, but, um, but it is true that the bipolar. thing is still like, even for me, Personally, like I had sort of stigmatized it. And when I stigmatize things, that’s not in a judgemental way, it just means that I haven’t heard enough people talking about it.

[00:28:46] I mean, Brett, you’ve done an enormous service to people, your readers, your listeners, by talking about it, writing about it, writing about the challenges, um, joking about how you can tell where you’re manic phases, where by looking at your GitHub [00:29:00] repo and your, when you’re pushing stuff. Um, but for me, it was like, for me, it remains a thing where just kinda like, I don’t mind talking about it, but it’s so fresh that I want to still leave room for me to sort of understand it and, and take form itself in front of me, you know?

[00:29:19] But it’s definitely one of those cases where. You know, I’ve had one other, two other situations like this, where something happens and it causes, and it causes me to just look back over my whole life and kind of reevaluate certain things that I had that I had called true about me. And they were true about me, but they were also true about me because of something going on in my brain chemistry.

[00:29:43] And so I almost wanted to do like a version of the alcoholics anonymous thing and like start calling people and be like, remember when I called you and pitched that like massive project that I then never followed up on here’s the deal. Yeah, exactly. There are like little, there are actually four or five people that I would like to [00:30:00] call or message and just be like, I just want to explain something because I feel really bad that I kind of disappeared on that after bringing it up.

[00:30:06] And I kind of understand why now.

[00:30:08] Brett: When Elle got diagnosed as autistic, uh, at like, after hearing about some of her like previous relationships and stuff, I kind of wanted her to like, do like a, Hey, so you remember how this relationship ended because of this or that. And it turns out, turns out I’m autistic. But so the reason that I always, I will always push to have the mental health corner in this show is because it has become, it has been told to me so many times that people benefits so greatly from hearing other people talk about mental illness.

[00:30:45] Uh, whether it’s a particular mental illness they have, which is where it’s most helpful, or just about mental illness in general, and just talking about it and being able to, uh, to lay out like here’s, what’s going on for me. [00:31:00] And here’s how it affects my wife like that. That is what allows other people to have the conversation.

[00:31:06] And it never dawned on me. Cause I’m just, I’m just fucking honest. Like I’ll,

[00:31:10] Christina: Yeah.

[00:31:11] Brett: I’ll tell you exactly what’s going on when you ask and I’ve never thought twice about it, but I get so many, just little like emails and DMS that are just like, thank you so much for talking about this. It, it has made a big difference in my job, in my life, in my relationship.

[00:31:30] And I love that and I want to keep doing that.

[00:31:33] Jeff: The thing that eats my soul about it is that I know that I have had, I have worked in workplaces where if I were to talk about this, it would not impact my experience, but that. if any of my colleagues who were women or people of color talked about it, and I’m not, I mean, I’m, I can not be more serious and more confident in saying this that it would impact.

[00:31:56] Profoundly in terms of how they were treated, how they were. And so [00:32:00] that’s another thing about, you know, we talk about sort of normalizing it, but like it’s only sort of normalizing it in a corner of, of, of mental health

[00:32:08] Christina: Well, well, it is, and it’s not, I think, I think that you’re right, that it would be different 100%, but I also think that the more, um, awareness and the more examples we have out there, the less, it is likely to be able to treat people differently for those things. And I say that as, as, as a woman, I’m not a person of color, obviously, and I have a lot of other privileges, but I’ve been very open about the fact that I suffer from depression and anxiety for basically as long as I’ve been a quote unquote public figure.

[00:32:37] Um, and, and so, um, and, and that doesn’t mean that there aren’t situations where I haven’t had people not be understanding and where I, I couldn’t, I can’t conceive, uh, places where people might judge me in certain ways. Cause I certainly can. Um, and, and that, that’s not to say my experience would be the same for everyone.

[00:32:56] I still think that even though you’re right, that you being public [00:33:00] is, can be received very differently from other people. I still think that the more people who discuss it, period, like, you know, um, what, what, what’s the phrase like, like all, um, tides raise

[00:33:12] Brett: tide, rising tide.

[00:33:14] Christina: lift all ships. Yeah.

[00:33:16] It’s

[00:33:16] Brett: Something like that.

[00:33:17] Jeff: yeah. Yeah. Right,

[00:33:18] Christina: And I think there’s truth to that. Right. I think that, that doesn’t mean that it’ll happen the same way, but it does mean cause there are still differences in how we even perceive, um, like things like autism, uh, between genders, um, and, and people from different backgrounds. Um, and, and we don’t know on this podcast, we don’t talk about the socioeconomic and class differences in mental illness, uh, which are very vast, you know, and, and we’re all coming at this from like a very certain point of view, but I still think that having the discussion period is good for everyone.

[00:33:54] Jeff: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I agree. I agree. What about you, [00:34:00] Brett? How are you doing.

[00:34:01] Brett: Well, speaking of bipolar since switching to Vyvanse, what two to three months ago, I have not had a single manic episode. And historically when I go thi