Leading Second Podcast

This episode’s guests are longtime friends of the Leading Second tribe, Earl and Oneka McClellan. They sat in the second chair for many years and now sit in the first chair as Senior Pastors at Shoreline City Church, just outside of Dallas, Texas. They talk about alignment, studying our pastors and learning their vocabulary, and having confidence in our identity.

We have the honor of hearing from Omar El-Takrori. Omar serves as the Community Pastor at City Light Church in Las Vegas, Nevada, and a content creator with Think Media. He shares his thoughts on serving, having confidence in your calling, and how to utilize social media to have an impact on your ministry.

I recently got the opportunity to sit down with Kogi Nareen and Shaun Lewarne from Rivers Church in South Africa. In this conversation, they bring insight into how their church has begun to shape their community’s culture by adjusting the mindsets of those attending each weekend. They also give some great thoughts on how to lead well from the second chair.

It’s the last episode of our Summer Camp series, and we’ve got a treat for you. Larry Brey from Elevation Church shares a lesson that will challenge what you might think needs changing in your church. Our panel this week does a great job expanding on his thoughts and helping us use this to align with the spirit of our own house.

This is the third episode of our Summer Camp series, and Brandon Stewart shares a message teaching us the difference between stewards and servants. And we have a fantastic panel that gives us some questions to ask ourselves that will connect us to what we are called to be stewards of.

We're back with the second episode of our Summer Camp series. This week we are joined by Joshua Bingle from Genesis Church in Spokane, WA. He challenges us about how we look at self-care and how we rest. With our new format for Summer Camp, our panel talks through this teaching, and what rest looks like in their lives.

This is the first episode of a 4 part series called Summer Camp. We have an incredible teaching by Nicole Moore from Champion’s Centre in Tacoma, WA, about the discipline of remembrance and how that can unlock some things in our leadership. In a new format just for this series, we have a panel that discusses their thoughts on this teaching and how to apply it.

What could a reset look like in your life? It’s easy to get into management mode where we are just surviving and no longer thriving in church leadership. Rest and rhythms of renewal are essential if you want to go the distance in ministry. This episode is your reminder to take a second and ask yourself a few questions. We also have a great second chair testimony from Chris Loukos who serves at Elevation Church.

Second chair leadership can look different in every season of life and ministry, so how do we lead second in every season? My conversation today is with Dave Simiele. Dave is on the Senior Management Team at Christ Fellowship Church in Palm Beach, FL, where he also serves as a Campus Pastor. So listen in as he gives us a masterclass on Leading Second. And be sure not to skip past Joseph Kelley, giving us five keys to overcoming a critical spirit.

If you’ve been in ministry for some time, you’ve probably felt like quitting. Or at least have asked yourself what the heck you are doing. So, where do you go when moments get tough? Today, I’m excited to bring a new friend to the Leading Second tribe. Jim Wideman is currently the Executive Operations Pastor at The Belonging Co in Nashville, Tennessee. Incredible in its own right, but even more impressive, Jim has a lifetime thriving in the second chair. He’s been in ministry for over 45 years, covering just about any role you can think of. You don’t want to miss the wisdom shared in this episode.

What makes a great team? We all want our teams to be healthy and thriving, so I thought I’d sit down with a few leaders from 7 Hills Church in Cincinnati, Ohio. Under the leadership of Marcus Mecum, this is an incredible team that I’ve grown to respect more and more. So let’s explore the DNA that creates a great team.

Our pastors hold a weight we may never even see and won’t ever know unless we sit in that chair. So, how can we help carry that? Here is a conversation with some practical insight and wisdom, regardless of your role or proximity to your pastors. Nick and Liz Dekold from Lakeshore Church in Rockwall, Texas, have been serving on their team for almost 20 years, so they have plenty of experience leading on behalf of their pastors.

Do you ever find yourself tying your identity to the affirmation of those around you? If we're honest, we all can from time to time. Joining us today is my friend Clayton Baird who is on staff at Celebration Church in Jacksonville, Florida. We talk about health in your church leadership and make sure that we find our identity in Jesus. We also have Jesse Rodriguez offer us five ways to give good feedback.

What can you learn about ministry and leadership from NASCAR? Our guest today is Dillon Ritchie. An executive pastor at CoastLife Church in Venice, Florida, he gives us a great lesson about racing and talks about being faithful in serving. We also have Jason and Liz Klammor, who share their story about leading in the middle.

As church leaders in the second chair of your ministry, can you handle a no from your pastor? There is tension at times between ambition and submission, and in this episode, I have a conversation with Temi Pope from Union Church where we talk about being faithful in the second chair. We also had a great listener question come in from Mary Jones, asking how to lead individuals who have higher skills than your own.

The big idea in our conversation today is remaining faithful under pressure. When it seems that there’s pressure coming at us from all sides, I wanted to have a conversation about how we remain faithful through it. But first, Jesse Rodriguez joins us with another Top 5 that you do not want to miss. He gives us 5 Ways to Increase Your Capacity as a Leader (1:27). Then I sit down with Tanisha Stromberg, Jen Tribble, and Tim Tribble, all campus pastors from Parallel Church in Alberta, Canada (6:33). As a church in Canada, they face unique circumstances and challenges on top of the changes in their own church. They’ve had a wild ride these past couple of years, and I’m so encouraged by how strong their church has come out of it.

We’re in a moment where I believe that leaders could use some wisdom on how to walk through something. It seems that there’s a new report or event surrounding a leader falling or making a mistake at a pretty consistent rate now. So I wanted to turn to the person who has helped me walk through so many challenging moments and tough conversations in my life. I asked my pastor, Kevin Gerald, to talk about how we are to respond when leaders fall, what our mentality should be, and what we can anchor to in these times.

Our conversation today is with Greg Basch. He is the Campus Leadership Pastor at Elevation Church, so he coaches and leads leaders and really just has a brilliant leadership mind and voice (seriously, follow him on IG asap). But before we get into the conversation with Greg, we have our first “Top 5” this season. Joseph Kelly is the Associate Pastor at Discovery Church in Oklahoma City, OK, and he gives us his top 5 prayers every leader should pray (1:16). Since our theme this season is “from the second chair, for the second chair,” we’re doing a little "get to know you" time with our guests since so many will be brand new to the podcast (9:31). Then, on some of our episodes this season, we will give our guests 10 minutes to give us their favorite leadership lesson or message. So I’m setting Greg loose for an incredible lesson on promoting and producing (17:20). Finally, for our conversation, we’re talking about being faithful in your calling (32:06).

Welcome to Season 5 of the Leading Second Podcast! With so many incredible testimonies coming in already from Leading Second Camp, we thought it’d be fun to give a little window into the day we had. In this table talk discussion session, Brandon and Lindsay Stewart, John Morgan, Kaisa Freeman, and Larry Brey talk about the lost art of honor. They talk through honor apathy, being an architect of honor, slowing down, and what a lifestyle of honor looks like. If you don’t want to miss out on Leading Second Camp next year in Salt Lake City, you can go ahead and register now at leadingsecondcamp.com using the access code “PODCAST-INSIDER.”

We are back! It is officially Season 5 of The Leading Second Podcast, and I couldn’t be happier to be back in this space. I am so excited about our lineup this season and our topics on deck to cover! Our theme for Season 5 is “from the second chair, for the second chair.” We usually have quite a few lead pastors on the podcast, but I know there’s so much gold inside people in the second chair that we can all learn from. So this season, I want to highlight that and bring some dignity back to the second chair. To kick the season off, we are hitting the current climate of church and ministry head-on with an episode on faithfulness and how to lead in a season of deconstruction. Josh Bingle is one of the most intelligent people I know, and he can speak simply to some of the most complex and confusing topics. He is the pastor of Genesis Church in Spokane, WA, he is a close friend to myself and Leading Second, and I couldn’t think of somebody better to talk through this with than him. Deconstruction is showing up in varying degrees, and in many different ways all over the place, so we cover a broad range of questions like: What is deconstruction? What do we do when drift becomes deconstruction? Is there a difference between deconstructing and just asking hard questions? Are there different kinds of deconstructors? How do we lead in a culture of deconstruction? In this tricky season, people have more and more big questions. So not only do we need to know how to answer those questions, we must be able to lead others through it graciously. That is my prayer this week for you. Run strong and lead well, Brandon

The end of the year always brings some time of reflection but also planning and dreaming for what is to come ahead. I want to start 2022 with some intention. Most people likely want to be a better leader at the end of the year than we were at the start, but what are we going to do about it?

Today I am so excited to welcome a new friend to the podcast! Clayton Baird joins me as we talk through “How to Lead in A Culture of Offense.” Clayton and his wife Bethany have served on staff at Celebration Church in Jacksonville, Florida, for ten years. He fits right in with the Leading Second family as he has done just about everything in his ministry journey, including worship pastor, youth & young adult pastor, and campus pastor. He is currently serving as a teaching pastor at Celebration while also overseeing Celebration Everywhere - the global online church community. Clayton is somebody who really just embodies the Leading Second spirit, and I’m so glad that he agreed to sit down with me for a little while. You also don’t want to miss another Top 5 this week! Dillion Ritchie gives us his top 5 ways to prepare for a hard conversation.

We start this episode with another incredible Top Five from Taylor Persello, and you’re not going to want to miss it. Then our conversation today is with our great friend Dan Lord. Dan is the pastor of Victory Church in St. Louis, MO. I’m also joined by BJ Cooper, who is on the team at Victory Church and has a bit of gold in him as well. The three of us talk about development, alignment, and transition.

Every once in a while, I have something that I want to take an episode and talk about myself. Well, this is one of those weeks. I’ve had something weighing on me for a while, and I finally feel like it’s something I need to take an episode and talk about. So if you’re a part of this tribe, if Leading Second has meant anything to you, or if you view me as any type of guide or pastor in your life, I want to take today’s conversation and have a pastoral call or pastoral talk with you today. I want to open up a discussion about influence vs. authority.

Here we are at our 100th episode!! I can’t believe we made it this far and if you’ve been with us for any amount of time, thank you so much for your support and for being a part of this tribe. We start this episode with a HUGE announcement that I am so excited about, so don’t miss that. Then I am joined with some friends, Dillon Ritchie, Kelly Goff, Tracy Keene, and Josiah Beougher, as we sit down with Larry Brey to talk about cultivating your calling.

We kick things off today with a special segment for Pastor Appreciation month where some of our Leading Second tribe answered a few questions about their own pastors! Then we dive into a rich conversation with a first-time guest to our podcast, Collin Henderson. Collin is from my hometown, Puyallup, WA! He’s a mental performance coach, speaker, and author who just released a new book called ‘Quiet Mind’ (and ‘Quiet Mind for Kids’). During this conversation, we talk about the impact of a leader’s mindset and its effect on their ministry.

It’s the final episode of our “Healthy Hustle” series, and our conversation for this one is with Noah Herrin! Noah has been on before, but this is the first time we’ve let him loose for an entire episode. If you aren’t familiar with him, he is a Gen Z leader whose voice I have grown to love more and more. He is a young leader who has an incredible anointing on his life and is hungry to grow continually. He has a young adults ministry and is a part of Neighborhood Church in Buford, GA. Join us as we talk about church hurt, coaching, and keeping joy in ministry.

In this episode of our series on “Healthy Hustle,” our goal is to break down the dichotomy between hard work and rest, equipping you to run at a sustainable pace in this season. But before we even get to that conversation, Taylor Persello hops on and lists 5 gifts that we can give our Pastors. They’re simple, they’re actionable, and they will propel you forward in your leadership if you apply them today. Following that, my friend Jonathan O’Reilly, an executive pastor at The Rock in Kansas City, MO, joins me in a conversation with Pace Hartfield! Pace was an incredible second chair leader for years, and he now pastors One Place Church in Coeur d’Alene, Idaho. The three of us chase down the question of “how can I avoid burnout?”

For the second episode in our series on Healthy Hustle, I sit down with Colleen Tunis. My friend Rachel Buckner joins us as well, as we talk about staying healthy while leading in a fast-paced environment and the tension between health and hustle. Colleen leads as the programming director at Elevation Church in Charlotte, NC. She is just a wealth of knowledge and perspective, and she carries the weight of ministry so generously.

Depression, anxiety, panic, suicidal thoughts… mental health is a bit of a buzzword right now, but what happens when you experience any of these first hand? We try to tackle so much on our own, but we do get confronted with these genuine issues. When that happens, do you have the courage to raise your hand and say, “I’m dealing with _____ right now.”? Is that even the right thing to do? And if it is, who do you say it to? This week we are kicking off a series called Healthy Hustle. How do we maintain health in all areas of life when we are constantly trying to hustle? I couldn’t think of a better person to start this conversation with than Troy Maxwell. Troy has been on the podcast once before, but if you aren’t very familiar with him, he launched Freedom House Church in Charlotte, NC, where he and his wife Penny have been serving for 19 years. We wanted to explore the question, “What if my emotional health has me leading on empty?” Troy has a conversation with me today where he opens up about his own personal experiences with panic attacks. He shares how they affected his life, and he talks through how to overcome these seasons or struggles in your own life. He wrote a book called Panic Room, which he talks a little about but if you’d like to hear even more from him on this subject, I highly recommend picking it up. Anybody leading on empty right now because of emotional health, this doesn’t have to be your story anymore. I pray that this episode shows people that they aren’t alone in what they are walking through. I pray that it gives people strength. And I pray that it provides some leaders courage to raise their hand if they need to and talk to their pastor about what they are going through. Run strong this week, but run healthy Brandon Resources: Panic Room by Troy Maxwell After the episode: What do you do to ensure that your mental and emotional health stays strong?

If we’ve ever had an episode that’s worth coming back to multiple times, this is it. I had a conversation with a man who has had a profound impact on my life, impacted many churches around the world, and does the best Brian Houston impersonation that I’ve ever heard. Pastor John Morgan joins us for a potentially life-changing episode about transition and how to transition well. My friend Kelly Goff and I got a chance to sit down with John while he was actually walking through a potential transition in his life, going from a volunteer staff role (while his wife Anna is on the executive team) to picking up his family and moving near Washington DC to pastor Word of Life International in Springfield, VA. John has been in ministry for over 35 years and has managed to transition so well multiple times, so it seemed fitting and natural for our conversation to just go there and speak some wisdom into moments or seasons of transition. Here are the things that we cover in today’s episode: John takes us through an overview of transitions that he has been through The importance of transitions and doing them well Planning for transition before it comes time to actually transition How do you help people process a “God told me.” Transitions in, are just as important as the transition out What does a healthy transition look like? It is always such an incredible opportunity to sit down with John. He is just a wealth of knowledge and wisdom in ministry. Even if you’re not currently going through a transition, you will eventually, and it is so important that we know how to do it well. Run strong this week, Brandon Editor's note: John has, in fact, gone to the darkside and is no longer a number 2. He is officially the lead pastor of Word of Life Church, so go on his Instagram and tell him congrats!

We are back with our second episode of this fall season, and it has felt great to get back in the groove of things. Before we dive into this week’s conversation, we had a great listener question come in this week from Matt Bowden at Zeal Church in Nashville, Tennessee. It sheds some light on church hurt. If that is something you’ve experienced or are currently experiencing, I want to encourage you to know the difference between playing hurt and playing injured. You don’t want to skip this question and answer. Well, our guest this week is no stranger at all in this space. He has been such a strong voice in this season, and honestly, I just never get tired of talking to him. My good friend Joshua Bingle, Pastor of Genesis Church in Spokane, WA, is back with us! The big question that we try to tackle today is how to disagree well. It isn’t a sexy topic, but this is such a needed conversation today. We’ve forgotten how to argue, and we have developed an inability to confront because ideas and people have become woven together. So we are going to talk about: How to separate ideas from people The difference between arguing and quarreling Talking to non-believers vs. believers Moralizing and demonizing Josh is brilliant in this conversation, and I know you will walk away with a perspective shift after this episode. Run strong this week, Brandon After the episode: What area of how you disagree with others hit home for you? How do you separate people from the ideas that they may hold?

Leading Second tribe!! Summer break is over, and we are back for the second half of season four, releasing new episodes every Thursday this fall. Well, if you haven’t gotten enough of Team Church Conference over the past 24 hours, we are kicking things off in a big way! We are joined by a panel of Executive Pastors and Campus Pastors that all came out to Team Church conference this August, and I had the pleasure of sitting down with them in the lobby for a conversation. We want to switch some episodes up this fall, and this is one of them, where the panel is actually going to ask me some questions that they have about leading in this season. My guests today are from some great churches all over the country. I’m joined today by Matt Kysor from Centerpoint Church in Chillicothe, OH, Kaisa Freeman from The Well Church in Salt Lake City, UT, Andrew Shaw from Velocity Church in Lawrence, KS, Emily Hanks from Christian Life Church in Murfreesboro, TN, and Josiah Beougher from Storyside Church in Belleville, OH. We kick things off just by going around the table and talking takeaways from Team Church Conference. Then we get into some questions: As second chair leaders, what do we need to instill in the next generation in order to pass the baton well? How do we preserve unity and stay in alignment with our lead pastors? We starts with me, so what are some of the characteristics or habits that a second chair leader needs for this next season? In supporting our lead pastors, how do we honor where we’ve been and support them best in where we’re going? How do we create a sense of urgency in our church and for our teams to run fast, and at the same time, ensure that our lead pastors are healthy and can run the race for a long time? This was such a fun episode to kick things back off with, and I hope you enjoyed it and had some things you took away from this conversation. I pray that it helps you run strong, Brandon Resources Mentioned: Team Church Conference - www.teamchurchconference.com Rocket Fuel by Gino Wickman

I’m joined for this conversation by Pastor Jabin Chavez. If you’ve been in the church world for very long, I’m sure you’re familiar with him, but for years Jabin has been serving churches all over the country. He is probably best known as a worship pastor and gifted communicator. Still, my favorite thing about Jabin, as I’ve gotten to know him over the years, is his heart for the local church. He’s also served as a youth and young adult pastor, an intern director, creative director, and even as a janitor! Anything he can do to serve, he’s all in. In 2018, he and his wife Shanen took on a new challenge… they launched City Light Church in Las Vegas, Nevada. It has been a thriving young church, but they haven’t been immune to the challenges that 2020 brought all of us. I loved getting to talk through some of those with him, but there are specific values that we shouldn’t let slip away and things that we need to fight for. In saying that, our big question this week is, “In our desire to move church forward, what are the things that we need to get back to?” Some of the other questions that we cover in our conversation are: What are your thoughts on people leaving? What can people do that would be meaningful and valuable in holding their pastor’s arms up? What are some values that are important for our churches today? What is your biggest prayer for the local church today? I love any opportunity that I get to sit down with a lead pastor and hear things from their perspective, so I pray that this gives you some insight into a pastor’s mind in this season and helps remind you of some of the foundational pieces we need as leaders. Run strong for the Kingdom, Brandon After the episode: Are there areas in your life that you’ve maybe let slip a little and you need to get back to? How is your prayer life right now? Are you praying for your teams? Your pastors? Your church? SUBSCRIBE COMMENT LIKE & SHARE We want you in our tribe! Stay connected to all Leading Second has to offer: Website: leadingsecond.com Instagram: instagram.com/leadingsecond Connect with Brandon Stewart Facebook: facebook.com/brandonmstewart Instagram: instagram.com/brandonmstewart Leading Second is an extension of the Team Church tribe. For more information on Team Church Conference and One Day events, check out teamchurchconference.com or search Team Church on Facebook.

20 years. June 3rd marks 20 years since my first Sunday as a youth pastor in Minnesota, and that came just days after graduating from ministry school. 3 1/2 years there, 10 years on staff at my home church, and then launching Leading Second while serving both my home church and the “big C” church. In all this time, I’ve picked up a couple lessons along the way that I think can impact your life and your ministry, so I wanted to take the time to share some of those. If you and I sat down for a coffee to talk about what I’ve learned in 20 years, these are many of the thoughts I would share. I believe there is something in here for everybody. I talk about individual growth, teams, and family. So I hope you enjoy this and find something in this episode that you can apply to your own life. Thank you to everybody that has given me wisdom, encouraged me, and walked with me through any, or all, of these 20 years. Brandon SUBSCRIBE COMMENT LIKE & SHARE We want you in our tribe! Stay connected to all Leading Second has to offer: Website: leadingsecond.com Instagram: instagram.com/leadingsecond Connect with Brandon Stewart Facebook: facebook.com/brandonmstewart Instagram: instagram.com/brandonmstewart Leading Second is an extension of the Team Church tribe. For more information on Team Church Conference and One Day events, check out teamchurchconference.com or search Team Church on Facebook.

Anna Morgan is always such a treat to have any time she comes on the podcast! She is a constant and continual learner, she has such a great heart for the church and leaders, and I just count it as such a privilege to have her and her husband in our world. If you’re not familiar, Anna is on the executive team at City Church Chicago, is married to our friend John Morgan (if you haven’t listened to his most recent episode with us this past fall, it is worth your time to go back and listen to), and she champions women in ministry so well in many different ways. The one big question that we will try to answer in this conversation is, “How should I carry myself as a leader?” In Ephesians 4, the Apostle Paul tells us to “live a life worthy of the calling we have received.” If we are to lead others toward maturity, shouldn’t we be setting the example for that? And if we are, what does that even look like? At a time where it is more and more popular to view self as authority, it’s getting easier to forget that we are to submit ourselves to Christ in everything we do? We tackle these topics of authority, being authentic, and submission, but also get into some of these questions: Are you concerned with some of the conduct that you are currently seeing? What are you seeing from church leaders currently on social media that is concerning you? How important are seasons of prep? What have you observed from people (leaders especially) who create posts and online content that ends up showing a gap between themselves and their pastor? I hope and pray that this episode leaves an impact on you and leaves you wanting to put some extra thought into how you conduct yourself as a leader. Run strong this week, Brandon Resources: https://firmisrael.org https://israelu.org Ruth Haley Barton Pete Scazzero Leading From The Second Chair by Mike Bonem and Roger Patterson After the episode: How can you carry yourself differently this week as a leader? How can you live a life worthy of the calling you have received? How clean is your car? “Should my church have a say about what I post online?” SUBSCRIBE COMMENT LIKE & SHARE We want you in our tribe! Stay connected to all Leading Second has to offer: Website: leadingsecond.com Instagram: instagram.com/leadingsecond Connect with Brandon Stewart Facebook: facebook.com/brandonmstewart Instagram: instagram.com/brandonmstewart Leading Second is an extension of the Team Church tribe. For more information on Team Church Conference and One Day events, check-out teamchurchconference.com or search Team Church on Facebook.

The big question we’re going to wrestle through on this episode is this: What could healthy team culture look like moving forward? In a season where it seems like everything has changed, some things remain constant - and the need for healthy team culture is undoubtedly at the top of that list. Today we’re going to talk to a team I highly respect in so many ways — the Life.Church team, under the leadership of Craig Groeschel has grown to be one of the most influential churches in the world. But what I appreciate so much is WHY they have gained influence. Their approach to ministry, commitment to health, and generous heart have won them my respect. We have two segments for you today with this team, and I’m so excited for you to hear from them… Part 1 is with Kyle Kutter. Kyle is the Central Group Leader of Digital Technology. If you are familiar with Open Network, Church Online Platform, Church Metrics, or Develop.me, Kyle has had his hands on them all (also, if you’re not familiar with them, I cannot recommend all of these enough). Here is some of what we talk about: Talk to us a bit about Open Network and your church’s heart to resource the “big C” church. What do you see about the church that is recalibrating right now? From a church that has pioneered digital gatherings for churches, is there still a place for physical gatherings? What lessons should we take with us coming out of this season? What about the local church has given you hope? For the second part of our episode today, we focus on their team culture and what makes their team so special. Both members of part two have been at Life.Church for over 10 years and that kind of longevity cannot be bought or shortcut to. Rachel Ricker is the Central Group Ministry Leader for Host Team. Sam Marin is the campus pastor for Edmond, OK, which is the broadcast location. Here’s where our conversation leads us: What do you feel is most special about your house and the culture of it? And what do you hope people remember about your church? What is so special about the culture of your team? What is the difference in carrying culture at a broadcast location vs. a remote location? What do you tell yourself when feedback is coming your way? What does being a culture carrier mean to you? Is there a time where you got it wrong with being a culture carrier? I was so excited to get a chance to sit down with this group of leaders from one of the most influential churches globally and have also had such a profound impact on my own life. Run Strong this week, Brandon After the episode: Evaluate how you carry the culture of your own church. How can you better carry it to your teams? SUBSCRIBE COMMENT LIKE & SHARE We want you in our tribe! Stay connected to all Leading Second has to offer: Website: leadingsecond.com Instagram: instagram.com/leadingsecond Connect with Brandon Stewart Facebook: facebook.com/brandonmstewart Instagram: instagram.com/brandonmstewart Leading Second is an extension of the Team Church tribe. For more information on Team Church Conference and One Day events, check-out teamchurchconference.com or search Team Church on Facebook.

This episode has literally been years in the making. I am so excited to have Pastor Lee Wilson finally join us on the podcast! I can honestly say that Lee has been one of the most significant ministry influences in my life. He came and consulted at the very first youth ministry that I had the opportunity to lead in Minnesota and preached at a winter camp with us (fun story in the episode about that). His fingerprints are all over Leading Second. I have always loved his voice on the platform, wisdom off the platform, and intentionality with which he lives his life. Lee has served in plenty of roles in his years in ministry, including as a lead pastor, but is currently serving as Youth and Executive Pastor at Abundant Life in Syracuse, NY. We kick off this conversation with Lee by chatting about a book he has coming out very soon called “Map Your Life.” It’s a joy to hear his heart behind this upcoming book, which is for this generation to define their God-given purpose. If we are going to run this race and run it to win, we need to have discipline and intentionality be a big part of who we are. Lee says that if you become a better person, you become a better leader. So our big question this episode with Lee is, “What can an intentional, disciplined life as a leader look like?” Some of the questions that we cover in this conversation are: Do you struggle with discipline? If so, how do you regain it when you lose it? What role has a discipline played in leading you into a life of true contentment and peace? What is the greatest habit or discipline you currently have working in your life? Where do you start in mapping out your life? What is the greatest lesson you have learned in leading second? Please do not miss the last 7 or 8 mins of this conversation. Lee speaks to the heart of Leading Second and talks about accepting that as a calling on people’s lives. It was such a joy to have Lee Wilson on this episode with me! I hope this helps you get some structure to the disciplines of your life and lead with more intentionality. Run strong this week, Brandon Resources From The Episode: https://leewilson.life @leewisonlife on IG After The Episode: What discipline can you incorporate into your life and ministry this year? SUBSCRIBE COMMENT LIKE & SHARE We want you in our tribe! Stay connected to all Leading Second has to offer: Website: leadingsecond.com Instagram: instagram.com/leadingsecond Connect with Brandon Stewart Facebook: facebook.com/brandonmstewart Instagram: instagram.com/brandonmstewart Leading Second is an extension of the Team Church tribe. For more information on Team Church Conference and One Day events, check-out teamchurchconference.com or search Team Church on Facebook.

Well, in our last episode, we had a question come in from Taylor Persello, and this week she joins her pastor, Joshua Bingle, for our conversation! He is the pastor of Genesis Church in Spokane, Washington, and is no stranger at all to this space. I love the way he thinks, and he is always one of the first places I go to bounce ideas off. Taylor is a member of the team at Genesis and is involved in so much behind the scenes here with Leading Second, from creating content to helping us stay organized. We are so blessed to have these two incredible people in our tribe. The main question we want to ask them today is this: What impact does my personal health have on my relationship with my pastor? In almost all of our relationships, in church or otherwise, we WILL experience hurts and offenses. When that happens, there’s likely a secret contract or unspoken expectation that is at the root of it. This idea of secret contracts is something that Josh and Taylor introduced to me and has shifted how I think about so many relationships. So I wanted them to unpack that here for all of us. A couple of the questions that we cover in this episode are: What is a secret contract, and where do they come from? How do we know if we’re holding someone to a contract they didn’t know about? What are some examples of secret contracts? We end things off by talking about what healthy contracts look like. I pray that this episode shifts some hearts and reaches people who can get a hold of this idea because I believe it can be so powerful if recognized. Brandon After the episode: What are some secret contracts that you hold others to? Are there any that you need to rethink or rewrite? SUBSCRIBE COMMENT LIKE & SHARE We want you in our tribe! Stay connected to all Leading Second has to offer: Website: leadingsecond.com Instagram: instagram.com/leadingsecond Connect with Brandon Stewart Facebook: facebook.com/brandonmstewart Instagram: instagram.com/brandonmstewart Leading Second is an extension of the Team Church tribe. For more information on Team Church Conference and One Day events, check-out teamchurchconference.com or search Team Church on Facebook.

Back for the first time this season, we have another installment of a series that we do periodically called ‘I Am With You.’ We sit down and have a conversation with a lead pastor and one of their key team members. Before we even get into that, we had a great question come in from a listener and member of the Leading Second team that I really enjoyed. Taylor Persello asked, “How do you lend the credibility of your pastor, to people that you lead or influence, without abusing his name or using the pastor card?” If you lead from the middle, I know that you have dealt with this. It was a great question that led us to an even bigger question, so don’t miss that part of the episode. Well, this week, we have the privilege of hosting Pastor Marcus Mecum and Even Cromer from Seven Hills Church in Florence, Kentucky. Marcus is one of my oldest and first friends in ministry. I first got to know him back when I was a youth pastor, and he actually was as well at the time! And Even has been on staff at Seven Hills for six years now and is currently the business pastor. This church has something so unique in their culture about developing leaders, so that is our big question or idea this week and what I hoped to draw out of them. What does a good target look like for developing leaders? Some of the questions that we discuss in this episode are: How do you develop leaders in the church right now? How do you identify future or potential leaders? If you started over today, what is one thing that you would do? What are some top qualities of prospective leaders? There are so many practical steps that we can take from this conversation and start implementing them into our teams and processes. Let’s focus on elevating the right people to places of influence in our churches. Run strong this week, Brandon After The Episode: Who did you meet this week? How are you going to take that family and progress them into the life of your church? One family at a time. SUBSCRIBE COMMENT LIKE & SHARE We want you in our tribe! Stay connected to all Leading Second has to offer: Website: leadingsecond.com Instagram: instagram.com/leadingsecond Connect with Brandon Stewart Facebook: facebook.com/brandonmstewart Instagram: instagram.com/brandonmstewart Leading Second is an extension of the Team Church tribe. For more information on Team Church Conference and One Day events, check out teamchurchconference.com or search Team Church on Facebook.

Hey, it’s Brandon. We’re interrupting our regularly scheduled programming to bring you a more personal episode today. I want to take a second and thank all of you who have reached out to check in on us or encourage us in any way. It has been such a blessing to be surrounded by an incredible community and so many great friends. We pulled an audible this week, and Lindsay and I just sat down and talked through what we’ve been going through these past couple of weeks. It has been some of the most trying times in our lives. There have been plenty of moments of doubt, fear, disappointment, but God has seen us through every step of the way. Through this whole process so far, we clung to having our foundation in our faith and the importance of community. Those two things have been so important to us. Knowing that no matter what happens, God will provide, and God is there for us. We’ve been driven to the feet of Jesus. And we can’t say enough about the support that we’ve had from the people around us. We would not want to walk through this alone. In walking through this, we wanted to show the other side of what people typically see on social media, or anywhere else we share about our lives. Beyond the filters, beyond the highlights, beyond the perfect lighting and staged poses, people have real lives. These lives can be messy and complicated. Just because you don’t have the experience you see of others while scrolling through Instagram, don’t look down on yourself or think less of your own situation. People see the perfect baby photo. We’ve wanted to show the NICU pictures. The captions about what we’re struggling with. Lindsay and I hope that this episode is just encouraging to you. Whatever you may be walking through right now or in the future, lean into that foundation of faith. Embrace the community around you and if you don’t feel like you have one, reach out. You’ve found a community in Leading Second. Run strong this week, Brandon and Lindsay SUBSCRIBE COMMENT LIKE & SHARE We want you in our tribe! Stay connected to all Leading Second has to offer: Website: leadingsecond.com Instagram: instagram.com/leadingsecond Connect with Brandon Stewart Facebook: facebook.com/brandonmstewart Instagram: instagram.com/brandonmstewart Leading Second is an extension of the Team Church tribe. For more information on Team Church Conference and One Day events, check-out teamchurchconference.com or search Team Church on Facebook.

For the second week in a row, we have another introduction to the Leading Second family! My conversation today is with Brad Lomenick. If you’ve been around church leadership for very long, he likely needs no introduction to you. But for the uninitiated, Brad is one of the visionary leaders who launched Catalyst! A podcast, a conference, and a group that has taught leadership to many thousands of people through the years and has had a considerable impact on churches worldwide. Most recently, Brad’s focus has been advising organizations and building connections with young leaders who will outlast him and build something greater than he could. He breaks down the lie of needing to go from big to bigger. Brad has a wealth of leadership experience and knowledge, but the one big question that I wanted to talk to him about is, “What are some habits of a healthy leader?” That leads to conversations about creating rhythms, having an ownership mentality, and anticipation. A few of the other questions we ask Brad: When was a time where you led from the middle, and what were some lessons you took from it? What is something you’ve learned about leading up? What was your inspiration for writing H3 Leadership? What would you say to somebody is needing to recalibrate this season? How do we keep our hunger alive? Right now is the perfect time to take some risks. We have COVID as a built-in excuse. So try some new things out! Run strong for the Kingdom this week, Brandon Resources: www.catalystleader.com “H3 Leadership” by Brad Lomenick “When” by Daniel Pink After the Episode: How can you be a leader who anticipates this week? i.e., what things can you take off of your Pastor/Leader’s plate? How can you create the best rhythm this week that allows you to flourish and thrive at your maximum capacity? Be the Chief Innovation Officer this week in your role. Have the courage to try something out. SUBSCRIBE COMMENT LIKE & SHARE We want you in our tribe! Stay connected to all Leading Second has to offer: Website: leadingsecond.com Instagram: instagram.com/leadingsecond Connect with Brandon Stewart Facebook: facebook.com/brandonmstewart Instagram: instagram.com/brandonmstewart Leading Second is an extension of the Team Church tribe. For more information on Team Church Conference and One Day events, check-out teamchurchconference.com or search Team Church on Facebook.

We have a first-time guest to the Leading Second Podcast, but she is a fast friend to our tribe and me. I am so excited to introduce Kadi Cole! Her professional resume speaks for itself, but Kadi was in leadership for 16 years at Christ Fellowship Church in Palm Beach Gardens, Florida. She served in key leadership positions as the church grew from 3,500 to 23,000 and launched eight additional campuses. Her final role was as Executive Director of Multisite as she oversaw all campuses. She has since launched her personal business, Kadi Cole and Company. And her newest passion project is helping church leaders who want to do a better job developing the female leadership talent in their congregations. She even has a new book that was just released on that very topic! As we’ve done every week this season, we have one big question for our guests, and this week, the question is, “What disruptions should the local church embrace in this season?” Kadi is an absolute expert on leadership development, church multisite, and growing staff and volunteer teams from within your congregation. She has a wealth of knowledge and wisdom in so many topics. We start our conversation by talking about her latest passion, which is women in ministry. Two things that Kadi has said and stuck out so much to me are, “suddenly, every church is a global church” and “communication is the new excellence.” We spend the bulk of our conversation unpacking these statements. The metric is no longer just butts in seats on a Sunday, so what does that look like now? And how can we thrive through disruption? We wrap things up by talking about diversity in ministry. This is a unique conversation with somebody who has such a unique voice, and I cannot wait for you to listen. Every interaction I’ve had with Kadi has left me both encouraged and challenged in the best possible way! I hope this conversation leaves you the same. Brandon *editor’s note: Brandon, Lindsay, and Zane just welcomed baby Glo into their family this week! Head over to their socials and show them some love and support! Resources: https://www.kadicole.com Kadi’s new book is “Find Your Leadership Voice In 90 Days” After The Episode: What ladies in your ministry can you identify this week that are not living to their fullest potential? Invite them to the leadership table! “Connection is the new excellence.” How can you effectively connect with your team/guests this week? (Relationships, noticing people, caring for them, praying in person, etc.) SUBSCRIBE COMMENT LIKE & SHARE We want you in our tribe! Stay connected to all Leading Second has to offer: Website: leadingsecond.com Instagram: instagram.com/leadingsecond Connect with Brandon Stewart Facebook: facebook.com/brandonmstewart Instagram: instagram.com/brandonmstewart Leading Second is an extension of the Team Church tribe. For more information on Team Church Conference and One Day events, check out teamchurchconference.com or search Team Church on Facebook.

We are back for part two of my conversation with my Pastor, Kevin Gerald! Honestly, we were just getting started with what we released last week. We just let the tape keep running and ended up having to split it into two episodes, and part two is even better than part one. Before we dive back into this conversation, I talk for a few minutes on the thought that connection is the new excellence. In a time that it is so easy to let people on our teams slip through the cracks, it is even more critical than ever that we are checking in and really caring for and connecting with those on our teams and in our churches. You never know the impact that a simple text or phone call can have on somebody. Our big question for this conversation is still: How can I build trust with my Pastor? Well, we jump right back into this conversation where we left off, and we start it with a bang! We talk about the lost art of honor and making serving a part of who you are. Hopefully, that leaves you with a desire to buck the trends of not trusting leadership and encourages you to always be serving. We close this conversation by talking about what Pastors look for before empowering others and giving ownership. Empowerment is the end goal for most people, and trust is the currency to get there. I pray this conversation leaves you refreshed and with a new drive to build trust with your leaders. Brandon After the episode: How can you start and/or continue to build trust with your Pastor this week? Matthew 13:44 is the parable of the hidden treasure. What fields can you mine for treasure in? Are you connecting with your teams and the people under your leadership? Take initiative: What is the next move? How do I build and grow my team? SUBSCRIBE COMMENT LIKE & SHARE We want you in our tribe! Stay connected to all Leading Second has to offer: Website: leadingsecond.com Instagram: instagram.com/leadingsecond Connect with Brandon Stewart Facebook: facebook.com/brandonmstewart Instagram: instagram.com/brandonmstewart Leading Second is an extension of the Team Church tribe. For more information on Team Church Conference and One Day events, check-out teamchurchconference.com or search Team Church on Facebook.

It’s always so exciting when I get to have my Pastor, Kevin Gerald, on the podcast. Not only because he was the first person to get behind me and help support and champion this thing along, but because I attribute so much of who I am and what I know to him. That is why we have him join us in this space once a season, so hopefully, you can glean some of the biggest lessons I’ve learned in life and leadership. We went way over on our time, but it was so good that we’ve split this conversation into two episodes, but we’ll have part two for you next Thursday! We had another excellent question come in from one of the people in our tribe. David says that he recently stepped into a new role leading a team and wants to know what steps he can take to cast vision? As we’ve been doing every week this season, we’re going to tackle one big question. In my eyes, one of my most significant accomplishments in ministry is the relationship that I have with my Pastor. It’s something that has taken work and time to develop. Trust seems to be the currency that leads to so many greater things. So our question this week (and next week) is: How can I build trust with my Pastor? We spend a little time breaking down a huge barrier that I know some second-chair leaders face when being honest with their leaders. We get a peek into the head of a lead pastor of 30 years on what he thinks when his team comes to him and are honest about themselves if they’ve dropped the ball in some area. His answer to this might be the opposite of what you would think instinctually. Here are some of the questions that we cover here in part one. What are some of the things that leaders on our team have done that have created a healthy relationship with you? What are some things that have broken or deteriorated your trust? How have you seen that trust is built in your space? How important is communication to you? We close part one of this conversation, talking about the importance of getting communication right with your Pastor. It’s on you to chase them and find ways to get in those circles. It’s also up to you that you show up prepared for those moments. I hope this gives you some freedom from any entitlement that so many face today, expecting their leaders to chase them down. We are just getting started and you are not going to want to miss part two of this conversation next week! Brandon After the episode: How can you start and/or continue to build trust with your Pastor this week? Position yourself this week to be a student and novice of your Pastor.

It’s another Thursday, and that means another episode of the Leading Second Podcast! We have a heart to see the local church be healthy in this season and my prayer for our tribe is unity for us towards our pastors and leaders. I believe that division is the biggest challenge facing the church today (we have a great episode all about that in season three with John Morgan), and I pray that we are part of the solution, not feeding into the problems. That’s where this episode starts today. I share some of my heart and prayers in this season in an opening segment before diving into our conversation. We got another great question from one of our listeners for this week’s episode! (4:16 if you want to jump to that) Our question that we tackled in this episode is, “When do we stop focusing on what was and shift to what is?” Please, if you ever have any questions that you’re facing right now or trying to wrestle through, don’t hesitate to ask. That is what the Leading Second community is all about! And finally, I’m so excited about our guest for this episode. Back to the podcast for the second season in a row, Julian Lowe! (Listen to our last episode with him if you missed that as well) When I first met Julien, he was an Executive Pastor at Oasis Church in Los Angeles, but is now the Lead Pastor there! I’m always fascinated when I get a chance to talk with pastors who have been on either side of that role. So from 11:39 through 27:02, we talk through his ministry life and what those various roles looked like, how he stayed the course, remained humble and healthy, and he shares some excellent advice and wisdom from his own personal journey in that time. Our big question if the week is (28:06), “What does a healthy, effective leader look like for the coming season?” Julian shares some unique insights on this episode. He challenges what we think “great” is and what it takes to BE great. He also shares some traits that he believes are going to be needed by leaders right now. This episode finishes up with him talking about ways that he stays fresh right now. I challenge you to listen to this episode and find something to take away and apply to your life right now. There is so much gold in this conversation, and I am so blessed to have Julian in my life. Run healthy this week, Brandon After the Episode Questions to ask yourself and your team this week: How has God given you grace or an anointing for the challenges you are facing? What are some practical habits you can implement this week to recover and continue leading strong? Follow Pastor Julian’s lead, and evaluate your day today. Ask yourself: How’s my soul today? How did my day go? Consider how you are doing, and ask the Holy Spirit to give you wisdom for tomorrow. SUBSCRIBE COMMENT LIKE & SHARE We want you in our tribe! Stay connected to all Leading Second has to offer: Website: leadingsecond.com Instagram: instagram.com/leadingsecond Connect with Brandon Stewart Facebook: facebook.com/brandonmstewart Instagram: instagram.com/brandonmstewart Leading Second is an extension of the Team Church tribe. For more information on Team Church Conference and One Day events, check-out teamchurchconference.com or search Team Church on Facebook.

It’s only the second episode of this new fourth season, and we’re already mixing it up! We want to switch things up every once in a while this season, and this is one of those episodes. We gathered a panel of executive pastors and campus pastors. These are some incredible second-chair leaders, who sat down with me, and just got to fire away some questions that they’ve been having this past year as they navigated leading during COVID-19. This panel is from churches of various sizes, different demographics, and from all over the country. I was so happy to sit down with Jeffery Davis from Verve Community Church, Nick Dekold from Lakeshore Church, Sarah Nelsen from The Well, Stephanie Blanton from Freedom House Church, and Dillon Ritchie from Coastlife Church. The goal of today’s episode is just to share some wisdom, and our big question is, “What does leadership look like during COVID-19?” There isn’t exactly a playbook on how to lead during a pandemic. Our pastors have some of the same questions that we’ve all been asking ourselves. There is so much uncertainty right now, and we need constant flexibility. So what does leadership look like, and how do we lead well from the second chair right now? I believe the questions asked were some that so many of us have been facing this past year. We tackled real problems that we’re facing and had some excellent conversations wrestling through these topics together. Here are the questions and topics we cover in this episode: What advice on developing healthy relationships would you give pastors/ leaders transitioning into new roles or churches during this time? We live in a world where people are worshipping opinion over God, self over others, and convenience over the church. In what ways can we support our Pastors in challenging worldly culture, which sometimes causes people to exit the church and at the same time focus on mobilizing the church for growth? For those of us who have gotten the opportunity to return to in-person gatherings, one of the hurdles I think many of us have experienced is re-building our Serve Teams. What are some ways or maybe some methods that can help re-engage our church family in serving? What are some things that I can do as a second chair leader to help continue to move the vision of the church forward in a time of uncertainty and during a season where everything seems like it has been put on pause? When the church (The Christian church as a whole) is under so much pressure, our Senior Pastors need us to hold their arms up more than ever. How can we do a good job of this when we ourselves need someone to hold our arms up? How do we tap into support while we are their support? I pray this leaves you with some practical wisdom so we can all lead at our absolute best. Run strong this week, Brandon After The Episode: What are you doing as a leader right now to fill in the gaps that you see? What practical steps can you take to create and guard alignment with your Pastor and your team this week? SUBSCRIBE COMMENT LIKE & SHARE We want you in our tribe! Stay connected to all Leading Second has to offer: Website: leadingsecond.com Instagram: instagram.com/leadingsecond Connect with Brandon Stewart Facebook: facebook.com/brandonmstewart Instagram: instagram.com/brandonmstewart Leading Second is an extension of the Team Church tribe. For more information on Team Church Conference and One Day events, check-out teamchurchconference.com or search Team Church on Facebook.

New year, new look, new perspective, new season... same Leading Second. We are back with season 4 of the Leading Second Podcast and we’ll be bringing you new episodes every Thursday this Spring!! This first episode of the season is dropping on Leading Second’s fourth birthday and we couldn’t have lined up a better guest to get things kicked off and started on the right foot. Our guest today has become such a great friend to me, as well as anybody who regularly listens to this podcast. He is a campus pastor at Elevation Church, a team builder, and honestly one of the absolute best second chair leaders in the world. Our conversation today is with the one and only, Larry Brey. Things look different today than they did a year ago. We’ve gone through a season of change unlike most of us have ever experienced before. Things that used to work, no longer work anymore. The needs people have right now, are not the needs that we were addressing a year ago. The solutions that we had for problems, need to be adjusted now. And things that seemed so important, we’ve realized, are maybe not quite as pressing. So… Where do we go from here?? That is the big question that we tackle today. With everything that has gone on and everything that has changed, what now? Pastor Larry is filled with so much wisdom, and this episode is packed with great takeaways that will help navigate this season of life and ministry. Some of the questions that we tackle in this episode are: How have things changed? What good do you see that this season has brought out of leaders and the local church? What do you think the leaders who will thrive in the coming season look like? What would you say to the leader who is experiencing alignment issues right now? Pastor Larry even opens up a lot about some of his own struggles this past year. So if you’ve felt isolated in this past year or like you’re facing challenges by yourself, know that you’re not alone in any of this. We’d love for you to join our community and tribe on Facebook because we are all better together. If you get nothing else out of this episode, be sure to catch Pastor Larry’s prayer for second chair leaders towards the end of the episode. He is somebody who prays continually for people in our shoes. I hope this episode leaves you encouraged. Until next week, let's run strong and in health. Brandon Stewart

This week I am joined by Brandon Catoe, Ryan McDermott, and Dave Simiele. These incredible men are all leaders at Christ Fellowship Church, under the leadership of Pastors Todd & Julie Mullens. Christ Fellowship Church is a thriving, life-giving, multi-site church in South Florida. I had the opportunity to be with them for a leadership gathering almost a year and a half ago, called Church United. Their team and their culture so impacted me that I’ve been looking forward to having them on the podcast ever since. There is something so unique and authentic about their culture. Like all of us, they are wrestling with life after COVID, as well as organizational clarity and restructuring. We can glean a lot here, so grab your team and let’s join this conversation with the team from Christ Fellowship.

This week's episode is another conversation taken from an online meet-up. If you're not already, I'd love for you to be a part of our tribe over on Facebook at The Leading Second Collective, so you don't miss out on these. They are so fun and prove to always bring us conversations that leave a mark. We've had Kayla Stoecklein on the podcast before, so if you haven't heard that, I definitely recommend going back and listening to that episode as well (Ep. 054). Her story is truly incredible. Since her last time on the podcast, she has come out with a book! It's titled "Fear Gone Wild: A Story of Mental Illness, Suicide, and Hope Through Loss," and it is brilliant and has truly life-saving potential. We get to hear a bit about the book and her heart behind it. One of my favorite things about Kayla is how she prioritizes mental health and tries to break the shame associated with talking about it. She gives us permission to be human. In this season, I've had a reborn commitment that leadership health is far more critical than just leadership ability. In this season, we've seen that the lasting leaders are the ones who have committed to personal health. If anyone reading this has had moments or seasons of burnout, depression, challenges with your mental health, or you just want to stay healthy… this conversation is for you. Resources mentioned in this episode: Leading on Empty by Wayne Cordeiro