Chatter

It's Presidents' Day! To mark the day, David Priess recorded this special episode with historian and author Lindsay Chervinsky about the history of this odd holiday--and the legacy of the first president, George Washington.They discuss the tensions historians face when writing about current events, the origins of Presidents' Day, the advisory bodies that Washington explored before settling on a cabinet, the first president's development of that institution during his administration and its role in early national security decisions, the impact of Washington's choices on his successors, how recent presidents have used the cabinet quite differently than their predecessors had done in the 18th and 19th centuries, and what Washington might think about assertions of executive privilege during the past few years.Chatter is a production of Lawfare and Goat Rodeo. This episode was produced and edited by Cara Shillenn of Goat Rodeo with engineering assistance from Ian Enright. Podcast theme by David Priess, featuring music created using Groovepad. Among the works cited in this episode:"A diverse Cabinet will make Joe Biden a better president and unify the country" by Lindsay Chervinsky, Washington Post, November 11, 2020"Five Best: Books on Presidential Cabinets" by Lindsay Chervinsky, Wall Street Journal, March 26, 2021"The Disturbing Precedent for McConnell's Debt-Ceiling Brinksmanship" by Lindsay Chervinsky, The Bulwark, October 1, 2021 The Cabinet: George Washington and the Creation of an American Institution by Lindsay ChervinskyHamilton: The MusicalTheodore Roosevelt: A Strenuous Life by Kathleen DaltonThere Is Nothing for You Here: Finding Opportunity in the Twenty-First Century by Fiona Hill Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

This week, for our first episode after the birthday of Abraham Lincoln, I chat with author and CNN senior political analyst John Avlon about Lincoln's underappreciated plan for post-Civil War peace--and how we can apply its lessons today. Avlon's new book, Lincoln and the Fight for Peace, explores both how Lincoln's character fostered his vision for achieving a just and secure peace after the Civil War and how Lincoln's plans informed future peacemakers.We spoke about popular applied history and why it matters, Lincoln's qualities and their application to issues of war and peace, Andrew Johnson's disastrous turn away from Lincoln's plan for Reconstruction and its effects, and the influence of Lincoln's peace vision on everyone from Woodrow Wilson to Lucius Clay to Douglas MacArthur.Chatter is a production of Lawfare and Goat Rodeo. This episode was produced and edited by Cara Shillenn of Goat Rodeo with engineering assistance from Ian Enright. Podcast theme by David Priess, featuring music created using Groovepad.Among the works cited in this episode:Lincoln and the Fight for Peace by John AvlonWashington's Farewell: The Founding Father's Warning to Future Generations by John AvlonCNN's Reality Check with John AvlonLincoln's Code: The Laws of War in American History by John Fabian Witt Lincoln by David Herbert DonaldAbraham Lincoln, A Life (two volumes) by Michael Burlingame9/11 Memorialization with Marita Sturken, Chatter Podcast, January 25, 2022Wingnuts: Extremism in the Age of Obama by John AvlonAccidental Presidents: Eight Men Who Changed America by Jared Cohen Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

This week, Shane Harris talks with journalist Erich Schwartzel about one of the most intense arenas of the great power competition between the United States and China: the movies. Schwartzel's new book, Red Carpet: Hollywood, China, and the Global Battle for Cultural Supremacy, is a deeply reported and riveting story about how American movie studios have spent decades breaking into the multi-billion dollar Chinese market. The moviemakers' success has come at a price. They’ve made concessions to Chinese censors--going so far as to erase all negative references to China from films--and increasingly find themselves caught between their Chinese fans and the U.S. government, as tensions rise with Beijing. Schwartzel also tells the story of how China’s government has promoted an indigenous film industry. It often turns out propaganda. But more recently, Chinese studios have also produced global blockbusters and created Chinese stars - only this new entertainment A-list isn’t beyond the government’s control. Schwartzel covers the film industry for The Wall Street Journal.Chatter is a production of Lawfare and Goat Rodeo. This episode was produced and edited by Cara Shillenn of Goat Rodeo. Podcast theme by David Priess, featuring music created using Groovepad.Among the works cited in this episode are:Red Carpet: Hollywood, China, and the Global Battle for Cultural Supremacy: https://www.penguinrandomhouse.com/books/611545/red-carpet-by-erich-schwartzel/ Read an excerpt of the book: https://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2022/02/china-captured-hollywood/621618/ Erich Schwartzel’s work for The Wall Street Journal: https://www.wsj.com/news/author/erich-schwartzelErich on Twitter: https://twitter.com/erichschwartzel  Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

This week, David Priess talks with professor and writer Ethan Scheiner about the history of the Olympic games, the many political controversies in and around the games since 1896, and the security challenges they present. A professor of political science at the University of California, Davis, who has specialized in Japanese politics and democratic representation in party systems, Scheiner has focused his recent research, teaching, and writing on the intersection of sports--from hockey to gymnastics to basketball--with both international and domestic politics. In this extended conversation, they discuss the origins and evolution of the modern Olympic games, early athletes' protests against competing under imperial flags, the dramatic 1936 games in Berlin, international sports competition as a Cold War battleground, Olympic boycotts and near-boycotts, controversies surrounding the 1968 games in Mexico City, the security debacle at the 1972 Munich Olympics, athletes' growing comfort in recent decades with taking political stands, and much more.Chatter is a production of Lawfare and Goat Rodeo. This episode was produced and edited by Cara Shillenn of Goat Rodeo. Podcast theme by David Priess, featuring music created using Groovepad. Among the works cited in this episode are:Democracy without Competition in Japan: Opposition Failure in a One-Party Dominant State, by Ethan ScheinerGames of Deception: The True Story of the First U.S. Olympic Basketball Team at the 1936 Olympics in Hitler's Germany, by Andrew Marinness"How a Hockey Game Powered a Revolution" by Ethan Scheiner, Washington Post, February 12, 2018"The Silent Protest During a National Anthem That Made Americans Cheer" by Ethan Scheiner, Politico, September 5, 2018 Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

This week, Shane Harris talks with veteran journalist Leslie Kean, who has done groundbreaking and widely admired reporting on unidentified flying objects. And, no, that does not mean aliens. Kean's bestselling 2010 book, UFOs: Generals, Pilots, and Government Officials Go on the Record, was a sober account of credible, first-hand witnesses to unexplained aerial phenomena. In 2017, Kean co-authored a major New York Times article that revealed a secret Pentagon effort devoted to the study of UFOs. More recently, the U.S. government has begun to standardize UFO reporting by military personnel and has declassified more information about what it knows about strange objects in the sky. Kean's reporting played a significant role in those disclosures. Kean discusses her early career as a journalist, her travels in Burma, and her interest in Buddhism. She talks about the important questions that remain about UFOs, and what the U.S. government may be on the cusp of answering.  Chatter is a production of Lawfare and Goat Rodeo. This episode was produced and edited by Cara Shillenn of Goat Rodeo. Podcast theme by David Priess, featuring music created using Groovepad.Among the works cited in this episode are:Leslie Kean's website: https://www.lesliekean.com/ UFOs: Generals, Pilots, and Government Officials Go on the Record: https://www.penguinrandomhouse.com/authors/114166/leslie-kean/ "Glowing Auras and ‘Black Money’: The Pentagon’s Mysterious U.F.O. Program:" https://www.nytimes.com/2017/12/16/us/politics/pentagon-program-ufo-harry-reid.html "Preliminary Assessment: Unidentified Aerial Phenomena" (Office of the Director of National Intelligence):  https://www.dni.gov/files/ODNI/documents/assessments/Prelimary-Assessment-UAP-20210625.pdf  Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

In this episode, David Priess talks with professor and author Marita Sturken about 9/11-related memorials, museums, and architecture. Her research and writings have examined everything from visual culture to the connection between memory and consumerism, with much of her recent work addressing memory of the attacks on September 11, 2001 as both the battleground and the site for negotiations of national identity.In this conversation, they talk briefly about various historical memorials and the purposes of such work before comparing and contrasting some of the 9/11 memorials around the country and those at Ground Zero, next to the Pentagon, and in Somerset County, Pennsylvania. They also discuss controversies surrounding the National September 11 Memorial Museum (commonly called the "9/11 museum"), including those about its gift shop and the human remains currently stored in the facility.Chatter is a production of Lawfare and Goat Rodeo. This episode was produced and edited by Cara Shillenn of Goat Rodeo. Podcast theme by David Priess, featuring music created using Groovepad. Among the works cited in this episode are:Memorials, Museums, and related sites:The National 9/11 Pentagon MemorialFlight 93 National MemorialThe National September 9/11 Memorial and MuseumWorld Trade Center OculusEmpty Sky Memorial in Jersey City, New JerseyReflect 9/11 memorial in Rosemead, CaliforniaVietnam Veterans MemorialThe Korean War Veterans MemorialWWII MemorialFranklin Delano Roosevelt MemorialMartin Luther King, Jr. MemorialDwight D. Eisenhower MemorialBooks:Terrorism in American Memory: Memorials, Museums, and Architecture in the Post-9/11 Era, by Marita SturkenTourists of History: Memory, Kitsch, and Consumerism from Oklahoma City to Ground Zero, by Marita SturkenTangled Memories: The Vietnam War, the AIDS Epidemic, and the Politics of Remembering, by Marita SturkenProsthetic Memory: The Transformation of American Remembrance in the Age of Mass Culture, by Alison Landsberg Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

This week, Shane Harris talks with pioneering multi-media artist Laurie Anderson. A retrospective of her work, called “The Weather,” is currently showing at the Hirshhorn Museum in Washington, DC. Several of Anderson’s works explore themes of security, terrorism, and surveillance. Her piece “Habeas Corpus” is a monumental scale video and sculpture installation about Mohammed el Gharani, who was imprisoned in Guantanamo Bay for seven years. Anderson talks about her life in New York during the pandemic, her creative influences, and the surprising ways that her storytelling intersects with national security. For instance, her biggest musical hit, “O Superman,” was inspired by the Iran hostage crisis. Chatter is a production of Lawfare and Goat Rodeo. This episode was produced and edited by Cara Shillenn of Goat Rodeo, with engineering assistance from Ian Enright. Podcast theme by David Priess, featuring music created using Groovepad.Among the works mentioned in this episode are:Laurie Anderson: https://laurieanderson.com/ “The Weather” at The Hirshhorn: https://hirshhorn.si.edu/exhibitions/laurie-anderson-the-weather/  “Habeus Corpus”: https://laurieanderson.com/?portfolio=habeas-corpus Anderson’s Norton Lectures: https://laurieanderson.com/2021/12/16/norton-lectures-spending-the-war-without-you/ “O Superman”: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vkfpi2H8tOE Thao & The Get Down Stay Down's "Phenom": https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DGwQZrDNLO8 Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

This week, Shane Harris and David Priess team up and talk with John Sipher, a former senior intelligence officer who has gone Hollywood. With his partners at Spycraft Entertainment, John is bringing compelling and, yes, accurate stories about espionage to the screen. Before working in the entertainment industry, he spent 28 years in the CIA, where he served multiple overseas tours as a chief of station. Shane, David, and John talked about their favorite spy movies, the fine line between the espionage and action-adventure genres, and the kinds of stories they’d like to see more of.   Chatter is a production of Lawfare and Goat Rodeo. This episode was produced and edited by Cara Shillenn of Goat Rodeo, with engineering assistance from Ian Enright. Podcast theme by David Priess, featuring music created using Groovepad.Among the works cited in this episode:Movies: The Good Shepherd, The Spy, Sneakers, Bridge of Spies, The Courier, 12 Strong, Argo, Spy Kids, The Spy Who Came In from the Cold, The Hunt for Red October, A View To a Kill, Mission Impossible, The Lives of Others, Breach, The Mauritanian, Snowden, Citizenfour, The Little Drummer Girl, Clear and Present Danger, Rogue One, RoninTV shows: Homeland, Mare of Easttown, The Americans, The Bureau, Tom Clancy’s Jack Ryan, The Night ManagerBooks: Betrayal in Berlin (Steve Vogel), Damascus Station (David McCloskey), The Spy’s Son (Bryan Denson), Billion Dollar Spy (David Hoffman), First Casualty (Toby Harnden), Russians Among Us (Gordon Corera), The Dead Hand (David Hoffman), Playing to the Edge (Michael Hayden), The Spy Who Came In from the Cold (John le Carré), The Little Drummer Girl (John le Carré), The Night Manager (John le Carré), The Nightingale’s Song (Robert Timberg), The Book of Honor (Ted Gup) Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

On this special January 6 episode of Chatter, David Priess speaks with historian and author Joanne Freeman about the history of violence on Capitol Hill and its relevance for the political situation today. They discussed the origins of assaults by and between U.S. representatives and senators, the culture and practice of dueling, the infamous caning of Senator Charles Sumner in the Senate chamber in 1856, how increasing violence in Congress reflected the country's movement toward Civil War, and why all of it has echoes today in the violent imagery and increasing threats of assault on Capitol Hill. Joanne is Professor of American History and of American Studies at Yale University, and her book, The Field of Blood: Violence in Congress and the Road to Civil War, provides the backdrop for much of the discussion. Chatter is a production of Lawfare and Goat Rodeo. This episode was produced and edited by Cara Shillenn of Goat Rodeo. Podcast theme by David Priess, featuring music created using Groovepad. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

On this week’s episode of Chatter, David Priess speaks with political scientist and author Brian Klaas about why certain people seek power, what holding power does to them, and how to get better leaders. They discuss the nature of political research, what kind of people become rulers, corruption and system effects, and ways to keep the most corrupt people out of power--as well as meerkat signaling, a cannibalistic dictator, and Brian's new book, Corruptible: Who Gets Power and How It Changes Us.Chatter is a production of Lawfare and Goat Rodeo. This episode was edited by Cara Shillenn of Goat Rodeo. Producing and audio engineering by Hamza Shittu of Goat Rodeo. Podcast theme by David Priess, featuring music created using Groovepad. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

On this week’s episode of Chatter, David Priess speaks with author and women's health advocate Anushay Hossain about the intersection of national security and women's health. They discuss her childhood in Bangladesh as part of a powerful political family, her work on Capitol Hill promoting global health, her research into how women--especially women of color--face systemic sexism in American healthcare, and her new book about it all, The Pain Gap: How Sexism and Racism in Healthcare Kill Women.Chatter is a production of Lawfare and Goat Rodeo. This episode was produced and edited by Cara Shillenn of Goat Rodeo. Podcast theme by David Priess, featuring music created using Groovepad. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

This week, Shane Harris talks with Noah Shachtman, the editor-in-chief of Rolling Stone. Before he took over the world’s most iconic music publication, Shachtman was a national security journalist. He co-founded the highly-regarded blog Danger Room and wrote for Wired magazine. Later, he ran the news division of Foreign Policy and then became the top editor of The Daily Beast, where he oversaw a team of national security reporters--including Shane! On this episode, they discuss Shachtman’s earlier career as a musician, how that prepared him for his new gig, and where  journalism is succeeding and failing today.  Chatter is a production of Lawfare and Goat Rodeo. This episode was produced and edited by Cara Shillenn of Goat Rodeo, with engineering assistance from Ian Enright.Podcast theme by David Priess, featuring music created using Groovepad. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

This week, Shane Harris talks with former CIA analyst turned spy novelist David McCloskey. His new book, Damascus Station, has been widely praised for its accurate portrayal of intelligence operations. The story plays out amid a burgeoning civil war in Syria, where McCloskey served. Shane spoke to David about his influences, his writing process, and why it was important to get tiny details right about life in the CIA. Chatter is a production of Lawfare and Goat Rodeo. This episode was produced and edited by Cara Shillenn of Goat Rodeo, with engineering assistance from Ian Enright.Podcast theme by David Priess, featuring music created using Groovepad. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

On this week’s episode of Chatter, David Priess has a special World AIDS Day conversation with longtime HIV/AIDS activist Emily Bass. They talk about the evolution of U.S. policy towards HIV/AIDS in Africa - including PEPFAR, the largest disease-specific foreign aid effort in world history, which started in the George W. Bush administration and saved millions of African lives. They discuss the evolution of that program, the on-the-ground fight against HIV/AIDS in Uganda and beyond, the conception of human security versus national security, and Emily's book chronicling the history of PEPFAR, To End a Plague: America's Fight to Defeat AIDS in Africa. Chatter is a production of Lawfare and Goat Rodeo. This episode was produced and edited by Cara Shillenn of Goat Rodeo. Podcast theme by David Priess, featuring music created using Groovepad. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

This week on Chatter, Shane Harris talks with journalist, historian, and now-fiction writer Garrett Graff. They discuss how Garrett first began writing about the FBI and the 9/11 attacks, as well as his new novella, what he calls a work of “speculative nonfiction,” about a real terror scare that got surprisingly little attention.  Garrett’s new book, “Dragonfire: Four Days That (Almost) Changed America,” is available from Scribd Originals. Chatter is a production of Lawfare and Goat Rodeo. This episode was produced and edited by Cara Shillenn of Goat Rodeo, with engineering assistance from Ian Enright.Podcast theme by David Priess, featuring music created using Groovepad. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

On this week’s episode of Chatter, David Priess has a conversation with former Principal Deputy Director of National Intelligence (PDDNI) and longtime intelligence officer Sue Gordon. Sue shares stories about her experiences in team sports, her lessons on leadership, her role in creating the CIA’s non-profit venture capital firm (In-Q-Tel), her interview with Donald Trump for the PDDNI job, and more. Chatter is a production of Lawfare and Goat Rodeo. This episode was produced and edited by Cara Shillenn of Goat Rodeo with engineering assistance from Ian Enright.Podcast theme by David Priess, featuring music created using Groovepad. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

On this week's Chatter, Congressman Adam Kinzinger sits down in his office with David to share his thoughts about his career in congress on heels of his announcement to not seek re-election. They talk about leadership, what the partisan divide means for future office holders, and how his time in the cockpit prepared him for tough matters of national security.Podcast theme by David Priess, featuring music created using Groovepad. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

On this, the debut episode of Chatter, Shane interviews a great American. The creator of The Americans, Joe Weisberg! Joe shares his journey from the agency to Hollywood, his work as a lifelong student of Russia, and his new book Russia Upside Down: An Exit Strategy for the Second Cold War.Chatter is a production of Lawfare and Goat Rodeo. This episode was produced and edited by Cara Shillenn of Goat Rodeo.Podcast theme by David Priess, featuring music created using Groovepad. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Coming soon from Lawfare:Weekly long-form conversations with fascinating people at the creative edges of national security. Unscripted. Informal. Always fresh. Hosted by Lawfare's David Priess and Shane Harris of the Washington Post.Chatter guests roll with the punches to describe artistic endeavors related to national security and jump into cutting-edge thinking at the frontiers where defense and foreign policy overlap with technology, intelligence, climate change, history, sports, culture, and beyond. Each week, listeners get a no-holds-barred dialogue at an intersection between Lawfare's core issue areas and something from Hollywood to history, science to spy fiction.Podcast theme by David Priess, featuring music created using Groovepad. Available on the App Store, https://apps.apple.com/app/id1454398991 Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.