What Works

The Nitty Gritty * How Mike transitioned from growing his design and marketing firm to creating FreshBooks, an invoicing software tool for small business owners * How a strong value of honesty seeps through the company and results in an open and transparent team that makes the product better * Why Mike created a pretend competitor to test new product features, how they tracked that project’s milestones, and when they knew that their new version would be a success If you’re a small business owner, no doubt that you’ve heard of FreshBooks. In fact, you might even use the software to bill your clients. But what you might not have heard is how FreshBooks came to be and how it’s improved over time. Mike McDerment, FreshBook’s cofounder and CEO, joins the podcast today to talk about how he structured his design agency to create more time to work on FreshBooks, why they used a secret company to test new features before launching them to the FreshBooks customers, and how important strong values are to create a strong company culture. We release new episodes of What Works every week. Subscribe on iTunes so you never miss an episode. Creating time to develop your business’ side project “I built my firm in such a way that I got a lot of time back. I helped curate the work of my team members and push them to do as much of the client engagement work as I can. That’s the one thing that I felt that I was still involved with and should be — but I wanted to just show up to meetings and grooming work.” — Mike McDerment For the first two years, FreshBooks made only $100 a month in revenue. That meant Mike and his team needed to get creative. Mike started by pivoting about 80% of his time from the firm to FreshBooks, which at the time was an unnamed side project. The rest of it was financed by agency staff who, when they had extra time, put that into FreshBooks. “That’s how we financed it without being explicit about it,” Mike explains. “We would have that company running and we were paying those employees, but more and more of their downtime was working towards the side project.” Soon enough, FreshBooks started to take off — a founder bought in and so did his mom: she wrote him a $10,000 check to invest in FreshBooks. At that point, Mike knew it was time to start firing clients from the design firm to work on FreshBooks full-time. Testing and changing your product by pretending to be a competitor “How are we going to figure out if this is a better experience for people and know that conclusively from a business results standpoint? We had a variety of other considerations but it basically led us to: how do we test it before it’s live? But, I was also thinking: we’re doing this to build something that’s a step change for us in a our business that helps us move faster and get ahead of the competition. If they’re able to watch us work along at this, that’s not very helpful or very stealthy — and we don’t get the benefit of being ahead.” — Mike McDerment Creating a secret competitor — a company they called Bill Spring — isn’t the average way to test new features or products. But that’s exactly what Mike and the team at FreshBooks did. “We used that as a petri dish,” Mike says. “That was a very important thing and I’ve learned a lot about innovation.” Particularly, he adds, how larger companies sometimes lack the ability to innovate because it’s too big of a risk. But they wanted to take huge risks. To get around that, they created a logo, website, and articles of incorporation for Bill Spring — but there were no legal ties to FreshBooks.... ★ Support this podcast ★

The Nitty Gritty * Why Natasha sold her digital offerings business arm to focus solely on 1:1 work — and how she gained two clients through sending out an email * How she found ways to bring more of herself into her business * Why Natasha uses affirmations to become the best business owner she can be and what her daily routine looks like * Where she noticed limitations in her personal life and how they impacted her business Natasha Vorompiova wants to help you amplify your impact through systems. That might look like organizing and optimizing your inbox or clarifying how your business operates. But Natasha isn’t just passionate about systems: she’s always looking for ways to optimize her own life and limitations to show up with more clarity in business. In this episode, she shares just how she does that through affirmations, paring down to just one-on-one clients, and much more. We release new episodes of What Works every week. Subscribe on iTunes so you never miss an episode. Bringing your whole self into business “I’ve stopped separating who I am in life and who I am in business. I realize more and more, I’m just this one single person and my weaknesses, or things that don’t go well for me as a person in my day-to-day life, those same things show up in my business.” — Natasha Vorompiova Separating yourself from your business is nearly impossible as an entrepreneur. Any shortcomings in your personal life show up in business just as much as your strengths. That’s something Natasha recently learned and started to tend to more. “I started looking for patterns,” she says, “where things don’t work overall in business or in my personal life. I started noticing what doesn’t work and tried to concentrate just working on that element.” For example, Natasha wouldn’t voice her opinion with some individuals in her personal life. That bled into her business and she’d struggle with having an upfront conversation with a client. True to her nature, Natasha decided to focus in on that personal shortcoming to see if she could improve it. And she did, making it that much easier to have tough conversations and ask her clients deep questions. “When I started to allow myself to ask questions that were a bit more confronting and not just systems focused, we are able to discover so much more,” she adds. Who do you need to be to achieve your goals? “I started paying very, very close attention to who I need to be in order to achieve something. That’s how I can then make sure that the action I take leads to the goals that I want to achieve.” — Natasha Vorompiova Have you ever felt like your goals were unattainable because of your (real or perceived) personal limitations? Without paying close attention to what you’re aiming for, it’s easy to slide off the path. That diversion comes by way of procrastination and avoidance, says Natasha. “When I begin procrastinating or avoiding something, I know I need to confront that versus just pushing through it,” she says. At the end of the day, “the goal itself or the money is not what we’re after,” says Natasha. “We’re after what that goal represents or what it will allow us.” How about you? Is there somewhere in your life that bleeds into the way you operate your business that might negatively impact it? Is there a way that you can focus on it so that you’re able to realign with your path forward? Using affirmations to reach your goals “The process of it made such a big difference and impression on me the very first time because I was able to feel and connect to that statement on a totally different level.” — Natasha Vorompiova Have you ever used affirmations as a mindset tool to reach your goals? ★ Support this podcast ★

The Nitty Gritty * How Christy’s sustainability values inform her minimalist and unique jewelry designs — and where she sources diamonds and gemstones from * What her weekly schedule looks like — from meeting with clients, working in the studio, sketching, and tending to longer-term projects * Who she hires to create a sustainable business model from accountants to lawyers to web designers to marketers * How Christy infuses her multicultural background into her work The jewelry trade isn’t always known for its sustainability — especially when it comes to sourcing diamonds. Today, that’s changing because jewelry designers like Christy Natsumi are making conscious choices to source diamonds and gemstones from vendors with honest supply chains. Through that thoughtful choice — and oh so many more — Christy creates change through her business: from where she sources raw materials from to the local artisans she hires in San Francisco to the unique and timeless designs she produces. We release new episodes of What Works every week. Subscribe on iTunes so you never miss an episode. The importance of having help and hiring experts “I’ve made my choices mostly on intuition and trust. It’s invaluable to have people who have your best interests in mind. It’s a foundational point that you need to be able to grow and thrive.” — Christy Natsumi While Christy doesn’t have any employees (yet!), she outsources specific parts of the jewelry manufacturing “to people who specialize in those particular techniques to accelerate the production and delivery time.” This includes local-to-her contract artisans in San Francisco. “It’s a very conscious choice to work with local makers and trade workers,” Christy adds. But it’s not just artisans she’s working with: she also works with an accountant that she meets with monthly as well as a lawyer that she consults from time to time on web copy. Her lawyer also drafted the contracts for her custom work. “Sometimes I’m taking in grandma’s diamonds so there needs to be protections in place for that,” Christy says. Beyond the legal work, Christy’s hired business coaches, videographers, and marketing and PR contractors. And lucky for her: her husband is a web designer and photographed all pieces since she opened her jewelry design studio. Making time for yourself keeps you engaged in your business “I bring attentiveness to my personal needs at the end of the week to make sure that I’m staying engaged and focused and to avoid burnout.” — Christy Natsumi Being your own boss can sometimes feel like you’re operating in a vacuum. That’s why Christy’s created specific workweek flows to keep her vision front and center. At the end of every week, she prints out photos from clients as well as kind words they send in an email. This ritual is part of Christy’s work week — and it’s something she intentionally does to stay inspired. “It honors the craft and it also honors the people you’re serving,” she says. “It’s really important to take a moment at least once a week to be reminded of that — and center back into why you’re doing something.” Is there a way that you can build in time to reflect on the value you’re creating for your customers and clients every week? Including custom pieces in a product-based business model “The custom process allowed me to be a little bit more environmentally mindful. I struggled in the beginning with the thought of making things for sake of producing a ton of things. I loved that the bridal pieces allowed me to not only merge value and client needs but it served my business in terms of h... ★ Support this podcast ★

The Nitty Gritty * Take a look at Srini Rao’s daily writing routine — from the apps to the systems — that enable him to write 1,000 words a day, every day * How creating for one — rather than many — invokes higher quality work * Why looking at the long-term view helps you avoid the comparison trap * Thoughts on mastering the creative process so that your work makes a lasting impact on your audience, customers, and clients Srini Rao writes at least 1,000 words a day and yet the majority of them you’ll never read. Why does he write so much, knowing that most of it won’t see the light of day through a blog post, an email, or a book chapter? Srini argues that within that daily practice comes some of your best work… and the essential opportunity to master your craft. We release new episodes of What Works every week. Subscribe on iTunes so you never miss an episode. Using a daily writing system to do the work “The seeds of your most resonant work are actually created in private. When you’re creating this much in private and you don’t have the pressure to share everything, then you can be selective. I create a large volume of work much of which largely nobody sees.” — Srinivas Rao Here’s a reality: not everything you create will be great and not everything will be for public consumption. That’s just part of the creative process. But as you dedicate yourself to a daily practice, you hone your skill and thus are more selective about what you do share. Take Srini for example. He writes over 7,000 words a week and only a small portion of those words become a blog post or an email or a book chapter. But through that process, Srini uncovers some of his best ideas. Here’s a look at his daily writing routine: * Wake up at 6 am * Meditate for 10 minutes using the Calm app * Read for 45-60 minutes. Almost everything he writes that day is inspired by something he’s read… and he only reads out of real books, not Kindle books. * Turn on the same techno track on repeat and put on noise canceling headphones. * Write in a physical notebook by hand first, then turn on Mac, open MacJournal, and write 1,000-1,500 words, which usually takes 30-45 minutes. Srini employs this process using the Activation Advantage, a concept from the book, The Happiness Advantage. By reducing the number of decisions he needs to make, he dives immediately into the work. No energy is spent on the steps that need to happen before he can start writing — like choosing a pen or notebook (or even music!) because it’s already planned out. The importance of creating for one “When you satisfy your own desires and you maintain your own values and standards — as opposed to letting it be driven by the desire to live up to the expectations of other people — you’re much more likely to create something with emotional resonance, something that’s going to have a lasting impact on people.” — Srinivas Rao Right now, you can create and share something online in the blink of an eye. Because of it, truly good work is often eclipsed by the stuff that gets all the likes. Despite that, Srini believes in a daily creative process to master your craft. But it’s not just about the daily work: it’s also about creating something that matters to you and slowly becoming your personal best at it. In Srini’s latest book, An Audience of One, ★ Support this podcast ★

The Nitty Gritty * What boundaries Charlie Gilkey and Angela Wheeler, founders of Productive Flourishing, set to coexist between business and life in a healthy way — plus, some of the rules they follow, like no screens in the bedroom (or in the hot tub!) * How their work styles differ — and how they make space for both * Why open communication is at the core of everything they do, including their relationship with each other and their team Ever thought of starting a business with your spouse? It takes strong boundaries, vision, and understanding to do it right: something that Charlie Gilkey and Angela Wheeler, founders of Productive Flourishing, have refined over the last 10+ years of working together. Of course, running a business and being in a relationship together results in unique challenges. How do you carve out time, outside of business, for your spouse when you work together all day? How do you determine who does what work — in the business and at home? How do you make sure you aren’t driving each other crazy? Charlie and Angela have run Productive Flourishing since 2007… and in this episode of What Works, they share what they put in place to do their best work — and show up as their best in the relationship, too. We release new episodes of What Works every week. Subscribe on iTunes so you never miss an episode. Creating boundaries: when business and life co-exist “There isn’t a very clear line that this is life and this is business. They mix all day, every day. As things have shifted and changed in our life, things have shifted and changed in our business — and who does what and when.” — Angela Wheeler While it may seem that there’s no separation between life and business for Charlie and Angela, there definitely is. But it’s not without effort: part of that distinction comes from the boundaries and rules they’ve created for coexisting both as a partnership in business and in life. “We have different ways of working,” Charlie says, “and it’s a constant challenge for us.” One of their differences? Charlie’s an early riser: he’s usually halfway through his workday flow when Angela wakes up. One of their rules here? Charlie doesn’t talk to Angela until she talks to him. “Then, I don’t stay in that weird relational hover zone to where it’s like: are we saying hi in the morning and being lovey-dovey?” he asks. “Or are you doing your thing and I’m doing my thing?” Knowing what to expect from one another, as they work and live together, helps them stay focused on doing the work. Appreciating contrasting working styles and roles “Equality is not equal time and it’s not equal results which can be a really sticky part of a relationship.” — Charlie Gilkey As a society, we’re conditioned to believe that productivity means working hard from 9-5. But work doesn’t always fit into that 8-hour time slot. Many times, it expands past those hours. That’s been the case for Angela who’s consistently worked through a health journey that prevents her from working at the capacity she would like to. “What am I able to contribute,” she asks, “versus what I wish I could contribute? It’s totally a mindset thing on my part but it’s also an honoring and a recognition on both of our parts.” Beyond handling the financial aspect of business and working on projects for Productive Flourishing, Angela also takes care of things around the house: something that has tremendous value for both their business and life — but it’s not something that earns her a paycheck. As Charlie says, equality doesn’t mean equal time or effort. Understanding and appreciating this really required many open conversations between them to f... ★ Support this podcast ★

The Nitty Gritty * Why Alison Pidgeon left her Director role at two outpatient clinics to start Move Forward Counseling, a group mental health practice based in Pennsylvania * The reasoning behind Alison’s choice to stop taking new clients — plus, how she divides her time between counseling and running the business * What makes growing a group mental health practice work. In the conversation, Alison shares how she approaches team building and culture creating to keep her practitioners happy * How she structures pay for the other therapists in the group practice and what money goes where Sometimes, the way you’ve worked for years doesn’t work anymore. Life changes and responsibilities shift. That was the case for Alison Pidgeon. As the former director of two outpatient clinics, Alison started feeling the itch to go out on her own. She was burned out, and with two small children at home, Alison yearned for more flexibility. So she made some big changes. Alison left her position as director and started her private practice just days later. As her practice grew, Alison made the switch from a solo private practice to a group practice. Today, seven therapists work at Move Forward Counseling alongside Alison to serve the women of greater Lancaster County community. Listen to this episode of What Works to hear more about what it took for Alison to scale her business from one to 7, how she shows appreciation for her staff, and how she’s established a thriving business through word-of-mouth. We release new episodes of What Works every week. Subscribe on iTunes so you never miss an episode. How to influence your company culture “My staff feels valued. They feel respected. They have flexibility and autonomy over their schedule and what kind of clients they want to see. They’re paid well so they have time to take care of themselves and take care of their families.” — Alison Pidgeon Every company has a culture: some companies are intentional about it while others are not. Alison is someone who cares about her staff — and through her own experience in community mental health, she learned what not to do. “I saw what was happening in the agency and I did the exact opposite,” she says. And it’s paid off. Her staff are happy in their jobs, they aren’t overworked, and they have the ability to choose how they work. Influencing the culture started early and found its footing in Alison’s own ponderings: “How would I want to be treated as a provider?” she asks. “It was easy to take that and develop that culture in my own practice.” Why should you scale a high-touch business? “Private practice can be quite lonely. It’s nice to have other people around. Obviously you can make more money and you’re able to scale your business and it’s not tied directly to trading dollars for hours anymore which really appealed to me.” — Alison Pidgeon Sometimes there’s an identity crisis as you scale a business — but that shouldn’t turn you away from an opportunity that’s crossed your path. As Alison continued working solo in her private practice, she realized that she could grow the practice — and that doing so would round out the services that they provided in one place. “I came up with the umbrella that we’re a practice focused on women’s issues,” Alison says. “Underneath that, everybody has their own specialty. Not everyone is doing the same thing but I’ve been able to tie it together for the purpose of branding and marketing.” So far so good: there are currently seven providers (meet them here!) On the logistical side of things, every provider is set up as an independent contract... ★ Support this podcast ★

The Nitty Gritty * From the ideal diet to meditation to work style, learn how Michelle embraces her Ayurvedic dosha type * How Michelle’s rebel brain held her back in traditional work environments — and how she unleashed it so she could do her best work * Why Michelle embraces three-day sprints for deep diving into client work and balancing that with three-day sprints for working on CEO type tasks As a startup cofounder and high achiever, Michelle Warner eventually hit a wall. She completely wore out her adrenals from working countless hours every day. But, instead of pushing through it and carrying on, Michelle’s body forced her to stop. That’s when she decided to get curious: how could she live and work in a way that aligned with her natural strengths instead of constantly pushing against them? As she began to understand both how her mind and body work optimally, Michelle appreciated what once caused her so much frustration: time management. Today, Michelle designs her business to fit her life instead of modifying who she is for the work. We release new episodes of What Works every week. Subscribe on iTunes so you never miss an episode. Discovering and working with the rebel brain within “I could not be told to sit in an office at a specific time. I would lose my mind. A piece of that is my entrepreneurial self. I’m just not meant to be an employee. But a piece of that was also trying to structure my day in that way and digging in on something that inherently didn’t work for me.” — Michelle Warner Have you ever struggled with working a traditional 9-5 schedule? You’re not alone! Michelle did, too. In fact, she struggled so much that she would surf the internet, send emails, or run errands throughout the entire day… anything so she didn’t have to feel like she had to work during those hours. … But then she’d spend the rest of her evening working from home. As you can imagine, working this way wasn’t the healthiest: Michelle spent most of her waking hours working. Eventually, Michelle understood and starting working with the rebel within. In other words, she needed the freedom and flexibility to work on what made sense for her and her schedule rather than being dictated by a color-coded calendar. And while the typical Pomodoro timer didn’t work for Michelle, now she blocks off time and makes a list of projects to do within that time. It works marvelously. “I have to roll with the flow of the day,” she says, “and make sure that I’m at the point I want to be by the end of that day. I need to leave that flexibility for the rebel brain in me.” Michelle’s 3-Day Intensives “I can have the 3 day routines and know what needs to happen but I can’t necessarily know which project. I can’t look at my quarter and say: these 3 days for this project and these 3 days are the next project. I will freak out and not do it. If I have a list of 10 to choose from, then one, I’m much more calm about it and two, I make the right choice in term of prioritizing what needs to get done.” — Michelle Warner For some, slow and steady wins the race. And for others, like Michelle, it’s more of a sprint. Because she embraces how she naturally works best and she understands the rebel inside, Michelle sets aside three full days deep dive into client work, according to what needs to be done each day and according to her bigger business goals. “I allow myself to completely go down the rabbit hole of their business,” Michelle says. “I create everything they need and get completely engrossed in that world. I don’t worry about anything else.” Now, this is her go-to style for client work — and she’s proven that there isn’t just one single way that you can do th... ★ Support this podcast ★

The Nitty Gritty * How Bridget’s struggle finding tops that fit her body type encouraged her to make her own — and how that pursuit turned into Têra Kaia’s first top, TOURA * The six words the Têra Kaia (formerly Aret Basewear) team uses to influence their branding, whether that’s photo styling or product developing * Their journey for finding a local athletic wear manufacturer that could make high-quality garments at an affordable price point — and what led Bridget to switch manufacturers * What their ambassador program looks like and why Instagram is their main marketing channel * How they ensure that customers find the right fit every time by using a sizing guide and a free exchange program — and how that value drives product design and informs customer service On today’s episode of What Works, Bridget Kilgallon, co-founder of Têra Kaia (formerly Aret Basewear), a collection of minimal basewear for the outdoorswoman, openly shares her journey bringing a physical product to market. From hand-sewing and testing the first top to partnering with a local manufacturer to marketing the brand, Bridget walks us through her thoughtful approach to product design, branding, and customer satisfaction. We release new episodes of What Works every week. Subscribe on iTunes so you never miss an episode. Finding a local manufacturer “Finding a reliable manufacturer that can create our tops at the quality that we want at a price that works in the marketplace: that was the biggest hurdle we faced as a business. It still continues to be to this day.” — Bridget Kilgallon Once Bridget nailed down the handmade prototype and tested it for four months with willing participants, she needed to find a manufacturer. As you can imagine, finding one that meets your needs isn’t always easy but Bridget knew what she needed: a local manufacturer that specialized in athletic wear. And she did… but they only worked in standard format, meaning they only produced athletic wear with one-size-fits-all type of sizing like S, M, and L. “It took a lot of convincing for us to be like: no, we’re doing it differently,” she says. “Our sewing process is different and our fitting process is different.” So, the search continued. They ended up working with multiple different manufacturers in and around San Diego, California, but continuously faced issues with quality control and price point. As of today, they’re in the process of switching to a new manufacturer that can do everything in one place. Plus, this new partner has a design studio on site to help get their designs ready for production. Matching your values with your branding “We’re not just making athleisure: we’re making something that’s functional and technical. A lot of clothing companies for women right now are focused on making something that’s stylish and pretty. We’re not on board that. We think womenswear should be just as functional as menswear.” — Bridget Kilgallon From the get-go, Bridget defined Têra Kaia’s top as technical gear… and that one key decision influences everything from how they communicate online to how they create imagery for their online shop and on Instagram. “We really go out of our way to make sure that it’s communicated that this is a piece of technical gear,” Bridget says. Beyond the design, they identified keywords that they use throughout the branding process: contour, strong, dynamic, futuristic, minimal, ★ Support this podcast ★

The Nitty Gritty * Why moving to Salt Lake City from San Diego inspired Nailah to start Color Outside — and how the free meetup transformed into the company it is today * How Nailah budgets, markets, and plans retreats — and why she hosts them in places that you wouldn’t normally take a vacation * How she uses private Facebook groups to connect with her people right away, plus her approach to sharing and posting content within it * What’s included in every retreat–including renting out an entire home, hiring a private chef and a photographer, offering unique activities, and more–plus, the pricing strategy Nailah uses to calculate costs–including profit As a new mom and a newcomer to Salt Lake City by way of San Diego, Nailah Blades Wylie sought community and adventure to reconnect with herself. That’s why she founded Color Outside, a meetup-turned-travel company for women of color who are ready to create unapologetic, joy-filled lives through outdoor adventure. In today’s conversation, Nailah shares how she budgets, markets, and plans the retreats and what’s so important about getting out into the wild. If you’ve ever considered running retreats or live events as the core offering of your business model, this is an episode not to miss. We release new episodes of What Works every week. Subscribe on iTunes so you never miss an episode. The evolution of Color Outside from a free meetup to an adventure company “I realized that hiking, exploring, kayaking and being out in the wild helped me to really reconnect with that part of myself that I was missing. My mind stopped racing. I was able to think through things more. I got a broader perspective on what was going on in my life… and I thought: other women need this.” — Nailah Blades Wylie As a new mom and a new resident of Salt Lake City, Utah, Nailah felt disconnected from herself — and from a community. She craved getting into nature and she needed to be around other women going through the same thing. Initially, Color Outside started as a free meetup group. She organized hikes for women of color to come together and explore this new place she called home. As Nailah continued to host meetups out in the wild, she realized just how much she enjoyed it. With a background in life and business coaching, she easily connected with other women on a deep level. In this episode, Nailah talks about a hike that confirmed this for her. As she and another woman powered through the woods, the woman shared that she was in a job she hated — and that she wanted to be a writer instead. For the remainder of their time together, they mapped out a plan for her to start exploring this new life path as a writer… and by the end of the day, the woman felt so much better because she had a plan to research and implement. That’s when Nailah knew that Color Outside could be so much more than a meetup group. It could be an opportunity for life and business transformation — and a place where women of color could feel — and experience — unapologetic joy, one of Nailah’s biggest values for Color Outside. Prioritizing and infusing unapologetic joy into everything “Expressing our joy and being unapologetic about it is revolutionary, especially for women of color. It’s something that’s not a given for us. We have to fight against the stereotype of the angry Black woman or the spicy Latina. Just showing up and taking up that space is huge: it ripples throughout our community and the entire world.” — Nailah Blades Wylie Unapologetic joy: even thinking about the idea feels liberating. ★ Support this podcast ★

The Nitty Gritty * How Beryl runs the Momtography® training program, how she landed on the price point, and how she promotes her teachers once they’ve successfully completed the initial training program * Why Beryl’s first step to licensing her work included hiring Autumn Witt Boyd, an intellectual property lawyer, to legally prep Momtography® for distribution * How she finds qualified people to work with, how many teachers she’s currently working with, and her vision for the future of Momtography® Today’s guest, Beryl Young, returns to the podcast — and this time, she’s sharing everything behind licensing her signature work, Momtography®. So far, Beryl’s licensed twelve teachers, with plans to expand to all 50 states in the U.S. in the future. In this conversation, Beryl talks about how she started Momtography®, how she prepared her content for licensing (including hiring a lawyer!), and what it felt like to transition from the creator to the leader. If you’ve ever considered licensing your work — or want to hear more of the nitty gritty details on how it can work — this episode is for you. We release new episodes of What Works every week. Subscribe on iTunes so you never miss an episode. Prepping to license your work “The first step was hiring a lawyer because I hadn’t trademarked the name. I knew that if I was going to percolate this on a national level, that was the first bow I needed to tie up. I also wanted to make sure that all my legal ducks were in a row. I wanted to speak to someone who worked with other licensing programs who could give me guidance.” — Beryl Young Getting your work ready to license is no small feat. Besides creating the content and finding people to train, you also need to ensure your work is legally ready for distributing. How do you protect the integrity of your work? How do you ensure that people don’t steal your idea? Those were some of the questions Beryl had — and why she hired Intellectual property lawyer Autumn Witt Boyd to help her do just that. Together, they parsed out the contracts and trademarks associated with the program as well as non-compete clauses. If you choose to license your signature work, take Beryl’s lead and contact a lawyer to set strong foundations to protect you and your creations. Giving up control to move from creator to leader “I asked myself: can I trust other people with this? I started building my team out over the last 2-3 years and this felt totally different. If somebody teaches this class in a way that’s different than me or in a way that I don’t agree with, am I going to be able to take that manager/CEO role and apply it? Can I let go of control and allow this to happen and allow Momtography® to spread?” — Beryl Young As an infinitely creative individual and the one-woman show behind Momtography® for so long, it was difficult for Beryl to shift identities from creator to leader. But to allow Momtography® to expand, she needed to give up that control… and trust. Giving up that creative control doesn’t mean you give up structure or rules. Instead, Beryl’s implemented a training and coaching program to show her teachers what’s expected. Part of that includes guidelines on what teachers can charge for the classes they teach. While licensing your work requires shifting up to a leadership role, it doesn’t mean that you are divorced from the creative aspect of it. Rather, it means that you’re in a position to set your teachers... ★ Support this podcast ★

The Nitty Gritty * What inspired Chris to start building CozyCal, a simple and easy-to-use online scheduling tool for small business owners and solopreneurs * Why Kat Lu decided to leave her healthcare consulting career to work on product development and customer support at CozyCal full-time * How Kat and Chris manage their roles in the company as a couple (and how their backgrounds influence how they operate) * What channels they use to grow CozyCal including the WordPress Plugin Directory, webinars, podcasts, and affiliate programs * Why they use Intercom over email for real-time feedback and communication with their users — and how that informs their development process Kat Lu and Chris Tan never set out to build a SaaS company… but when a friend needed an easy way to schedule appointments online for her naturopathic practice, Chris decided to develop a minimalist calendar to automate the process for her. That service is now CozyCal, a simple-to-use online scheduler, that helps users generate leads and grow faster. After seven months of working on the product part-time, they decided to go all in. Kat left her job in healthcare consulting to become CozyCal’s product and customer support manager while Chris continued to build out requested features as the head (and only!) developer. In this episode, Kat and Chris shed light on what their product development process looks like, what it’s like to work together as a couple, and all the interesting ways they market and promote CozyCal. We release new episodes of What Works every week. Subscribe on iTunes so you never miss an episode. How they use Intercom for onboarding and real-time customer support “Intercom made a huge difference for us. Prior to that, we used Zendesk and it’s a more passive channel of communication between us and the customers. We have to wait for them to send an email to us and then we send an email back. There is no real time communication. With Intercom, we’re able to talk to users in real time and gather feedback.” — Kat Lu Collecting user feedback is essential for SaaS companies like CozyCal. Customers who use the product every day know the product well, then share their ideas to optimize and improve it. That’s why Kat and Chris recently switched from the email helpdesk tool, Zendesk, over to Intercom. Intercom makes it dead simple to communicate with customers in real time and collect feedback. In fact, the pair joke that they answer customer requests faster than they respond to each other’s text messages. Another feature they love, Kat says, is Intercom’s onboarding campaign feature. So far, they’ve used it to auto-send messages throughout a new user trial period. “It really makes a huge difference to us,” she adds. Here’s an example of how a 10-day onboarding campaign works: * Day 1: Welcome message in app and email * Day 2: Examples of how other people use CozyCal * Day 5: Reminder of additional features, like payment and Zapier integrations * Day 9: Prompt user to upgrade to the Pro Plan As you can see, they strategically educate users over a period of time in accordance with the trial — and they do it all from Intercom. Using the WordPress plugin directory to market and grow CozyCal’s user base “One of the terms of being in the WordPress plugin directory is that, if you’re selling a SaaS, you need a freemium plan. That’s one thing that’s tricky. The people who come in through WordPress may not be the easiest to convert — but just having that... ★ Support this podcast ★

The Nitty Gritty * How Jacquette uses different themes every month to inform the activities and questions she poses during her monthly dinner series, The Comfort Circle™ * Why Jacquette increased the event pricing from $75 to $150 per person and what went into the decision to host the dinner in the same restaurant month after month * How the dinner series works into her larger business model — and why she’ll be offering self-hosted dinners as well as firm-hosted ones * What’s the future of The Comfort Circle™? Jacquette says that it might include retreats Financial behaviorist Jacquette Timmons helps people talk about uncomfortable things. One of the ways she does that is through The Comfort Circle™, an intimate gathering where she walks her guests through curated topics about money and life over a three-course meal. In this episode of What Works, Jacquette shares her perspective on discomfort and why it’s crucial to success, how she uses different topics to curate The Comfort Circle™ experience, and where this in-person event fits into her business model. If you’re a coach or consultant and you’re looking for new ways to approach your business model, this episode is for you. And even if you aren’t, Jacquette’s stories and experience provide insights into pricing a service and leaning into discomfort: two essential skills that every entrepreneur needs. We release new episodes of What Works every week. Subscribe on iTunes so you never miss an episode. Why an in-person dinner on money and life? “My clients can talk about sex with their friends. But they can’t talk about money because there isn’t an environment where people feel that they can be vulnerable.” — Jacquette Timmons It was obvious to Jacquette: people need safe spaces to have difficult conversations. Initially, Jacquette considered a traveling conference that would pop-up in several U.S. cities. But she realized that it required too many resources. Instead, she decided to think smaller and more intimate… and that’s where the idea for The Comfort Circle™ came. The dinner series, which started in January 2017 in New York, provided a space for real talk around money and fit within her business vision while suiting Jacquette’s natural inclination to connect in person. “I know live events are powerful,” she says. “I know I show up powerfully and I connect well with people that way.” Jacquette consistently hosts The Comfort Circle in the same restaurant for a small group. She says the max is twelve guests because her intent was always to keep the dinners intimate. How The Comfort Circle™ fits into her larger business model “The dinner is a lead generation vehicle. It’s an opportunity to get to know me and my approach. Some of them convert into coaching clients. Not every dinner results in immediate conversion or a conversion to a four figure coaching engagement but that does happen.” — Jacquette Timmons Jacquette uses the monthly dinner series as a way to connect with potential clients — both personal and corporate. “I already do financial workshops for corporations,” she explains, “but there are times when they don’t want to do the same old thing. This is a way of doing something different.” Different indeed! For example, a law firm hired her to host a customized dinner for 40 people. And instead of charging the typical $150/per person, the firm paid her as a speaker. “I now think of this as there’s a self-hosted version of the dinners and there’s the firm-hosted dinners, which I’m hoping will gain some traction,” Jacquette adds. Besides strategically using the dinners as a lead generation exp... ★ Support this podcast ★

The Nitty Gritty * The red-yellow-green system Jess Ostroff and the Don’t Panic Management team apply to every potential new client relationship and new hire to help them take the emotion out of it, particularly when it’s not the right fit * What Jess does if a potential client isn’t ready for their services yet, like helping them systematize their business so they’re ready for an assistant in the future * Why Jess chose to only hire United States-based and college-educated virtual assistants This week’s guest is Jess Ostroff, founder and Director of Calm at Don’t Panic Management, a people-first virtual assistant agency founded in 2011. In addition to running the Don’t Panic team, she’s also a speaker and author of Panic Proof: How the Right Virtual Assistant Can Save Your Sanity and Grow Your Business. In this episode, Jess shares the process she uses to vet new clients and new hires, plus how she operationalizes red flags to help her identify make-or-break situations using a red-yellow-green system. For Jess, this system helps her make choices that are informed by both her gut reaction as well as objective facts. We release new episodes of What Works every week. Subscribe on iTunes so you never miss an episode. Operationalizing red flags “It’s not just feeling. That’s why we have this red-yellow-green system. I might say: Sally is so nice and she really needs our help. And Jen, my colleague, will say: yes, but did you see those 10 red flags? We gave her a yellow and now she’s a red. She’s not a good fit for us. It makes it easier for me to say no with objective ranking factors in place.” — Jess Ostroff How many times have you said yes to a new client when you should have said no? Maybe the client needed more than what you offered but you felt bad or felt like you should say yes simply because you knew you could help them (and you needed the work.) Whatever the situation, Jess’ method for systematizing red flags with new clients is key for looking through an objective lens rather than a rose-colored one. “I like to start out by feeling what I’m feeling,” says Jess. “But then I like to fact-check that against that everything else I have in terms of information.” Here’s a real-life example. The beginning of a new relationship with a client starts with a general form on Jess’ website. Once they receive that email, they apply the red-yellow-green system immediately. They only move forward with people who pass with a yellow or green. Here’s what this looks like: * Red is a hard no. If the individual provides no information about their business in their initial email or there are other indications that they aren’t a good fit, they don’t move forward. * Yellow is a maybe. In this situation, Jess would need to gather more information. She might ask them to fill out a pre-call form to get a feel for their experience working with assistants, plus what their needs are. * Green is a yes. These individuals are self-aware, very organized, and very communicative. It’s obvious that they’re ready for the help and they have a system for bringing on an assistant with clear tasks and expectations. But the red-yellow-green system doesn’t stop at the intake form: it’s used at every additional step, including phone calls, to ensure it’s a good fit for everyone. “If it’s a red, I’ll say: you know what, I don’t think you’re ready or the right fit,” Jess says, “and I’ll point them in another direction.” Finding and working with clients that are the perfect fit ★ Support this podcast ★

When I got married 11 years ago, I was depressed, ashamed, and feeling like I had no opportunities left — in the way only a 25-year-old can feel. I had always planned to keep my maiden name, which was Seefeldt, but I also planned to be a successful academic with a published work or two under my belt by the time I got married. Instead, I was a grad school drop out working as a retail manager earning less than $30,000 per year. When I met my husband, I was so depressed that I hadn’t been able to eat solid food in about a week. My weight had plummeted and, instead of a solid size 8 and 145 pounds as I’d been most of my life, I was struggling to keep my size 0 pants on my boney frame. I was a complete mess. Marrying my husband — in my tortured mind — seemed like the only solid opportunity I had left. Of course, when you’re that depressed and unwell, making the decision to get married is never a good one. You could be marrying the best person on earth, even the best possible match for you, and you’d be in trouble. But marry I did. I was pregnant — by choice and plan but, again, after a life-to-that-point of not wanting children — within 3 months. While pregnant with my daughter, I was put on Zoloft in an attempt to quell the early symptoms of prenatal depression. It worked beautifully. The medication took the edge off and helped me to see new possibilities. I started to feel more in control, more confident, and more capable again. This state of mind helped me make room for starting a small business — the business that has grown into CoCommercial. I started doing things that made me feel like me again — writing, reading, and thinking. At the same time, it became clear that my marriage was just not going to work. It was a rough time and I didn’t handle it very maturely — but eventually, we made the mutual decision to split up. This was a really positive step in the right direction, even if it caused some logistical difficulties initially. One such difficulty was realizing that I had started to build a brand and a reputation with a name that didn’t feel like my own — Gentile. I considered changing it as we finalized our divorce but going back to Seefeldt seemed like a domain name nightmare and I wasn’t creative enough come up with something on my own! That was then. This is now. When I created my 2018 goal list, I put changing my last name on it — along with climbing a V5-graded boulder problem (done), doing 10 unassisted pull-ups (I’m at 6), running a sub-30-minute 5k (I did 28:18 last month), and hiking the Highline Trail in Glacier National Park (on the schedule). Even if my long-time partner and I weren’t going to get married, I was going to change my name to something else. Well, we are getting married in 2 weeks and, luckily, marriage makes the paperwork a little easier. We toyed with the idea of both of use changing our names but, in the end, I decided on simplicity and doing — for the second — the decidedly un-modern thing of taking his last name. Starting June 28, I’ll begin the transition to calling myself Tara McMullin. Personally, this was an easy decision. Professionally, it causes me anxiety. I’ve spent the last decade building name recognition, credibility, and a reputation as Tara Gentile. I’ve done podcast interviews, spoken at events, been a featured expert, written books, and been a

The Nitty Gritty * Jaime’s lessons from hiring virtual assistants in the Philippines — and why she eventually hired an employee local to her * How Jaime and her team use Asana to manage projects and assign tasks * What books and tools Jaime uses to track employee time — and how she uses that as a tool to ensure employees are doing what they love with their time * Hear more about Jaime’s approach to the not-so-fun aspect of running a business: firing employees * The difference between an owner and an operator — yet how crucial they are to each other’s success Jaime Masters is a business coach and host of the Eventual Millionaire blog and the going-on-seven-years podcast series. In this episode of What Works, Jaime walks us through her process for hiring and keeping employees happy. She also shares her tactics for firing underperforming employees in a fair and diplomatic way. Curious about the resources that Jaime mentions on this episode? You can find them all at this link! We release new episodes of What Works every week. Subscribe on iTunes so you never miss an episode. When hiring an employee is good for business “Before I was trying to hide from the responsibility [of having employees] because I had a bad experience. But it made me understand how important it is to not do everything yourself. I thought I was good at everything but my executive assistant was good at so many other things than me. Letting go made a huge different in my sanity. I could double myself.” — Jaime Masters Before Jaime hired her first employee, she tried working with virtual assistants from the Philippines. Jaime was afraid to hire an employee because of negative experiences in the past — and she thought that a V.A. would meet her business needs. But a coach she worked with told her an employee is a good thing. “You’ll be a better business owner because you have that responsibility,” they said. Jaime took that to heart and hired her first employee: an executive assistant. It turns out Jaime’s coach was right: not only did hiring an employee force Jaime to show up on time — it also made her more dedicated to her work. “It made me put roots down and say: okay, we’re doing this!” she says. Today, Jaime employs four full-time employees: an operator, a full-time virtual assistant, a technician who specializes in Infusionsoft, and a personal assistant. She also works with many contractors, including ghost writers, copywriters, and podcast editors. An overlooked reason why tracking employee time is a good thing “The goal is to level up the things that they do best so that they can feel in flow and love their job.” — Jaime Masters In most jobs, tracking time and tasks is a way to keep employees accountable. But in Jaime’s world, she uses time tracking not only to see what employees are spending their time on — but also to ensure they’re spending time on the things that they love. If employees spend more time on things they’re naturally good at, they’re happier and more productive. That’s what Jaime’s seen with her team by putting this practice into place. And it’s super simple: they use the RescueTime time management software. Taking the emotion out of firing underperforming employees “I had to put something in place on the firing side so that I could separate it from my emotions because I want to help everybody and I hate firing people. Everybody’s probably heard that you want to be slow to hire and quick to fire. ★ Support this podcast ★

The Nitty Gritty * How Lauren and Jason Pak, cofounders of Achieve Fitness, use their Instagram to educate and inspire their audience — and why they chose Instagram as Achieve Fitness’ main marketing platform * What their weekly social media schedule looks like and how they plan, create, and edit that content * How the first four years of business helped the duo master the day-to-day operations and why they now feel confident to delegate to team members * What their strategy for hiring new team members looks like and how they infuse empathy and kindness into everything they do, including weekly team meetings Lauren and Jason Pak are the cofounders of Achieve Fitness, a gym based in Boston, Massachusetts. While personal fitness is what they do, their why is even more compelling. This husband-wife team set out to change the industry: they want to make the fitness industry a more approachable and positive place to be. While the pair got into personal training by accident in 2007, their approach to growing their business is anything but accidental. They’re extremely intentional about their core values and building that into everything they do at Achieve Fitness, from planning and creating Instagram posts to hiring new coaches. Listen to the entire episode to hear more from the Paks and definitely check out their 5 Year Business Anniversary video on YouTube to see their story in action. We release new episodes of What Works every week. Subscribe on iTunes so you never miss an episode. Translating your core values into your social media content “It’s our mission not just to change our gym and our area but we really want to change the way that the fitness industry approaches helping people. We felt like, especially on social media, a lot of what happens is trainers trying to show off what they could do in order to impress other people. What was actually happening was they were intimidating other people.” — Lauren Pak Lauren and Jason were frustrated by the fitness industry. To them, it felt unapproachable and inaccessible — and they saw that same theme extend to social media. The majority of posts that they saw were trainers showing off — and in a way, they felt, making fitness intimidating for others. When it came to crafting their own social media presence, they decided to do things differently and made it easier for people to feel that being healthy and fit was possible for them. “We really had to take a step back and say: are we doing this for other coaches? Or are we doing this to make a positive impact on the industry? That means we need to simplify things and make it much more approachable and much more accessible,” Jason said. Planning a weekly social media strategy “We’re spending about 15-20 hours on social media creation so it’s pretty much a part-time job. We were only recently able to get involved with it since we were able to develop a really strong team at the gym.” — Jason Pak For the first four years of business, Jason and Lauren were deep into the day-to-day necessities. But now that they’ve hired out some of those responsibilities, they have more time to translate their vision into Instagram content that attracts a worldwide audience. You can see their entire Instagram feed by clicking here. At the heart of what they post is the desire to educate people. They schedule in a weekly meeting where they plan the content for the week, including taking photos and videos. Then, they post videos and demos, with a focus on proper form, ★ Support this podcast ★

The Nitty Gritty * How Sarah Bray, entrepreneur, author, and digital strategist, transitioned from working exclusively for herself to joining the smart and passionate team at &yet, a design and development consultancy * What it means to be an intrapreneur in the modern creative world — and what drew Sarah to the &yet team * How to fuel your self-confidence, especially if you’re moving from the entrepreneurship world to a team culture * Why Sarah and the &yet team create resources, like Leadershippy, that serve the company culture as well as the public to inspire, educate, and support them on their work/life journey Have you ever felt that you could never work for someone else, other than yourself? Sarah Bray, entrepreneur, author, and digital strategist, felt the same. That is: until she saw how she could give more life to her ideas by working on a team. Despite working independently for years, today, Sarah works as the Chief of Strategy at &yet, a design and development consultancy based out of Richland, Washington, that centers their work on possibility and people.. Listen to this inspiring episode of What Works to hear more from Sarah about her transition from working solo to working in tech. We release new episodes of What Works every week. Subscribe on iTunes so you never miss an episode. Tapping into your confidence as you transition from entrepreneurship to intrapreneurship “My confidence in what I could do and what I could bring came from those experiences and that validation. I was at a point in my growth that I didn’t have to seek out those people. I never had to sell my ideas to anyone because they’d been reading my work for a long time and they knew who I was.” — Sarah Bray The digital entrepreneurship world and the tech world are similar in many ways. Culturally, they’re both forward thinking and quick moving. There isn’t much bureaucracy (hopefully!) — autonomy and bold ideas are welcome. But the big difference between the online business world and the tech world is that the people who work within each realm don’t cross paths often. As Sarah shares, her new coworkers at &yet weren’t familiar with her digital work, besides her business partner Adam. But it didn’t matter because Sarah knew she created quality work… and she used that confidence to push forward from running solo to joining forces with others. If you’re considering making the jump from growing your own business to working for someone else, consider: what do you do really well? How is what you do well served by pivoting to a team-based environment? And how does this shift serve you personally and professionally? Embracing frustration to fuel your work “Frustration is the most amazing thing. Anytime there’s something I’m annoyed about or that’s driving me crazy, that’s the feeling that I know my own limitations well… and that I really need to be working with other people to move my ideas farther than I’m able to take them.” — Sarah Bray Something I love about &yet’s company culture is that they fully embrace the idea of possibility. But not as a grandiose vision that doesn’t feel grounded in reality. Instead, it’s at the heart of everything they do and something they highlight on their website’s homepage. Possibility is no doubt something that Sarah embraces in her life, too. If she didn’t, would she have considered working for someone else? Would she have believed that working with others could make more of her ideas come to life than w... ★ Support this podcast ★

The Nitty Gritty * How Cathy and her songwriting agency, Catch the Moon Music, manage music inquiries and how they close deals * Hear all the details on Mochas and Music, Cathy’s unique way of putting her music in the hands of music supervisors (hint: it worked!) * Why she uses live events to bring together songwriters and music supervisors together in one room, plus why she started a course for songwriters * How she turns outreach on its head by approaching clients in a way that’s authentic to her, and equally important, valuable to them On this week’s episode, we talked with Cathy Heller, songwriter and President of Catch The Moon Music, a songwriting agency for T.V., ads, and film based out of Los Angeles. In our conversation, she shares where her love of music stems from, how she used closed doors as an opportunity to create her own path, and why she’s now offering courses for other songwriters. We release new episodes of What Works every week. Subscribe on iTunes so you never miss an episode. Using “no” as a tool to uncover your strengths “I believe that if it is right and the world is saying yes, then there’s enough room. But you need the courage to try and you might be told no. If you’re told no enough times, maybe you need to realize that you’re meant to be on the other side. You’re just really great at identifying great music so you should be the one choosing the songs.” — Cathy Heller When Cathy first pursued her music career, she wanted to be a singer. She didn’t anticipate songwriting as her chosen field — but when she went to Los Angeles and she heard no enough times, she realized that she didn’t need to be the singer. Instead, she could be the one writing the songs. That moment transformed her career from singer to songwriter and ultimately she founded Catch The Moon Music, a boutique music licensing company. Today, her clients include global corporation like Coca Cola and McDonald’s as well as Netflix, Crate and Barrel, and Disney. As Cathy mentions, sometimes when you hear no enough, it’s not the wisest choice to keep pushing through to prove a point. Sometimes those no’s are really a window, showing you different opportunities that might suit your talents better. Radical empathy is the tool for solving other people’s problems “The difference between a hobby and a business, at its core, is radical amounts of empathy. If anybody wants to make money, somebody else is going to give you that money, so we have to spend a lot of time anticipating other people’s needs.” — Cathy Heller At the core of Cathy’s work is curiosity. “What else can I create with my two hands that is going to serve my audience,” she asks. Her method includes asking the music supervisors who are choosing music what they need. Not only that but she’s always looking at what they’re already using in their T.V. shows and ad placements, then reverse engineers songs from what she’s learned to anticipate their needs. Think about your own business: how can you embrace radical empathy and put yourself in your customers shoes? How can you start to anticipate what your clients and customers need? Finding what is authentically you… and what’s valuable to others “Every person has their thing and when it’s expressed, it makes the world brighter and better. Every person can find a way to make it a living but it takes some introspection, it takes some exploring, and it takes some start and stops because sometimes we gotta try things to figure out what works and what doesn’t. We have to be willing to put in the quest.” — Cathy Heller Even after taking a break from the music world for two year... ★ Support this podcast ★

The Nitty Gritty * The story behind Susan’s personal breakthrough that prompted her to leave a two decade fashion career to launch Art & Eden, a sustainable clothing line for kids * How Susan transformed her approach to business from fast to slow * What processes Susan and the Art & Eden team put in place to stay accountable to their sustainability values * Where — and why — they give back a portion of their profits to social equity projects as a part of their Buy Better, Do Better mission After two decades in the fast fashion industry, Susan Correa decided to leave her career as the sole breadwinner of her family to pursue a more sustainable approach to fashion. Today, Susan is the founder of Art & Eden, a sustainable clothing line for kids that approaches fashion in a slower, more intentional pace and weaves in social equity projects into the foundation of the business model. Listen to this episode of What Works to hear more from Susan on what transformed her mindset to create a business that is better for the planet and the people. Plus, so much more on the values, processes, and branding efforts that go into a sustainable business model — and how that applies to any business. We release new episodes of What Works every week. Subscribe on iTunes so you never miss an episode. Leaving behind a career to launch a business “It was the most difficult decision of both my personal and professional life. It was a really tough decision but I could no longer participate in a world that values profit over people. I knew too much.” — Susan Correa In Susan’s fashion industry experience she focused entirely on profit. What trends would bring the most money? That was at the foundation of everything Susan did for two decades. But after learning more about using business for good, including giving a portion of profits to social equity programs, Susan faced a turning point in her life. Susan declares, “I had one of two choices: accept the industry or change the industry. And I’m one that doesn’t take anything lying down so I decided to make change a reality.” With a newfound passion for sustainability, partnered with her longstanding experience in fashion, she decided to leave the career behind and start a brand new business from the ground up. That business is now Art & Eden, a collection of sustainable children’s clothes made from organic cotton, low-impact dyes, and unique prints. Staying accountable to sustainability principles “It’s really a coming together of committed people from committed institutions that makes it all come together. Even in our smaller world of Art & Eden, engaging with a community that cares is what enables us to make this a possibility.” — Susan Correa Creating a sustainable foundation to your business requires buy in and help from anyone — and any company, collaborator, or partner — that touches your business. In this conversation, Susan shared multiple ways that her company stays accountable to the sustainability principles that they were founded on. Here’s a quick look: * Sustainability from seed to finished product. This means asking questions like: are we dying the textiles in the correct manner? Are we labeling products correctly? Are we working to educate our farmers? * Relationships with independent testers. Art & Eden works with the Global Organic Textile Standard, or GOTS, as well as

The Nitty Gritty * What inspired Sarah to launch Startup Pregnant (and how that concept pivoted from book to podcast) * Sarah’s strategy for securing sponsors before launching a podcast (hint: it’s all about knowing your target audience and what their pain points are) * What new resource Sarah’s working on to meet the precise needs of her community Sarah Peck is a writer and the host of Startup Pregnant, a weekly podcast where she explores and reimagines what parenting, entrepreneurship, work, and motherhood looks like. Listen to this episode of What Works to hear more about Sarah’s journey in launching Startup Pregnant, plus her vision for the podcast and her body of work. We release new episodes of What Works every week. Subscribe on iTunes so you never miss an episode. Securing podcast sponsors before launching “If somebody’s going to put dollars for advertising somewhere, they’re going to spend it on Google ads and Facebook ads because they’re better. But I can happily lose that game because what we’re looking for in sponsors is people who believe in the value and the mission of what we’re doing. They think that providing services for new moms isn’t just a business opportunity — it’s also worth doing in the world.” — Sarah Peck At a bare minimum, Sarah needed enough to cover the costs of running the podcast — and while that didn’t mean she paid herself (at least not yet), she didn’t want to pay out of pocket to launch Startup Pregnant. Luckily she didn’t need to. She asked four people who were already a part of her blog community and they all said yes to sponsoring the podcast. So what did it take for them to say yes, especially because the podcast wasn’t even launched yet? It was all about the intended audience of the podcast: women entrepreneurs who might also be mothers and what might help make their lives easier. Sarah says they value things that save them time, save them money and also help them with efficiency… so services like Acuity and MeetEdgar are two sponsors that meet those needs. Creating a wildly valuable resource that your audience needs “Here’s what I made. Steal it. I’ve just saved you 25 hours of time and here are the negotiation scripts. It solves a really specific problem for people — but I hope it can also change people’s lives.” — Sarah Peck What happens when you need to go on maternity leave… but you aren’t sure what the policy should be? Sarah’s target audience are entrepreneurial and working moms — specifically new moms — and this was a question she heard all. the. time. She decided to put together an entire resource, dedicated to not only answering this question — but also providing policy language and negotiation scripts. “Look, you’re pregnant so you’re really tired,” Sarah says, “and you have limited time. You’re trying to finish your job and you’re trying to do a good job. Doing research is not easy.” Think for a moment about the struggles and pain points that your audience might face. How can you offer something as specific and resourceful as this? Letting your vision lead you… even when you don’t know where it’s heading “It’s not easy for me to do but I’m trying to remain as open as possible to the fact that I might not even know what this is becoming yet.” — Sarah Peck The truth of entrepreneurship is that everything is an experiment. The path isn’t laid out for you. You have to forge through, learning more about your customers, your product or service, and yourself along the way. ★ Support this podcast ★

The Nitty Gritty * How Jennifer’s creative entrepreneurial journey influenced the creation of Sister and Feminine Business School * What led Jennifer to transition from solopreneurship to a brand that’s bigger than her — and how collaboration sets the foundation for Sister * The practical and foundational values of creating and formulating a feminist business * Why you should see your business as a partnership and some of the tools Jennifer uses to connect students with their business’ “spirit” Do you think there’s a better way to approach your work than just hustling hard? Jennifer Armbrust, founder of Sister and Feminist Business School, would argue there’s a more feminine way to build and grow your business. In this episode of What Works, Jennifer walks us through what a feminine economy looks like, how to use those values to guide your business decisions, and tools for working on your business in a holistic, healthy way for work/life balance. Jennifer also discusses her experience with growing from a solopreneur mindset to a leadership one… and the struggles she faced on that journey. We release new episodes of What Works every week. Subscribe on iTunes so you never miss an episode. What is a feminine economy? “If capitalism is an economy that values masculine traits, what could another economy look like? That’s where we get the feminine economy. It’s almost a backward question. Instead of saying what economy would we need for feminine values, I’m saying: what if we start valuing feminine principles? Will that shift the economy?” — Jennifer Armbrust Capitalism currently operates according to masculine traits of the ego, Jennifer says. For example, worker value comes from productivity, poverty is vilified, nature is dominated, and systemic racism and sexism are commonplace. You can find the graphics mentioned in the podcast here. So what would the world look like if we included resourcefulness, mindfulness and gratitude, integrity, and honesty in the very foundation of every business and system? Things would radically change — for the better. Infusing feminine ideals into daily life “It’s a creative act every day going to my business, taking these ideas and ideals, and asking: what are the choices and the ways I’m setting up my business that’s going to evoke them?” — Jennifer Armbrust One of Jennifer’s most recent experiences putting her values into her business was with her new office. “I want it to be honoring my body,” Jennifer shares, “which is the first principle of the 12 principles for prototyping a feminist business. Our bodies are things that we use in our day-to-day workspace so how do I configure my workspace to support my body?” With that as a guiding principle, she got both a sitting desk and a standing desk. She also added a meditation pillow. “I’m not trying to make the choice that other people made before me,” she says. “Instead, it’s: what is my office? What is Jennifer Armbrust’s office for Sister? What is this space going to be and how do I work in it?” What are some feminine values that you already infuse into your business? What are some that you’d like to explore more in your everyday work life? Check out the 12 Principles of the Feminine Economy from Sister for more insight and ideas! Scaling from one to many, with intention ★ Support this podcast ★

The Nitty Gritty * Why Michael created Buzz, a rock-and-roll infused sandwich shop on wheels * How he infused his personal values into Buzz — and how those values extend into the culture of the company * Everything Michael learned from taking the B Impact Assessment * How becoming a B Corp positively impacts Buzz, its employees, and the community * What running a responsible business means to Michael Today on What Works, we welcome Michael Sirianni, owner of Buzz, a mobile rock-and-roll inspired sandwich shop serving the Lancaster, Pennsylvania community. But Buzz is about so much more than egg and cheese sandwiches: as a B Corp certified business, Michael runs his restaurant-on-wheels a bit differently than most. Listen to the entire conversation with Michael to hear all the details on what B Corp certification is, why sustainability is an important foundation for running any business, and how the B Corp certification benefits Buzz, its employees, and the community. We release new episodes of What Works every week. Subscribe on iTunes so you never miss an episode. How B Corp Certification aligns Michael’s company and personal values “I’m a firm believer that a company’s values need to drive and reflect what your customers, vendors, and employees value. In addition to that, those values should be rooted in kindness, fairness, and generosity.” — Michael Sirianni Most of us go into business because we see possibility for a better world — and we see how we can help make it so. That’s definitely true for Michael, who, after years working in the food industry, felt that his B Corp business matched his personal values. “I think that’s who I always saw myself as a leader in business,” Michael adds. “I could not be more happy that B Corp came along and now my personality matches my professional desire.” For him, making Buzz a B Corp certified business made it possible to make an even bigger impact than without it. What Michael learned from taking the B Corp Assessment “I sat down with my books and said I can’t really afford to do this. I can’t afford to give everyone a living wage and bring home X of profit. But that’s what the whole thing’s about. It’s about saying profits need to be sacrificed for the betterment of my staff. When you give somebody a living wage, they’re less likely to leave, they learn more, they grow more, they’re more invested, they become a bigger part of your company in the long run, they’re less likely work a second job because they have less of an economic need so they’re available more hours to you. There are all these positives about it. That’s the thing I learned most and simultaneously the thing I’m proudest about.” — Michael Sirianni Going through The B Corp assessment, Michael realized that if he truly wanted to create the company he was the proudest of, he needed to be able to pay his staff a living wage. That meant that he’d take home less profit — but, to Michael, it’s worth it because it results in happier and healthier employees. In addition, providing stable, living-wage jobs to his employees results in a stronger community. What responsibility in business looks like “Are you doing what’s right for your community? Because they’re your customers and they’re your future employees. The private sector, as we define it, absolutely has a responsibility to make themselves a part of the solution and a part of progress.” — Michael Sirianni B Corp certification is Business Sustainability 101. “Everyone should do it, ★ Support this podcast ★

The Nitty Gritty: * Marie shares the role customer interviews have played in the evolution of her online learning software product, Doki * How automation plays an important role in how Marie and her partner manage their workload without assistants or contractors * What enables Marie to balance managing her business with outside pursuits like rock climbing and permaculture On this episode, I’m caught up with Marie Poulin, the co-founder of digital agency Oki Doki during another live recording of the podcast. Marie is a designer and digital strategist who helps small business owners translate their 1:1 services into profitable digital products and programs. She co-founded Oki Doki with her partner Ben, and together they run Doki, their platform for delivering online learning experiences. When she’s not working with clients, you can find her climbing rocks or playing in the garden. On a personal note… One of the personal goals that I set for myself this year was: “Spend at least as much time mastering technique and perfecting form as learning new things” You have no idea how difficult this is for me. I love to try new things… and I hate repeating things for precision. You can ask my mom about how well I handled that in grade school. But I’m in the process of massively leveling up—as I know you are too—and technique counts. It counts big time. I’m applying this goal to everything from physical fitness to new digital tools to tried-and-true marketing techniques. It always takes a mental cue for me to pause and perfect my technique before I move on but, each time I do, I get better and better. Without spending time on optimizing what works and mastering technique, you end up piling more and more on your plate because you assume the only way to move forward is to do more. You never give what you’ve introduced into your business (a new social media channel, a sales funnel, a team member, etc…) the time to show you what it can really accomplish on its own. It might feel slow at first–but it’s the fastest, most sustainable way to make progress in the long-term. Marie cares deeply about mastering technique and optimizing what works One thing I always take away from conversations with Marie is her commitment to getting things right, focusing on the details, and optimizing what works. She recognizes that the best way to get big things done is to care about the little things. You’ll find this theme throughout the whole interview and you’ll see how she’s applied technique and optimization to everything from her product development to her service delivery to the way she sets up her weekly schedule. Listen to the full episode to hear it all. ★ Support this podcast ★

The Nitty Gritty * What prompted Carlos to shut down a thriving digital agency to start The Happy Startup School * What happiness as a business model looks like — and how Carlos teaches that model to others * Why Carlos includes an application process for his in-person events, plus the four main elements he always follows to produce a great event * How Carlos and his business partner Lawrence turned an idea for in-person conversations in unique places around the world into their retreat, Alptitude Carlos Saba is an agency owner turned community builder — and his focus? Happiness. Through his work with The Happy Startup School and his retreat, Alptitude, Carlos is sparking conversations around building a life and business rich in purpose. In this episode of What Works, Carlos digs into why he left agency life behind, the importance of starting conversations with like-minded people, giving yourself space to think up new ideas, and how to turn a dream into reality. We release new episodes of What Works every week. Subscribe on iTunes so you never miss an episode. Making a case for the lazy approach to business “Some people are built in a certain way that they can just chase that thing and they make a success out of it through brute force. What we’re much more about is the lazy approach to business: how can we do things a bit more effortlessly? How can we actually tune into what we want to do and what we get energy from, and where we find flow — and overlap that with a way of making money and a way of sustaining ourselves and making a business?” — Carlos Saba In modern life, quick success is celebrated. We love overnight successes — even when we know, behind the scenes, they are anything but instant wins. No doubt you know of an entrepreneur who seemingly popped out of nowhere and are killing it. While it may seem glamorous — and something that all entrepreneurs strive for — what if you don’t? What if you want to move more slowly towards your goals? What if you don’t want to hustle hard for 50 or 60 hours a week? What if you want more balance in work so you can more fully enjoy your life? Those were some questions that Carlos asked himself as he created The Happy Startup School — and something he wanted to share with others. Optimizing for happiness in life and work “We were optimizing for happiness. It isn’t just about the money — what we’re all trying to do is find happiness. And happiness is a personal thing and it’s different for everyone, but that’s the thing… the startup school wasn’t just about starting a business: it was also about building a business that aligns with who you are.” — Carlos Saba When Carlos and his business partner Lawrence started talking about The Happy Startup School, they knew they wanted to focus on educating clients. They thought the school would train entrepreneurs on how to build and grow lean startups in a happy way, that was based on two of their favorite books: Lean Startup and Delivering Happiness. But they realized they could do so much more than that. That’s when they decided to focus entirely on happiness in life and business — and to share that with their community. Now, they provide resources, gatherings, and people to spark new ideas and conversations around infusing happiness into every aspect of life and business. Creating space for event attendees “The real key thing that we think is really important is space. Not filling it for the sake of filling it because you think that’s how you create value but actually creating the space for value to emerge fr... ★ Support this podcast ★

The Nitty Gritty: * How Michelle created the “3 Word Rebellion” framework that brings her new client leads * Why Michelle uses a free consultation to book new clients * The importance of Being Boss’s Chalkboard Method for knowing how many clients she needs at any time * How Michelle has optimized her schedule to make 1:1 client coaching more sustainable In this episode, I catch up with Dr. Michelle Mazur (episode 53) for another special LIVE episode of the podcast! Michelle founded Communication Rebel on the belief that communication changes the world. To do that, Michelle helps business owners, executives, and thought leaders craft their 3 Word Rebellion, their speech, and their positioning and pricing so they can get booked. The speakers she works with have generated incredible results like booking a $10,000 speaking gig, raising 3x the amount of money expected for the launch of a charity, and becoming an international speaker in front of world leaders. She lives in Seattle with her adoring husband, 3 obsessive felines, and a huge collection of Duran Duran memorabilia. Michelle made her “lead magnet” and her first offer one and the same Instead of spending time creating a piece of lead generation content that was separate from her initial offer, Michelle uses her 3 Word Rebellion framework 2 ways. First, it’s freely available right here. She acknowledges: There will be a small percentage of people who can do it. They can nail their 3 Word Rebellion on their own; they don’t need any help. And… the majority of people struggle with this because they are so close to their message. Once she’s delivered the framework and given people a chance to give it a try on their own, she shares why it can be so difficult to come up with it on your own. This opens the door to make an invitation to work with her to craft your 3 Word Rebellion. Michelle doesn’t take any speech coaching clients that haven’t first completed their 3 Word Rebellion–her seed offer. She’s learning to make an offer much, much sooner What I’m realizing is that people want to find out how to work with you a lot sooner than you think. I know everybody thinks you have to do so much nurturing and give 3 or 4 emails of packed-tight content but we have to start making the ask sooner! Because Michelle’s lead magnet is perfect for people ready to work with her right now instead of 6 months from now, she’s started to realize that people want to find out how she can help right away. The big takeaway here–and I was so excited Michelle spoke about this–is that, if you make your marketing assets much closer to the “buying” part of the customer journey, you’ll need to spend less time in nurture mode and can get to the sale right away. You’ll not only move people through the process faster, but you’ll end up losing fewer clients to competitors because they want help now… not at the end of your 26-part email automation sequence. Learn more about how Michelle is building a client pipeline and turning lookers into buyers by listening to the full episode below or anywhere you listen to podcasts. ★ Support this podcast ★

The Nitty Gritty * The breaking point in Lisa’s life that inspired her to turn to herbalism for answers — and why she decided to study herbalism deeper * How Lisa manages her job as a spaceship builder and her herbalism clients * What specific strategies Lisa uses to plan and optimize her daily and weekly tasks * Who, exactly, Lisa works with through her herbalism business — and how she balances client sessions with the unpredictable needs of spaceship building Lisa Akers is both a spaceship builder and herbalist (really!) While this might sound like an unusual duo, Lisa demonstrates just how closely the two are related — and how she balances working as an engineer and working as an herbalist. In this episode of What Works, Lisa shares how she connects engineering and herbalism, what’s so magical about herbalism, and how she optimizes her week around the energy available to her. We release new episodes of What Works every week. Subscribe on iTunes so you never miss an episode. What drew a spaceship engineer to clinical herbalism “I saw an acupuncturist, a massage therapist, and eventually an herbalist who said, ‘here’s what’s going on, sweetheart.’ And she was right. I said, ‘this is magic so I need to learn more about this herbalism thing.’ If she can do that over the course of 90 minutes then I need to know how this works because I could be really helpful and support other people. I wasn’t thinking of it as a business at that point — just to learn for myself to support my own needs and my family’s needs.” — Lisa Akers At one point in Lisa’s health journey, she ended up in the emergency room, convinced she was suffering from a heart attack. Fortunately, that wasn’t the case — but doctors gave her Xanax to help her mediate the stress she was under from working long hours instead. Dissatisfied with that solution, Lisa sought additional professional opinions. Every doctor she saw recommended Xanax. At that point, she explored alternative routes in an effort to understand and fix the root problem. “I’m an engineer. I’m trained to search for the root cause so that we can fix it and prevent the symptoms and the indications of failure from happening,” says Lisa. Through her experience with the herbalist who pinpointed her health imbalance, Lisa knew that herbalism worked — and she wanted to learn more about how she could help herself, her family, and eventually clients. Pinpointing and working with ideal clients “I work with a fairly narrow group of people in midlife and later who are finding that the lifestyle they lived as young people no longer works for them in their more mature adulthood. They’re struggling with diabetes, high blood pressure, autoimmune disease, or maybe even cancer. They need a better solution. They don’t just want to follow down this pathway where they take this medication that makes this other symptom happen that they have to take another medication for that causes something else. They have this downward spiral that ends in their death and nobody wants that — they actually want to make it better so I’m looking for people who want to understand how that works.” — Lisa Akers Lisa knows exactly who she can help: people who want answers to their health woes that they can’t find anywhere else. One way Lisa attracts those folks is through positioning herself as a scientist. She’s someone who not only understands plants, but someone who also thinks with an engineering perspective: that we need to get to the root of the issue to truly fix it. And Lisa’s knowledge and ability to find and understand scientific studies around plants give her a strong foundation to her herbalism bu... ★ Support this podcast ★

The Nitty Gritty * Why Michelle Fifis consolidated her offers into her membership program, the Textile Design Lab * The steps Michelle took to achieve greater profitability focusing on doing less and more meaningful growth * What parameters Michelle uses to decide whether a new marketing opportunity is worth pursuing–or just a time suck * The brand partnership Michelle has leveraged to increase her reach, get paid, and amp up her brand’s visibility * How Michelle’s team has evolved to support the focus she’s created in her business–and what her next steps are with hiring Today, I’m catching up with Michelle Fifis for a special episode of What Works that we recorded live on Crowdcast. Michelle is the creator of Pattern Observer, a blog all about surface design, and the founder of The Textile Design Lab, a community and education space for emerging and established surface designers. After leaving her corporate textile design job in 2010, Michelle wanted to keep her momentum going, stay up with the trends and industry news and keep track of her inspiration and resources, so she created the blog Pattern Observer. Today, Michelle is a successful textile designer who has worked with such clients as Lucy Activewear, Columbia Sportswear, Jantzen Swimwear, Pendleton and P&B Textiles. On her blog, she continues to write about business and textile design and her membership community, The Textile Design Lab, offers learning and networking opportunities to hundreds of designers worldwide. Fewer moving pieces, more profit Michelle and I focused our conversation on how she’s made her business more lean-and-mean over the last year–and increased profitability at the same time. She said: I am constantly trying to systematize what I am doing and then passing it off to someone on our team, which includes my teammate Chelsea and my husband Ken. I have cut back on the amount of information that I am taking in with regards to marketing and business growth. I used to constantly try new things and really bought into the “you have to do x,y, or z to grow your business.” I am now very hesitant to start something new or add something to our business unless I can figure out a way for someone else in our team to manage it AND it is not going to affect our profitability. Meaningful growth instead of a breakneck pace It can be so tempting to pursue growth at the expense of your life, health, and bottom line. Michelle took a hard look at how she’d been growing her business over the years and decided to make some changes. She said: I am over this focus on super fast business growth. When my business was very young, it would double every year, so I got into this mindset that I needed to continue to grow at that rate. But that level of growth became stressful and I was investing so much money in future growth that my profitability was becoming lower and lower. Since pausing on my extreme growth plan I am happier, less stressful and more profitable than ever! And still growing at a healthy rate! Listen to the full episode to learn more about how Michelle Fifis has streamlined her business to make more money. ★ Support this podcast ★

The Nitty Gritty * Why Ali’s new brand message is all about shifting the way her clients see themselves * How she draws a connection between health and politics — and positions her opinion in a way that her ideal customers breathe out: “finally, someone gets it!” * What writing exercise she used to inform her new website copy (and exactly what her company’s new position is) * Why you should always ask your customers for feedback, plus the exact process Ali used to choose a logo that spoke to them In this episode of What Works, we welcome Ali Shapiro, MSOD, certified holistic health counselor, and founder of Truce with Food® to talk about her recent rebranding and repositioning of her business. We cover everything from what she’s learned as a health coach and her own experience with cancer as a teenager, to the importance of using customer feedback to inform branding decisions, to bringing politics into your business as a way to truly serve your customers. Listen to this episode to learn more about Ali’s health journey and her experience working with women who are fed up with the status quo — and are looking for radical shifts toward true healing. We release new episodes of What Works every week. Subscribe on iTunes so you never miss an episode. How Ali knew it was time to reposition. “I realized that as I got more resilient, I actually became healthier. I really started to see with my clients that if I could help them with a research-based but client-proven process to focus on that emotional piece, their healing was exponential.” — Ali Shapiro For Ali and her clients, experiencing true healing isn’t just about what you eat. It’s about how food and emotions work together to cultivate and activate natural healing within the body. Ali knew that positioning her work around both the body and the emotions would be more difficult than just talking about food. At the same time, she felt that it might be too much for people — would they resonate with it? Would they want to work with her? Ultimately, she knew that bringing together food and emotions was crucial for her clients to experience true healing. Fortunately, her clients responded well and told her just how much of a relief it was, despite the hard work. Why? Because it gave them answers. They were finally understanding aspects of themselves that they never had. This was the foundation of her rebranding and repositioning. The importance of asking for customer feedback as you rebrand. “I didn’t end up going with the logo because I didn’t want to turn people off before they really understood what it was about. Always ask your customers and clients — even your ideal clients are going to have a range of reactions.” — Ali Shapiro As Ali worked with her clients, she realized that her work was founded on liberating women so they can get answers and feel their absolute best. As she rebranded, Ali wanted a logo that represented the work she did — and ended up with two that she loved. One logo was a dynamic logo of a woman’s body behind bars — and the bars faded away — it was a literal representation of her work. Ali loved it, but when she asked her customers, it was a split: half of them liked it while others felt that it didn’t totally encompass her work — and in a way, it didn’t align with the experience they had with her. So… instead of using the logo that she liked the most, she decided against it based on customer insights. Why Ali brings politics into her business (and her branding) “When you start talking about who has power, and who doesn’t, ★ Support this podcast ★

The Nitty Gritty: * Why Lacy is producing fewer “how to” articles and, instead, focusing on “riffing” on the leading edge of content marketing thought leadership * How she’s developing a process for asking for referrals after realizing her top clients come through that channel * Why her priorities have changed when it comes to growing her email list–and why she’s stopped using content upgrades to find new subscribers * How she makes sure none of the work falls through the cracks even as her client load and her team has grown Today, we’re catching up with Lacy Boggs in a special episode recorded live on Crowdcast. Lacy is a content strategist and Director of The Content Direction Agency, which helps online small business owners communicate and connect with their audiences through authentic, organic, and values-driven content. Lacy has been honing her business model, adjusting her own content marketing strategy, and growing her team over the last year. Figuring out what’s not working is just as important as figuring out what is working–especially if you want to cut back on your workload and cultivate sustainable operations in your small business. Lacy shared that she’s been intentional about figuring out where her clients come from and reducing the amount of time and effort she puts into marketing activities that don’t yield the kinds of clients she’s really looking for. For her, that means backing away from email list growth-at-all-costs and, instead, putting an emphasis on showing up in communities where her ideal clients hang out and writing content that positions her as an authority worth trusting. Listen to the full episode and subscribe on Apple Podcasts or RadioPublic so you never miss an episode. Plus, follow CoCommercial and What Works on Crowdcast to get notifications whenever we do live episodes. ★ Support this podcast ★

The Nitty Gritty * The four reasons why Emily and Kathleen, co-hosts of the Being Boss podcast, chose to traditionally publish their first book, Being Boss, instead of self-publishing (and how they weighed the pros and cons of each) * What the collaborative process looked like behind-the-scenes for them, from writing sessions over Zoom to in-the-moment editing * The multiple marketing channels they’re using for the book launch from traditional methods like radio and T.V. to community-focused methods like launch teams made up of passionate Being Boss supporters and more. Today on What Works, we welcome back Emily Thompson, founder of Indie Shopography, co-host of the Being Boss podcast, and co-author of Being Boss: Take Control Of Your Work + Live Life On Your Own Terms. Emily graciously takes us behind the scenes of co-writing her first book, including what she considered when choosing between traditional and self-publishing. She also shares the process behind writing the book together with Kathleen Shannon, and what marketing methods they used for promoting the book. We release new episodes of What Works every week. Subscribe on iTunes so you never miss an episode. Why they chose traditional publishing over eBook and print-on-demand “For us, it was a matter of a couple different things, one of those being our multi-year long relationship where we were both talking about writing the book — and neither of us had done it yet. We both knew that external pressure — those deadlines and expectations from someone else — would actually help us write the book. That was a big part of it: knowing that we were answering to someone else.” — Emily Thompson If you know Emily and Kathleen, you know they are no strangers to doing the work. Each of the women run their own successful companies in web design and branding, respectively. Yet despite their independent success and work ethics, the book still hadn’t been written. Ultimately, the pair looked at their biggest roadblocks to writing the book and realized that while they’re both completely capable entrepreneurs, they felt that having to answer to someone else would actually force them to get the book out the door. But that wasn’t their only reason for choosing traditional publishing. They also wanted to reach further than their Being Boss community — something they felt they could only do by traditionally publishing their book. “For us it was about creating an experience for the people who are going to be reading the book,” says Emily. And that simply wasn’t something they could create through self-publishing as an eBook or even as a print-on-demand book. How they collaboratively wrote the book “The book started with us getting really clear on the entire linear outline. From there, we started writing from the very beginning all the way to the very end so we could really build upon each piece as we went as opposed to piecemealing it together. We found that writing separately was a lot less productive than actually writing together so we would block out a couple of hours every week. We would get on Zoom and we would write together.” — Emily Thompson Yay! for the digital age where we can co-collaborate on projects, no matter where we are physically located. That was definitely the case for Emily and Kathleen, who co-wrote their book together from two different states, using the (practical) beauty of Zoom and Google Docs. Have the right tools was only one part of the book writing process, though. It also required that Emily and Kathleen release any expectations (and the... ★ Support this podcast ★