The Will to Change: Where Leadership Meets the Courage to Evolve

Author, speaker, and consultant Lily Zheng returns to The Will To Change to discuss their new book, DEI Deconstructed, which centers on accountable and effective practices to achieve DEI outcomes in organizations. Discover why even leaders with the best of intentions find it difficult to achieve the DEI outcomes they desire. Lily also discusses the outcomes that they typically advise leaders to achieve and how to measure them. They also reveal how they work with leaders who may be resistant to DEI efforts.

In this unique and timely episode, Jennifer and Doug Foresta, producer of the Will to Change, come together just days after the 2024 election to share words of wisdom, comfort, and perspective for changemakers who may be feeling discouraged. Through powerful quotes and thoughtful discussion, they explore themes of grief, resilience, and the importance of both bonding within communities and building bridges across divides. Jennifer and Doug remind listeners that periods of uncertainty and transition can be opportunities for deep reflection, reimagining strategies, and finding new ways forward while staying grounded in hope and community.

In recognition of Diwali, we are re-airing this episode, which features a conversation between Jennifer Brown and Mita Mallick, Head of Inclusion, Equity and Impact at Carta. Jennifer and Mita discuss the importance of authentic and accurate representation of diverse cultures in the media. The conversation stemmed from a LinkedIn post by Mita about her reaction to the Diwali episode of And Just Like That, a revival of the HBO television series Sex and the City. Mita breaks down the episode, which was described in a Vogue article as a "messy tangle of misnomers and misappropriation." Mita also discusses the exhaustion many people from marginalized communities feel, and what allies can do to help.

Step inside the world of U.S. intelligence agencies with Stephanie LaRue, Chief Diversity Officer for the U.S. Intelligence Community, as she reveals how she's transforming culture across 18 federal intelligence organizations. From her unexpected journey as a first-generation American and CIA attorney to becoming one of the youngest executives in the Senior National Intelligence Service, Stephanie shares candid insights about driving change in the world's most complex bureaucracy. Learn how she's measuring progress through innovative maturity models, building bridges across agencies, and why diversity isn't just about recruitment—it's mission-critical to national security. Tune in for a rare glimpse into leadership at the highest levels of government service.

In this episode, Jennifer is joined by Tiffany Yu, disability advocate, author, and founder of Diversability, for a discussion about the evolution of disability rights and inclusion. Tiffany shares her journey from accident survivor to changemaker, offering insights into disability advocacy. She also discusses approaches to raising awareness, including grassroots organizing, social media, and her book "The Anti-Ableist Manifesto." The conversation covers the nature of social change, resilience in advocacy work, and Tiffany's vision for disability inclusion.

This episode was recorded for the Farsight Chat podcast and is being shared with permission on the Will to Change. Host Farah Bala discusses unconscious bias with Harvard University experts Dr. Tessa Charlesworth and Caitlin Finton. The conversation covers implicit bias, the Harvard Implicit Association Test, and research on bias evolution. Topics include the decrease in some biases, the persistence of others, global perspectives on bias, and strategies for combating prejudices. The guests address criticisms of the IAT and explain its value in understanding cultural biases. They also explore the concept of intersectionality, examining how different biases interact, particularly around race and wealth.

Join Jennifer as she welcomes Farah Bala, founder and CEO of FARSIGHT, in a conversation about the evolving landscape of DEI in the workplace. Farah shares insights from her journey of transforming "Farsight Friday" into the more expansive "Farsight Chats" podcast, exploring how leaders can make DEI a core competency in today's rapidly changing business environment. Farah also discusses the challenges of navigating generational expectations, embracing authenticity in the workplace, and leading through the "messy middle" of progress.

This episode, originally recorded as a community call, features a conversation with Blair Imani, author, content creator, and DEI advocate. Blair discusses her transition from crisis communications to social media education, explaining how she simplifies complex DEI topics. She also addresses DEI language evolution, neurodiversity in advocacy, and balancing authenticity with accuracy online. Discover strategies for adapting while maintaining mission integrity.

This episode was originally recorded as a Community Call and features a conversation with Bridges Holmes, VP of DEI and Sustainability at The Adecco Group. The discussion explores Bridges' role in integrating DEI initiatives into sales strategies at Adecco. Bridges shares insights on developing a DEI sales toolkit, conducting live training sessions, and the challenges of changing "old school thinking" within the organization. The conversation highlights the importance of authentic engagement in DEI work, the evolving expectations of clients regarding diversity initiatives, and the need for sales professionals to become more comfortable discussing these topics.

In this episode, Mira Dewji, a former corporate lawyer turned DEI strategist, shares her perspective on the landscape of diversity, equity, and inclusion in the legal industry. Drawing from her experiences at a law firm, Mira explores the challenges in implementing DEI initiatives within conservative legal cultures. She discusses the shift from compliance-focused approaches to business-driven DEI efforts, emphasizing the importance of behavioral science and organizational change. Mira delves into the impact of generational differences, changing client demographics, and the demand for moral leadership in shaping DEI in law firms.

In this episode, we explore imposter syndrome with Dr. Valerie Young, a global thought leader on the topic and co-founder of the Impostor Syndrome Institute. Jennifer and Dr. Young discuss the evolution of imposter syndrome and its prevalence among various groups. Dr. Young introduces her "humble realist" concept and suggests strategies for organizations to address imposter syndrome. The conversation covers intersections with diversity and inclusion efforts, reframing competence, and addressing self-doubt in the workplace. To learn more about Dr. Young and her work, visit www.ImpostorSyndrome.com.

Tune in for a conversation with Dr. Stacy Hobson, Director of the Responsible Technologies Research group at IBM Research, as we delve into the critical intersection of ethics and artificial intelligence. In this eye-opening episode, Dr. Hobson shares her journey from rural South Carolina to leading cutting-edge research in responsible AI development, illuminating the challenges and paramount importance of creating ethical, unbiased AI systems. Discover how IBM Research is tackling the complex task of balancing rapid technological advancement with careful consideration of AI's societal impacts. Dr. Hobson also discusses the need for diverse perspectives in AI development, the global nature of AI ethics, and the power shifts that AI can create in society.

In this episode, we explore the intersection of masculinity, politics, and social change with author, speaker, and consultant, Mark Greene. The conversation covers male engagement in the electoral process and the cultural shift in expressions of manhood. Mark discusses the move from traditional masculinity towards more empathetic approaches and its effects on workplace dynamics and leadership. The discussion extends to nurturing emotional intelligence in younger generations, proposing initiatives to address social and emotional learning. Tune in to hear insights on political activism, workplace culture, and the future of masculinity.

In this episode Jennifer is joined by Dr. Cheryl Ingram, Founder & CEO of Inclusology, a pioneering DEI assessment platform, as they dive deep into the challenges and opportunities facing DEI work today. Drawing from her extensive experience and insights from her upcoming book, Dr. Ingram explores how the field has evolved from its roots in multiculturalism to its current form – and the crises it now faces. Jennifer and Dr. Ingram also tackle tough questions about addressing systemic issues and workplace trauma, the impact of recent backlash and legal challenges, and how practitioners can maintain resilience and effectiveness in turbulent times.

In this episode, we welcome Dr. Tania Israel, Professor of Counseling Psychology at UC Santa Barbara and author of the forthcoming book "Facing the Fracture: How to Navigate the Challenges of Living in a Divided Nation." Dr. Israel delves into the complexities of our politically fractured society, offering fresh perspectives on misinformation, polarization, and the psychological impacts of living in a divided country. Drawing from her extensive research and clinical experience, Dr. Israel shares valuable insights on maintaining personal well-being and workplace unity amidst political tensions.

This episode, originally recorded for the Smart Gets Paid podcast, and hosted by Leah Neaderthal, explores how being queer has positively impacted business ownership. Leah shares her personal journey of coming out 20 years ago and how it has shaped her approach to business, from challenging assumptions to expressing herself authentically. She also invites Jennifer and other fellow queer business owners to share their experiences. These entrepreneurs discuss how their queer identities have fostered resilience, creativity, and a unique perspective in their work.

In this episode, we welcome Loren Gesinsky, Partner at Seyfarth Shaw LLP, to discuss the critical importance of disability inclusion in the workplace and society at large. Loren shares his personal journey from employment lawyer to passionate disability rights advocate, offering valuable insights into the evolution of disability inclusion practices. He also explores the challenges and opportunities in recognizing various types of disabilities, including invisible disabilities and mental health issues, and emphasizes the power of creating environments where people feel comfortable self-identifying. Discover the concept of universal design, the business case for disability inclusion, and the role of leadership in advancing these efforts.

This "Best of The Will to Change" episode, features an interview with Joze Piranian, Global TEDx Speaker and a lifelong stutterer turned transformational speaker on inclusion and resilience. Joze also shared information about stuttering, and revealed what he has learned from his own journey.

In this episode, we talk with Yemi Akisanya, VP of Diversity, Equity, and Inclusion at Axon, a technology company serving law enforcement and public safety. Yemi discusses his journey from finance to DEI leadership and his innovative approach to implementing DEI strategies in a complex industry. He also explains how he aligns DEI initiatives with Axon's mission to protect life, accelerate justice, and capture truth. Yemi shares insights on his data-driven methods, moving beyond traditional DEI programs, and embedding inclusive leadership throughout the organization. Discover the challenges and opportunities of DEI in law enforcement technology, including product development informed by DEI principles and community feedback.

This episode features an interview with AJ Hikes, Deputy Executive Director for Strategy & Culture at the American Civil Liberties Union (ACLU). This discussion covers everything from healing the harm caused by racist bias within organizations, to integrating justice into diversity, equity & inclusion work, to the exclusionary nature of our modern legal system.

In this episode, Jennifer speaks with Maureen O'Neill. SVP and Diversity, Equity & Inclusion Officer at Consilio, about her journey from litigation to leading DEI efforts in a rapidly growing global professional services company. Maureen shares insights on creating and scaling DEI initiatives, including employee resource groups and advisory boards, while navigating industry-specific challenges in the legal tech world. She discusses the importance of balancing quantitative metrics with qualitative aspects of inclusion, the critical skills needed for DEI leadership, and the long-term impact of fostering a culture of belonging. Join us for a candid conversation about the art and science of corporate DEI, and the continuous evolution required to make meaningful progress in this vital field.

In this episode of The Will to Change, Jennifer sits down with Sterling Cruz-Herr, a trans elder, educator, and activist. They discuss Sterling's journey of self-discovery, the importance of intergenerational learning within the LGBTQ+ community, and the challenges faced by marginalized groups in today's society. Sterling also shares their experiences teaching "Trans 101" to older generations, highlighting the hunger for knowledge and the desire to remain relevant among elders. The conversation also touches on the exclusion faced by trans individuals within the lesbian community and the need for greater inclusivity and understanding. Discover the power of empathy, the importance of allyship, and the transformative potential of embracing a "they" mindset – one that celebrates diversity, kindness, and unconditional love.

In this special Pride Month roll-up episode of The Will to Change, Jennifer and Doug revisit powerful conversations with past guests who share insights on navigating DEI work in today's challenging climate. They discuss highlights from episodes featuring Lily on making DEI work "boring" to reach more people; Dr. Elijah on the importance of naming identities and allyship; Rhodes on knowing your audience when communicating about DEI; and Erik, Senior Vice President of Global Small Business at Dell Technologies, on how belonging at work can be life-changing for LGBTQ+ employees. Throughout the episode, Jennifer reflects on key lessons and offers advice for DEI practitioners and leaders committed to advancing inclusion in complex times.

In this episode Jennifer shares her process for preparing and delivering keynotes that go beyond simply giving a speech. She discusses the importance of being consultative, collecting information, and calibrating with clients before, during, and after the event. Jennifer also reveals how she engages the audience through interactive polling, uses the data to provide valuable insights to clients, and tailors her message to meet the needs of laggards, learners, and leaders in the room. She reflects on the changing landscape of DEI speaking engagements and the need to adapt language and approaches to draw people into the conversation. Throughout the discussion, Jennifer emphasizes the significance of creating a meaningful experience that leaves a lasting impact on the audience. Join us for this conversation about the art and science of keynote speaking in the DEI space.

In this conversation, originally recorded as a Community Call, Jennifer welcomes Lucida Plummer, Managing Director and Chief Diversity Officer at Evercore, to discuss the challenges and strategies for advancing diversity, equity, and inclusion (DEI) within organizations. Lucida shares her experience leading DEI efforts at various companies, emphasizing the importance of adapting strategies to meet organizations where they are, navigating the landscape of DEI work, and celebrating wins along the journey. Together, they explore the need to rethink DEI approaches and confront personal biases as DEI leaders. Throughout the discussion, Lucida offers insights on tailoring DEI strategies for impact and finding purpose in the nature of this work.

Mark McBride-Wright, author of "The Safe Leader" and Founder & CEO of EqualEngineers, joins Jennifer, Jenn T. Grace of Publish Your Purpose, and Eduardo Placer of Fearless Communicators to discuss the critical importance of diversity, equity and inclusion in the engineering and STEM fields. Mark shares his journey of writing the book, the support he received from Jennifer, Jenn and Eduardo along the way, and his mission to change the culture in engineering to one where everyone can feel safe to bring their whole authentic selves to work. The group explores how creating psychological safety is key to making progress on DEI goals and reducing the unacceptably high rates of suicide and mental health struggles prevalent in the engineering industry today. Mark's work provides a new vocabulary and framework for tackling these challenges and has the potential to revolutionize the way we approach DEI across all industries.

In this episode, we dive deep into the fight against discrimination in the retail industry with Calla Devlin, Managing Director of the transformative organization Open to All. Through Calla's insights and the inspiring work of Open to All, we explore the multidimensional challenges of bias and exclusion in retail and the innovative strategies being employed to drive systemic change. From groundbreaking partnerships with companies like Yelp to the creation of comprehensive resources and trainings, Open to All is at the forefront of a growing movement to reimagine retail as a space of true belonging for all. Join us as we examine the human and business costs of discrimination, the power of collaboration to break down barriers, and the unstoppable momentum of the inclusion revolution.

In this episode, Jennifer is joined by coach and artist Alexandra Jamieson as they explore the challenges and opportunities facing women leaders in their 40s and 50s. Through the lenses of their own experiences and those of their clients, Jennifer and Alex delve into the impact of external factors, the importance of creativity and community, and the power of reconnecting with one's values in the face of adversity. Using rich metaphors from nature and art, they illuminate the messy yet rewarding process of cultivating resilience, authenticity, and mutual support in a world that often presents significant barriers to women's advancement and well-being. Discover the inner and outer work required to thrive and lead in uncertain times.

In this episode, Jennifer is joined by renowned consultant, keynote speaker, and bestselling author, Dorie Clark, for a conversation about the challenges faced by DEI practitioners, Dorie shares her insights on the importance of personal branding and authenticity in driving change. Together, Jennifer and Dorie explore the need for a paradigm shift in how DEI is perceived and communicated, focusing on the fundamental principles of civility, respect, and creating a welcoming environment for all. This episode offers actionable ideas for DEI leaders to work smarter, not harder, in their pursuit of building a more inclusive world.

In this episode Jennifer welcomes Jay Van Bavel, an Associate Professor of Psychology and Neural Science at New York University. Together, they discuss the complex challenges facing the DEI field, exploring how extreme stances and political backlash have overshadowed much of the good work being done. Jennifer and Jay consider ways to rebrand and reinvent DEI by focusing on broader issues like organizational culture, psychological safety, and collective well-being. Through their candid dialogue, they highlight the importance of intergenerational conversations, social norms, and rewarding incremental progress in shaping inclusive cultures.

In this episode originally recorded as a community call, Jennifer is joined by Kat Gordon, a trailblazing leader who has made significant contributions to the fields of advertising, diversity, equity, and inclusion (DEI), and leadership coaching. As the founder of the 3% Movement, Kat has been a driving force in increasing female representation in creative leadership positions within the advertising industry. Drawing from her personal and professional transitions, Kat shares valuable insights on navigating change, embracing authenticity, and fostering personal growth. With her background as an advertising creative director and her current role as a leadership coach, Kat offers a unique perspective on the power of emotional intelligence, psychological safety, and the importance of creating more equitable and diverse workplaces.

In this episode Jennifer welcomes Amie Kromis and Lina Clavijo from Essity, a leading global hygiene and health company, to discuss the company's commitment to diversity, equity, and inclusion (DEI) in their products and workplace. Amie and Lina share insights on how Essity incorporates inclusive design principles to create products that are accessible to all, regardless of ability or circumstance. They explore the company's journey towards breaking barriers and providing the highest hygiene standards for everyone, and how this commitment to DEI has become an integral part of Essity's culture and business strategy. Through initiatives like "Courageous Conversations" and a focus on universal design, Essity is setting an example for how companies can combine business success with social responsibility. Tune in for an enlightening discussion on the power of inclusive design and the importance of DEI in driving innovation and positive change.

Tune in as Jennifer is joined by Jane Hyun, a leading expert on cultural fluency, diversity, and inclusion. Jane shares her personal journey as an Asian American navigating the complexities of identity and leadership in corporate America. They discuss Jane's groundbreaking book, "Breaking the Bamboo Ceiling," and her upcoming release, "Leadership Toolkit for Asians." Jane reflects on the challenges Asian professionals face in the workplace, the importance of bringing one's whole self to work, and the role of allies and advocates in fostering inclusivity. As an interculturalist, Jane offers strategies for bridging cultural gaps, developing authentic leadership, and embracing the beauty of diversity.

In this special Women's History Month episode, Jennifer shares valuable insights and inspiration from the stories of five remarkable women previously featured on The Will to Change podcast. The episode explores topics such as finding community and belonging in the workplace, the ongoing fight for pay equity, body inclusivity, and the importance of breaking the stigma around addiction and recovery. This episode serves as a celebration of the diverse voices and experiences of women, while also highlighting the critical work that still needs to be done to achieve true equity and inclusion for all.

In this episode, originally recorded as a community call, Jennifer sits down with Djuana Beamon, the Chief Diversity and Corporate Social Responsibility Officer at Empower. With a wealth of experience across various industries, including financial services, pharma, insurance, and healthcare, Djuana shares her journey in the diversity, equity, and inclusion (DEI) space. She also discusses the importance of self-care, building a supportive village, and fostering authentic relationships with senior leaders to drive meaningful change. Discover the challenges and opportunities in the current DEI landscape and the success of Empower's innovative sponsorship program, which pairs senior executives with talent from different levels of the organization to promote mutual mentoring and growth.

In this episode, Jennifer welcomes back Rhodes Perry, an award-winning social entrepreneur, sought-after speaker, podcast host, and nationally recognized LGBTQ thought leader. Jennifer and Rhodes dive deep into the current state of DEI work, exploring the challenges practitioners face in navigating pushback and misinformation, as well as the opportunities to reframe the vision for inclusion. They discuss strategies for building trust, countering misinformation with skillful dialogues, and the importance of sustainable activism within the DEI community. Rhodes shares his personal experiences as a trans leader, highlighting the power of inviting allyship through vulnerability and the impact of pop culture representation in normalizing inclusion. This thought-provoking conversation is a must-listen for anyone passionate about reimagining belonging and driving change in these turbulent times.

This episode was originally recorded as a Community Call and features a conversation with Jackye Clayton, Textio's VP of Talent Acquisition and DEIB. Jackye reveals how AI tools like Textio can mitigate exclusionary workplace communications, and how your most subtle word choices may inadvertently perpetuate bias. She also outlines Textio's approach to developing equitable language technology and provides pragmatic ideas to cultivate authentic belonging through conscientious communication.

Jorge Quezada, Chief Inclusion Officer and VP of People & Culture at Granite Construction, joins the program for a conversation with Jennifer about their decades of experience guiding organizations on the journey toward diversity, equity and inclusion. Jorge and Jennifer discuss the pendulum swings of progress and pushback, the difference between checklist "doing" and transformative visionary "being," the emotions that accompany change, and more. Jorge also shares his thoughts about Michelangelo's idea that the practitioner's role is to chip away obstacles to reveal the beauty already existing in each organization's people and potential.

In this special minisode, Jennifer provides invaluable insights on how leaders can effectively direct their message through impactful storytelling. She also shares perspectives on why many hesitate to share their stories, often failing to recognize the wisdom they have to offer. Discover how to shape and structure a compelling leadership story, and how to push past doubts and vulnerability to convey authentic narratives that will resonate across audiences. For any leader seeking to boost their communication skills and storytelling abilities, this discussion delivers thoughtful guidance and inspiration!

In this special episode of the Will to Change, Jennifer reflects on conversations with influential black leaders and changemakers. Hear clips and insights from author and DEI expert Jessica Bantom; Lorraine Orr, COO of Boys and Girls Clubs of America; author Martinus Evans; award-winning trans advocate Dr. Elijah Nicholas, Tony DeGruy of Cisco, and Carin Taylor, CDO of Workday. As we honor Black History Month, Jennifer synthesizes the themes of positive change, empathy, allyship, and pushing for progress that thread through the words of wisdom of these impactful guests shaping the future. This is a can't-miss episode for gaining motivation, perspective, and calls to action during Black History Month and beyond.

DEI trailblazer Dr. Poornima Luthra joins the program to discuss how underlying fears are fueling resistance to DEI efforts globally. She discusses research on the top fears around not knowing enough and saying the wrong thing, and the need to create psychologically safe environments that encourage vulnerability, intelligent failures, and growth mindsets. Dr. Luthra also shares perspectives on avoiding assumptions, leading with cultural humility, and understanding how history shapes inclusion across different cultural contexts. Tune in for an enlightening conversation on how to advance inclusion by addressing the fears that obstruct progress.

In this episode, Jennifer is joined by Audra Jenkins, Chief Equity Officer at Randstad. Audra discusses the important role supplier diversity plays in furthering inclusion, tapping into untapped talent pools such as people with disabilities and veterans, and the business imperative for organizations to create equitable and welcoming cultures. She also shares insights from her unique position working with both internal and external clients on DEI strategy. Discover the reasons for pushback against DEI efforts, where Audra finds hope amidst the challenges, and the need for self-care in this difficult work.

In this thought-provoking episode, Jennifer explores the nuances between different professional roles like coaching, consulting, public speaking, and thought leadership. She also shares wisdom on finding one's unique voice and platform to make a difference in the world, overcoming imposter syndrome to embrace our most powerful stories, and the responsibilities leaders have to lift up diverse voices. Whether you're reevaluating your career path or seeking to expand your reach, Jennifer offers compassionate yet direct guidance on aligning your talents with the change you wish to create. This episode provides an abundance of insight for anyone ready to step into their full potential as a leader and change agent.

In this episode, Jennifer is joined by Deloitte's Sameen Affaf and The Meltzer Center's David Glasgow, as they discuss findings from the recent "Uncovering Culture" report. Detailing the latest data around workplace "covering" behaviors among marginalized groups, they explore surprising statistics on intersectionality, younger generations, and executive leadership. Touching on storytelling, allyship, and small signals of belonging, the discussion offers thought-provoking analysis and practical tips for fostering authentic, inclusive cultures.

This episode was originally recorded as a DEI Community Call, and features a conversation with Jennifer and JBC Consultants as they reflect on learnings and positive change from 2023 that give hope for further progress, while also confronting the roadblocks still firmly in place across society and workplaces. Touching on challenging issues around dialogue, activism, leadership buy-in, capacity for change, and practitioner sustainability, the group explores nuanced, intersectional approaches for embedding inclusive cultures more systematically into company DNA. While acknowledging the constant uphill journey, their wisdom provides renewal, clarity, and energy to equip changemakers for the joys and trials ahead in 2024.

In this episode, Jennifer speaks with Laura Alvarez Schrag, Senior Consultant at JBC, about making personal connections to foster belonging in organizations. They discuss Laura's background, the importance of sharing personal stories and being vulnerable, generational differences in connecting, and how leaders can role model embracing learning and change. Laura emphasizes that while technology enables some connections, human relationships are still essential, so leaders should focus on elevating individuals, which then lifts entire organizations. Discover how intimate work that starts with personal transformation can then radiate out to create cultures of belonging over generations.

In this minisode, Jennifer offers an inside look into her approach for architecting high-impact sessions with leadership teams. From managing anxious executives to contending with vocal CEOs, Jennifer shares her tactics for establishing psychological safety while also driving towards candor and vulnerability. She spotlights common C-Suite dynamics, competency levels, and fears that manifest around DEI, providing guidance for how to move executives along the conscious incompetence spectrum.

Tune in as Jennifer welcomes Carla Knapp, National Vice President of Native Services at Boys & Girls Clubs of America., as Carla discusses empowering indigenous youth and professionals to thrive as their authentic selves. Carla reveals how to use storytelling to preserve rich cultural traditions, and shares her personal journey of leading with grace and courage to pave the way for future indigenous generations. Discover how to honor tribal sovereignty through trauma-informed empowerment, and learn creative strategies to foster an inclusive culture where all identities can fully shine.

From the Best of the Will to Change: In this episode, originally recorded at the Belonging at Work Summit, Jennifer Brown is joined by Rhodes Perry, founder of Rhodes Perry Consulting and Joel Brown, Chief Visionary Officer of Pneumos, as they discuss the importance of self-care. Discover how to develop sustainable self-care practices and increase your resilience.

In this episode, Jennifer continues her conversation with co-authors Christopher McCormick and Aman Gohal about human development frameworks. Christopher and Aman reveal how most DEI conversations happen at lower action logics, creating exclusion and division. Discover the importance of meeting people where they are developmentally, structurally changing systems, and bringing more joy and humanity into DEI work.