Startups For the Rest of Us

In episode 747, Rob Walling interviews Jane Portman, co-founder of Userlist, to discuss the evolution of their SaaS customer success strategy. Jane shares the four stages of Userlist’s customer success journey, from the early days of trial and error to implementing done-for-you services. They also discuss the challenges of customer onboarding for complex products. Topics we cover: (2:20) – How customer success works at Userlist (5:27) – Dealing with upfront onboarding friction (9:51) – Stage 1, “young and naive” (12:16) – Stage 2, “hire someone” (19:06) – Stage 3, “done for you services” (25:47) – Leveraging the Userlist blog (29:26) – Stage 4, “developing your own frameworks” Links from the Show: SaaS Institute TinySeed Jane Portman (@uibreakfast) | X Jane Portman (@uibreakfast.com) | Bluesky Userlist Episode 471 | Fighting to Gain Traction in a Crowded Space with Jane Portman of Userlist Episode 742 | Normalizing Hard Things, Facing Your Biggest Threat, and Making it Fast (A Rob Solo Adventure) Crossing the Chasm by Geoffrey A. Moore Userlist Closes a Pre-Seed Round with 21 Angel Investors SaaS Email Marketing Strategy: Everything You Need to Know 20+ “Invite Your Team” Email Examples Atomic Emails: Our Proven Method for Writing Email Campaigns If you have questions about starting or scaling a software business that you’d like for us to cover, please submit your question for an upcoming episode. We’d love to hear from you! Subscribe & Review: iTunes | Spotify

In episode 746, Rob Walling looks ahead to 2025 with nine startup predictions, exploring trends in no-code tools, search, autonomous vehicles, AI, and an increase in platform risk for bootstrapped founders. Topics we cover: (1:52) – Carrying forward predictions from 2024 (3:09) – Search volume for Google organic SEO (6:34) – Ads in AI interfaces (7:50) – Google’s revenue drops, bootstrapper opportunities (10:07) – “AI” use in H1’s (14:01) – Self-driving taxis (19:28) – Platform risk intensifies Links from the Show: Exit Strategy: The Entrepreneur's Guide to Selling Your Business Without Regret Episode 697 | 7 Predictions for SaaS Bootstrappers in 2024 Episode 725 | SEO in the Age of AI, Freemium, When Brand Becomes Important, and More Advanced Listener Questions (with Ruben Gamez) LINKLO TinySeed Episode 735 | The 8 Levels of SaaS Platform Risk (A Rob Solo Adventure) If you have questions about starting or scaling a software business that you’d like for us to cover, please submit your question for an upcoming episode. We’d love to hear from you! Subscribe & Review: iTunes | Spotify

In episode 745, Rob Walling goes solo to reflect on 2024. He revisits key concepts and frameworks introduced on the podcast, including the 2-20-200 Validation Framework, Orthogonal SaaS, and the eight levels of platform risk. Rob also looks back at his top five favorite episodes and reviews his predictions for the year—some of which came to pass, and others that didn’t. Topics we cover: (2:05) – Looking back at concepts and frameworks from past 12 months (8:50) – Rob’s 5 favorite episodes (11:56) – Reflecting on 2024 accomplishments (19:47) – TinySeed Tales Returns in 2025 (21:18) – Evaluating 2024 predictions Links from the Show: The SaaS Launchpad – Start Free with “The DNA of a Great SaaS Idea” MicroConf YouTube Channel Episode 706 | 2/20/200 Validation, Prior Art, and Designing by Committee (A Rob Solo Adventure) TinySeed Vertical SaaS vs Horizontal SaaS - Which is More Profitable? Episode 735 | The 8 Levels of SaaS Platform Risk (A Rob Solo Adventure) The SaaS Playbook Episode 728 | Bootstrapping Gymdesk to a More Than $32.5M Exit Episode 706.5 | Rethinking My Most Common Advice Episode 729 | 9 Things I’ve Learned Investing in 170+ SaaS Companies Episode 709 | The 7 Greatest Investments of My Life Episode 694 | 2023 In Review: Amazing Growth & Fighting Burnout How Ben Chestnut Bootstrapped Mailchimp to a $12 Billion Exit MicroConf New Orleans 2025 Start Small, Stay Small by Rob Walling Exit Strategy: The Entrepreneur's Guide to Selling Your Business Without Regret TinySeed Tales

In episode 744, Rob Walling is joined by Tracy Osborn and Einar Vollset to give their hot takes on some recent news. They cover the recent rise of Bluesky, kicking off a 4-figure bet between Tracy and Einar. Then they discuss TinySeed’s third fund, YC Combinator backing competitors, dealing with imposter syndrome, and finally government involvement in banning social media. Topics we cover: (1:49) – Will Bluesky survive and thrive? (9:07) – The bet on Bluesky growth (13:46) – TinySeed is raising a third fund (17:25) – Y Combinator backs duplicates (22:18) – Dealing with Imposter Syndrome (27:46) – Australia's social media ban Links from the Show: The SaaS Launchpad – Start Free with “The DNA of a Great SaaS Idea” Invest in TinySeed Rob Walling (@robwalling.com) | Bluesky TinySeed (@tinyseed.com) | Bluesky Tracy Osborn (tracymakes) (@tracyosborn.com) | Bluesky Einar Vollset (@einarvollset) | X Y Combinator often backs startups that duplicate other YC companies, data shows Procrastination and the Fear of Not Being 'Good Enough' by Swapnil Chauhan Startup Founders, Do THIS to Beat Imposter Syndrome Australia proposes 'world-leading' ban on social media for children under 16 If you have questions about starting or scaling a software business that you’d like for us to cover, please submit your question for an upcoming episode. We’d love to hear from you! Subscribe & Review: iTunes | Spotify

In episode 743, Rob Walling and Dr. Sherry Walling read the first chapter of their new book, Exit Strategy: The Entrepreneur’s Guide to Selling Your Company Without Regret. They discuss the emotional and psychological challenges of selling a business, and why it’s often harder than founders expect. They offer insights on how to prepare for a sale, protect your mental health, and how to best navigate this major life change that few others understand. Back the book on Kickstarter Episode Sponsor: Hiring senior developers can really move the needle in your business, but if you bring on the wrong person, you can quickly burn through your runway. If you need help finding a vetted, senior, results-oriented developer, you should reach out to today’s sponsor, Lemon.io. For years, they’ve been helping our audience find high quality, global talent at competitive rates, and they can help you too. Longtime listener Chaz Yoon, hired a senior developer from Lemon.io and said his hire ”definitely knew his stuff, provided appropriate feedback and pushback, and had great communication, including very fluent English. He really exceeded my expectations.” Chaz said he’d definitely use Lemon.io again when he’s looking for a senior level engineer. To learn more and get a 15% discount on your first four weeks of working with a developer at lemon.io/startups. Topics we cover: (1:49) – Exit Strategy Introduction (6:56) – Exits are complicated (11:16) – One of the hardest things you’ll ever do (15:57) – Your business is your baby (18:35) – Entering the unknown (26:49) – Six factors that shape how you feel about an exit (31:03) – Making it real Links from the Show: Exit Strategy: The Entrepreneur's Guide to Selling Your Business Without Regret Back the book on Kickstarter MicroConf Connect Applications Close Today, December 10th Rob Walling (@robwalling) | X Dr. Sherry Walling (@sherrywalling) | X The SaaS Playbook Built to Sell by John Warrillow Touching Two Worlds by Dr. Sherry Walling The Entrepreneur’s Guide to Keeping Your Sh*t Together by Sherry Walling, PhD, Rob Walling If you have questions about starting or scaling a software business that you’d like for us to cover, please submit your quest...

In episode 742, Rob Walling goes solo to explore normalizing doing hard things and facing your biggest threats. He also discusses a framework for founders looking to scale without cutting corners – making things work, making them right, and then making them fast. Exit Strategy Kickstarter ends on December 12! Topics we cover: (2:39) – Normalizing doing hard things (6:54) – The “hard things” in your startup (10:27) – Walking into the storm (16:21) – ”Make it work, make it right, make it fast” (22:04) – Building your “Founder Gut” (25:42) – Think in years, not months Links from the Show: Exit Strategy: The Entrepreneur's Guide to Selling Your Business Without Regret MicroConf Masterminds Applications Close on December 4th Rob Walling (@robwalling) | X Dr. Sherry Walling (@sherrywalling) | X The Comic Lab Podcast The SaaS Playbook The Stair Step Method of Bootstrapping This Took 11 Years to Be An "Overnight Success" - SaaS Exit Strategy If you have questions about starting or scaling a software business that you’d like for us to cover, please submit your question for an upcoming episode. We’d love to hear from you! Subscribe & Review: iTunes | Spotify

In episode 741, Rob Walling talks to Wes Bush, CEO and Founder of ProductLed, about the nuances and misconceptions of product-led growth. Wes debunks common myths and explains how companies can leverage their product to drive user acquisition, engagement, and growth. They dive into a real-world example and explore how founders can avoid the trap of thinking the product will “sell itself” while contrasting PLG and sales-led strategies. Episode Sponsor: Hiring senior developers can really move the needle in your business, but if you bring on the wrong person, you can quickly burn through your runway. If you need help finding a vetted, senior, results-oriented developer, you should reach out to today’s sponsor, Lemon.io. For years, they’ve been helping our audience find high quality, global talent at competitive rates, and they can help you too. Longtime listener Chaz Yoon, hired a senior developer from Lemon.io and said his hire ”definitely knew his stuff, provided appropriate feedback and pushback, and had great communication, including very fluent English. He really exceeded my expectations.” Chaz said he’d definitely use Lemon.io again when he’s looking for a senior level engineer. To learn more and get a 15% discount on your first four weeks of working with a developer at lemon.io/startups. Topics we cover: (2:01) – Defining product-led growth (6:07) – Are users able to get value for free? (11:38) – Hybrid: both product-led and sales-led (14:52) – Determining the main outcome of your free model (19:23) – Misuse of the PLG terminology (22:00) – The benefits of PLG over sales-led growth (24:08) – Workshopping SavvyCal’s product-led strategy Links from the Show: Mastermind Applications are open until December 4th Wes Bush (@wes_bush) | X ProductLed (@productled) | X ProductLed Product-Led Growth: How to Build a Product That Sells Itself by Wes Bush The Product-Led Playbook: How to Unlock Self-Serve Revenue and Dominate Your Market (With a Tiny Team) by Wes Bush Free Audiobook of The Product-Led Playbook Product-Led Onboarding by Ramli John TinySeed SparkToro SavvyCal If you have questions about starting or scaling a software business that you’d like for us to cover, please submit your question for an upcoming episode. We’d love to hear from you!...

In episode 740, Rob Walling speaks with Dr. Sherry Walling about their new book, "Exit Strategy: The Entrepreneur's Guide to Selling Your Business Without Regret." They explore the emotional, psychological, and practical aspects of selling a business, emphasizing the universal challenges entrepreneurs face. The book draws on both Rob and Sherry’s unique experiences that they’ve shared with countless founders throughout their careers. Exit Strategy is now live on Kickstarter! Topics we cover: 2:01 – Not just a book for those selling SaaS 8:13 – The Kickstarter for the book is live today 12:16 – Before, during, and after the exit 14:55 – Why exiting is so hard 20:39 – Life after the exit 25:10 – A few traps await founders shortly after exit 26:24 – What do you do with a big pile of money? Links from the Show: MicroConf Remote Goes Live November 20th! Exit Strategy: The Entrepreneur's Guide to Selling Your Business Without Regret Rob Walling (@robwalling) | X Dr. Sherry Walling (@sherrywalling) | X Zen Founder Zen Founder Podcast The SaaS Playbook The Art of Selling Your Business by John Warrillow Before the Exit by Dan Andrews Finish Big by Bo Burlingham MicroConf TinySeed Touching Two Worlds by Dr. Sherry Walling If you have questions about starting or scaling a software business that you’d like for us to cover, please submit your question for an upcoming episode. We’d love to hear from you! Subscribe & Review: iTunes | Spotify

In episode 739, Rob Walling interviews Andy Kim, co-founder of Trotto, about his unique journey into SaaS. Andy shares how “go links” work, and why they are so valuable for internal, enterprise use despite their relative obscurity. They also explore the marketing hurdles and customer adoption challenges in a business like Trotto. Episode Sponsor: Hiring senior developers can really move the needle in your business, but if you bring on the wrong person, you can quickly burn through your runway. If you need help finding a vetted, senior, results-oriented developer, you should reach out to today’s sponsor, Lemon.io. For years, they’ve been helping our audience find high quality, global talent at competitive rates, and they can help you too. Longtime listener Chaz Yoon, hired a senior developer from Lemon.io and said his hire ”definitely knew his stuff, provided appropriate feedback and pushback, and had great communication, including very fluent English. He really exceeded my expectations.” Chaz said he’d definitely use Lemon.io again when he’s looking for a senior level engineer. To learn more and get a 15% discount on your first four weeks of working with a developer at lemon.io/startups. Topics we cover: 3:13 – Go links, URL shorteners for enterprise 6:14 – History of the problem and core users 9:44 – Customer education and growth opportunities 15:37 – Finding the repeatable marketing funnel 21:07 – Buying into a co-founder role at Trotto 24:42 – What’s the hardest part of running Trotto? Links from the Show: Exit Strategy: The Entrepreneur's Guide to Selling Your Business Without Regret MicroConf Masterminds - Applications close on December 4th, 2024 Trot.to Trotto go links (@TrottoHQ) | X TinySeed How did go links start and evolve at Google? Quiet Light If you have questions about starting or scaling a software business that you’d like for us to cover, please submit your question for an upcoming episode. We’d love to hear from you! Subscribe & Review: iTunes | Spotify

In episode 738, join Rob Walling for a solo adventure as he answers listener questions. He explores how to target larger, enterprise deals after achieving product-market fit, and why word of mouth marketing can be great, yet is tricky to control. Rob also answers a later-stage question and cautions against trying to educate the market as a bootstrapper. Topics we cover: 1:58 – Expanding to enterprise deals after product-market fit 6:39 – Word of mouth marketing is tricky for B2B SaaS 14:36 – Educating the market as a bootstrapper 20:07 – Selling integrations through incubators and accelerators 24:38 – Developing a profit sharing model Links from the Show: Register for MicroConf Remote before Nov. 7th for Early Bird pricing & extras Ask a Question at Startups For the Rest of Us The SaaS Playbook TinySeed Adjacency Matrix: How to expand after PMF by Jason Cohen F5Bot Syften Podscan Veed Devising a profit sharing program for micro-multinationals by Peldi Guilizzoni If you have questions about starting or scaling a software business that you’d like for us to cover, please submit your question for an upcoming episode. We’d love to hear from you! Subscribe & Review: iTunes | Spotify

In episode 737, Rob Walling is joined by Derrick Reimer to recap the experience from MicroConf Europe 2024 in Dubrovnik. They discuss the differences between MicroConf US and MicroConf Europe, some small programming tweaks over the years, and they revisit the highlights from the talks at this event. If you missed the event and had some MicroConf FOMO, get your tickets now for our New Orleans event! Episode Sponsor: Hiring senior developers can really move the needle in your business, but if you bring on the wrong person, you can quickly burn through your runway. If you need help finding a vetted, senior, results-oriented developer, you should reach out to today’s sponsor, Lemon.io. For years, they’ve been helping our audience find high quality, global talent at competitive rates, and they can help you too. Longtime listener Chaz Yoon, hired a senior developer from Lemon.io and said his hire ”definitely knew his stuff, provided appropriate feedback and pushback, and had great communication, including very fluent English. He really exceeded my expectations.” Chaz said he’d definitely use Lemon.io again when he’s looking for a senior level engineer. To learn more and get a 15% discount on your first four weeks of working with a developer at lemon.io/startups. Topics we cover: 2:47 – MicroConf Europe vs. MicroConf US 6:44 – Adding “excursions” to the programming 11:29 – From Maker to Founder to Owner to Entrepreneur with Peldi Guilizzoni 18:55 – Thinking big and small: Data-driven growth strategies to grow your business with Andrew Davies 20:45 – Contributing factors to the success of this event in particular 23:47 – 10 Lessons Learned in 10 Years of Starting, Growing, and Selling WebinarNinja with Omar Zenhom 26:40 – Bootstrapping Our Freemium Form Builder: From Zero to $1.5M ARR with Marie Martens 30:37 – 3 mistakes I won’t repeat after growing my business to +35M and selling it with Tim Vandecasteele 33:50 – Breaking Through the 7 SaaS Growth Plateaus with Rob Walling Links from the Show: Get Tickets for MicroConf US 2025, New Orleans Signup for the MicroConf newsletter Derrick Reimer (@derrickreimer) | X SavvyCal Peldi from Balsamiq (@peldi) | X The SaaS Playbook Omar Zenhom (@TheOmarZenhom) | X Episode 717 | Bootstrapping to $1.3M ARR and 300,000 Free Users If you have questions about starting or scaling a software business that you’d like for us to cover, please

In episode 736, join Rob Walling as he answers some later-stage listener questions in another solo adventure. He discusses common pitfalls in delegation, transitioning from one-time transactions to SaaS models, and when it makes sense to target multiple ICPs. Rob also warns about the limited impact that social media marketing can have on growing your SaaS tool. Episode Sponsor: Are you drowning in challenging tech decisions? You should check out today’s sponsor, Techstack. Unlike typical staffing agencies, these folks are startup specialists with over a decade of experience in startup software development. Techstack can help your startup build an MVP that's designed for explosive growth, rapidly expand your team for new features, or optimize your existing codebase for peak performance. Whether you're launching, scaling up, or fine-tuning, they've got the expertise to supercharge your tech. One of Techstack’s clients was recently featured on Inc. Magazine's Fast Growth Companies list, and they attributed part of their 375% growth to their partnership. Here's an exclusive offer for "Startups For the Rest of Us" listeners: Get a 10% discount on your first month of development with Techstack. And if you're one of the first 10 listeners to get in touch, you'll also receive a free, in-depth tech assessment and expert consultation – a $3,000 value – in your choice of critical areas like architecture, infrastructure, development process or project management. This could be the game-changer your startup needs. Don't let tech challenges slow you down. Check out https://www.tech-stack.com/startups to discover how Techstack can turbocharge your growth. Topics we cover: 2:17 – What to delegate on the path to $10k MRR 6:43 – Be wary of social media marketing masquerading as productivity 10:31 – DIY vs. hiring a growth agency for B2B SaaS marketing 15:22 – Not every business should be a subscription business 22:00 – Defining, targeting, and selling to different ICPs Links from the Show: Get Tickets for MicroConf US 2025, New Orleans The SaaS Launchpad TinySeed The Stair Step Method of Bootstrapping Founding Sales by Peter Kazanjy Rob Walling (@robwalling) | X If you have questions about starting or scaling a software business that you’d like for us to cover, please submit your question for an upcoming episode. We’d love to hear from you! Subscribe & Review:

In episode 735, join Rob Walling for a solo adventure where he categorizes the different levels of SaaS platform risk. He introduces a framework with three key factors: Replacement, Customer Concentration, and Lead Flow. Rob then defines eight levels of risk according to these factors and other vulnerabilities such as relying on open source – a hot topic with recent news about WordPress, WP Engine, and Automattic. Episode Sponsor: Hiring senior developers can really move the needle in your business, but if you bring on the wrong person, you can quickly burn through your runway. If you need help finding a vetted, senior, results-oriented developer, you should reach out to today’s sponsor, Lemon.io. For years, they’ve been helping our audience find high quality, global talent at competitive rates, and they can help you too. Longtime listener Chaz Yoon, hired a senior developer from Lemon.io and said his hire ”definitely knew his stuff, provided appropriate feedback and pushback, and had great communication, including very fluent English. He really exceeded my expectations.” Chaz said he’d definitely use Lemon.io again when he’s looking for a senior level engineer. To learn more and get a 15% discount on your first four weeks of working with a developer at lemon.io/startups. Topics we cover: 2:32 – Are replacements available for this platform? 4:56 – How concentrated are your customers on this platform? 5:31 – What is your lead or customer flow? 8:54 – Level 1: almost no platform risk 10:04 – Level 2: reliant on a commoditized platform 11:49 – Level 3: using large cloud providers like AWS 15:33 – Level 4: deeply tied to open source software like WordPress 18:11 – Level 5: high switching costs, but replacements exist like in no-code 20:00 – Level 6: 100% lead flow risk 21:44 – Level 7: a friendly app ecosystem 23:24 – Level 8: aggressive platforms, few replacements, customer concentration Links from the Show: Get Tickets for MicroConf US 2025, New Orleans TinySeed Rob Walling (@robwalling) | X Ask a Question on SFTROU How to find and validate business ideas from 75+ SaaS Marketplaces If you have questions about starting or scaling a software business that you’d like for us to cover, please submit your question for an upcoming episode. We’d love to hear from you! Subscribe & Review: iTunes | Spotify

In episode 734, Rob Walling interviews Ian Landsman, founder of HelpSpot, about his 20-year bootstrapper journey. They discuss Ian's transition from on-prem software to SaaS, the challenges and benefits of each, and the early days of building the business. They wrap up by discussing the potential impact of AI on the customer service industry. Topics we cover: 1:11 – Ian, the OG bootstrapper 2:22 – Benefits of on-prem software in 2024 5:46 – Slow, steady, profitable growth through the years 9:20 – Embracing a risky start 14:11 – Getting early awareness 18:52 – Transitioning to SaaS 26:37 – Laravel raises $57M 28:59 – AI impact on customer service Links from the Show: The SaaS Playbook TinySeed Ian Landsman (@ianlandsman) | X HelpSpot (@helpspot) | X HelpSpot Podscan Accel invests $57M into Laravel Products & Open-Source Framework Mostly Technical If you have questions about starting or scaling a software business that you’d like for us to cover, please submit your question for an upcoming episode. We’d love to hear from you! Subscribe & Review: iTunes | Spotify

In episode 733, join Rob Walling for a solo adventure where he covers several topics. In this episode he differentiates between good and bad distractions, weaknesses versus blind spots, and shares personal experiences of struggle. He concludes with actionable advice – uncover the blind spots, then launch, iterate, and take feedback. Topics we cover: 2:09 – Not all distractions are bad 5:42 – The worst distractions masquerade as productivity 9:48 – Weaknesses versus blind spots 16:41 – Everybody struggles 24:40 – Launch, iterate, and take feedback Links from the Show: The SaaS Launchpad The SaaS Playbook MicroConf Connect The Hard Thing About Hard Things by Ben Horowitz Why Startup Founders Should Stop Reading Business Books by Rob Walling Traction by Gabriel Weinberg, Justin Mares Episode 725 | SEO in the Age of AI, Freemium, When Brand Becomes Important, and More Advanced Listener Questions (with Ruben Gamez) Launch. A Startup Documentary. If you have questions about starting or scaling a software business that you’d like for us to cover, please submit your question for an upcoming episode. We’d love to hear from you! Subscribe & Review: iTunes | Spotify

In episode 732, Rob Walling interviews Jeff, a mostly anonymous and retired founder, about his mostly bootstrapped business and subsequent exits. Jeff shares how he started the company in 2003 and how he persevered in the early, lonely years to achieve traction in the business. They also discuss finding fulfillment after a huge, life-changing exit. Topics we cover: 2:17 – Jeff, the retired SaaS founder you haven’t heard of 3:32 – Refreshing the bank balance after multiple exits 5:26 – ARR multiples across several exits 8:11 – “Accidentally” SaaS, growing the business in the early days 11:35 – Getting through the toughest moments in the journey 16:31 – Why did the business work? 20:14 – “Short term generous, long term greedy” 24:32 – Staying busy after an exit 32:09 – Giving back to founders Links from the Show: Purchase The SaaS Launchpad before September 30th to get access to a live Q&A with Rob TinySeed Retired Founder (@RetiredFounder) | X Contact Retired Founder Beyond The Finish Line If you have questions about starting or scaling a software business that you’d like for us to cover, please submit your question for an upcoming episode. We’d love to hear from you! Subscribe & Review: iTunes | Spotify

In episode 731, join Rob Walling and Derrick Reimer as they tackle some more advanced listener questions. They discuss delegation and giving up areas of control as a founder, including examples from their time together at Drip. Derrick describes how he approaches partnering with other SaaS businesses and why planning a full quarter ahead doesn’t work for many bootstrapped founders. Episode Sponsor: Hiring senior developers can really move the needle in your business, but if you bring on the wrong person, you can quickly burn through your runway. If you need help finding a vetted, senior, results-oriented developer, you should reach out to today’s sponsor, Lemon.io. For years, they’ve been helping our audience find high quality, global talent at competitive rates, and they can help you too. Longtime listener Chaz Yoon, hired a senior developer from Lemon.io and said his hire ”definitely knew his stuff, provided appropriate feedback and pushback, and had great communication, including very fluent English. He really exceeded my expectations.” Chaz said he’d definitely use Lemon.io again when he’s looking for a senior level engineer. To learn more and get a 15% discount on your first four weeks of working with a developer at lemon.io/startups. Topics we cover: 1:17 – Delegating as a perfectionist 7:19 – Learning to hire those that are better than you in some domains 14:50 – Risk vs. certainty 19:01 – Finding specialized marketing roles vs. a generalist 24:04 – Managing partnerships with other SaaS products 31:17 – Reaching out about partnerships 32:46 – Quarterly planning for your SaaS 34:20 – Planning in smaller time blocks 40:58 – Quizzing developers’ on their knowledge Links from the Show: Purchase The SaaS Launchpad TinySeed The SaaS Playbook MicroConf YouTube Channel Derrick Reimer (@derrickreimer) | X SavvyCal Finding Fulfillment by Jason Cohen Shape Up If you have questions about starting or scaling a software business that you’d like for us to cover, please submit your question for an upcoming episode. We’d love to hear from you! Subscribe & Review: iTunes | Spotify

In episode 730, Craig Hewitt turns the table and interviews Rob Walling about releasing The SaaS Launchpad course. Craig, founder of Castos, asks Rob about the course's purpose and structure, which founders that it’s designed for, and why he made a course as opposed to a new book, or a YouTube series. They also discuss the pricing strategy, hosting platforms, accountability, community, and more. If you’re trying to take your SaaS from zero to one, purchase The SaaS Launchpad before September 30th to get access to a live Q&A with Rob. Topics we cover: 2:00 – Why a course? 4:35 – Who is it for? 9:37 – Breaking down the pricing behind the course 14:32 – Choosing a platform to host the course 17:47 – Enabling action from those who enroll 27:33 – Course topics that help founders get early traction 30:26 – The biggest problems early-stage founders face Links from the Show: The SaaS Launchpad Craig Hewitt (@TheCraigHewitt) | X Castos The Rouge Startups podcast Craig’s YouTube Channel Episode 606 | The Podcasting Landscape, Keeping Your Saw Sharpened, and Scaling Your Team with Craig Hewitt The SaaS Playbook MicroConf Connect MicroConf Mastermind Matching The MicroConf YouTube channel TinySeed Episode 726 | Selling 29,000 Copies, Information vs. Motivation, and Making Your First Level Last (A Rob Solo Adventure) Circle.so Ruben Gamez (@earthlingworks) | X Lianna Patch (@punchlinecopy) | X Derrick Reimer (@derrickreimer) | X Ross Hudgens (@RossHudgens) | X Episode 628 | The 5 PM Pre-Validation Framework If you have questions about starting or scaling a software busines...

In episode 729, join Rob Walling as he shares insights from the 170+ SaaS investments he’s made through his B2B SaaS accelerator, TinySeed. Key patterns include the survivability of SaaS, the lucrative value of these companies, and commonalities across the ones that grow the fastest. To see even more patterns that didn’t make this episode, be sure to check out the MicroConf YouTube channel. Episode Sponsor: Hiring senior developers can really move the needle in your business, but if you bring on the wrong person, you can quickly burn through your runway. If you need help finding a vetted, senior, results-oriented developer, you should reach out to today’s sponsor, Lemon.io. For years, they’ve been helping our audience find high quality, global talent at competitive rates, and they can help you too. Longtime listener Chaz Yoon, hired a senior developer from Lemon.io and said his hire ”definitely knew his stuff, provided appropriate feedback and pushback, and had great communication, including very fluent English. He really exceeded my expectations.” Chaz said he’d definitely use Lemon.io again when he’s looking for a senior level engineer. To learn more and get a 15% discount on your first four weeks of working with a developer at lemon.io/startups. Topics we cover: 2:24 – Survivability of B2B SaaS in TinySeed 4:09 – SaaS is extremely valuable 8:26 – Vertical and orthogonal SaaS face fewer headwinds 12:36 – A supermajority of TinySeed companies want a big exit 15:51 – TinySeed founder count aligns with the broader MicroConf ecosystem 17:04 – Ruined cap tables have prevented deals 19:35 – A quarter of TinySeed companies raise subsequent fundraising 21:17 – Common advisory topics: pricing, plateaus, cofounders, funding, selling Links from the Show: Apply for TinySeed Invest in TinySeed MicroConf YouTube: 6 Lessons From My Most Successful Investments (B2B SaaS) Episode 727 | Gymdesk Sells for More than $32.5 million, Hiring Gets Easier, and More Hot Take Tuesday Topics Episode 728 | Bootstrapping Gymdesk to a More Than $32.5M Exit State of Independent SaaS Report If you have questions about starting or scaling a software business that you’d like for us to cover, please submit your question for an upcoming episode. We’d love to hear from you! Subscribe & Review: iTunes |

In episode 728, Rob Walling interviews Eran Galperin, founder of Gymdesk, about his incredible exit. Eran shares his journey of transforming Gymdesk from "Martial Arts on Rails" into a successful gym management software company. He discusses how they succeeded in a competitive market, the role of TinySeed in their growth, and how feelings of burnout eventually led to a majority buyout for the company. Topics we cover: 2:02 – Gymdesk Announces a $32.5 Million Strategic Growth Investment 5:13 – How the investment will be used 6:38 – Eran’s projects before Gymdesk 9:21 – Sticking with one idea long enough to see success 12:45 – Entering a competitive market 16:37 – Rapid growth as a marketing leader 20:54 – Dealing with burnout and entertaining an acquisition 26:45 – Handling a stressful sales process 32:19 – The future of Gymdesk Links from the Show: Apply for TinySeed Gymdesk Announces a $32.5 Million Strategic Growth Investment from Five Elms Capital Episode 727 | Gymdesk Sells for More than $32.5 million, Hiring Gets Easier, and More Hot Take Tuesday Topics Gymdesk.com Eran Galperin (@erangalperin) | X Eran Galperin | LinkedIn Eran’s Website Financial Independence, Retire Early (FIRE) Explained: How It Works Discretion Capital If you have questions about starting or scaling a software business that you’d like for us to cover, please submit your question for an upcoming episode. We’d love to hear from you! Subscribe & Review: iTunes | Spotify

In episode 727, Rob Walling is joined by Tracy Osborn and Einar Vollset to give their hot takes on some recent news. First they celebrate Gymdesk’s recent funding and evaluate what that means for TinySeed companies. Then, they weigh in on bootstrapper hiring, grappling with new challenges as MRR grows, and how to really move the needle in your business. Episode Sponsor: Hiring senior developers can really move the needle in your business, but if you bring on the wrong person, you can quickly burn through your runway. If you need help finding a vetted, senior, results-oriented developer, you should reach out to today’s sponsor, Lemon.io. For years, they’ve been helping our audience find high quality, global talent at competitive rates, and they can help you too. Longtime listener Chaz Yoon, hired a senior developer from Lemon.io and said his hire ”definitely knew his stuff, provided appropriate feedback and pushback, and had great communication, including very fluent English. He really exceeded my expectations.” Chaz said he’d definitely use Lemon.io again when he’s looking for a senior level engineer. To learn more and get a 15% discount on your first four weeks of working with a developer at lemon.io/startups. Topics we cover: 2:19 – Gymdesk Announces a $32.5 Million Strategic Growth Investment 9:06 – Is it getting easier for bootstrappers to hire? 12:22 – Facing different challenges as MRR grows 19:37 – Identifying what really moves the needle 23:56 – Listen to those who have built businesses before you Links from the Show: Subscribe to the Startups For the Rest of Us Email List TinySeed The SaaS Playbook Discretion Capital Tracy Osborn (@tracymakes) | X Einar Vollset (@einarvollset) | X TinySeed (@tinyseedfund) | X Gymdesk Announces a $32.5 Million Strategic Growth Investment from Five Elms Capital Eran Galperin (@erangalperin) | X Episode 697 | 7 Predictions for SaaS Bootstrappers in 2024 State of Independent SaaS Report The Elephant in the room: The myth of exponential hypergrowth

In episode 726, join Rob Walling for a solo adventure where he covers several topics. In this episode he reveals the sales details around “The SaaS Playbook” by sharing the volume and sales channel data. He explores the importance of motivation over mere access to information, particularly for developers, with the introduction of AI. Rob also previews several exciting projects to be released in the near future. Topics we cover: 2:49 – The SaaS Playbook sales channel breakdown 8:20 – Learnings from the book launch 9:51 – Upcoming books and courses 12:07 – ”Teach them how to run fast, better” 16:04 – Access to information vs. motivation 19:40 – Creating your onboarding last Links from the Show: Discretion Capital Einar Vollset (@einarvollset) | X Episode 707 | Once.com, Open Source to FT Income, and More (Hot Take Tuesday) TinySeed The SaaS Playbook The SaaS Launchpad video course Sherry Walling (@sherrywalling) | X Netflix’s Sprint John Romero (@romero) | X Masters of Doom by David Kushner Doom Guy by John Romero If you have questions about starting or scaling a software business that you’d like for us to cover, please submit your question for an upcoming episode. We’d love to hear from you! Subscribe & Review: iTunes | Spotify

In episode 725, join Rob Walling and Ruben Gamez as they answer several more advanced listener questions. They discuss the challenges of pursuing freemium as a bootstrapper and make a suggestion that might surprise you. Rob and Ruben also talk about why building your business as a SaaS founder is usually the best way to build your brand indirectly. Episode Sponsor: Hiring senior developers can really move the needle in your business, but if you bring on the wrong person, you can quickly burn through your runway. If you need help finding a vetted, senior, results-oriented developer, you should reach out to today’s sponsor, Lemon.io. For years, they’ve been helping our audience find high quality, global talent at competitive rates, and they can help you too. Longtime listener Chaz Yoon, hired a senior developer from Lemon.io and said his hire ”definitely knew his stuff, provided appropriate feedback and pushback, and had great communication, including very fluent English. He really exceeded my expectations.” Chaz said he’d definitely use Lemon.io again when he’s looking for a senior level engineer. To learn more and get a 15% discount on your first four weeks of working with a developer at lemon.io/startups. Topics we cover: 2:31 – Considering a freemium plan as a bootstrapper 9:52 – Freemium, but without the intent to convert free users 12:24 – Raising prices as an alternative to starting a freemium plan 18:32 – When to start caring about your “brand” 25:10 – Investing directly in branding 31:00 – Revisiting your marketing funnels 34:08 – AI’s impact on SEO 38:20 – Google’s search results are already changing Links from the Show: Get notified about The SaaS LaunchPad Ask a Question on SFTROU Email a Question on SFTROU MicroConf TinySeed The SaaS Playbook Ruben Gamez (@earthlingworks) | X SignWell Episode 724 | Managing Managers, Breaking Through Plateaus, Thoughts on EOS, and More Later-Stage Listener Questions Episode 717 | Bootstrapping to $1.3M ARR and 300,000 Free Users Val Sopi (@valsopi) | X BlogMaker

In episode 724, join Rob Walling as he takes on some later-stage listener questions in another solo adventure. He provides several tips for managing managers, how to break through MRR plateaus, and how to think about SaaS versus agency work. Rob also offers his take on how he would talk about his product at conferences, without overselling it. Topics we cover: 3:48 – Three tips for managing other managers 8:42 – Schedule “skip level” meetings 9:50 – Attending a conference without overselling 15:00 – Breaking out of the $20k-$30k MRR plateau 19:57 – How to keep your self-serve SaaS from becoming an agency 23:58 – Scaling management through company growth Links from the Show: Get tickets for MicroConf Europe in Dubrovnik, Croatia (before August 15th) TinySeed Christopher Gimmer (@cgimmer) | X Episode 480 | Stairstepping Your Way to SaaS with Christopher Gimmer Seeking Scale If you have questions about starting or scaling a software business that you’d like for us to cover, please submit your question for an upcoming episode. We’d love to hear from you! Subscribe & Review: iTunes | Spotify

In episode 723, Rob Walling interviews Charles Duhigg, a Pulitzer Prize-winning journalist and bestselling author, about the significance of effective communication for founders. They discuss practical advice on recognizing different types of conversations, techniques for understanding and transitioning conversations, and how to quickly move past small talk in a conference setting. Episode Sponsor: Hiring senior developers can really move the needle in your business, but if you bring on the wrong person, you can quickly burn through your runway. If you need help finding a vetted, senior, results-oriented developer, you should reach out to today’s sponsor, Lemon.io. For years, they’ve been helping our audience find high quality, global talent at competitive rates, and they can help you too. Longtime listener Chaz Yoon, hired a senior developer from Lemon.io and said his hire ”definitely knew his stuff, provided appropriate feedback and pushback, and had great communication, including very fluent English. He really exceeded my expectations.” Chaz said he’d definitely use Lemon.io again when he’s looking for a senior level engineer. To learn more and get a 15% discount on your first four weeks of working with a developer at lemon.io/startups. Topics we cover: 2:42 – What’s a “super communicator?” 4:35 – Getting better at being a great communicator 8:10 – Identifying the types of conversations you are having 11:31 – Transitioning between different types of conversations 16:51 – Advice for introverts engaging in deep conversations with new people 22:01 – How to quickly improve small talk 27:22 – Non-verbal communication has slightly different rules Links from the Show: MicroConf Connect Charles Duhigg (@cduhigg) | X Charles Duhigg’s website Supercommunicators by Charles Duhigg The Power of Habit by Charles Duhigg Smarter, Faster, Better by Charles Duhigg Crucial Conversations by Joseph Grenny et. al If you have questions about starting or scaling a software business that you’d like for us to cover, please submit your question for an upcoming episode. We’d love to hear from you! Subscribe & Review: iTunes | Spotify

In episode 722, Rob Walling interviews James Mooring, co-founder of Astalty, a SaaS serving Australia's NDIS market. James reveals how they bootstrapped from zero to seven figures in just 18 months and then they explore the strategic decisions, clever pricing, and deep industry knowledge that propelled Astalty's remarkable growth, proving their success was far more than just a lucky break. Episode Sponsor: If you need help hiring great talent from Latin America and the Philippines, but don’t want to pay ongoing recruitment fees, check out Outwork Staffing. Outwork Staffing can help you hire customer support, virtual assistants, developers - or whoever you need! You pay a one-time hiring fee after they find your ideal candidate, and that’s it- there’s no additional costs, even if your new hire stays for years. If your new hire doesn’t work out, Outwork Staffing will find you a replacement, free of charge within the first 6 months of their employment. They also provide coaching to help you find, manage, and grow your global team efficiently. Visit outworkstaffing.com/startups to book a call and get $500 off your first placement by mentioning Startups For the Rest of Us. Topics we cover: 2:44 – NDIS software for providers of disability care 4:23 – Astalty’s rapid growth 6:34 – Finding success with a strong co-founder pairing 8:39 – Deciding to tailor the Astalty MVP 12:25 – Building a free Chrome extension, smart or lucky? 17:18 – Launching a paid plan and nailing the pricing 21:57 – Explosive word of mouth growth 25:19 – Selling at in-person events and in Facebook groups 31:02 – A clever way of raising prices 35:00 – Learning from fast iteration Links from the Show: The SaaS Playbook TinySeed James Mooring | LinkedIn Astalty How Ben Chestnut Bootstrapped Mailchimp to a $12 Billion Exit Question & Answer with Jason Fried, Co-Founder, Basecamp – MicroConf Growth 2019 If you have questions about starting or scaling a software business that you’d like for us to cover, please submit your question for an upcoming episode. We’d love to hear from you! Subscribe & Review: iTunes | Spotify

In episode 721, Rob Walling and Asia Orangio analyze the results of MicroConf’s 2024 State of Independent SaaS Report. They share their key takeaways including the impact of business models on growth, requiring credit cards for free trials, and how the number of founders affects performance. Additionally, they delve into growth by target markets and the data behind bootstrapped SaaS companies taking funding. To get your copy of the full report, head to stateofindiesaas.com. Topics we cover: 2:03 – The State of Independent SaaS Report 7:36 – Requiring a credit card upfront 10:27 – Three founders perform best 14:31 – Free trials and credit cards 19:11 – Average growth by target market 22:46 – Plans for outside funding 25:10 – Credit cards, trials, and churn 32:10 – Advertising channels that are working Links from the Show: Download the State of Independent SaaS Report Subscribe to the MicroConf YouTube channel TinySeed Rob Walling (@RobWalling) | X Asia Orangio (@AsiaOrangio) | X DemandMaven If you have questions about starting or scaling a software business that you’d like for us to cover, please submit your question for an upcoming episode. We’d love to hear from you! Subscribe & Review: iTunes | Spotify

In episode 720, Rob Walling is joined by Craig Hewitt to discuss the intricacies of prioritization in both business and in life. In addition to running Castos, Craig has started coaching founders in sales and marketing, and describes how he strives to focus on the right things. They talk about buying back their time, creating family-focused time, and share their solo podcasting experience after previously having co-hosts. Episode Sponsor: If you need help hiring great talent from Latin America and the Philippines, but don’t want to pay ongoing recruitment fees, check out Outwork Staffing. Outwork Staffing can help you hire customer support, virtual assistants, developers - or whoever you need! You pay a one-time hiring fee after they find your ideal candidate, and that’s it- there’s no additional costs, even if your new hire stays for years. If your new hire doesn’t work out, Outwork Staffing will find you a replacement, free of charge within the first 6 months of their employment. They also provide coaching to help you find, manage, and grow your global team efficiently. Visit outworkstaffing.com/startups to book a call and get $500 off your first placement by mentioning Startups For the Rest of Us. Topics we cover: 3:34 – Prioritizing marketing growth and work-life balance outside of work 7:07 – Buying back your time and optimizing for convenience 10:08 – Identifying the right things to work on with coaches and masterminds 19:42 – Making fewer, bigger decisions as a founder 22:01 – Making intentional family-focused time 30:03 – How Craig started his coaching 36:11 – Podcasting with co-hosts vs. podcasting solo Links from the Show: MicroConf Connect TinySeed Craig Hewitt (@TheCraigHewitt) | X Castos Rogue Startups Craig’s Founder Insights Newsletter 718 | When to Give Up, Open Source Competition, Painful Features, and More (with Derrick Reimer) Episode 644 | Buying Back Your Time with Dan Martell Buy Back Your Time by Dan Martell Zirtual Buying The Future by Craig Hewitt The MicroConf YouTube Channel W...

In episode 719, join Rob Walling as he embarks on another solo adventure, tackling listener questions. He discusses how to test pricing, addresses the pitfalls of one-time payments vs. SaaS, and he reflects on “building something for everyone.” He wraps up with advice on making better recommendations. Episode Sponsor: We have been partnering with Lemon.io for several years, and they’ve proven to be a great choice when it comes to hiring for a highly skilled developer to work on your project. Here are five reasons why you should consider working with Lemon.io. The time from your request to getting a candidate is just 48 hours. Developers have previously worked with tech giants such as Apple, Google, Netflix, Airbnb, Intel, and LEGO. They only provide senior devs, with an average of 7 years' experience. Their talent pool covers more than 300 dev languages & frameworks. Your hire comes with a zero-risk, replacement guarantee. Customers of Lemon.io typically stick around for at least a year, proving they know how to gain your trust by delivering consistent results. Quit wasting time searching for a solid developer at a great price. Get in touch with Lemon.io. As a bonus for our podcast listeners, you’ll get a 15% discount on your first four weeks of working with a developer at lemon.io/startups. That’s lemon.io/startups Topics we cover: 0:58 – Testing different prices for your product 8:12 – One-time or lifetime payments 15:02 – Horizontal products, building something for everyone 21:43 – Making descriptive recommendations Links from the Show: 718 | When to Give Up, Open Source Competition, Painful Features, and More (with Derrick Reimer) TinySeed Building & Scaling Products: Lessons Learned from Four Years and 8,000 Customers – Des Traynor Shoe Dog by Phil Knight Sid Meier's Memoir! by Sid Meier Masters of Doom by David Kushner Doom Guy by John Romero The Ultimate Sales Machine by Chet Holmes If you have questions about starting or scaling a software business that you’d like for us to cover, please submit your question for an upcoming episode. We’d love to hear from you! Subscribe & Review: iTunes |

In episode 718, Rob Walling and Derrick Reimer tackle listener questions about giving up on ideas, competing in crowded markets, and developing painful features. They also chat about SavvyCal’s recent design refresh, finding founder-market fit, and whether Derrick has retired from podcasting. Episode Sponsor: Is your outsourced development team dropping the ball? Maybe you’ve worked with a team that just couldn't grasp your vision and needed constant oversight because they weren’t thinking strategically. Or maybe you ended up wasting hours micromanaging, often needing to jump on late-night calls across massive time zone differences to get alignment. And in the end, they delivered a sluggish app with a frustrating UI that didn’t come close to the solution you had envisioned. If any of that sounds familiar, you need to reach out to our sponsor - DevSquad. DevSquad provides an entire development team packed with top talent from Latin America. Your elite squad will include between 2 to 6 Full Stack Developers, a technical product manager, plus experts in product strategy, UI/UX design, DevOps, and QA - all working together to make your SaaS Product a success. You can ramp up an entire product team fast, in your timezone, and at rates 75% cheaper than a comparable US-based team. And with DevSquad, you pay month to month with no long-term contracts. Get the committed, responsive development team that your business deserves. Visit DevSquad.com/startups and get 10% off the first three months of your engagement. Topics we cover: 3:59 – Which feature felt harder and took longer than imagined? 9:14 – When is time to give up on a SaaS idea and move on? 17:51 – Finding customers in crowded markets with large incumbents 23:32 – Has Derrick officially retired from podcasting? 25:57 – Handling competitors that are copying differentiating product features 28:48 – Evaluating SavvyCal’s refreshed design 31:10 – Considering vertical vs. horizontal SaaS for SavvyCal 34:05 – Why did Derrick decide to pursue the idea for SavvyCal? 40:19 – Finding “founder-fit” Links from the Show: The SaaS Playbook by Rob Walling TinySeed Derrick Remier (​​@derrickreimer) | X SavvyCal Group scheduling mode The Build In Public Podcast The Art of Product Podcast 8 B2B Marketing Strategies That Got My Startup to $10 Million (and 1 that FAILED) Finding My Next Bootstrapped Business Idea If you have questions about starting or scaling a software business that you’d like for us to cover, please

In episode 717, Rob Walling interviews Marie Martin, co-founder of Tally. They discuss the company’s journey to $1.3M ARR and the unusual pricing strategy that got them there. Marie details how they keep their support volume low, how they differentiate Tally from other form builders, and how they grew to over 300,000 free users. Episode Sponsor: We have been partnering with Lemon.io for several years, and they’ve proven to be a great choice when it comes to hiring for a highly skilled developer to work on your project. Here are five reasons why you should consider working with Lemon.io. The time from your request to getting a candidate is just 48 hours. Developers have previously worked with tech giants such as Apple, Google, Netflix, Airbnb, Intel, and LEGO. They only provide senior devs, with an average of 7 years' experience. Their talent pool covers more than 300 dev languages & frameworks. Your hire comes with a zero-risk, replacement guarantee. Customers of Lemon.io typically stick around for at least a year, proving they know how to gain your trust by delivering consistent results. Quit wasting time searching for a solid developer at a great price. Get in touch with Lemon.io. As a bonus for our podcast listeners, you’ll get a 15% discount on your first four weeks of working with a developer at lemon.io/startups. That’s lemon.io/startups Topics we cover: 2:22 – Where Tally is today 3:53 – Keeping customer support volume low 7:12 – Differentiating Tally from other form builders 10:55 – The ingredients needed to make “free” work 18:31 – ”Shrinking a Market” 24:27 – Growing to 300,000+ free users 26:47 – Dealing with bad actors 29:37 – Applying the learnings from Tally’s success Links from the Show: Tickets for MicroConf Europe | Oct 6 - 8, 2024, Dubrovnik, Croatia Apply for MicroConf Masterminds before June 12th 2024 Marie Martens (@MarieMartens) | X Tally No-Code France TinySeed If you have questions about starting or scaling a software business that you’d like for us to cover, please submit your question for an upcoming episode. We’d love to hear from you! Subscribe & Review: iTunes | Spotify | Google<...

In episode 716, join Rob Walling for another solo adventure where he answers listener questions. He shares how he would position against incumbents, when to change an H1, and how choosing a tech stack affects your business valuation. Rob also weighs whether to skip a “Step 1” or “Step 2” business and start directly with a standalone SaaS in the Stair Step Method of Bootstrapping. Episode Sponsor: Is your outsourced development team dropping the ball? Maybe you’ve worked with a team that just couldn't grasp your vision and needed constant oversight because they weren’t thinking strategically. Or maybe you ended up wasting hours micromanaging, often needing to jump on late-night calls across massive time zone differences to get alignment. And in the end, they delivered a sluggish app with a frustrating UI that didn’t come close to the solution you had envisioned. If any of that sounds familiar, you need to reach out to our sponsor - DevSquad. DevSquad provides an entire development team packed with top talent from Latin America. Your elite squad will include between 2 to 6 Full Stack Developers, a technical product manager, plus experts in product strategy, UI/UX design, DevOps, and QA - all working together to make your SaaS Product a success. You can ramp up an entire product team fast, in your timezone, and at rates 75% cheaper than a comparable US-based team. And with DevSquad, you pay month to month with no long-term contracts. Get the committed, responsive development team that your business deserves. Visit DevSquad.com/startups and get 10% off the first three months of your engagement. Topics we cover: 4:07 – How directly should I position my product against incumbents? 8:25 – Making and testing changes to your H1 12:22 – Identifying and qualifying niches based on traffic 18:07 – Should I skip a “Step 1” or “Step 2” business to start a SaaS? 20:16 – How a tech stack affects valuations 27:29 – Differentiating between B2B and B2C Links from the Show: Apply for MicroConf Masterminds before June 12th 2024 Ask a Question on SFTROU Episode 673 | Lifetime Plans vs Subscriptions, Testing an Idea With a Landing Page, and More Listener Questions Start Small Stay Small by Rob Walling The SaaS Playbook by Rob Walling The Stair Step Method of Bootstrapping Similarweb Vertical SaaS vs Horizontal SaaS - Which is More Profitable? If you have questions about starting or scaling a software business that you’d like for us to cover, please

In episode 715, Rob Walling is joined by Dr. Sherry Walling to discuss a variety of topics. They chat about two recent and meaningful interactions made possible by the Internet, the motivations behind organizing and performing a circus show, and they chat about upcoming launches on the horizon – new books and courses for SaaS founders. Episode Sponsor: We have been partnering with Lemon.io for several years, and they’ve proven to be a great choice when it comes to hiring for a highly skilled developer to work on your project. Here are five reasons why you should consider working with Lemon.io. The time from your request to getting a candidate is just 48 hours. Developers have previously worked with tech giants such as Apple, Google, Netflix, Airbnb, Intel, and LEGO. They only provide senior devs, with an average of 7 years' experience. Their talent pool covers more than 300 dev languages & frameworks. Your hire comes with a zero-risk, replacement guarantee. Customers of Lemon.io typically stick around for at least a year, proving they know how to gain your trust by delivering consistent results. Quit wasting time searching for a solid developer at a great price. Get in touch with Lemon.io. As a bonus for our podcast listeners, you’ll get a 15% discount on your first four weeks of working with a developer at lemon.io/startups. That’s lemon.io/startups Topics we cover: 4:00 – Examples of thoughtful, nuanced Internet interactions 8:12 – Impacting people you otherwise couldn’t online 15:12 – Dr. Sherry Walling’s circus show motivation 21:53 – The psychology of business exits 25:27 – Commonalities across founders considering exits 31:11 – Speaking to the whole lifecycle of a SaaS business Links from the Show: Apply for MicroConf Masterminds before June 12th 2024 Sherry Walling (@sherrywalling) | X Sherry Walling (@dr.sherrywalling) | Instagram TinySeed Discretion Capital Before The Exit by Dan Andrews Episode 532 | The Art of Selling Your Business with John Warrillow The Entrepreneur’s Guide to Keeping Your Sh*t Together by Sherry Walling, PhD and Rob Walling Enter your email at Robwalling.com Sign up for the Zen Founder newsletter If you have questions ab...

In episode 714, join Rob Walling for another solo adventure where he answers listener questions. He talks about what to expect when acquiring a competitor and how he might integrate their business. Rob also covers navigating HIPAA compliance as a bootstrapper, how to find a developer co-founder, and he explores the concept of Total Reachable Market (TRM). Episode Sponsor: Is your outsourced development team dropping the ball? Maybe you’ve worked with a team that just couldn't grasp your vision and needed constant oversight because they weren’t thinking strategically. Or maybe you ended up wasting hours micromanaging, often needing to jump on late-night calls across massive time zone differences to get alignment. And in the end, they delivered a sluggish app with a frustrating UI that didn’t come close to the solution you had envisioned. If any of that sounds familiar, you need to reach out to our sponsor - DevSquad. DevSquad provides an entire development team packed with top talent from Latin America. Your elite squad will include between 2 to 6 Full Stack Developers, a technical product manager, plus experts in product strategy, UI/UX design, DevOps, and QA - all working together to make your SaaS Product a success. You can ramp up an entire product team fast, in your timezone, and at rates 75% cheaper than a comparable US-based team. And with DevSquad, you pay month to month with no long-term contracts. Get the committed, responsive development team that your business deserves. Visit DevSquad.com/startups and get 10% off the first three months of your engagement. Topics we cover: 3:45 – How to navigate acquiring a competitor 6:34 – How to transition the newly acquired customers into your product 9:58 – HIPAA compliance for a bootstrapped MVP 13:07 – Total Addressable Market (TAM) vs. Total Reachable Market (TRM) 19:01 – How do I find a developer co-founder? 28:03 – Can I find data on SaaS app store spending? Links from the Show: MicroConf Mastermind Program TinySeed MicroConf Connect The SaaS Playbook by Rob Walling Start Small Stay Small by Rob Walling If you have questions about starting or scaling a software business that you’d like for us to cover, please submit your question for an upcoming episode. We’d love to hear from you! Subscribe & Review: iTunes | Spotify | Google

In episode 713, Rob Walling is joined by Arvid Kahl to share their experience from MicroConf US 2024 in Atlanta. They each discuss their top 5 moments, ranging from Dr. Sherry Walling’s talk on motivation to Ben Chestnut’s chat with Rob onstage. They agree that there’s nothing quite like being in the room with everyone and soaking in all the interactions outside of the official talks. If you missed the event and had some MicroConf FOMO, make sure to sign up for our email list to be notified when the tickets for our next event go on sale.! Click here to watch Rob’s Fireside Chat with Ben Chestnut! Episode Sponsor: We have been partnering with Lemon.io for several years, and they’ve proven to be a great choice when it comes to hiring for a highly skilled developer to work on your project. Here are five reasons why you should consider working with Lemon.io. The time from your request to getting a candidate is just 48 hours. Developers have previously worked with tech giants such as Apple, Google, Netflix, Airbnb, Intel, and LEGO. They only provide senior devs, with an average of 7 years' experience. Their talent pool covers more than 300 dev languages & frameworks. Your hire comes with a zero-risk, replacement guarantee. Customers of Lemon.io typically stick around for at least a year, proving they know how to gain your trust by delivering consistent results. Quit wasting time searching for a solid developer at a great price. Get in touch with Lemon.io. As a bonus for our podcast listeners, you’ll get a 15% discount on your first four weeks of working with a developer at lemon.io/startups. That’s lemon.io/startups Topics we cover: 1:05 – Key takeaways from MicroConf 2024 3:45 – Dr. Sherry Walling’s talk on motivation 7:02 – Stephen Steer’s sales scripts talk 9:25 – Live valuation of a business by Quiet Light Brokerage 12:23 – Micro excursions that allow founders to connect with one another 14:09 – The hallway track outside of the venue 15:53 – ”Nothing beats being in a room” 19:22 – Lack of hierarchy among founders 22:38 – Lianna Patch’s copywriting swipe file 23:50 – Ben Chestnut is just like one of us 29:50 – Don’t get stuck with MicroConf FOMO Links from the Show: MicroConf Europe | Dubrovnik - October 6 - 8, 2024 MicroConf US 2025 Waiting List Arvid Kahl (@arvidkahl) | X The Entrepreneur’s Guide to Keeping Your Sh*t Together by Sherry Walling, PhD and Rob Walling Sherry Walling (@sherrywalling) | X

In episode 712, join Rob Walling for another solo adventure. He starts by revisiting past predictions and provides an update on how he successfully staved off full burnout. Rob then gives updates on this podcast, the progress of TinySeed and MicroConf, and teases two new books that he’s working on. Episode Sponsor: Is your outsourced development team dropping the ball? Maybe you’ve worked with a team that just couldn't grasp your vision and needed constant oversight because they weren’t thinking strategically. Or maybe you ended up wasting hours micromanaging, often needing to jump on late-night calls across massive time zone differences to get alignment. And in the end, they delivered a sluggish app with a frustrating UI that didn’t come close to the solution you had envisioned. If any of that sounds familiar, you need to reach out to our sponsor - DevSquad. DevSquad provides an entire development team packed with top talent from Latin America. Your elite squad will include between 2 to 6 Full Stack Developers, a technical product manager, plus experts in product strategy, UI/UX design, DevOps, and QA - all working together to make your SaaS Product a success. You can ramp up an entire product team fast, in your timezone, and at rates 75% cheaper than a comparable US-based team. And with DevSquad, you pay month to month with no long-term contracts. Get the committed, responsive development team that your business deserves. Visit DevSquad.com/startups and get 10% off the first three months of your engagement. Topics we cover: 1:21 – Revisiting past predictions and reporting back on burnout 2:45 – Revisiting predictions for SaaS bootstrappers in 2024 5:29 – Twitter changes hands in 2024? 6:29 – Reducing travel to quell burnout on the horizon 11:45 – State of Startups For the Rest of Us 14:40 – TinySeed invested in over 170+ companies 17:54 – First annual TinyFest 18:42 – TinySeed Tales Season 5 19:50 – The SaaS Playbook and my next two books Links from the Show: MicroConf Connect TinySeed The SaaS Playbook by Rob Walling Start Small Stay Small by Rob Walling Episode 697 | 7 Predictions for SaaS Bootstrappers in 2024 Vertical SaaS vs Horizontal SaaS - Which is More Profitable? State of Independent SaaS MicroConf Mastermind Program TinyFest Unwrapped: Inside Our First-Ever Founder Conference and Retreat in Cancun

In episode 711, join Rob Walling and Ruben Gamez as they answer listener questions. They chat about finding early customers without an audience, how to approach horizontal vs. vertical product spinoffs, and some considerations for No Code development. They also discuss the challenges of serving prosumer SaaS, the importance of understanding customer segments for pricing strategies, and the dual funnel approach for catering to different customer tiers. Episode Sponsor: We have been partnering with Lemon.io for several years, and they’ve proven to be a great choice when it comes to hiring for a highly skilled developer to work on your project. Here are five reasons why you should consider working with Lemon.io. The time from your request to getting a candidate is just 48 hours. Developers have previously worked with tech giants such as Apple, Google, Netflix, Airbnb, Intel, and LEGO. They only provide senior devs, with an average of 7 years' experience. Their talent pool covers more than 300 dev languages & frameworks. Your hire comes with a zero-risk, replacement guarantee. Customers of Lemon.io typically stick around for at least a year, proving they know how to gain your trust by delivering consistent results. Quit wasting time searching for a solid developer at a great price. Get in touch with Lemon.io. As a bonus for our podcast listeners, you’ll get a 15% discount on your first four weeks of working with a developer at lemon.io/startups. That’s lemon.io/startups Topics we cover: 2:00 – Strategies for finding your first users when you don’t have an audience 10:42 – Positioning yourself to compete well against others 12:25 – Jumping into SEO before having a product 18:42 – Exporting No Code projects 24:15 – Choosing between a vertical or horizontal product spinoff 33:55 – Building a B2P, “business to prosumer” product 42:53 – How to make lower pricing tiers work outside of B2B Links from the Show: MicroConf Connect Ruben Gamez (@@earthlingworks) | X SignWell TinySeed Bubble MicroConf YouTube channel State of Independent SaaS Episode 216 | How a Single Founder Launched a 7-Figure SaaS App (with Nate Grahek) Sticky Castos...

In episode 710, join Rob Walling for another solo adventure where he answers listener questions. He answers whether you need a burning passion to be successful in entrepreneurship, and how that relates to developing a product alongside a day job. Rob also discusses competing against VC-backed companies, learning to code in the age of AI, and how much risk lies in IP theft when building your SaaS. Episode Sponsor: Is your outsourced development team dropping the ball? Maybe you’ve worked with a team that just couldn't grasp your vision and needed constant oversight because they weren’t thinking strategically. Or maybe you ended up wasting hours micromanaging, often needing to jump on late-night calls across massive time zone differences to get alignment. And in the end, they delivered a sluggish app with a frustrating UI that didn’t come close to the solution you had envisioned. If any of that sounds familiar, you need to reach out to our sponsor - DevSquad. DevSquad provides an entire development team packed with top talent from Latin America. Your elite squad will include between 2 to 6 Full Stack Developers, a technical product manager, plus experts in product strategy, UI/UX design, DevOps, and QA - all working together to make your SaaS Product a success. You can ramp up an entire product team fast, in your timezone, and at rates 75% cheaper than a comparable US-based team. And with DevSquad, you pay month to month with no long-term contracts. Get the committed, responsive development team that your business deserves. Visit DevSquad.com/startups and get 10% off the first three months of your engagement. Topics we cover: 3:00 – Reacting to needing a burning desire for entrepreneurship 5:20 – Maintaining a day job to enable space for entrepreneurial pursuits 8:52 – Balancing build speed vs. scalability with your tech stack 10:30 – The April Fools Episode 12:55 – Competing against VC-backed companies in a “hot” space 18:34 – Is learning to code dead? 27:33 – Risk in SaaS of IP theft Links from the Show: MicroConf Connect Episode 704 | Landing Pages, Buying a SaaS, the Right Tech Stack, and More Listener Questions Episode 706.5 | Rethinking My Most Common Advice The SaaS Playbook by Rob Walling Start Small Stay Small by Rob Walling TinySeed Episode 688 | Growing Boot.dev From $6k to $110k in Monthly Revenue in 15 Months Ask a Question on SFTROU If you have questions about st...

In episode 709, join Rob Walling for a solo adventure as he shares his story of growing his personal wealth over the past few decades. Selling companies was the major driver of wealth, but he also explores the role of cryptocurrency, running profitable companies, and angel investing. Rob emphasizes the power of entrepreneurship in achieving financial freedom, while acknowledging there are ways to do so while keeping risk relatively low. Episode Sponsor: We have been partnering with Lemon.io for several years, and they’ve proven to be a great choice when it comes to hiring for a highly skilled developer to work on your project. Here are five reasons why you should consider working with Lemon.io. The time from your request to getting a candidate is just 48 hours. Developers have previously worked with tech giants such as Apple, Google, Netflix, Airbnb, Intel, and LEGO. They only provide senior devs, with an average of 7 years' experience. Their talent pool covers more than 300 dev languages & frameworks. Your hire comes with a zero-risk, replacement guarantee. Customers of Lemon.io typically stick around for at least a year, proving they know how to gain your trust by delivering consistent results. Quit wasting time searching for a solid developer at a great price. Get in touch with Lemon.io. As a bonus for our podcast listeners, you’ll get a 15% discount on your first four weeks of working with a developer at lemon.io/startups. That’s lemon.io/startups Topics we cover: 2:50 – A lesson on how to build wealth 4:31 – Entrepreneurship was our biggest tool 6:37 – Building, acquiring, then selling companies 10:45 – Building slowly while staying risk-averse 13:27 – Investing in riskier assets like cryptocurrency 19:39 – Running profitable companies 20:56 – Angel investing, and WP Engine 23:44 – Traditional, salaried employment 24:53 – Typical investments: stocks, bonds, REITs 27:36 – Real estate investing Links from the Show: MicroConf Connect Christopher Gimmer (@cgimmer) | X Christopher’s tweet Sherry Walling (@sherrywalling) | X The Stair Step Method of Bootstrapping Start Small Stay Small by Rob Walling This Took 11 Years to Be An "Overnight Success" - SaaS Exit Strategy Zen Founder The SaaS Playbook by Rob Walling WP Engine TinySeed Barbell Strategy Explained for Stock and Bond Investors If you have questions about starting or scaling a software business that you’d like for us to cover, please submit your question for an upcoming episode. We’d love to hear from you! Subscr...

In episode 708, Rob Walling and Derrick Reimer tackle listener questions about building development skills vs. business skills and strategies for entering competitive markets. They also chat about building on top of AI services, addressing the risks of platform dependency and the importance of managing infrastructure costs. Episode Sponsor: Is your outsourced development team dropping the ball? Maybe you’ve worked with a team that just couldn't grasp your vision and needed constant oversight because they weren’t thinking strategically. Or maybe you ended up wasting hours micromanaging, often needing to jump on late-night calls across massive time zone differences to get alignment. And in the end, they delivered a sluggish app with a frustrating UI that didn’t come close to the solution you had envisioned. If any of that sounds familiar, you need to reach out to our sponsor - DevSquad. DevSquad provides an entire development team packed with top talent from Latin America. Your elite squad will include between 2 to 6 Full Stack Developers, a technical product manager, plus experts in product strategy, UI/UX design, DevOps, and QA - all working together to make your SaaS Product a success. You can ramp up an entire product team fast, in your timezone, and at rates 75% cheaper than a comparable US-based team. And with DevSquad, you pay month to month with no long-term contracts. Get the committed, responsive development team that your business deserves. Visit DevSquad.com/startups and get 10% off the first three months of your engagement. Topics we cover: 02:38 - Should you build technical skills or business skills? 11:41- Entering a competitive market 21:14 - Building a valuable analytics dashboard tool 29:29 - When should a solo founder hire for marketing roles? 36:29 - The rare skillset of a full-stack marketer 38:18 - Implications of building on openAI and scaling infrastructure costs Links from the Show: Register for MicroConf US in Atlanta, April 2024 Rob Walling | X Derrick Reimer | X Derrick Reimer SavvyCal Start Small Stay Small by Rob Walling The SaaS Playbook by Rob Walling Devin AI If you have questions about starting or scaling a software business that you’d like for us to cover, please submit your question for an upcoming episode. We’d love to hear from you! Subscribe & Review: iTunes | Spotify

In episode 707, Rob Walling, alongside guests Tracy Osborn and Einar Vollset, give their hot takes on some recent news in the world of SaaS. They discuss Once.com’s launch, liquidation preference nuances in startup buyouts, with moving from open source to full time income and more. Episode Sponsor: Find your perfect developer or a team at Lemon.io/startups The competition for incredible engineers and developers has never been more fierce. Lemon.io helps you cut through the noise and find great talent through its network of engineers in Europe and Latin America. They take care of the vetting, interviewing, and testing of candidates to make sure that you are working with someone who can hit the ground running. When it comes to hiring, the time it takes to write your job description, list the position, review resumes, schedule interviews, and make an offer can take weeks, if not months. With Lemon.io, you can cut down on a lot of that time by tapping into their wide network of developers who can get started in as early as a week. And for subscribers of Startups For the Rest of Us, you can get 15% off your first 4 week contract with a developer by visiting lemon.io/startups Topics we cover: 2:18 - Once.com and the Implications of One-Time Software Sales 10:39 - Liquidation Preferences in Startup Acquisitions 21:59 - Turning an open source project into a business 24:32 - Book recommendations 30:30 - Is building a startup actually hard? 32:46 - Startups vs. lifestyle businesses Links from the Show: Register for MicroConf US in Atlanta, April 2024 Once.com Campfire Venture Deals: Be Smarter Than Your Lawyer and Venture Capitalist by Brad Feld Never Split the Difference by Chris Voss The Anomaly by Herv Le Tellier The Art of Learning by Josh Waitzkin The Beginning of Infinity by David Deutsch TinySeed Einar Vollset (@EinarVollset) | X Tracy Osborn (@itsTracyMakes) | TikTok If you have questions about starting or scaling a software business that you’d like for us to cover, please submit your question for an upcoming episode. We’d love to hear from you! Subscribe & Review: iTunes | Spotify | Google

In episode 706.5, join Rob Walling as he reconsiders some of his most common advice. He explores why lowering prices might make sense and discusses the benefits of a B2C business model. Rob also walks back his prior advice on bootstrapping two-sided marketplaces and launching multiple products to see what sticks. Topics we cover: 1:04 – What would happen if you lowered prices? 3:56 – Benefits of a B2C approach 7:05 – Two-sided marketplaces allow to reach two audiences 8:47 – Launch a bunch of products to see what sticks 10:52 – This episode was released April 1, 2024 Links from the Show: The SaaS Playbook Rob Walling (@robwalling) | X If you have questions about starting or scaling a software business that you’d like for us to cover, please submit your question for an upcoming episode. We’d love to hear from you! Subscribe & Review: iTunes | Spotify | Google

MicroConf US in Atlanta is here in just a couple weeks, and this is your last call to buy tickets. We've sold more than 90% of the tickets, and we will sell this event out as we have for many years. The event is April 21st through the 23rd in Atlanta, Georgia at the amazing Starling Atlanta. There are going to be 200-ish of your closest bootstrapped and mostly bootstrapped founder friends who are showing up to hear talks from folks like Rand Fishkin of SparkToro, Asia Orangio of DemandMaven. I'm giving a talk as well, and Dr. Sherry Walling will be talking about staying motivated as an entrepreneur. We have a special guest MC, Lianna Patch, and we'll have a very special guest who has never appeared on the MicroConf stage before- Ben Chestnut, the co-founder of MailChimp. Get all the details and secure your ticket before they run out at microconf.com/americas.

In episode 706, join Rob Walling for a solo adventure where he discusses a variety of topics. He starts with why it’s important to both consider and credit “prior art” in business. Rob outlines his 2/20/200 idea validation framework used to repeatedly evaluate ideas. He also covers why, though there are some advantages, designing by committee has some significant downsides. Episode Sponsor: Is your outsourced development team dropping the ball? Maybe you’ve worked with a team that just couldn't grasp your vision and needed constant oversight because they weren’t thinking strategically. Or maybe you ended up wasting hours micromanaging, often needing to jump on late-night calls across massive time zone differences to get alignment. And in the end, they delivered a sluggish app with a frustrating UI that didn’t come close to the solution you had envisioned. If any of that sounds familiar, you need to reach out to our sponsor - DevSquad. DevSquad provides an entire development team packed with top talent from Latin America. Your elite squad will include between 2 to 6 Full Stack Developers, a technical product manager, plus experts in product strategy, UI/UX design, DevOps, and QA - all working together to make your SaaS Product a success. You can ramp up an entire product team fast, in your timezone, and at rates 75% cheaper than a comparable US-based team. And with DevSquad, you pay month to month with no long-term contracts. Get the committed, responsive development team that your business deserves. Visit DevSquad.com/startups and get 10% off the first three months of your engagement. Topics we cover: 2:37 – Learning from, and crediting, prior art 10:27 – The 2/20/200 Idea Validation Framework 16:03 – Be wary when designing by committee 21:09 – When to crowdsource feedback Links from the Show: Register for MicroConf US in Atlanta, April 2024 Do Things That Don’t Scale by Paul Graham David Sacks (@DavidSacks) | X Hackers and Painters by Paul Graham Episode 705 | From Bootstrapped to Mostly Bootstrapped Episode 628 | The 5 P.M. Idea Validation Framework Use This PROVEN Formula to Validate Your Next Startup Idea Validate Your SaaS Idea FAST (Step-by-Step SaaS Validation Process)✅ Start Small Stay Small by Rob Walling Metallica: Some Kind of Monster If you have questions about starting or scaling a software business that you’d like for us to cover, please submit your question for an upcoming episode. We’d love to hear from you! Subscribe & Review: iTunes | Spotify | Google

In episode 705, Rob Walling interviews Braden Dennis, co-founder and CEO of FinChat. They discuss Braden’s journey going from fully bootstrapped, all the way to taking venture capital as FinChat scaled. Braden shares his experience in initially launching to an audience, how they successfully launched a second product, and how FinChat operates well with multiple co-founders. Episode Sponsor: Find your perfect developer or a team at Lemon.io/startups The competition for incredible engineers and developers has never been more fierce. Lemon.io helps you cut through the noise and find great talent through its network of engineers in Europe and Latin America. They take care of the vetting, interviewing, and testing of candidates to make sure that you are working with someone who can hit the ground running. When it comes to hiring, the time it takes to write your job description, list the position, review resumes, schedule interviews, and make an offer can take weeks, if not months. With Lemon.io, you can cut down on a lot of that time by tapping into their wide network of developers who can get started in as early as a week. And for subscribers of Startups For the Rest of Us, you can get 15% off your first 4 week contract with a developer by visiting lemon.io/startups Topics we cover: 2:55 – What does FinChat look like today? 4:00 – Starting with an audience and building a SaaS 6:40 – Formulating the product and moving upmarket 8:35 – Launching a second product 12:25 – The common pitfall of launching a second product 16:25 – How FinChat found explosive growth 19:27 – Deciding to take venture funding 26:13 – Making hard decisions with incomplete information 30:31 – Working with multiple co-founders Links from the Show: Register for MicroConf US in Atlanta, April 2024 Apply for Director of Marketing and Operations for MicroConf MicroConf YouTube Channel TinySeed Braden Dennis (@BradoCapital) | X FinChat (@finchat_io) | X FinChat Episode 681 | Why Launching a Second Product is Usually a Bad Idea If you have questions about starting or scaling a software business that you’d like for us to cover, please submit your question for an upcoming episode. We’d love to hear from you! Subscribe & Review:

In episode 704, join Rob Walling for another solo adventure where he answers listener questions. He weighs in on buying a SaaS, how to validate ideas using landing pages, and what tech stack to choose. Rob also provides guidance for those considering leaving their comfortable day jobs in favor of being a founder. Episode Sponsor: Is your outsourced development team dropping the ball? Maybe you’ve worked with a team that just couldn't grasp your vision and needed constant oversight because they weren’t thinking strategically. Or maybe you ended up wasting hours micromanaging, often needing to jump on late-night calls across massive time zone differences to get alignment. And in the end, they delivered a sluggish app with a frustrating UI that didn’t come close to the solution you had envisioned. If any of that sounds familiar, you need to reach out to our sponsor - DevSquad. DevSquad provides an entire development team packed with top talent from Latin America. Your elite squad will include between 2 to 6 Full Stack Developers, a technical product manager, plus experts in product strategy, UI/UX design, DevOps, and QA - all working together to make your SaaS Product a success. You can ramp up an entire product team fast, in your timezone, and at rates 75% cheaper than a comparable US-based team. And with DevSquad, you pay month to month with no long-term contracts. Get the committed, responsive development team that your business deserves. Visit DevSquad.com/startups and get 10% off the first three months of your engagement. Topics we cover: 4:00 – Comparing your business to successful outliers 9:50 – Exploring business outside of a comfortable day job 15:45 – Early access landing pages prior to development 20:00 – How do you vet SaaS businesses that you are trying to acquire? 27:16 – Evaluating a seller’s intentions 29:50 – Choosing a tech stack for your SaaS Links from the Show: MicroConf Remote – Early Stage Saas Strategies Register for MicroConf US in Atlanta, April 2024 Apply for Director of Marketing and Operations for MicroConf MicroConf Connect Startups For The Rest of Us – Ask a question 37signals 7 Proven Ways to Create Profitable SaaS Ideas EVERY Time The SaaS Playbook Quiet Light Acquire.com The Stair Step Method of Bootstrapping If you have questions about starting or scaling a software business tha...

In episode 703, Rob Walling interviews Jordan Hansen, founder of Cobalt Intelligence. They dive into Jordan's unexpected journey into SaaS and the growth of his company, which specializes in business verification through API. Jordan reflects on quitting his job to pursue his startup and the benefits of community and mentorship he has received from TinySeed. Episode Sponsor: Find your perfect developer or a team at Lemon.io/startups The competition for incredible engineers and developers has never been more fierce. Lemon.io helps you cut through the noise and find great talent through its network of engineers in Europe and Latin America. They take care of the vetting, interviewing, and testing of candidates to make sure that you are working with someone who can hit the ground running. When it comes to hiring, the time it takes to write your job description, list the position, review resumes, schedule interviews, and make an offer can take weeks, if not months. With Lemon.io, you can cut down on a lot of that time by tapping into their wide network of developers who can get started in as early as a week. And for subscribers of Startups For the Rest of Us, you can get 15% off your first 4 week contract with a developer by visiting lemon.io/startups Topics we cover: 2:30 – What does Cobalt Intelligence offer? 5:45 – Team scale, market, and business origins 9:55 – Starting YouTube and finding motivation to continually publish 13:27 – Working with a savings runway and applying to TinySeed 23:50 – Finding product-market fit 26:58 – Unlisting content to align with business goals 31:50 – “Accidental” SaaS founder Links from the Show: Register for MicroConf US in Atlanta, April 2024 TinySeed The SaaS Playbook Jordan Hansen (@JordBHansen) | X Cobalt Intelligence (@CobaltIntell) | X Cobalt Intelligence Lianna Patch (@punchlinecopy) | X The Stair Step Method of Bootstrapping Soft Skills: The software developer's life manual by John Sonmez Episode 698 | How to Launch a Million Dollar Business (With Noah Kagan)

In episode 702, join Rob Walling for another solo adventure where he answers listener questions. He answers how to introduce friends to bootstrapping, when to lower your prices, and addresses the difference in revenue and profit multiple valuations. Rob also offers advice when weighing a career move versus building side projects and scaling your MVP. Episode Sponsor: Is your outsourced development team dropping the ball? Maybe you’ve worked with a team that just couldn't grasp your vision and needed constant oversight because they weren’t thinking strategically. Or maybe you ended up wasting hours micromanaging, often needing to jump on late-night calls across massive time zone differences to get alignment. And in the end, they delivered a sluggish app with a frustrating UI that didn’t come close to the solution you had envisioned. If any of that sounds familiar, you need to reach out to our sponsor - DevSquad. DevSquad provides an entire development team packed with top talent from Latin America. Your elite squad will include between 2 to 6 Full Stack Developers, a technical product manager, plus experts in product strategy, UI/UX design, DevOps, and QA - all working together to make your SaaS Product a success. You can ramp up an entire product team fast, in your timezone, and at rates 75% cheaper than a comparable US-based team. And with DevSquad, you pay month to month with no long-term contracts. Get the committed, responsive development team that your business deserves. Visit DevSquad.com/startups and get 10% off the first three months of your engagement. Topics we cover: 3:15 – How to introduce friends to entrepreneurship and bootstrapping 6:00 – When to focus on profit vs. top-line revenue 10:40 – Considerations for building, scaling, and differentiating an MVP 15:45 – Rare circumstances where you should lower prices 20:25 – Pursuing career moves vs. building on the side 23:43 – Managing cap tables and equity vesting Links from the Show: MicroConf Remote – Early Stage Saas Strategies TinySeed The Stair Step Method of Bootstrapping Start Small, Stay Small The SaaS Playbook MicroConf YouTube Channel: Building Your First SaaS: The Ultimate Crash Course SFTROU Greatest Hits Episode 222 | The Stair Step Approach to Launching Products What is a SAFE? If you have questions about starting or scaling a software business that you’d like for us to cover, please

In episode 701, Rob Walling interviews Matt Wensing, founder of Summit, a SaaS platform for lead scoring and qualification. Matt shares insights on finding product-market fit, the importance of following customer workflows to get there, and the challenges of marketing and positioning. Rob asks about his choice to raise venture capital, and how keeping a lean team maximizes that opportunity. Episode Sponsor: Find your perfect developer or a team at Lemon.io/startups The competition for incredible engineers and developers has never been more fierce. Lemon.io helps you cut through the noise and find great talent through its network of engineers in Europe and Latin America. They take care of the vetting, interviewing, and testing of candidates to make sure that you are working with someone who can hit the ground running. When it comes to hiring, the time it takes to write your job description, list the position, review resumes, schedule interviews, and make an offer can take weeks, if not months. With Lemon.io, you can cut down on a lot of that time by tapping into their wide network of developers who can get started in as early as a week. And for subscribers of Startups For the Rest of Us, you can get 15% off your first 4 week contract with a developer by visiting lemon.io/startups Topics we cover: 2:27 – “Traveling many H1’s”, refining a target market 5:44 – Moving back to a self-serve model 10:52 – Niching down to achieve stronger product-market fit 12:53 – Tactics that Matt used to achieve traction 16:54 – Lead scoring by behavior and persona-fit 19:20 – Scoring as a whole product vs. as only a feature 23:31 – Pursuing VC with a lean team 29:09 – Who is your ideal customer profile? Links from the Show: Apply for Tinyseed Feb 12th through Feb 25th MicroConf Remote – Early Stage Saas Strategies Matt Wensing (@mattwensing) | X Summit Episode 696 | The Truth about Product-Market Fit + Doing Sales as an Introvert (With Ruben Gamez) Out of Beta Episode 633 | Building SaaS Plus a Two-Sided Marketplace The SaaS Playbook "How I Sold My SaaS in An 8-Figure Exit" with Matt Wensing If you have questions about starting or scaling a software business that you’d like for us to cover, please

In episode 700, Rob goes solo to celebrate another milestone of Startups For the Rest of Us. He reflects on playing the long game and doing so publicly enough to create larger luck surface area. He also emphasizes building skills in the process, and highlights several founders who have done this well. Episode Sponsor: Is your outsourced development team dropping the ball? Maybe you’ve worked with a team that just couldn't grasp your vision and needed constant oversight because they weren’t thinking strategically. Or maybe you ended up wasting hours micromanaging, often needing to jump on late-night calls across massive time zone differences to get alignment. And in the end, they delivered a sluggish app with a frustrating UI that didn’t come close to the solution you had envisioned. If any of that sounds familiar, you need to reach out to our sponsor - DevSquad. DevSquad provides an entire development team packed with top talent from Latin America. Your elite squad will include between 2 to 6 Full Stack Developers, a technical product manager, plus experts in product strategy, UI/UX design, DevOps, and QA - all working together to make your SaaS Product a success. You can ramp up an entire product team fast, in your timezone, and at rates 75% cheaper than a comparable US-based team. And with DevSquad, you pay month to month with no long-term contracts. Get the committed, responsive development team that your business deserves. Visit DevSquad.com/startups and get 10% off the first three months of your engagement. Topics we cover: 2:41 – Balancing short vs. long term thinking and decision making 7:30 – Examples of founders leaning into the long game 12:18 – Putting in the time, and doing it publicly (enough) 16:42 – Lucky or smart? 21:22 – How do I know if I’m playing the correct long game? 23:54 – Acquiring skills as you play the long game 27:13 – Cheers to 700! Links from the Show: Apply for TinySeed Spring 2024 MicroConf TinySeed Start Small, Stay Small by Rob Walling Gather TinySeed Tales S2E1 | Introducing Gather Lucky or Smart? by Bo Peabody If you have questions about starting or scaling a software business that you’d like for us to cover, please submit your question for an upcoming episode. We’d love to hear from you! Subscribe & Review: iTunes | Spotify |