SpyCast

Summary Vikram Sood (Twitter, Blog) joins Andrew (Twitter; LinkedIn) to discuss intelligence in the world’s largest democracy. He was the chief of India’s Research & Analysis Wing (R&AW). What You’ll Learn Intelligence The intelligence landscape in India China, Pakistan, and the intelligence challenges in the region The founding and evolution of the Research and Analysis Wing The pressure involved in the top job and being responsible to the Prime Minister Reflections The power of narratives Spies can be sensitive souls too And much, much more… Episode Notes This is the final installment of our month long special on SPY CHIEFS, featuring Vikram Sood. former Director of India’s foreign intelligence agency, the Research & Analysis Wing (RA&W). This episode from the vault was recorded during the darkest days of the pandemic when the International Spy Museum was closed, infections and deaths were sky high, and Andrew was at home in his living room with Vikram at his in New Delhi. So, is the R&AW similar to the CIA or MI6 or both? Does it have a covert action capability? How focused is it on China and Pakistan? Who does the Director report to? To hear the answers tune in to listen to an Indian Spy Chief who was in office in the critical years 2000-2003. Vikram was in the intelligence business for more than thirty years, since leaving as the professional head of India’s foreign intelligence agency he went on to have a successful second career at the think-tank, Observer Research Foundation, which is based in New Delhi. He is the author of two books (see below). And… Depending on the source, India has more, a little less, or roughly the same number of Muslims as Pakistan. An incredible fact when you consider that Pakistan is generally in the top five for having the largest population in the world. In fact, India has a larger population than the United States, Pakistan, Indonesia, Brazil and Nigeria combined. Quote of the Week "There is immense tension in the job because anything can go wrong any day and you will be held responsible if there is another bomb blast somewhere else. But if the leadership is supportive and it's understanding, and also contributes to helping you decide things, takes decisions for you that need politically clearances. That helps a lot that takes away the anxieties, it keeps the blood pressure down." – Vikram Sood Resources Headline Resource The Ultimate Goal: R&AW Chief Deconstructs how Nations Construct Narratives (Harper India, 2020) The Unending Game: A Former R&AW Chief’s Insights into Espionage (Penguin, 2018) Beginner Resources [Video] How Was R&AW Started: Story of India’s External Intelligence Agency, WION (2022) [Article] RAW: A History of India’s Covert Operations, Yatish Yadav, New Indian Express (2020) Books The War that Made R&AW, A. Nandakumar (Westland, 2021) JFK’s Forgotten Crisis: Tibet, the CIA and the Sino-Indian War, B. Riedel (BIP, 2015) Intelligence Elsewhere, P. Davies & K. Gustafson (GUP, 2013) The Kaoboys & R&AW, B Raman (Lancer, 2012) India’s External Intelligence, V.K. Singh (ManasPub, 2007) Articles History of RAW, Sachidananda Mohanty, Frontline (2022) A Peek Into India’s IB and RAW, Amjed Jaaved, Pakistan Today (2022) Inside R&AW, Rahul Bedi, The Wire: India (2020) Quiet Americans in India, P. McGarr, Diplomatic History, 38(5), 2014 (1046-1082) Videos Ex-Israel Spy Chief Talks Intelligence Cooperation with India, The Quint, YouTube (n.d.) Ex R&AW Chief Vikram Sood Gives a Glimpse of the World of Spies, The Quint, YouTube (n.d.) *Wildcard Resource* “The James Bond of India” Real-life spy Ajit Doval who spent years undercover in Pakistan He is currently the National Security Advisor of India!

Summary Ellen McCarthy (Twitter; LinkedIn) joins Andrew (Twitter; LinkedIn) to discuss her career and time as head of the State Department’s intelligence agency. INR is one of the 18 U.S. intelligence agencies. What You’ll Learn Intelligence Her start as a Soviet submarine analyst in the Office of Naval Intelligence Bringing the U.S. Coast Guard intel. program into the Intelligence Community (IC) Working for DoD and Geospatial-Intelligence Why she admires the Bureau of Intelligence and Research (INR) Reflections Government/for-profit/non-profit life Managing complexity and change And much, much more… Episode Notes Imagine seeing a pyramid from different angles and different heights instead of from one vantage point? You get a better sense of what it truly looks like, its dimensions, colors, idiosyncrasies, and the shadows it casts, right? Ellen McCarthy has seen more of the U.S. Intelligence Community (IC) pyramid than most: she started as a junior analyst for the U.S. Navy Office of Naval Intelligence and ended up as the head of the State Dept.’s Bureau of Intelligence and Research (INR). Along the way, she was with the U.S. Coast Guard, in the Office of the Undersecretary of Defense for Intelligence, and at the National Geospatial-Intelligence Agency. Quite the journey, I am sure you will agree… And… INR has been called the “biggest little intelligence shop in town” and its morning intelligence summary, “Better than Wheaties.” The NYT called it the “least wrong” intelligence agency on Iraq possessing weapons of mass destruction (WMD), and it has been credited for a more accurate assessment of Ukraine’s ability to withstand Russia than its peers. “They get paid attention to because they’re good and they tend to be contrarian,” notes a former chair of the National Intelligence Council. How do they manage this? Well, big question, but the deep, deep expertise of their staff – who are on average on their regional or functional area for over a decade – as well as an “intolerance for mediocrity” would be good places to start. Quote of the Week "The Geographer of the United States sits in INR. I don't think a lot of people know that. So, when there's a boundary dispute or you've got countries trying to build islands, it's INR that's actually working what the legal boundaries are. The other thing that INR does that a lot of folks don't know about is polling. Polling in the intelligence community is conducted at INR…And I will tell you that the polling capability at INR is the best I've ever seen." – Ellen McCarthy Resources *SpyCasts* “State Department Intelligence: Inside the INR” – INR Leadership (2020) Beginner Resources Bureau of Intelligence and Research, Wikipedia [webpage] Learn About the Smallest Organization in the IC, YouTube (n.d.) [1:45 minute] Geographer of the United States, YouTube, (2011) [13:24 minute] Books “Intelligence Informs Policymaking at DoS: INR,” T. King in T. Juneau, ed. Strategic Analysis in Support of Policymaking, R&L (2017), pp. 95-110. Reducing Uncertainty: Intelligence Analysis & National Security, T. Fingar, SUP (2011) INR, Intelligence & Research at State, U.S. DoS (1973) Article The U.S. Intelligence Community Needs a ‘Wild Bill’ Moment, E. McCarthy & M. Scott, Cipher Brief (2021) Video SPYCHAT: Ellen McCarthy & Chris Costa, YouTube (2021) The New IC: Ellen McCarthy Keynote, YouTube (2019) FedMentor: NGA’s Ellen McCarthy, YouTube (2014) Primary Sources INR: 2025 Strategic Plan (2022) Oral History with Teresita Schaeffer (1998) Oral History with Thomas F. Conlon (1992) Oral History with Frank Burnet, (1990) Oral History with Daniel Zachary (1989) *Wildcard Resource* The Ralph J. Bunche Library State Dept. Library named after OSS intelligence analyst, diplomat & Nobel Prize Winner Dr. Bunche

Summary Ellen McCarthy (Twitter; LinkedIn) joins Andrew (Twitter; LinkedIn) to discuss her career and time as head of the State Department’s intelligence agency. INR is one of the 18 U.S. intelligence agencies. What You’ll Learn Intelligence Her start as a Soviet submarine analyst in the Office of Naval Intelligence Bringing the U.S. Coast Guard intel. program into the Intelligence Community (IC) Working for DoD and Geospatial-Intelligence Why she admires the Bureau of Intelligence and Research (INR) Reflections Government/for-profit/non-profit life Managing complexity and change And much, much more… Episode Notes Imagine seeing a pyramid from different angles and different heights instead of from one vantage point? You get a better sense of what it truly looks like, its dimensions, colors, idiosyncrasies, and the shadows it casts, right? Ellen McCarthy has seen more of the U.S. Intelligence Community (IC) pyramid than most: she started as a junior analyst for the U.S. Navy Office of Naval Intelligence and ended up as the head of the State Dept.’s Bureau of Intelligence and Research (INR). Along the way, she was with the U.S. Coast Guard, in the Office of the Undersecretary of Defense for Intelligence, and at the National Geospatial-Intelligence Agency. Quite the journey, I am sure you will agree… And… INR has been called the “biggest little intelligence shop in town” and its morning intelligence summary, “Better than Wheaties.” The NYT called it the “least wrong” intelligence agency on Iraq possessing weapons of mass destruction (WMD), and it has been credited for a more accurate assessment of Ukraine’s ability to withstand Russia than its peers. “They get paid attention to because they’re good and they tend to be contrarian,” notes a former chair of the National Intelligence Council. How do they manage this? Well, big question, but the deep, deep expertise of their staff – who are on average on their regional or functional area for over a decade – as well as an “intolerance for mediocrity” would be good places to start. Quote of the Week "The Geographer of the United States sits in INR. I don't think a lot of people know that. So, when there's a boundary dispute or you've got countries trying to build islands, it's INR that's actually working what the legal boundaries are. The other thing that INR does that a lot of folks don't know about is polling. Polling in the intelligence community is conducted at INR…And I will tell you that the polling capability at INR is the best I've ever seen." – Ellen McCarthy Resources *SpyCasts* “State Department Intelligence: Inside the INR” – INR Leadership (2020) Beginner Resources Bureau of Intelligence and Research, Wikipedia [webpage] Learn About the Smallest Organization in the IC, YouTube (n.d.) [1:45 minute] Geographer of the United States, YouTube, (2011) [13:24 minute] Books “Intelligence Informs Policymaking at DoS: INR,” T. King in T. Juneau, ed. Strategic Analysis in Support of Policymaking, R&L (2017), pp. 95-110. Reducing Uncertainty: Intelligence Analysis & National Security, T. Fingar, SUP (2011) INR, Intelligence & Research at State, U.S. DoS (1973) Article The U.S. Intelligence Community Needs a ‘Wild Bill’ Moment, E. McCarthy & M. Scott, Cipher Brief (2021) Video SPYCHAT: Ellen McCarthy & Chris Costa, YouTube (2021) The New IC: Ellen McCarthy Keynote, YouTube (2019) FedMentor: NGA’s Ellen McCarthy, YouTube (2014) Primary Sources INR: 2025 Strategic Plan (2022) Oral History with Teresita Schaeffer (1998) Oral History with Thomas F. Conlon (1992) Oral History with Frank Burnet, (1990) Oral History with Daniel Zachary (1989) *Wildcard Resource* The Ralph J. Bunche Library State Dept. Library named after OSS intelligence analyst, diplomat & Nobel Prize Winner Dr. Bunche

Summary Mike Burgess (Website; Twitter) joins Andrew (Twitter; LinkedIn) to discuss his agency and the enduring strength of Australia’s alliances. ASIO is the second intelligence agency he has directed. What You’ll Learn Intelligence The Australian idea of “mateship” in the intelligence context The Australian intelligence landscape The United States as its most important strategic alliance The enduring value and historical uniqueness of the FIVE EYES alliance Reflections How Man. Utd. might help us understand leadership The frustrations of watching spy fiction on TV as a practitioner And much, much more… Episode Notes The top job: what is it like? what are the joys and pains of leadership? This is not like leading a business, though, or a soccer team, this is protecting the country and its citizens from terrorism, espionage, sabotage, and external interference. Such is the charge of the Australian Security Intelligence Organization (ASIO). To address these questions, Andrew sat down with Mike Burgess, who was formerly the Director-General of the Australian Signals Directorate (ASD), comparable to GCHQ and the NSA – an agency would serve in for over 20 years. They also discussed the Australian intelligence landscape and its most important alliances, such as the U.S. and FIVE EYES and some of its important regional relationships. And… Mike and Andrew hit it off, especially when discussing Alex Ferguson and how soccer can help us understand management and leadership. Ferguson won more titles in soccer than any other manager, at 49, and he is generally considered the GOAT or a strong contender. Of course, trophies are extremely important, but they do not capture everything. If you are looking for an example of transformational change of an entire organization and its subsequent culture, HBS could do a lot worse than draft a case study on the legendary leadership of Liverpool F.C. by Bill Shankly. He made people believe. Quote of the Week Talking about FIVE EYES, that's one of those foundational partnerships in our relationships…It's unique because…it was born through WWII. It's an interesting phenomenon because it started its life as a signals intelligence relationship…at its core, it's an intelligence relationship that really has made a difference to each of those five nations’ respective national security…And we do trust each other, and we share our most intimate secrets. Resources *SpyCasts* “Keeping Secrets/Disclosing Secrets” – with Spy Chief turned DG of Australia’s National Archives David Fricker (2022) “Desperately, Madly in Love” – Brett Peppler and the Australian IC (2021) Beginner Resources Australian Intelligence Community, Wikipedia [webpage] Australian Security and Intelligence Organization (ASIO) [Website] Why I Spy, M. Burgess, YouTube (n.d.) [60 second video] Intelligence Professionals FAQ, ASIO, YouTube (n.d.) [2:32 minute video] Virtual Exhibition Spy: Espionage in Australia (NAA) Books Spies & Sparrows: ASIO & the Cold War, P. Deery (2022) Between Five Eyes, A. Wells (2020) Intelligence & the Function of Government, D. Baldino & E. Crawley (2018) The Official History of ASIO – 3 Volumes, D. Horner, J. Blaxland, R. Crawley (2014/2015/2016) Report Intelligence Oversight: A Comparison of the FIVE EYES Nations, C. Baker et.al., Parliament of Australia (2017) Primary Sources Director-General’s Annual Threat Assessment (2022) Foreign Espionage: An Australian Perspective, ASIS DG (2022) ASIO Internal Message on Vietnam War (1970) Surveillance of the Aarons, Communist Party Australia (1966) Counterespionage Film, ASIO (1963) Citizenship for former Soviet Spies, Petrovs (1956) *Wildcard Resource* Sydney vs. Melbourne: The Real Canberra Story If you’ve ever wondered why Canberra is the capital…

Summary Paul Lashmar (Twitter, Website) joins Andrew (Twitter; LinkedIn) to discuss investigative journalism and intelligence. He is a former UK Reporter of the Year. What You’ll Learn Intelligence The similarities and differences between spooks and journalists The role Watergate played for his generation of journalists Intelligence overseers as “Ostriches,” “Cheerleaders,” “Lemon-suckers,” or “Guardians” Bellingcat, Spycatcher and the “Zinoviev Letter” Reflections The long shadow of the Second World War Investigative journalism in democratic societies And much, much more… Episode Notes “Cardiac stimulating experiences,” is how this week’s guest describes meeting sources in smoky IRA pubs in Belfast all on his lonesome. But he also met sources in the oak-paneled clubs of Whitehall and in many other places around the world. So, what has our guest distilled from his long career examining intelligence agencies? What are the types of relationships spooks and journalists have had with one another? What are the similarities and differences between both tribes? To answer these questions and more, Andrew sat down with investigative reporter and current Head of the Dept. of Journalism at City, University of London, Paul Lashmar. Paul has worked across the media landscape, as a producer for the BBC, as a broadcast journalist with British current affairs television program World in Action, and as an investigative journalist for the Observer newspaper. He won Reporter of the Year in the 1986 UK Press Awards. He is the author of Spy Flights of the Cold War, Britain’s Secret Propaganda War, and most recently Spies, Spin and the Fourth Estate. And… World in Action was a legendary investigative TV program in the U.K. It’s programming led to the resignation of a Home Secretary, one of the Great Offices of State in the UK; the release of the Birmingham Six, who were wrongfully convicted of planting IRA bombs; and the exposure of Combat-18, a violent neo-Nazi movement. It would also publish the original story of the Spycatcher allegations that the head of MI5 was a Soviet mole and that there had been a joint MI5-MI6 plot to overthrow Labor Prime Minister Harold Wilson. Paul co-wrote that 1984 episode. For all these reasons and more, it was rarely out of the courts. The last series was broadcast in 1998. Quote of the Week "They would meet you in an up-market club in the center of London…it's leather Chesterfields, gentleman walking around getting your gin and tonic. It was all of that, in those days it was all informal…there are now in most newspapers, somebody who is usually appointed by the editor who maintains those connections… it's a sensible arrangement." – Paul Lashmar Resources Headline Resource Spies, Spin and the Fourth Estate, P. Lashmar (EUP, 2021) *SpyCasts* The Women of NatSec Journalism – 6 Leading Journalists (2017) Covering Intelligence (2015) Part 1: with Mark Mazzetti Part 2 – with Ali Watkins Part 3 – with Greg Miller Books Zinoviev Letter, G. Bennett (OUP, 2020) Spies and the Media in Britain, R. Norton-Taylor (IBT, 2018) Spinning Intelligence, R. Dover and M. Goodman (CUP, 2009) Spycatcher, P. Wright (Viking, 1987) Beginner Articles UK Officials Still Blocking SpyCatcher Files, Guardian (2021) The Zinoviev Letter, FT (2018) When Spy Agencies Didn’t Exist, BBC (2014) Articles Why Good Investigative Journalism Matters (2022) Obituary: Peter Wright, Independent (1995) Documentary “World in Action,” YouTube (n.d.) Primary Sources The Spy Who Never Was [World In Action] (1984) Moscow Orders to Our Reds [Daily Mail Accusation] (1924) Zinoviev Denies Writing Letter (1924) Zinoviev Narrative of Facts [TUC & Labour Party] (1924) *Wildcard Resource* How Bellingcat is Using TikTok to Investigate the War in Ukraine Investigative journalism, Bellingcat style!

Summary Admiral Hernando Wills Velez (Twitter) joins Andrew (Twitter; LinkedIn) to discuss intelligence in Colombia. He is the former professional head of the Colombian Navy. What You’ll Learn Intelligence What it is like to be the head of an entire Navy Intelligence from the point of view of a senior military officer The unique set of challenges Colombia faces – insurgents, terrorists, paramilitaries, drug-cartels, etc. The role intelligence played in the daring Operation Jacque Reflections The blessings and curses of geography Capacity building in organizations And much, much more… Episode Notes To hear more about his remarkable career as former professional head of the Colombian Navy, and to discuss Colombia and intelligence, Andrew sat down with Admiral Hernando Wills Vélez. Colombia and its navy must reckon with a unique combination of challenges – including Marxist insurgents, right-wing paramilitaries, drug cartels, crime syndicates, and a vast and diverse territory. To sum up, it is a remarkably fascinating case-study for the role intelligence might play. Admiral Wills was also the commander of the Pacific Fleet, head of the Colombian Coast Guard, and a former aide de camp to the President of Colombia. His father was a career military officer who served in the Korean War with the Colombian Navy. He is an NDU graduate. And… “Operation Jacque.” This episode coincides with a pop-up exhibit at our museum on a 2008 Colombian intelligence-led operation to rescue 15 hostages held for many years by the FARC, a Marxist guerilla group who were involved in drug trafficking, extortion, and terrorism. 3 Americans and 12 Colombians were rescued, including a candidate for the Colombian presidency. Bottom line: all the hostages were freed from deep within the rainforest without a single shot being fired. Intelligence baby, intelligence. Quote of the Week "Time goes so fast. I joined the Navy when I was 15 years old, very young. I finished high school. in the Naval academy. And then you start your regular business as a young lieutenant in ships and destroyers and positions on land. And all of a sudden, you see yourself as an admiral. I mean, it's a crazy thing…[then] I had the privilege to be selected by the president to lead the Columbia Navy." – former Head of Columbia's Navy Admiral Hernando Wills. Resources Headline Resource “Operation Jacque,” International Spy Museum, Spring-Summer 2022 Books Colombia: A Concise Contemporary History, M. Larosa & G. Mejía (R&L, 2017) Out of Captivity: Surviving 1967 Days in the Colombian Jungle, M. Gonsalves, et al. (W. Morrow, 2009) Beginner Articles Colombia Profile – Timeline, BBC (2018) Colombia – CIA World Factbook, CIA (2022) Colombia Marks One Year Anniversary of Jaque, Reuters (2009) Colombia – Navy, Global Security (n.d.) Articles Anchoring the Caribbean: The Colombian Navy, W. Mills, Stable Seas (2021) Colombia & Operation Jacque, L. Collins, Modern War Institute (2021) Plan Colombia and the U.S. Army’s 7th Special Forces Group, K. Higgins, Taylor Francis (2021) Plan Colombia: Effectiveness & Costs, D. Mejía, Brookings (2016) Globalization & FARC, J. Forero, USAWC (2013) FARC: A Portrait of Insurgent Intelligence, J. Gentry & D. Spencer, INS (2010) Videos FARC Hostage Rescue Video – Operation Jacque, CBS (2008) Primary Sources Revocation of Terrorist Designation for FARC, A. Blinken, State (2021) Plan Colombia – Staff Trip Report, Senate Foreign Relations Committee (2005) Plan Colombia, U.S. Role – Hearing, House Subcommittee on the W. Hemisphere (2000) NSC 1 – Carter Panama Canal Directive (1977) Letter to U.S. Senators From Carter – Panama Canal (1977) *Wildcard Resource* One Hundred years of Solitude (novel), Embrace of the Serpent (movie), or Adventures of an Orchid Hunter (travel memoir) – take your pick!

Summary Peter Earnest spent 35 years in the CIA as a case officer and retired as its chief spokesman. He was the founding Executive Director of the International Spy Museum. What You’ll Learn Intelligence Losing a friend in the line of duty vs. betrayal by a colleague Using affability to your advantage Thoughts on the shift from classic espionage to counterterrorism for the CIA The relationship between the CIA, the press and the public Reflections The origins of the International Spy Museum The role museums can play in fostering a sense of collective identity & esprit de corps And much, much more… Episode Notes May 21st, 2022. The date of the Memorial Service at the International Spy Museum for Peter Earnest, the founding Executive Director of the museum and a 35-year veteran of the CIA and. In honor of him, his week’s episode is an exit-interview he recorded with my predecessor, Vince Houghton, not long after Peter announced his retirement from the museum. Peter was a case officer at CIA for 25 years, largely in Europe and the Middle East, recruiting and running agents, and getting involved in covert actions, counterespionage, and double agent operations. He later went on to work in the Inspector General’s office and as the CIA’s Senate liaison, concluding his career as the CIA’s chief spokesman. What is it like being a nice guy in the murky world of intelligence? How does a tight-lipped case officer make the transition to chief spokesman? How did a museum on espionage and intelligence end up in Washington D.C.? Peter Earnest died on February 13, 2022. He will be sorely missed. And… Peter wrote the foreword for a 2011 edition of Boy Scout founder Robert Baden-Powell’s classic book, My Adventures as a Spy, featuring chapters such as “Commercial Spying,” “Traitorous Spying,” and “How Spies Disguise Themselves.” The only CIA officer who came through the ranks to become Director, Robert Gates, was an Eagle Scout, as was the only Director of both the CIA and the FBI, Judge William Webster. Quote of the Week "There's a broad respect from museums by the American public they're distrustful of almost everything else, but the trust in museums is high, and so I think it's a place that some of those senior professionals refer to. If they've come down, they feel, it's, doing good work." – Peter Earnest Resources Headline Resource TRIBUTE: CIA Veteran Who Helped Launch the Spy Museum, Dies at 88, International Spy Museum, YouTube (2022) *SpyCasts Peter Earnest: My Life in the CIA (2012) Articles In Memoriam, Peter Earnest, 1934-2022, SPY (2022) CIA Veteran who Ran a Spy Museum, Dies at 88, NYT (2022) CIA Veteran Who Helped Launch Spy Museum, Dies at 88, H. Smith, WaPo (2022) Family of Spies, Washingtonian Magazine (2013) Books The Real Spy’s Guide to Becoming a Spy, P. Earnest (Harper, 2009) Business Confidential: Lessons for Corporate Success from Inside the CIA, P. Earnest & M. Karinch (AMACOM, 2010) Harry Potter and the Art of Spying, P. Earnest & S. Harper (Wise Ink, 2014) Primary Sources Soviet Defector Arkady Shevchenko Dies, WaPo (1998) Emily A. Earnest, Consular Office Obituary, WaPo (1994) CIA Officer Richard Welch Murdered in Athens, CIA (1975) CIA COS Richard Welch Murdered in Athens, Counterspy Magazine Blamed for his Death, British Pathe (1975) *Wildcard Resource* Colbert Classic, Spy Training with Peter Earnest, Comedy Central (2013) Go to 3:31

Summary Lis Wiehl (Twitter, Website) joins Andrew (Twitter; LinkedIn) to discuss the FBI Agent Robert Hanssen. His espionage for the Russians was described as the “worst intelligence disaster in U.S. history.” What You’ll Learn Intelligence The many contradictions of this fragmented personality The criminal sworn FBI Agent The sexual fetishist in Opus Dei The anti-communist Soviet spy Hanssen’s impact on the FBI and American Intelligence How the Hanssen case effected the FBI-CIA relationship Reflections Technology’s impact on the espionage/counterespionage cat-and-mouse game Cultural and institutional blind spots And much, much more… Episode Notes The International Spy Museum has the handcuffs that were put on one of the most notorious spies in American history, former FBI Agent Robert Hanssen. But what was the backstory of the moment those metal restraints closed around his wrists in Foxstone Park, Virginia? What did he do? Why did he do it? Who was this man? What damage did he do? To discuss these questions, Andrew sat down with the author of A Spy in Plain Sight, Lis Wiehl. Lis is a former Federal Prosecutor and a legal analyst and reporter on major news networks, including a 15-year stint at Fox News. She is the best-selling author of 20 fiction and non-fiction books and last but not least she is the daughter of an FBI Agent who heard stories of Hanssen’s betrayal from her father. Hanssen betrayed “jewel in the crown of American intelligence, Dimitri Polyakov, and other U.S. assets, as well as handing over thousands of pages of highly classified information to the Soviet Union and later Russia. And… In the intelligence community compartmentalization is a way to try to protect sensitive information, caveats, codewords, clearances, read ins, need to know, etc., but in the personal context it refers to being capable of being a “different person in terms of outlook, values and behavior at different times and circumstances.” David Charney met with Hanssen for an entire year after his arrest and described him as “the most compartmentalized person I have ever met.” He also mentions that he is a very experienced psychiatrist. Charney says in terms of compartmentalization most of us are a 1-2 on a scale of 10. Guess where Hanssen was? Quote of the Week "At one point hacked into one of his colleagues’ computers to get more information, he was found out and his excuse was, I was just trying to show you how easily we're hacked into so that we can make sure that we don’t, and they believed him because he was a computer guy…they just believed him when he hacked in this other person's computer. Crazy." – Lis Wiehl Resources Headline Resource A Spy in Plain Sight, L. Wiehl (S&S, 2022) *SpyCasts* “The FBI Way” - Counterintelligence Chief Frank Figliuzzi “Leningrad, Molehunts, and Life After the CIA” - Christopher Burgess (2021) “Defending a Spy, An Espionage Attorney” - Plato Cacheris (2015) “The Movie Breach and Hollywood’s Take on Espionage” – Eric O’Neill (2007) “FBI Counterintelligence and the Robert Hanssen Spy Case” – Dave Major (2007) Books New History of Soviet Intelligence, J. Haslam (FS&J, 2015) Spy Handler, V. Cherkashin, (Basic, 2008) Articles Spy Who Kept Cold War Cold – Polyakov, History (2019) Spy Psychology/Insider Spies, NOIR (2014) Death of the Perfect Spy – Polyakov, Time (2001) Videos Charney on What Makes Traitors Tick? SPY (2014) Primary Sources Witness to History at SPY, Hanssen Investigation (2013) Review on FBI Performance Detecting Hanssen, OIG (2003) A Review of FBI Security Programs, Webster Commission (2002) Sandy Grimes Interview on Polyakov (1998) *Wildcard Resource* Inside the Supermax Prison (Florence, Colorado) Hanssen is here alongside Harold James Nicholson, El Chapo, Ramzi Yousef and Terry Nichols

Summary Mike Susong (Website; LinkedIn) joins Andrew (Twitter; LinkedIn) to discuss CIA, cyber and corporate intelligence. He won the Intelligence Star for Heroism in the Field. What You’ll Learn Intelligence Applying aspects of Mike’s training to the private sector using “competitive intelligence” Mike’s role co-founding a pioneering company in the field of Cyber Threat Intelligence (CTI) The role of technology in enabling and constraining espionage What drew Mike to an annual free-thinking social experiment in the desert Reflections Entrepreneurial thinking as unwavering belief in an idea The difference between working for Uncle Sam and working for corporate America And much, much more… Episode Notes Andrew sat down with W. Michael Susong for a two-parter to discuss CIA, cyber and Burning Man. Last week in PART I we looked at Mike’s time working for the CIA and in the domain of human intelligence, while in PART II we will focus on his time as an entrepreneur and intelligence leader in the cyber threat intelligence and competitive intelligence spaces. Mike was a U.S. Army major who completed multiple combat tours and a CIA case officer. He went into the private sector and created competitive intelligence programs for Fujitsu and Ernst & Young, and he was a pioneer in the field of cyber threat intelligence or CTI, creating the first programs for Visa and Pacific Gas & Electric. He is both CISM and CPP certified and a Black Rock Ranger. And… Black Rock Rangers are volunteers at Burning Man, an annual event that focuses on artistic expression, spiritual regeneration, and radical inclusion. It culminates in the symbolic burning of a large wooden effigy, known as “The Man.” If you want to explore the event or the ideas that propel it, including its roots in the Californian counter-culture and its Silicon Valley connections, you can do so here, here, here, here, here, and here. Quote of the Week "I worked with, with two corporations to build competitive intelligence programs, for them…I want to emphasize that's the ethical application of certain aspects of the intelligence cycle, to support a business decision. So, this was more on the analysis piece, some on collection, and certainly when you start to speak of collection within a private sector environment, you have to have clear, bright lines aloud about what is and is not acceptable." – Mike Susong Resources Headline Resource Application of Intelligence Principles to Raise IT Security, M. Susong, YouTube (2012) *SpyCasts From the CIA to Strategic Cyber – Hans Holmer (2022) Cyberattacks, Espionage & Ransomware – Inside Microsoft’s MSTIC (2022) Articles Start a Competitive Intelligence System that Wins, P. Mertens, Sprout Social (2022) Gathering Competitive Intelligence From Twitter, S. Argawal, Startup Grind Websites Competitive Intelligence Resources, SCIP PBR (Projects, Briefs, Reports) 2022 State of Competitive Intelligence, SCIP/Crayon (2022) CTI: Applying Better Terminology to Threats Intelligence, A. Greer, SANS (2021) Understanding Cyber Threat Intelligence Operations, Bank of England (2016) Courses Cyber Threat Intelligence, SANS Cyber Threat Intelligence, Threat Intelligence Academy Podcasts Cyber Threat Intelligence, Hacking Humans (2020) Intelligence Operations: A First Principle of Cybersecurity, CSO Perspectives (2022) Video 2022 State of Competitive Intelligence, YouTube (2022) A CEO’s Perspective on Intelligence, Report Linker (2020) Primary Sources Letter to CIA Deputy Director on Competitive Intelligence (1986) *Wildcard Resource* The Whole Earth Catalog (1968) Steve Jobs called it “the bible of his generation” and links have been made between it and Silicon Valley, Cyber, and Burning Man.

Summary Mike Susong (Website; LinkedIn) joins Andrew (Twitter; LinkedIn) to discuss CIA, cyber and corporate intelligence. He won the Intelligence Star for Heroism in the Field. What You’ll Learn Intelligence The outgrowth of “intelligence” from a nation-state activity to a corporate activity Recruiting and running agents as a CIA case officer His shift from tactical intelligence to strategic intelligence His journey from a curious kid with a short-wave radio to an intel professional Reflections Effective decision-making and intelligence The opportunities and challenges of working in different fields and domains And much, much more… Episode Notes What is it like to do intelligence for Uncle Sam and then for the private sector? What is different and what is similar? How did intelligence go from supporting national security decision-making to business decision-making? To answer these questions, Andrew sat down with W. Michael Susong for a two-parter. PART I will focus on Mike’s time working for the CIA and in the domain of human intelligence, while PART II will focus on his time in the as an entrepreneur and intelligence leader in the cyber threat intelligence and competitive intelligence spaces. Mike was a U.S. Army major who completed multiple combat tours and a CIA case officer. He went into the private sector and created competitive intelligence programs for Fujitsu and Ernst & Young, and he was a pioneer in the field of cyber threat intelligence or CTI, creating the first programs for Visa and Pacific Gas & Electric. He is both CISM and CPP certified and a Black Rock Ranger. And… Black Rock Rangers are volunteers at Burning Man, an annual event that focuses on artistic expression, spiritual regeneration, and radical inclusion. It culminates in the symbolic burning of a large wooden effigy, known as “The Man.” If you want to explore the event or the ideas that propel it, including its roots in the Californian counter-culture and its Silicon Valley connections, you can do so here, here, here, here, here, and here. Quote of the Week "It’s analogous to business. So, there's closers, people who are really the salesman…but then they're not good at the kind of that long-term relationship, reassuring, working over time…And so I would say that there are case officers who are better at spotting and recruiting, and there are case officers that are better at handling." – Mike Susong Resources Headline Resource Application of Intelligence Principles to Raise IT Security, M. Susong, YouTube (2012) *SpyCasts From the CIA to Strategic Cyber – Hans Holmer (2022) Cyberattacks, Espionage & Ransomware – Inside Microsoft’s MSTIC (2022) Articles Start a Competitive Intelligence System that Wins, P. Mertens, Sprout Social (2022) Gathering Competitive Intelligence From Twitter, S. Argawal, Startup Grind Websites Competitive Intelligence Resources, SCIP PBR (Projects, Briefs, Reports) 2022 State of Competitive Intelligence, SCIP/Crayon (2022) CTI: Applying Better Terminology to Threats Intelligence, A. Greer, SANS (2021) Understanding Cyber Threat Intelligence Operations, Bank of England (2016) Courses Cyber Threat Intelligence, SANS Cyber Threat Intelligence, Threat Intelligence Academy Podcasts Cyber Threat Intelligence, Hacking Humans (2020) Intelligence Operations: A First Principle of Cybersecurity, CSO Perspectives (2022) Video 2022 State of Competitive Intelligence, YouTube (2022) A CEO’s Perspective on Intelligence, Report Linker (2020) Primary Sources Letter to CIA Deputy Director on Competitive Intelligence (1986) *Wildcard Resource* The Whole Earth Catalog (1968) Steve Jobs called it “the bible of his generation” and links have been made between it and Silicon Valley, Cyber, and Burning Man.

Summary Noah Hurowitz (Twitter; LinkedIn) joins Andrew (Twitter; LinkedIn) to discuss infamous drug kingpin El Chapo. A weak link in his cybersecurity set-up would help bring him down. What You’ll Learn Intelligence El Chapo’s internal surveillance operation The cartel’s use of cryptography to keep communications covert How cybersecurity enabled then brought down El Chapo The role of the infamous DFS – a corrupt and now disbanded intelligence agency Reflections Technology – early adopters vs. counter responders The changing nature of crime enabled by emerging technologies – spyware, drones, etc. And much, much more… Episode Notes Joaquín Archivaldo Guzmán Loera, aka El Chapo (shorty) because of his 5-foot 6-inch frame, was called by one of the agents chasing him, “the godfather of the drug world.” So, how did a low-level drug dealer from a provincial state rise to try and subvert the Mexican government to his will? What was the intelligence game that played out with regards to El Chapo? How did the cartels use spytech, tradecraft and cybersecurity to stay one step ahead of the law? How was he caught? To answer these questions and more, Andrew sat down with Noah Horowitz who covered the trial of El Chapo in Brooklyn for Rolling Stone magazine. Noah is also the author of the recent book El Chapo, and his work has appeared in the Village Voice, the Baffler and New York Magazine. And… In the El Chapo trial, question No.57 asked prospective jurors, “Are you familiar with Jesus Malverde?” If you are not familiar with this angel of the poor (el ángel de los pobres) as well as the Sinaloan narcos (el narcosantón), then you can find out why this question would be relevant here, here, here and here. Quote of the Week "So, in addition to encrypted communications…he was also installing spyware on Blackberry devices that El Chapo was giving out to his lieutenants and his girlfriends and his wives. And then EL Chapo was able to use this, the spyware program to see what was on their phones. He was able to see their text messages. He was able to see their locations. He was even able to remotely activate their mic and listen to them. And he loved that…it was like a toy to him almost. He became obsessed with it." – Noah Hurowitz Resources Headline Resource El Chapo, N. Hurowitz (S&S, 2021) *SpyCasts* Drug Cartels, Sleeper Cells, the Waco Siege & the Mob - Dennis Franks (2021) Books Dope: History of the Mexican Drug Trade, B. Smith (W.W. Norton, 2021) Blood Gun Money: How America Arms Gangs & Cartels, I. Grillo (Bloomsbury, 2021) Articles Drugs, Crime and the Cartels, CFR (2021) The Tech that Took Down Pablo Escobar, Wired (2021) Mexican Cartels Cyber Surveillance, C. Schilis-Gallego, Forbidden Stories (2020) Spy vs. Spy, El Chapo Edition, E. Groll, FP (2019) The Spyware that Brought Down El Chapo, S. Fussell, The Atlantic (2019) Websites El Paso Intelligence Project (EPIC) Centro Nacional De Intelligencia (CNI) PBR (Projects, Briefs, Reports) Mexico: Evolution of the Merida Initiative, C. Seelke, CRS (2021) Mexico Organized Crime and Drug Traffickers, J. Beittel, CRS (2020) Primary Sources EDNY Press Release on El Chapo Trial (2019) Memo in Support of Pre-trial Detention, USA vs. Joaquín Guzmán Loera (2017) Trial Transcripts of El Chapo Text Messages with His Mistress (2012) Official Report on Mexico’s “Dirty War” (2006) Foreign Narcotics Kingpin Designation Act (1999) Primary Source Collections The Mexican Intelligence Digital Archives (MIDAS) Inside The Cartel: Key Documents (LAT) *Wildcard Resource* “The Original Indigenous People of Sinaloa” To understand Joaquín Guzmán Loera, starting at the year of his birth, 1957, might be enough; but to understand “El Chapo” it might help to go deeper still…

Summary Daniel Milton (Website; Twitter) joins Andrew (Twitter; LinkedIn) to discuss the former Caliph of the Islamic State. Al Mawla was killed in a U.S. raid in February 2022. What You’ll Learn Intelligence The origin of the term “Canary Caliph” The mythology of Islamic State and the reality Battlefield intelligence and understanding an enemy The Combating Terrorism Center being on the radar of terrorists Reflections The presentation of “self” The relationship between organizational priorities and organizational hierarchies And much, much more… Episode Notes Daniel Milton joins us again to discuss a series of interrogation reports of Al Mawla, at the time leader of Islamic law in Mosul for the Islamic State in Iraq (ISI). ISI was the successor to Al Qaeda in that country and the predecessor of Islamic State (Islamic State is a larger umbrella category, while ISIS, ISKP, etc. come with geographical designations, e.g., Islamic State of Iraq and Syria). Al Mawla gave up the names of over 50 people within his own organization: and that was only in the first 3 of 56 interviews. One interesting insight you can glean from the documents is that Islamic State while very different from many organizations in many respects, is just like them in others: empire building, clashing personalities, struggles over process, paperwork, committees, territorialism, jealousy, prejudice, insecurity – like The Office, but with much more malevolent intent. And… If you want to read a document that captures (a) an important inflection point in the transition from Al Qaeda to Islamic State and (b) was one of the West Point CTC publications captured during the Bin Laden raid, read “Al Qaeda Secedes from Iraq.” Quote of the Week "I think we get a sense of it as an organization that exists and has similar struggles as any other organization does. Having said that, clearly, it's a clandestine organization, and so one of the overriding imperatives is security. Individuals are trying to stay alive and not get arrested or killed. And that affects a little bit of the way that you carry out business. I do think that you also see some element of the things that you described. There is competition. There are people who don't like each other." – Daniel Milton Resources *Headline Resources* Al Mawla Interrogation Reports “Islamic State,” Mapping Militants, CISAC Stanford Books Enemies Near & Far, D. Gartenstein-Ross (CUP, 2022) The ISIS Reader, Ingram et al. (Hurst, 2020) The Rise of Global Jihad, T. Hegghammer (CUP, 2020) Foreign Fighters in the Armies of Jihad, D. Byman (OUP, 2019) Anatomy of Terror, A. Soufan (W.W. Norton, 2017) The Far Enemy, F. Gerges (CUP, 2005) Best Books on the Middle East (Five Books) Articles ISIS Leader Quraishi Kills Himself, Al-Khalidi & Bose, Reuters (2022) ISIS’S Leadership Crisis, H. Ingram and C. Whiteside, Foreign Affairs (2022) The Islamic State in Afghanistan, A. Jadoon et al., CTC (2022) The Cloud Caliphate, Ayad et al., CTC (2021) Lessons from the Islamic State’s “Milestone” Texts and Speeches, Ingram et al., CTC (2020) Timeline: The Rise, Spread & Fall of the Islamic State, C. Glenn et al., Wilson Center (2019) Documentary Iraq & Syria: After Islamic State, BBC (2018) Confronting ISIS, PBS Frontline (2016) Reports Islamic State’s Method of Insurgency, H. Ingram, GW (2021) Web Operation Inherent Resolve Primary Sources President Biden on a Successful Counterterrorism Operation (2022) Cyber Command’s Internet War Against ISIL (2018) Islamic State Memo for Dealing with New Recruits (2017) Message to the Mujahidin and the Muslim Ummah, Caliph Al Baghdadi (2014) The Management of Savagery (2006) The Sykes-Picot Agreement (1916) *Wildcard Resource* “Camp Bucca Newsletter #1” A U.S. forces newsletter from the time-period when Al Mawla was interrogated at Camp Bucca, in the vicinity of Umm Qasr, Iraq.

Summary Daniel Milton (Website; Twitter) joins Andrew (Twitter; LinkedIn) to discuss Tactical Interrogation Reports of the former Caliph of the Islamic State. Al-Mawla was killed in a U.S. raid in February 2022. What You’ll Learn Intelligence The ideological feud between Islamic State and Al Qaeda Islamic State's retreat from a quasi-state centered to a shadowy insurgency Battlefield intelligence such as “exploitable material” and “interrogation reports” The role of the Combating Terrorism Center in analyzing this intelligence Reflections Training your people for the current fight…and the next one The trade-off between a short-term view and a longer-term view And much, much more… Episode Notes This week’s episode focuses on battlefield intelligence, or more specifically a series of tactical interrogation reports from 2008. Ok, so why are they significant? Well, the individual being interrogated, Al Mawla, would go on to become the second leader and so-called Caliph of the Islamic State. Ok, so why are they significant beyond that…well, it turns out that Al Mawla was an informant who gave away colleagues and friends to save his own skin, leading to the nickname, “The Canary Caliph.” Daniel Milton joined Andrew to discuss these reports and what they mean in the broader scheme of things. Daniel is the Director of Research at the Combatting Terrorism Center at West Point, and he has a Ph.D. from FSU. He has been cited in outlets such as The NYT, BBC, and NBC News and he regularly briefs all levels of the Government, including the Intelligence Community and Department of Defense. And… In February 2022, Al Mawla became the second Islamic State Caliph to blow himself up during a U.S. raid. His predecessor Abu-Bakr al-Baghdadi had done so in October 2019. I wonder what will happen to the third Caliph… Quote of the Week "I think that's one of my favorite things about looking at this type of material is that it really gives an inside view to organizations that are clandestine and usually not seen very well from the outside, but these documents paint a very vivid picture of struggles, challenges, bureaucratic minutia, whatever the case might be, which is not typically how we think about these organizations, but these documents really allow us to see that." – Daniel Milton Resources *Headline Resources* Al Mawla Interrogation Reports CTC Sentinel Books Enemies Near & Far, D. Gartenstein-Ross (CUP, 2022) The ISIS Reader, Ingram et al. (Hurst, 2020) The Rise of Global Jihad, T. Hegghammer (CUP, 2020) Foreign Fighters in the Armies of Jihad, D. Byman (OUP, 2019) Anatomy of Terror, A. Soufan (W.W. Norton, 2017) The Far Enemy, F. Gerges (CUP, 2005) Best Books on the Middle East (Five Books) Articles ISIS Leader Quraishi Kills Himself, Al-Khalidi & Bose, Reuters (2022) ISIS’S Leadership Crisis, H. Ingram and C. Whiteside, Foreign Affairs (2022) The Islamic State in Afghanistan, A. Jadoon et al., CTC (2022) The Cloud Caliphate, Ayad et al., CTC (2021) Lessons from the Islamic State’s “Milestone” Texts and Speeches, Ingram et al., CTC (2020) Timeline: The Rise, Spread & Fall of the Islamic State, C. Glenn et al., Wilson Center (2019) Documentary Iraq & Syria: After Islamic State, BBC (2018) Confronting ISIS, PBS Frontline (2016) Web Operation Inherent Resolve Primary Sources President Biden on a Successful Counterterrorism Operation (2022) Cyber Command’s Internet War Against ISIL (2018) Islamic State Memo for Dealing with New Recruits (2017) Message to the Mujahidin and the Muslim Ummah, Caliph Al Baghdadi (2014) Zawahiri’s Letter to Zarqawi (2005) The Sykes-Picot Agreement (1916) Wildcard Resource “The America I Have Seen” An account of his time living in the U.S. by theorist of violent jihad Sayyid Qutb.

Summary Thomas Leahy (Website; LinkedIn) and Eleanor Williams (Website; Twitter) join Andrew to discuss the intelligence war during “the Troubles.” Thomas lives in Cardiff and Eleanor lives in Belfast. What You’ll Learn Intelligence The Troubles through the lens of intelligence Some key intelligence players in the Northern Ireland conflict How the IRA and the British Army adapted organizationally The role intelligence played in the end of the conflict Reflections The fluid nature of motivations and intentions How historic narratives shape and constrain the here-and-now And much, much more… Episode Notes From the late 60’s to the late 90’s Republican and Loyalist paramilitaries, and the British and Irish states, were engaged in a period known as “the Troubles”: a struggle to define or redefine the future of the island of Ireland. This is an issue with deep and complex roots, but the intelligence dimension of the period known as the Troubles is fascinating and often overlooked. To help us get our head around it all, Andrew sat down with two specialists to discuss all things intelligence and the Troubles: from the role that MI5 and MI6 played, to the Force Research Unit and the RUC Special Branch, through to how the IRA played the counterintelligence game and the role that informers, agents and moles, such as the notorious “Stakeknife,” played. Thomas is the author of the Intelligence War Against the IRA, while Eleanor is a doctoral candidate comparing intelligence use during the Northern Irish and Colombian conflicts. And… The head of the Republic of Ireland’s police and security intelligence force, the Garda Síochána, is Drew Harris. Drew Harris was a career Royal Ulster Constabulary officer whose father, also a career RUC officer, was killed by the IRA in 1989. He was the first external appointee from outside the Garda. Quote of the Week "What's their [IRA] main role in this intelligence conflict?...one of the key points here…the IRA was quite highly regional regionalized. That's actually quite key to explain why British intelligence had some difficulties against them…Initially, it was set up similar to armed forces. It would have brigades, battalions and companies…the IRA operated this kind of army structure up to 1975…the IRA then switched to this new strategy…And part of this was to prevent mass infiltration, which had started to become a problem, particularly in Belfast pre-1975. So, what it adopted in Belfast and Derry was a cell structure." – Thomas Leahy Resources Books The Intelligence War Against the IRA, T. Leahy (CUP, 2020) Britain’s Secret War Against the IRA, A. Edwards (Merrion, 2021) Thatcher’s Spy, W. Carlin (Merrion, 2019) The Accidental Spy, S. O’Driscoll (Mirror, 2019) Snitch! S. Hewitt (Continuum, 2010) Infiltrating the IRA, R. Gilmour (LB&C, 1998) Fifty Dead Men Walking, M. McGartland (Blake, 1997) Best Books on the Troubles (Five Books) Articles The Murky World of Spying During the Troubles, J. Ware, Irish Times (2017) Alternative Ulster: How Punk Took on the Troubles, T. Heron, Irish Times (2016) Audio MI5 Chameleon Infiltrated New IRA Documentary Spotlight on the Troubles: A Secret History, BBC (2019) The Spy in the IRA, BBC (2017) Web Operation Kenova MI5 in Northern Ireland Primary Sources IRA-MI6 Intermediary: Interviews with Brendan Duddy (2009) Good Friday Agreement (1998) Downing Street Declaration (1993) Anglo-Irish Agreement (1985) Thatcher Speech at Airey Neave Memorial (1979) IRA Green Book (1977) PM Wilson & Thatcher discuss N. Ireland (1975) Secret Meetings Between Government and IRA (1972) Senator E. Kennedy, Ulster is Britain’s Vietnam (1971) IRA Reports on Intelligence Informants (1922) W.B. Yeats, “Easter: 1916” (1921) Oral Sources Duchas Oral History Archive (2014) Wildcard Resource “Murals of Northern Ireland” (4500+ Photographs)

Summary Sean Maloney (Website) joins Andrew (Twitter; LinkedIn) to discuss the secret history of emergency war plans and the nuclear doomsday machine. He was the first Canadian civilian historian to go into combat since WWII. What You’ll Learn Intelligence Top secret emergency war plans for WWIII The role of human intelligence operations in nuclear doomsday planning Some key terms you need to understand the nuclear issue The policy of “massive retaliation” versus “flexible response” Reflections Movies to scare yourself by The best and worst of humanity Episode Notes Sean Maloney is a force of nature. The first Canadian civilian historian to go into combat since WWII - he went to Afghanistan eleven times, survived multiple attempts on his life, and two bomb attacks. “I’ve been shot at, rocketed, mortared, all of it.” He is also a Professor at the Royal Military College of Canada and the author of more than a dozen books, including the “Rogue Historian in Afghanistan” trilogy, as well as another trilogy in the form of the official history of the Canadian Army in Afghanistan. He is never happier, though, than when wading through secret nuclear war plans and documents. Coming on the back of Learning to Love the Bomb (2007) and The Secret History of Nuclear War Films (2020), he returns to “Nukes” in Emergency War Plan: The American Doomsday Machine. Sean has been described as intense and unorthodox, but I found him intense and unorthodox. “Megadeath” is a unit of measurement for nuclear war, equivalent to the death of one million people. It is crazy that as a species we have reached the point where we now have a term for it. Quote of the Week "We have public pronouncements…We have the media and academic discussion of the public pronouncements, but then there's the strategy itself. Which is usually highly classified…that's what I'm getting at with the Emergency War Plan book…you can see all the factors that fed into that, including the intelligence and the intelligence directly affects the plan…there is a direct relationship between the intelligence and the targeting, but it's also in terms of collection of information to get the bombers to the target…that's important because, to have a deterrent posture, that's credible, you have to demonstrate that you're capable of carrying it out." Resources SpyCasts The Nuclear Emergency Search Team – Jack Doyle Nuclear Information Project – Matt Korda Nuclear Threats – Jeffrey Lewis Confessions of a Nuclear War Planner – Daniel Ellsberg Spooks and Nukes – James Acton Books Restricted Data: A History of Nuclear Secrecy in the US, A. Wallerstein (UCP, 2021) The Bomb, S. Kaplan (S&S, 2020) Raven Rock, G. Graff (S&S, 2017) My Journey at the Nuclear Brink, W. Perry (SUP, 2015) The Making of the Atomic Bomb, R. Rhodes (S&S, 1987) Best Books on Nuclear (Five Books) Articles How Many Nuclear Weapons Does Russia Have in 2022? Kristensen & Korda, Bulletin (2022) Doomsday Clock at 100 Seconds to Midnight, Bulletin (2022) The Cold Comfort of MAD, J. Castillo, War on the Rocks (2021) Video 282 Interviews: War and Peace in the Nuclear Age, PBS (1986-89) Power of Decision, USAF (1958) Documentary Sources H. G. Wells – The World Set Free (1914) W.S. Churchill - Shall We All Committ Suicide? (1924) Einstein to Roosevelt (1939) The MAUD Report (1941) The Quebec Agreement (1943) Hiroshima, J. Hersey, New Yorker (1946) The Decision to Use the Atomic Bomb, H.L. Stimson, Harpers (1946) McMahon Act (1946) Truman Announcing First Soviet Bomb (1949) Atoms for Peace – Eisenhower Speech (1953) History of SIOP-62 (1961) Joint Chiefs of Staff Memorandum (1971) The Effects of Nuclear Weapons (1977 [1950]) The Effects of Nuclear War (1979) Oral Sources Voices of the Manhattan Project US Strategic Nuclear Policy, 1945-2004 Wildcard Resource Threads, Movie (M. Jackson, 1984) “Arguably, the most devastating piece of television ever produced”

Summary Volko Ruhnke (Website; Twitter) joins Andrew (Twitter; LinkedIn) to discuss his life and career in the CIA as an analyst and designer of board games. He is a former World Board Game Champion. What You’ll Learn Intelligence Designing board games to teach CIA analysts Moonlighting as an award-winning board game designer while working at CIA Similarities and differences between intelligence analysis and board-games The difference between role-play games and board-games in training national security professionals Reflections Humans are good models of humans Volko’s journey from Virginia to the CIA via William & Mary and the U.S. Army And more… Episode Notes Volko Ruhnke is a helluva interesting guy. He grew up as an avid board gamer raised on stories of the French and Indian War, which led him to design the 2001 winner of the best pre-WWII boardgame Wilderness War. His time at the CIA after 9/11 then led him to design the 2010 winner of the best post-WWII boardgame Labyrinth, where players were immersed in the operational and ideological aspects of the Global War on Terror. It doesn’t stop there, though, he has also designed a series of counter-insurgency games such as Andean Abyss, which focused on 1990’s Columbia, and Fire in the Lake, a multi-faction treatment of the Vietnam War. While teaching a new generation of intelligence analysts, Volko combined both of his passions to help them understand the complexity and open-endedness of the real-world via board games. As an analyst himself, Volko looked at the Soviet & Russian military and counter-proliferation, before going on to be Deputy National Intelligence Officer for Science and Technology at the National Intelligence Council, and then on the Presidents Daily Brief (PDB) staff to brief cabinet level officials. And… Volko is now a commercial board game designer, and you can get quite a few of his games here – but not all of them. One day historians, one day… Quote of the Week "Games allow you to get inside and operate the machine yourself and do experiments and pull a lever or push a button and see what happens. And because it's happening on the tabletop, rather than say, in a computer program, you, you can understand it very well. You can see exactly why what just happened. So, I became among others, a promulgator of, of that particular medium for teaching as well as for analysis." - Volko Ruhnke Resources SpyCasts Intelligence Analysis in the 21st Century - Mark Lowenthal Modern Intelligence Analysis: From Art to Science? Books Storytelling in the Modern Boardgame, A. Arnaudo (McFarland, 2018) White King & Red Queen: Cold War on the Chessboard, D. Johnson (Mariner, 2008) Best Books on Play (Five Books) Articles All the World’s a Game, C. Hadavas, Foreign Policy (2021) Digital Version of Counter-Terror Game Labyrinth, J. Bolding, PCGamer (2020) Winning Edge: Board Game Used by the U.S. Army, P. Suciu, National Interest (2020) Why the CIA Uses Board Games to Train Officers, S. Larson, CNN (2017) The CIA Uses Board Games to Train Officers, S. Machkovech, ArsTechnica (2017) Making Board Games for the CIA, C. Hall, Polygon (2017) Political Board Games Change View of World, M. Thrower, Guardian (2015) Volko Ruhnke Has Become a Hero, J. Albert, WaPo (2014) Video We Review CIA’s Classified Board Game, Two Bats Gaming, (YouTube, 2018) Primary Sources Kingpin: The Hunt for El Chapo (CIA, 2018) Collection Deck (CIA, 2017) Whodunnit? (Wapo, 1985) Wildcard Resource Lego ® Serious Play ® Game Used by Fortune 500 companies, unleasher of talent, and serious fun!

Summary Hans Holmer (LinkedIn) joins Andrew (Twitter; LinkedIn) to discuss his time as a CIA operations officer and his transition to a cyber strategist. He served on every continent except South America and won a CIA Intelligence Star. What You’ll Learn Intelligence The advantages for a case officer growing up in two cultures and speaking multiple languages before joining the IC The tech person trained to be a case officer vs. a case officer trained to be a tech person debate That no amount of technology will make up for a lack of “cyber strategy” The concept of “digital dandruff” Reflections Growing up in Denmark, moving to the US for high school, joining the Army then CIA Privatizing information gains but collectivizing information losses What it was like to program back in 1973! And more… Episode Notes Hans Holmer describes the cat-and-mouse of surveillance and counter-surveillance the most fun you can have (a) in public and (b) sober. Ever wondered how you go from a CIA case officer in the Sub-continent, to a technical counterintelligence evangelist who travelled the world, to a cyber strategist living in Vienna, Austria? To find out, listen to this week’s episode where you’ll find Hans thoughtful and articulate, but I think you will also appreciate his forthright views on corporate data leaks and digital personal responsibility. He originally got in touch to talk about the Operation Silver, the British intelligence operation that covertly tapped the communications of the Soviet Army HQ in Vienna, at SPY we actually have a piece – yes, an actual piece – of the Berlin Tunnel, which was a successor operation – betrayed by communist MI6 officer George Blake – which borrowed heavily from Silver: it was even called Operation Gold! The monitoring station in Op. Silver was disguised as a tweed clothing shop on the assumption that no one in Vienna would be interested in Scottish clothing! Hans actually tracked down the modern site of the tweed store and is trying to dig (no pun intended) for further information on the operation – can anyone help…? Quote of the Week "I've been arguing that the way to improve cyber security in the U.S. is very simple. Any company that loses personally identifiable information, payment card information, healthcare information, HIPAA data, or access to critical infrastructure, has to pay each victim a dollar a day from the beginning of the breach till it's been closed off…the average breach lasts about a hundred days…some of the more recent breaches are a hundred million people. So, imagine a hundred million people who get a dollar a day for a hundred days. Companies would take that seriously." Resources SpyCasts “Operation Gold” - Steve Vogel & Bernd von Kostka (Berlin Tunnel) “George Blake, Happy Traitor” – Simon Kuper (Berlin Tunnel) Zero Days – Nicole Perloth Part I and II (Cyber) “The Cyber Zeitgeist” – Dave Bittner (Cyber) “Snowden & Surveillance” – Barton Gellman (Cyber) Books Betrayal in Berlin, S. Vogel (CH, 2019) Spymaster – MI6 Chief Oldfield, M. Pearce (Transworld, 2016) Documents on the Intelligence War in Berlin, D. Steury (CSI, 1999) Best Books on Cybersecurity (Five Books) Articles “Engineering the Berlin Tunnel,” SII (2008) “Betrayal in Berlin - Review,” WaPo (2019) Documentaries The Great Hack, Noujaim & Amer (2019) Zero Days, A. Gibney (2016) Education Cyber Training Series (DNI) The Danger of Stone Age Habits in a Cyber World (HSToday, 2019) Primary Sources Cyber Security Officer (CIA, 2022) CIA Director Burns - Cyber (WSJ, 2021) National Cyber Strategy of the USA (WH, 2018) Interview with CIA Director Brennan - Cyber (NPR, 2016) The IC’s Role Within Cyber R&D (FAS, 2013) Remarks by DNI Clapper at HPSCI (DNI, 2011) Securing Critical Infrastructure in the Age of Stuxnet (HSGA, 2010) Mail Service of the Soviet Army in Austria (CIA, 1955) Wildcard Resource “Technical Counterintelligence Officer,” INTEL.gov

Summary Enrique “Ric” Prado (LinkedIn) joins Andrew (Twitter; LinkedIn) to discuss his new memoir “Black Ops.” One of the most renowned CIA officers of his generation tells his story. Book You can buy Ric’s book, Black Ops, and support the International Spy Museum’s mission here. What You’ll Learn Intelligence His time as CIA Counterterrorist Chief of Operations which included 9/11 His career battling communist insurgents and Islamic terrorists on multiple continents His experience living in “Contra” camps during the Nicaraguan Revolution His time as Dep. Chief of Station and co-founding member of the Bin Laden Task Force Reflections Conquering your emotions to stay focused in a crisis His journey fleeing the Cuban Revolution as a young boy to CIA via USAF Pararescue And much, much more… Episode Notes Ric Prado spent twenty-four-years in the CIA – and what a twenty-four years it was. His first 36 months were in the jungles of Central America as the first CIA officer to live among the “Contras,” including a period with the Miskito Native people; indeed, the photos he took ending up on the desk of CIA Director Bill Casey. So, what was it like at the pointy end of the Reagan Doctrine’s anti-communist spear, or as CIA Counterterrorist Center Chief of Ops during 9/11? To find out, and to hear more about Ric’s storied career, Andrew sat down with him for this week’s episode. One of the meanings of the noun “legend” is “a story coming down from the past.” Many people who were in the business at the CIA and elsewhere will have heard the stories that come down from the past re Enrique “Ric” Prado, but now we all have a chance to hear Ric set the record straight in his own words. And… If Ric’s communist uncle hadn’t alerted the family that his school intended to send him off to the Soviet Union as a promising student for further education…if he hadn’t taken an Oceanography class at Miami Dade College and met someone who led him to USAF Pararescue…if he hadn’t been tipped off that he was to be killed in a Contra camp during the night and extricated himself from the situation…as Bob Dylan said, summing up so much of the human condition, “one more time, for a simple twist of fate.” Quote of the Week "The wiring was there and the mentoring from my dad…then the trip to the orphanage. And then definitely when I got into pararescue…being one of our special operations forces, the training is very, very intense…And making it through SERE school, making it through mountain climbing school. There's a certain level of conquering your emotions that you have to do…But I think that the most important thing was that I believed in what I was doing." – Ric Prado Resources SpyCast Episodes In the CT Center on 9/11, C. Storer A Life in the CIA, Hank Crumpton Interview with Cofer Black CT, Nicholas Rasmussen CT Strategy: P. Bergen & C. Costa Rethinking CT: J. Blazakis Books The Reagan Doctrine, J. Scott (DUP, 1996) The Real Contra War, T. Brown (UOP, 2001) Insurgency to Stability, “The Philippines,” Rabasa et al., (RAND, 2011) Shining Path’s Politics of War, C. Degregori (UWP, 2012) Red Revolution: Philippine Guerillas, G. Jones (Routeledge, 2019) The Shining Path, Starn & Serna (Norton, 2019) US Relations with Latin America (Five Books) Articles “Shining Path Leader Dead,” BBC (2021) “Nicaragua Veers to Dictatorship,” J. Cordoba, WSJ (2021) Documentaries Nicaragua Was Our Home (L. Shapiro, 1985) Ballad of the Little Soldier (W. Herzog, 1985) Primary Sources President Carter to Somoza (Brown, 1979) Reagan Covert Ops. Nicaragua (NSA, 1981) US Aid to Nicaragua (1982) Reagan Covert Ops. Nicaragua (Brown, 1983) Goldwater to Casey, “I’m Pissed Off” (Brown, 1984) Reagan State Of The Union (APP, 1985) Reagan Address Nicaragua (ReaganLib, 1986) Contras Lost Congress (WaPo, 1986) 25 Years of the NPA (Hartford, 1994) Wildcard Resource The Clash, Sandanista (Album, 1980)

Summary J. Scott Cameron (LinkedIn) joins Andrew (Twitter; LinkedIn) to discuss the National Intelligence University (NIU). He is the President of this unique “skiffed” institution. What You’ll Learn Intelligence o The NIU – what it is, what it does, and what it does differently. o NIU’s position within the American intelligence ecosystem o How NIU “banks knowledge” without compromising intelligence o What it is like to be a student in a Top Secret/Sensitive Compartmentalized Information (TS-SCI) research facility Reflections o 20th century institutions for 21st century problems o Scott’s journey from a plant biologist who has been shot at, to his recruitment into the IC at a high school soccer match, to NIU President And much more… Quote of the Week "We do work in secret. So how do you bank knowledge in that kind of a community? All communities that are healthy bank knowledge and learn from it. So, our job is not just to be a classroom, but to be that defender of knowledge building in the community to make sure that we're learning from ourselves, that we understand ourselves and advance our mission by better ideas and then empowering the next generation to take those and equip them with the confidence to go out there and do something with it." – Scott Cameron Episode Notes “TS-SCI” is one of the major terms you will hear with regards to American intelligence, but what happens if you cross that with the concept of “the university,” a place that relies on sharing information, pooling knowledge, and the free flow of ideas? To find out how this circle is squared, Andrew sat down with President of the National Intelligence University, Scott Cameron. The NIU, which is housed at the Intelligence Community Campus Bethesda (ICCB), alongside our friends at the NCSC and quite a few other agencies, is unique in many ways. It is behind “guards, guns, and gates,” you need TS-SCI clearance to apply, and tuition is courtesy of the government. The staff-student ratio is also in the very top tier of the 4000 or so degree granting institutions in the United States. It transitioned from the DIA to the ODNI in June of 2021. And… Scott’s grandmother was from Glasgow, as was Allan Pinkerton, Bobby Thompson, Craig Ferguson, and Christina Conte (try her fish n’ chips recipe!). Incidentally, there are many more Glasgow’s in the United States than in Scotland, at 21. Further Resources SpyCast Episodes · Joint Special Operations University President “Ike” Wilson Virtual Exhibition · Wall of Spies (ICC-B) Books · China’s Artificial Intelligence Ecosystem, R. Uber (2020) · History of American Higher Ed., R. Geiger (2016) · Higher Ed. & the Growth of Knowledge, M. Segre (2015) · NIU’s Role in Interagency Research, Johnson et al. (2013) Articles · Eisenhower Signs National Defense Intelligence Ed. Act (Politico, 2018) · Goldwater-Nichols & the Evolution of JPME (CRS, 2016) · The Origins of JPME (JFQ, 2005) Audio · NIU Moving Under ODNI Umbrella (FedNewsNet, 2021) Websites · NIU Degrees (NIU) · NIU Catalog, 2021-22 (NIU) · College of Strategic Intelligence (NIU) · School of Science & Technology Intelligence (NIU) · Institute for Intelligence Research (NIU) · IC Centers for Academic Excellence (DNI) Primary Sources · The American Scholar, R. Waldo Emerson (Em.Cent., 1837) · The Idea of a University, J. H. Newham (1852, 1858) · National Defense Education Act of 1958 (FedEdPolicy) · Degree Granting Authority for NIU (GovInfo, 2012) · US Intelligence Community’s Human Capital Vision 2020 (DNI, 2014) · The National Intelligence Strategy of the US (DNI, 2019) · NIC - Global Trends 2040 (DNI, 2021) Wildcard Resource How to set up a “SCIF,” aka: · “Technical Specifications for Construction & Management of Sensitive Compartmented Information Facilities” (DNI, 2020)

Summary David Fricker (Website; LinkedIn) had the No.2 job at Australia’s security and intelligence agency ASIO. He sat down with Andrew (Twitter; LinkedIn) to discuss the relationship between this role and his most recent one as Director-General of the National Archives of Australia. What You’ll Learn… Intelligence o ASIO, the Australian intelligence landscape and the region o His role as CIO and then Deputy-Director General of ASIO o The role major allies & partners play including the US and Five Eyes (FVEY) o David’s views on intelligence and public trust Reflections o David’s abiding interest in the power of information o The importance of museums and archives in a knowledge society And much more… Episode Notes Ever wondered what it would be like to go from gamekeeper to poacher, spy chief to chief archivist and - as this week's guest said tongue-in-cheek - the “biggest blabber-mouth in the country”? If the answer is yes, you’ll appreciate this week’s guest David Fricker, who has had all manner of interesting jobs, including a ten-year stint with the Australian Security Intelligence Organisation (ASIO), akin to the FBI and MI5, followed by ten years with the National Archives of Australia. By way of information, the “Australian Intelligence Community” is also comprised of: the Australian Secret Intelligence Service (ASIS), similar to the CIA; Defence Intelligence Organisation (DIO), similar to the DIA; the Australian Signals Directorate (ASD), similar to the NSA; and Australian Geo-spatial Intelligence Organization (AGO), similar to the NGA; and Office of National Intelligence (ONI), similar to the ODNI. And… David was a pretty mean COBOL programmer back in the day, a computer language that grew out of a Department of Defence sponsored program to find a common business language. You can learn it here. It is a legacy software system across the U.S. government and you can command six-figure salaries if you can program in it: any retirement plans David? Quote of the Week "I think what the SPY museum does and what I hope we do at the National Archives in Australia, gets back to the public...some of it can be quite entertaining. It can be quite engaging and fun, but the work we do has got a serious message as well. And I think it's to make sure the public in a liberal democracy, the public should know. What espionage, what spycraft is all about." – David Fricker Further Resources SpyCasts o “Desperately, Madly in Love” – Brett Peppler and the Australian IC o “I was a Presidential Daily Briefer on 9/11” – Mike Morell & President Bush Virtual Exhibition o Spy: Espionage in Australia (NAA) Books o Spies & Sparrows: ASIO & the Cold War, P. Deery (2022) o Between Five Eyes, A. Wells (2020) o Intelligence & the Function of Government, D. Baldino & E. Crawley (2018) o The Official History of ASIO – 3 Volumes, D. Horner, J. Blaxland, R. Crawley (2014/2015/2016) Articles o “Strategic Intelligence Practice in the Australian IC,” P. Walsh & M. Harrison, INS, 2021) o “The Post-9/11 Evolution of an Australian National Security Community,” D. Jones, INS (2016) o “ASIO Debate”, L. Clohesy, The Conversation (2014) Audio o Spymasters & Secret Agents: the Birth of ASIO (ABC, 2022) o ASIO’s Official History, J. Blaxland (The Conversation, 2015) Documentary o Final Rendezvous (ABC, 2020) Websites o ASIO (ASIO) o NAA (NAA) Primary Sources o Letter to Petrov from Prime Minister Menzies (1954) o Royal Commission on Espionage Report (1955) o ASIO Report on Ric Throssell (1971-74, NAA) o Report on ASIO (NLA, 1977) o Australian Intelligence, 1900-1950 (NAA, 1977) o Soviet Embassy Contact with Members of Parliament (1971-86) o ASIO Annual Report 2020-21 (2021, ASIO) Further Research o History of Intelligence & Security (NAA) o US-Australia Diplomatic Oral Histories (ADST) Wildcard Resource Pine Gap o A fictional portrayal of a real-world AUS-US spy site in Central Australia (Netflix, 2018)

Summary Joe Weisberg (Twitter) joins Andrew (Twitter; LinkedIn) to discuss his new book on Russia. Joe is the creator of award-winning TV drama The Americans and a former CIA officer. What You’ll Learn Intelligence o His past experience as a hardliner who loved to hate the “evil empire” o His thoughts on a trip through the Soviet Union and Eastern Europe in the twilight of the Cold War, especially experiencing it as an American Jew o His interpretation of the KGB and Vladimir Putin o His take on the “moral equivalency” argument and U.S. foreign policy ·Reflections o The role of complexity vs. simplicity in understanding “the Other” o Joe’s journey from the Chicago suburbs of Illinois to Langley to New York City And much, much more… Episode Notes “How dare you, Joe Weisberg, make me rethink my comfortable loathing of the Russians.” Not Andrew’s words, but those of former chief of CIA counterintelligence James Olson in an encomium for the book (albeit a little tongue-in-cheek). If that is not enough to get you intrigued in Joe’s new book, Russia Upside Down, then perhaps the sub-title will, An Exit Strategy for the Second Cold War. So how do we get out of the Second Cold War? To find out Joe’s diagnosis and prognosis, and much else besides, Andrew sat down with him for this week’s episode. A fair number of listeners will know of Joe as creator of the award-winning and hugely popular TV series, The Americans, some may even know that he had a three-and-a-half-year stint in the CIA where he trained to be a case officer; a few may even be a know him from his stint at the Agency which began on the eve of the dissolution of the Soviet Union. And… The Americans is set in and around NoVa which is replete with all manner of famous sites from intelligence history – including the Arlington home of real-life Russian illegals Nataliya Pereverzeva and Michael Zottoli Mikhail Kutsik who were rolled up by the FBI in 2010 as part of Operation Ghost Stories” which we cover in our exhibits. Quote of the Week "When I was working at the CIA and in my younger years, I had a very one-dimensional view of this evil empire, this totalitarian state that we had to fight because we were the good guys, and we were the bad guys. And the book that I've written is essentially a kind of argument with myself or me with my younger self to say, huh, I think you were not looking at that in all the complexity that you might have." – Joe Weisberg FURTHER RESOURCES SpyCasts o KGB Illegal Jack Barsky here and here o The Spymasters Prism: CIA Legend Jack Devine on Countering Russian Aggression o 2010 Russian Spy Case – KGB Major General Oleg Kalugin o Spy Sites of Washington D.C. Books o Putin’s People: How the KGB Took Back Russia, Catherine Belton (2020) o The New Tsar: Rise & Reign of Vladimir Putin, Steven Lee Myers (2016). o Spy Handler: Memoir of a KGB Officer - The Man Who Recruited Robert Hanssen & Aldrich Ames, Victor Cherkashin (2004) o The Caucasus, Thomas De Waal (2018) o Khrushchev's Thaw and National Identity in Soviet Azerbaijan, Jamil Hasanli (2014) o The Best Books on Contemporary Russia (Five Books) Articles o “Dictatorship and Double Standards,” Jeane Kirkpatrick, Commentary (1979) o NATO Enlargement & Russia (NATO, 2014) o “False Equivalence” & “Tu Quoque”, IEP Documentaries o The Putin Interviews (ShowTime, 2017) o Cold War 2.0, Vice/HBO (2015) Primary Sources o Russian-Chinese Relations (CIA, 1998) o Putin’s Munich Speech, (WaPo, 2007) o Interview With KGB/SVR Illegal (Chekist Monitor, 2020) o U.S. Ambassadors to Russia Interviewed (NSA) o US-Russia Oral Histories (ADST) o Archival Research on Russia (NSA) Enjoy the show? Please leave a review here.

Summary David Cattler (Twitter; LinkedIn) joins Andrew (Twitter; LinkedIn) to discuss how intelligence functions at NATO. He is the NATO Assistant Secretary General for Intelligence and Security. What You’ll Learn o What it is like to be the leader of intelligence and security across the largest peacetime alliance in history? o How does intelligence come together at NATO – who are the key-players, institutions, and stakeholders? o What are some of the main challenges facing the Alliance including Russia and Cyber? o “Reading” an institution and its key players o The importance of “soft skills” in professional life Episode Notes Every polisci student knows from their Plato to NATO class, that NATO is (a) considered the most successful alliance of its kind in history and (b) was founded in 1949. As you can imagine, intelligence is incredibly important to the whole endeavor, so why has NATO only had an intelligence supremo since 2016? To find out the answer, and much else besides, Andrew sat down with David Cattler. David is (a) the principal advisor on intelligence to the NATO Secretary General and (b) the lead for coordinating intelligence relationships between NATO and the 75 individual intelligence agencies across its 30 constituent nations (talk about herding cats). With Russian forces built up on the Ukrainian border in February 2022, the timing of this episode is, well, germane. And… Andrew picked David up outside the U.S. Department of State and drove him to the SpyCast studio at SPY – if the traffic is right, you can do it in under 10 minutes! Quote of the Week "The secretary general is my boss but imagine him in this context to put it in a different frame is that he is the CEO of a large international conglomerate that engages in multiple business lines. And I am the CEO of the business line for intelligence and security. The nation's intelligence services in effect are my corporate board. So, they provide that governance and the oversight for all the work." – David Cattler Further Resources SpyCasts o Able Archer 83: An Interview with Nate Jones o Our Latest Long War: An Interview with Ben Jones Books o Enduring Alliance: A History of NATO & the Postwar Global Order, Timothy Andrews Sayle (2019) o How NATO Adapts: Strategy & Organization in the Alliance Since 1950, Seth A. Johnson (2017) o The Memoirs of General Lord Ismay, Lord Ismay (1960) o Present at the Creation, Dean Acheson (1969) o The Best Books on Contemporary Russia (Five Books) Video o What is NATO, Why Does it Exist, and How Does it Work? (NATO) o How Does a Country Join NATO? (NATO) Documentary o The Cold War, Narrated by Kenneth Branagh (CNN 1998) Websites o NATO Declassified (NATO) o NATO (Atlantic Council) o NATO (RUSI) Primary Sources o The North Atlantic Treaty (1949) o Address by Harry S. Truman on the Signing of the North Atlantic Treaty (1949) o North Atlantic Council – First Session – Summary Minutes (1949) o Historical Holdings on NATO (Eisenhower Library) o The NATO Problem: French Forces in Europe (CIA, 1966) o Being NATO’s Secretary General on 9/11 (2011) o USNATO Oral Histories (ADST) Enjoy the show? Please leave a review here

"The Wright Brothers of the U.S. Drone Warfare Program." That is how some people have referred to this week's guests, Alec Bierbauer and Mark Cooter. Andrew sat down with them to dig into drones and their intelligence implications.

This was the most popular episode of 2020. Apparently, people are interested in the views of former GCHQ Director, Joint Intelligence Committee Chair, and first UK Security and Intelligence Coordinator on, well - how spies think. I am sure David – now a Visiting Professor at Kings College, London – has a few thoughts on the subject. Hear Andrew debrief this week’s guest on the insights derived from a career spent at the summit of British intelligence. 1 Book, 2 Glaswegians, 10 Lessons in Intelligence. It’s simple, really. Sláinte!

Alexis Albion – star of our 500th episode anniversary special – is a very good friend of the current Undersecretary for Arms Control & International Security, Bonnie Jenkins. Way back when, they were both on the 9/11 Commission Report – while Alexis’ focus was on the CIA and counterterrorism before the attacks, Bonnie’s was on the DOD and counterterrorism – tiny subjects, I know. In this week’s episode, hear two old friends reminisce, reflect, and put the world to rights. Move over Saturn, get out of the way Jupiter, two huge brains are a comin’ through.

Spook. Warrior. Author. This week’s guest is one helluva interesting guy. He was in a clandestine Special Forces unit in Berlin during the Cold War, “stay behinds” who would sabotage, subvert and generally wreak havoc should World War III break out. He was badly wounded after driving over a land-mine in Somalia in 1992, almost losing his entire leg and suffering a serious head injury. In a subsequent life, James was a CIA officer in Africa when the US embassies were blown up in Kenya and Tanzania and saw the Agency pivot in the aftermath of 9/11. Oh, did I mention, he also dabbles in combat archaeology. “Hours and hours of boredom punctuated by moments of sheer terror.” If this sounds like your last trip down the I-95, listening to your blowhard uncle at Thanksgiving, or what it’s like to watch Jets vs. Giants, it’s purely coincidence – for it’s how this week’s guest characterized Army life.

Project Prometheus. In the words of ex-Delta Force author Brad Taylor, “Super Double Daddy Bad Classified.” If you’re looking to find a podcast that helps break down the complexities of Chinese foreign policy through the vehicle of a page-turner written by a NYT Bestselling Author, you’ve arrived at the right doorstep my friend. Brad does serious research. He is also funny, down-to-earth, and super-duper interesting. Por ejemplo, on his first date with his now wife, he told her he was going to join Special Forces and write a novel – after 21 years in the military, including many years in a special mission unit, Brad has now written 15. We talk through American Traitor, Pike Logan, his writing process (and Chinese foreign policy).

I was really good at buying drugs, which is how I got recruited into narcotics. Apparently, I make a really good crackhead.” “Frankly, fact-checking doesn’t matter in today’s world.” Intrigued? You should be. Avril and Lisa are absolutely fascinating! Avril built an intelligence team for the Attorney General’s Office in Pennsylvania, from scratch. Her unit collected strategic intel on narcotics trends and went on to predict the methamphetamine trend before it even hit the Keystone State. Lisa was the Digital Director for Angus King of Maine, a Senator on the Select Committee on Intelligence, the Armed Services Committee, and the Energy & Natural Resources Committee. Hmmmm…do you think those committees might have digital information foreign adversaries might be interested in…Get the full skinny on Avril – CSO for Github - and Lisa – CEO of Alethea Group - in this week’s SpyCast. Because intel is regional too.

Post 9/11, special operations and intelligence worked together side-by-side, shoulder-to-shoulder and hand-in-glove (or any other heavily-hyphenated term you care to mention that connotates BFFness). What will happen with the relationship now, though, and in American history how have these two important components of national security related to each other? Enter the Joint Special Operations University (JSOU), located in Tampa, Florida, and more particularly their President Isaiah “Ike” Wilson, who sits down with Andrew for this week’s episode of #SpyCast. “I think, therefore I am” Nope. “I think, therefore I do”

Beijing. New Delhi. Kathmandu. “Hang on, I thought the title said FBI, not CIA?” Well, it did. Kathy Stearman was an FBI Legat who lived and worked in all of those capital cities. “Well, I’ve heard of the Ambassador and the Station Chief, but not the Legat?” Well, that’s why you need to listen to this week’s SpyCast! Kathy Stearman is a retired FBI Special Agent and author of It’s Not About the Gun: Lessons From my Global Career as a Female FBI Agent (I know the title sounds like Lance Armstrong’s It’s Not About the Bike, but Kathy is not a sociopath who will rip your heart out after you invest in her story: I promise). Kathy spent a large part of her career working Chinese counter-intelligence – including time in San Francisco and New York City (I hope the FBI has a generous rent allowance!) – and she speaks fluent Mandarin. BUY THE BOOK FROM OUR ONLINE INDEPENDENT BOOKSTORE: HERE

The Committee on Public Information (CPI) is the first and only Ministry of Propaganda the United States has ever had. It started one week after the United States entered World War I in April of 1917; in fact, there wasn't even conscription for some weeks, but the Committee on Public Information was created right away. Why? To explore this question, and to learn more about the CPI, Andrew sat down with journalist, professor and Vietnam veteran Jack Hamilton (yes, actually sat down, like face-to-face, eyeball-to-eyeball!).

Doug London is thoughtful and reflective – but he doesn’t pull his punches and he candidly shares his analysis of the contemporary intelligence landscape. In this second part, Doug reflects on the path taken after 9/11, the CIA at the crossroads, and why human intelligence (HUMINT) will remain central to the vast and increasingly technologically sophisticated world of intelligence. Also, hear about a superstar counterintelligence operative Doug is currently running – although there is also a rumor, she might be playing the game for herself – listen to find out more…

This week’s guest believes that espionage is about the “human soul…[it’s] a very intimate profession…the relationship between a case officer and an agent and the need to really have…a profound insight window into their life and their souls.” Doug London may be accused of many things, but you can’t say he’s shallow. His book, The Recruiter, is based on a 34 year career and can be purchased from our online independent bookstore. Next week we’ll hear more about Doug’s career, his views on CIA at the cross-roads, the centrality of human intelligence to the intelligence business, despite profound technological change, as well what he calls the Lost Art of American Intelligence.

He was a Soviet agent who was “turned” by Karl Marx after reading Das Kapital – which led him to give up the important operations, a host of MI6 agents and a treasure trove of secret intelligence… George Blake was a courier in the Dutch resistance, an MI6 intelligence officer, a language student at Cambridge, a “Vice-Consul” in South Korea, a prisoner in North Korea, and a hero returning to Britain in 1953. He would escape from a British prison after getting caught and would live out the rest of his life as “The Happy Traitor” in Moscow before dying in 2020. What did author Simon Kuper think when he sat down to personally interview Blake before his death? Well, you’ll have to listen to find out. SpyCast listeners can win free copies of the book by entering here: https://bit.ly/3mW1YmL

He has worked as a counterintelligence analyst at the FBI and the DIA. He speaks Russian. He was personally supervised by Robert Hanssen. He has an obsession with Soviet Defectors… “Freedom has many difficulties,” said JFK in his Berlin Speech, “and democracy is not perfect, but we have never had to put a wall up to keep our people in.” What was it like to leave that type of system, though, to come from behind the Iron Curtain and cross the East-West physical and ideological divide? Kevin Riehle has spent many years studying Soviet defectors and their motivations, and he is the author of Soviet Defectors: Revelations of Renegade Intelligence Officers, 1924-1954.

Nada Bakos is a former CIA analyst and Chief Targeting Officer, Mark Fallon was an NCIS Special Agent and Director of the Criminal Investigative Task Force at Guantanamo, Frank Snepp is a former chief analyst of North Vietnamese Strategy for the CIA during the Vietnam War. Mark Zaid - one of the nation’s top national security lawyers - joins Andrew to help break the issue down. This week’s guests discuss their motivations, frustrations, victories and defeats in publishing, “The Targeter: My Life in the CIA Hunting Terrorists and Challenging the White House”; “Unjustifiable Means: The Inside Story of How the CIA, Pentagon and US Government Conspired to Torture”; and, “Decent Interval: An Insider’s Account of Saigon’s End Told by the CIA’s Chief Strategy Analyst in Vietnam.”

Description: It’s one of the most haunting murder cases you’ll ever hear about, and it takes place in a small town in Israel. Tair Rada was only 13-years-old when her body was found inside a locked bathroom stall. She was viciously murdered during a school day, and yet no one saw or heard a thing. The police arrested the janitor, Roman Zadorov, and he eventually confessed, but this was far from being the end of it. Based on the hit true-crime series from Netflix, the podcast "Shadow of Truth" will take you on a journey into one of the wildest and most contested murder cases in the history of Israel, as it reaches its final resolution, 15 years after it all started. Link to Clip http://wondery.fm/SOT_SpyCast

From the SpyCast Field of Dreams: to coincide with the first game of the 117th World Series, a special episode on the links – yes, there are many – between espionage and America’s Pastime with baseball fanatic and ex-spook (it’s a baseball special, not Halloween, so no pun intended) Marc Polymeropoulos. Baseball fans, welcome to espionage; espionage fans, welcome to baseball; fans of both – welcome to our very own Fall Classic. #baseball #worldseries

On October 17, 2001, Team Alpha were dropped into the mountains of northern Afghanistan. Two of the eight appear in this week’s episode alongside the author of a new book telling the story of the first Americans behind enemy lines after 9/11 – and what a story it is. Justin Sapp was a Green Beret detailed to CIA, he would go on to be a commander in the Asymmetric Warfare Group, and is currently Senior Military Advisor to the U.S. Mission to the United Nations. David Tyson was a polyglot former Central Asian academic who fought jihadists at close-hand to help his comrade, ex-Marine Mike Spann, the first American casualty in a war that would go on to become the longest in American history. In an extended podcast that is both conversation and historical document: this is their story. Award-winning journalist and author Toby Harnden helps contextualize the story of Team Alpha. You can learn more about the book here.

This is a big one, a very big one: our 500th episode & 15th anniversary We have come a long way since we began back in 2006 – it’s quite fitting then, that in this week’s episode I speak to our very first historian and curator, Alexis Albion, who is currently the Curator for Special Projects here at the Spy Museum Alexis actually left us way back when to be on the 9/11 Commission Report, where she was the central researcher on the CIA and US counterterrorism policy before 9/11. Hang on, did you just say what I think you said, she was the central researcher on the CIA…? Yup. I know, what the hell, right, we’ve been sitting on this story all this time! Episode 500 is a good time to thank two of the behind-the-scenes unsung technical heroes – Mike and Memphis who have been involved with more SpyCast’s than anyone else. They are awesome. They are great guys, and they rock. Other people who have been involved in the content side of SpyCast have included Peter Earnest and Chris Costa, our former and current Exec Director, as well as my other predecessors in the Historian & Curator role: Thomas Bogart, Mark Stout and Vince Houghton. The show would of course be nothing without our guests, who have contributed their time, expertise and experience to help educate, inform and occasionally entertain the public on the vitally important matters of intelligence and espionage. Sometimes this past year I have felt like Churchill, in that he got the job he had always coveted: but under the least auspicious circumstances. It has been emotional people, but, we are getting there. Here’s to the next 500. Sláinthe.

From your Visa card to your Outlook account, and from the gas you pump into your Ford to your Windows operating system, a cyber struggle is taking place all around us. In this episode Andrew spoke to founder of Microsoft’s threat hunting intelligence center John Lambert, which tracks the world’s most dangerous cybercriminals and state-affiliated hackers, and the head of the Digital Security Unit Cristin Goodwin, who helps provide security support to governments and works closely with John’s team. Microsoft has billions of customers, serves millions of businesses, and works with almost every government department: to say it might have something to do with information and intelligence would be like saying perhaps it would have been a good idea to have bought buy some shares when it first went public in 1986 (June 2021 it was valued at 2 trillion dollars!).

He is the Horatio Alger of the CIA. His first job was punching paper. He went on to be a Station Chief. He worked for every directorate. He lived in several continents. He was in the Soviet Union for six years. He was caught up in the molehunt for Robert Hanssen. He survived to tell his tale. Christopher is genial, hearty and now lives in the other Washington (the rainy state on the West Coast, not the rainy town in Northern England) in the foothills of the Cascade Mountains, where he writes for our friends at Clearance Jobs. He tweets @burgessct

What do you get if you cross a Greek Orthodox guy from Athens and a Jewish girl from Long Island; and then mix in two Ivy League degrees and a 26-year career in the Central Intelligence Agency? If you haven’t worked out that this refers to Marc, given that he is mentioned in the episode title, you can probably forget ever having a career in intelligence. Mark is brimming with vitality, chock full of stories, and can talk baseball and wings as well as the finer points of Algerian politics or US grand strategy in the Middle East. If you ever pull up a bar stool next to Mark: you’ve hit a home run! Mark’s new book, Clarity in Crisis: Leadership Lessons From the CIA, distills the insights he derived from his career and is available in the International Spy Museum’s bookshop.

As the 20th anniversary of 9/11 approached Peter Bergen sought to reevaluate the man responsible for precipitating America’s long wars with al-Qaeda and its descendants. Bergen produced the first television interview with bin Laden in 1997. He has had years to reflect on and study the man. In his new book The Rise and Fall of Osama bin Laden he captures all the dimensions of his life: family man, zealot, battlefield commander, terrorist leader, and fugitive. Join International Spy Museum Historian and Curator Andrew Hammond in conversation with Bergen about the many contradictions he finds in bin Laden and why his legacy lives on despite his failure at achieving any of his strategic goals. Bergen, a Vice President at New America, is the author or editor of nine books, including three New York Times bestsellers and four Washington Post best nonfiction books of the year. He is a national security analyst for CNN and has testified before congressional committees 18 times about national security issues. Thanks to exclusive interviews with family members and associates, and documents unearthed only recently, Bergen has used the knowledge he has gained in the intervening years to discover who bin Laden really was and why he continues to inspire a new generation of jihadists.

Dave Terry was with Vice President Cheney on the morning of 9/11. He started work as a PDB briefer the same day as Mike. He went on to be Chief of the PDB. He started out working on grain production at the CIA in 1979. He comes from Kansas. For the rest, it’s best if you hear Dave. “And I think for any intelligence officer, what you're doing is often overwhelming, whether you're in front of the President, or a vice president, or the asset that you're trying to debrief, or your colleagues…And the stakes often are life and death.”

Mike Morell was with President Bush on the morning of 9/11. He saw the President several times that day. Ten years later he was with President Obama for the bin Laden raid. He was former Acting and Deputy Director of the CIA. He comes from Ohio. For the rest, it’s best if you hear Mike. “I believe that when we get to the end of the trail, we’re going to find al Qaeda, and we’re going to find an Osama bin Laden. I told him that I was so confident in that judgment that I would bet my children’s future on it.”

Kristin Wood was at CIA HQ on the morning of 9/11. Phil Mudd was at the National Security Council. Kristin was a PDB briefer for the VP’s National Security Advisor. Phil was Director for Gulf Affairs. They would go on to work counterterrorism together. Kristen has a Wheaton Terrier. Phil has a farm. For the rest, it’s best if you hear Kristin and Phil. “… knowing that every day, you had to deliver relevant information to the nation's leaders, it is a feeling of enormous responsibility that all of the 1000s and 1000s and 1000s of intelligence officers who have done amazing work, you want to represent it faithfully.” I just I didn't want to be alone. I didn't know what was going on. So I stayed at a friend's house, maybe a mile or two from my house just watching through the downing of the Towers. And at that point, I said, I'm going home. My only other memories are realizing I couldn't go to the White House.

It was the 1980’s. “I don't think they'll ever have the fun I had that year, at 23 years old, going to the White House and the NSC, briefing cabinet members…I mean, you name it. It was just incredible!” Three years into her CIA career, Diana Bolsinger found herself on point as the sole person working on the Afghanistan account in her department. Thereafter, she was Acting Deputy to the Ambassador to the Afghan Resistance (“mujahedeen”), a political officer in Islamabad, an analyst at the Counterterrorism Center (CTC), and received multiple awards including for her role in investigating the Boston Marathon bombing. She has a serious Afghanistan/Pakistan resume; Al Qaeda were on her radar from 1990; and, she oozes calm, measured, thoughtful analysis. Ladies & gentlemen: Diana Bolsinger.

Turning the tide in the Pacific at the Battle of Midway, establishing secure communications on the beaches during D-Day, staving off nuclear Armageddon – what did cryptology ever have to do with anything, right? To discuss these big themes – and to celebrate our partnership on the exhibition “Codes, Ciphers and Mysteries” – we brought back you know who, Executive Director of the National Cryptologic Museum (NCM) and former SpyCast host, Vince Houghton (Retd). Through the end of September 2021, you can see the NCM’s superstar artifacts here at SPY before they return to their home base at Fort Meade. Sssshhhhh, though…No Such Museum.

Codes. Ciphers. Mysteries. This week’s guests are fascinated by codebreaking and cryptography: as well they should be! The Voynich Manuscript, the Dorabella Letter, The Beale Papers, the Zodiac Cipher, Kryptos – so much history, intrigue, and speculation. Andrew sat down with Elonka Dunin, code-breaker extraordinaire, and Klaus Schmeh, a world leading expert on the history of cryptography, to discuss the cat-and-mouse game between code-makers and code-breakers across the ages from ancient cuneiform up to quantum cryptography. Word to the wise: their book has been described by Sir Dermot Turing as “the best book on codebreaking I have ever read, a must for would be recruits to GCHQ and the NSA.”