422: Election Madness and Terminal Emulators

Election Madness and Terminal Emulators

[00:00:00] Introduction and Host Greetings

[00:00:00] Jeff: Hello, brand new America. This is the Overtired podcast. Uh, I’m Jeff Severns Guntzel. I got Christina Warren with me. Hi, Christina.

[00:00:14] Christina: Hi, Jeff. Um,

[00:00:16] Brett’s Health Update

[00:00:16] Jeff: you follow Brett on social media, uh, and maybe if you don’t, uh, you will now know that he is having some health issues. Um, and, uh, and we wish him so well. He is not here with us.

[00:00:28] Christina: he is not here with us. He’s, he’s with us in spirit. We hope that he’s doing well and that we figure out, hopefully, you know, by the time this episode goes up, he’ll be closer to figuring out why he’s been having some, uh, some fainting spells and some other stuff, which is super, super scary. So, and a fucking terrible week for it.

[00:00:45] I mean, it’s a terrible week in general, but like, of all the weeks for like, you know, to have to have like a health crisis on top of everything else.

[00:00:52] Jeff: Yeah, it’s like the only week that would also explain that particular health

[00:00:55] crisis. I’m not saying It’s I’m definitely

[00:00:58] Christina: no, no, Oh, no, [00:01:00] no, no. It doesn’t seem to be, but no, but yeah, totally. It is one of those things. Well, the thing is, if it hadn’t started like before Tuesday, I think that that would have been um, like, if I were the ER doctor, I’d be like, are we sure this isn’t just a stress response?

[00:01:16] Jeff: right. Yeah. Are we sure there’s not people across America passing out consistently right now?

[00:01:22] No. Uh, feel better, Brett. Uh, and

[00:01:26] it just sucks, and hopefully he figures it out, and if you do follow him on social media, send him, send him well wishes, um, and hope that he posts no more photos of himself from the ER.

[00:01:36] Christina: Yeah. For real. For real. Um, and, and, and, and, Very sad. Um, and, and if you’re either a doctor or an armchair doctor, please respond to him, um, with, um, suggestions for how you can solve his medical problem without actually knowing what his symptoms and, and situation is, because I know he will love that.

[00:01:58] Jeff: That’s a little special request he sent [00:02:00] through us.

[00:02:00] Christina: It is. It is. It is.

[00:02:01] Jeff: and we, we like to take care of him.

[00:02:03] Christina: We, we, we do. Just, just say that, you know, Christina and Jeff wanted to make sure that he doesn’t get any sleep.

[00:02:08] Jeff: Yeah, definitely. And if you’ve Googled this thing or something, you know, let him know the first thing you see, cause that’s sometimes the best thing.

[00:02:15] Christina: Yeah, it’s, it’s never the worst. It’s never gonna freak anybody out or like take them down another sort of spiral. It’s never gonna do anything else. No, um, please don’t, please don’t actually do that.

[00:02:23] Medical Advice and ChatGPT Discussion

[00:02:23] Christina: And, and, and Brett, if you’re, if you’re listening to this, please don’t, like, WebMD yourself. Like, we, we all know that, we all know the, the fear of, or, or at this point, okay, mindfuck.

[00:02:39] People are, because I’m already probably thinking of doing this, people aren’t going to WebMD themselves anymore. They’re just going to ChatGPT their symptoms.

[00:02:47] Jeff: Yeah, yeah, yeah, which is, which can be not helpful. Probably can be helpful in some scenarios, but can

[00:02:53] Christina: I was going to say in

[00:02:54] Jeff: And you can’t know, is the point.

[00:02:56] Christina: I was going to say, like, I actually firmly believe [00:03:00] that if you had a really good medical LLM, or like, like a medical version of ChatGPT, which frankly, that’s what, that’s what OpenAI should do. They should start making like specialized, like off the shelf LLMs.

[00:03:10] So we’re doing things specifically for certain industries that are models that are tuned similar to like GitHub Copilot, like where things that are like, Hey, this is tuned on medical analysis and information and we can have statistical data and, and we can refine the parameters so that, um, uh, certain functions are not happening, um, you know, like, um, non deterministically but are actually happening on a deterministic system.

[00:03:32] So like math and things like that are always going to be correct, but we can make sure that like the, the, the training data is good. Like. Um, I could actually see, you know, that being a really, I mean, already doctors are using it and they’ve used, you know, like, uh, you know, things for years to be able to kind of like run through symptoms and try to get, you know, like, things back.

[00:03:51] But like, you could see, and, you know, that be, you know, really, really good, like, diagnostic, and like, uh, analysis tool, right? [00:04:00] Um, and, and even for like, lay people, if you even had like a, a, again, you know, like, OpenAI, like, make this, make, make the medical grade one for the doctors, but then also make, like, a home version where, like, people can pay, like, 40 a quarter on addition to their ChatGPT, you know, plus bill, and they can get, like, the personal, you know, MD sort of thing, and, like, get, like, you know, like, talk to your doctor about this, um, but, like, yeah, I mean, I guess you’d have to get chemical compliance, but, Anyway, I’m coming up with all kinds of business ideas for, for OpenAI.

[00:04:35] Jeff: rich by the end of this podcast, probably.

[00:04:38] Christina: no, I mean, it won’t be, but like, and God only knows, like, what it’ll cost them to actually run those things.

[00:04:44] Jeff: What about just a, what if, what if our goal could be by the end of this podcast to just have a little walking around money? Yeah. Yeah.

[00:04:49] We don’t have to

[00:04:49] Christina: that would be great.

[00:04:50] Jeff: Yeah, I

[00:04:51] guess

[00:04:51] Christina: mean, I would love it.

[00:04:52] Jeff: gives us, is a little bit of walking around money.

[00:04:54] Um, Yeah. I, uh, there’s a funny, um, my, um, [00:05:00] there’s somebody in my life who was in the ER recently, I won’t be, I won’t give any indications, but she gave birth to me, um, and, and, she was, she got tested for something and then was reading the results You know, you’re in the ER and you’re, you have results, but you’re still waiting for a room for somebody to talk to you.

[00:05:20] You can’t help but look at them. And she, she texts me and she says, it says, I have a collapsed bladder. I don’t, I’m eager to know what that means. And I was like, yeah, no, probably it doesn’t mean anything bad because. Medical language is funny. And what occurred to me is it might mean that you just don’t have any pee. And, and sure enough, she got to the doctor, she’s all worried about the like, collapsed bladder. What does it mean? It just means your bladder is empty. Oh, right.

[00:05:48] Christina: Amazing. Amazing. Yeah. And, and, and that’s

[00:05:51] Jeff: sound good.

[00:05:52] Christina: no, no, but see, that’s actually a great example again of like a personal, like medical, like jargon thing. Like what does this mean? Like honestly, [00:06:00] even putting aside, okay, genuine like product idea and it doesn’t have to be OpenAI. Anybody could do this.

[00:06:05] Because in this case, you wouldn’t have to be necessarily, I mean, it would be better if you were fine tuned on like, you know, medical, um, uh, books and, and, and things like that. But, but, but it wouldn’t strictly even have to be. So just having like a, a, a well tuned kind of like personal, you know, explainer be like, I can type in what this medical term is from my doctor’s office and this is going to tell me in real language what it actually is.

[00:06:30] Jeff: Yeah, that’s, I love that. Yeah. I’m gonna actually, I’m sure she could have seen this on Google, although she didn’t seem to. I’m in ChatGPT, or in the most recent Roderick on the Line, John Roderick called it ChattyG, which is really amazing, and

[00:06:44] I, I, it’s so in my head that when I

[00:06:46] opened Alfred just now, I started typing ChattyG.

[00:06:50] Christina: Amazing. I mean, honestly, honestly, I kind of want to like, make that my alias for it.

[00:06:55] Jeff: So good. I know it was just my thought like, Oh, yeah, maybe I’ll do that. [00:07:00] Ooh, Collapsed bladder, often referred to as bladder prolapse or a cystoseal, occurs when the bladder drops from its normal position in the pelvis and presses against the vaginal wall. This typically happens when the muscles and tissues supporting the bladder become weakened.

[00:07:14] That’s not at all an empty bladder, says Chatty G.

[00:07:18] Christina: Yeah, I was gonna say, Chatty G seems like a very different thing. So, uh, so maybe not. Maybe, maybe, maybe this is not. Maybe, maybe we’re not having a good idea. Like, we’re

[00:07:28] Jeff: about this? Isn’t it just an empty bladder? Welcome to Chatty G with Christina and Jeff. Uh, isn’t it just an empty bladder, Chatty G? Let’s see. Hmm. It can indeed sound like I might refer to it, wow, it’s actually a structure. Well, that’s not what the doctor told my mother. All right, let’s stop there. Uh, and, uh, we’ll, we’ll take this to my chart.

[00:07:51] Election Night Reflections

[00:07:51] Jeff: Um, Anyway, so, uh, mental health, what, how about Mental Health Corner

[00:07:56] is, what are your coping strategies for, [00:08:00] um, the thing, the, the,

[00:08:02] The disaster?

[00:08:03] Christina: The disaster. Um, yeah, I’m curious to hear yours. So, I’m going through like the, the stages of, of grief and whatnot, and, and I’m pretty stuck in anger. Um, and, but, but the, the, like, the focus of my anger is shifting. And, um, which I feel like that’s growth. So, um, I, I kept, I, so. It was obvious to me on Tuesday night, fairly early, West Coast time, what was happening.

[00:08:31] Um, the same way that it was obvious to me in 2016, um, uh, then on East Coast time, like, what was happening. And so, I started having this sense of deja vu, and you see the numbers coming in, and you see, like, the polls, and like, you know, look. There can always be upsets, but in general, they follow a typical standard, and 2020 did as well, right?

[00:08:50] Like, it was really close. The thing that was shocking about 2020 was Georgia, um, I mean, Arizona a little bit too, but Georgia, just the fact that we didn’t know, and it was so close, and that they had to do their [00:09:00] recount, and that they had to do, like, the runoff for Senate, right? Like,

[00:09:03] Jeff: Thank you, thank you, Warnock.

[00:09:05] Christina: yeah, exactly, um, and Stacey Abrams, and all, uh, you know,

[00:09:09] Jeff: Yes, so Stacey Abrams, I’ll tell you later why I think of Warnock first, but yes, thank you all those people.

[00:09:15] Christina: Well, I mean, you know, obviously he was the one running for Senate, so, you know, um, and, and, and she, you know, had, had, had lost governor, so, you know, which is still amazing that she was able to pull in so many voters, but, like, you know, you, you, we, we saw even before it got to that point, like, we saw that it was close, and we saw, I mean, like, virtually tied, and that, and that it was, it was more competitive than we’d ever thought it would be, um, and, and so that, that, like, 2020, you know, It changed things, right?

[00:09:42] Like, like that was different, but like you didn’t, you knew early on that it was going to be like a tightrope, but like you felt good. Like 2016 though, I remember being like, this is, this is bad, she’s lost. And I felt the same exact way this time. And so I was, you know, kind of tweeting about it and posting about it [00:10:00] on threads and posting about it on Macedon and Blue Sky because we were The world is awful.

[00:10:05] Jeff: yeah, yeah, yeah.

[00:10:06] Christina: And, so you have to be all those places, and all of them suck, and, and, you know, um, our, our, and, and Twitter, the worst one, is the only one that is real time at all. I mean, blue sky, I

[00:10:16] Jeff: I miss, that’s when I miss Twitter the most, is

[00:10:19] things like election night. So

[00:10:21] Christina: totally. And, and, and, but, but, but Elon has ruined it, and so it’s like the worst people in the world are there, but yet the news is there too, so it’s one of those fucking mixed things.

[00:10:29] So I’m kind of, kind of expressing, like, my, my anger, then I’m like, you know, I feel sick, I want to throw up, and I was like, I’m, I, you know, I, but, but already I started seeing people doing the whole, well, just put your chin up, you know, kind of attitude, you know, we’ll continue to fight, and I’m like, go. Fuck yourself.

[00:10:45] People are allowed to be mad. And like, that’s what I said. I was like, I was like, I started saying like, like Tuesday night and then into Wednesday, I was like, let people be mad. Let them feel what they feel. I’m not even saying be angry forever. And to be clear, I’m not saying don’t be angry forever because I have [00:11:00] some sort of sense of duty about like, oh, we all need to pick ourselves back up and do

[00:11:04] Jeff: Yeah, yeah.

[00:11:05] Christina: No, it’s because the anger Anger, it can be fueling and it can be good for a time, but ultimately it can become toxic. And so my whole thing with the anger is purely selfish. It’s like, as long as the anger works for you, be angry. But at a certain point, for most of us, anger is no longer, um, a, a beneficial response.

[00:11:24] And it winds up being hurtful. So when I say get rid of the anger, it’s not for the other people. It’s not to have peace for them, like, fuck them. It’s, it’s the same way I view forgiveness. Forgiveness is not for other people. It’s for yourself. You forgive so that you don’t have to live with that, right?

[00:11:38] And, and, and that is, you know, so that you’ve let it go and it’s no longer, like, eating at you. Like, fuck the other person, right? Like, that, that’s not who it’s from. Forgiveness is for you. Um, and I feel like

[00:11:48] Jeff: It’s not even an effective gift in many cases, right? It

[00:11:51] is something you have to do for you, and

[00:11:53] Christina: You do. Yeah, right. Exactly. Exactly. Right. Because it’s like, okay, because you can’t control whether or not someone forgives you or not, [00:12:00] especially if they really do.

[00:12:00] Right. Because a lot of people say, Oh, I forgive you. And then they don’t. Um, they’re, they’re still holding that through. Right. So it’s like, you know, if you’ve wronged someone or even if you haven’t, but they perceive that you have, like, there’s not a whole lot of control you have over that. Right. But like, I can control how I feel about a situation for someone else and how much I continue to let it affect me.

[00:12:18] And I feel the same way about anger. Right. But sometimes the can be really, really. fueling and, and really, frankly, like can feel good. So, you know, I’m not saying be angry forever, but I am being like, let people fucking feel how they feel and don’t immediately go into that, all right, time to get back to work.

[00:12:36] Like, first of all, fuck off. The work didn’t work last time and we should really talk about it. Um, you know, and there’s a lot, there’s enough blame to go around to everybody, but I, you know, the, the, the people I want to hear from the least are the fucking resistance, you know, like, Libs who have done jack shit for us in my opinion over the last eight years That’s who I’m really kind of pissed at now because

[00:12:58] Jeff: Well, it also feels like, when people do that, it [00:13:00] feels like they’re, it’s like, are you actually talking to yourself? Cause like, otherwise, who are you addressing? Everybody?

[00:13:04] Like, what is this fight? I mean, give me a minute.

[00:13:08] Christina: Right, right.

[00:13:10] Coping Strategies and Mental Health

[00:13:10] Christina: So anyway, you asked about coping strategies. My mind is basically just maybe like be pissed off and I’m okay with it. I’ve also been trying to like, you know, do some work and do some other things. I’ve got an insane next six weeks of travel planned. I’m gonna be in Salt Lake City for KubeCon next week.

[00:13:25] I’m gonna be in Chicago actually the week after that for Microsoft Ignite. So I’ll be near you and Brett. Then I’m going to be in Atlanta for Thanksgiving. Then I’m gonna be in Seoul for kind of a quick trip. Yep. Um, and then, then I’m going to be, um, uh, back for like a week, then I’m going to, um, uh, Rome, um, with a friend for a long weekend, and then I’m going to, then I’ll be back in Atlanta for Christmas.

[00:13:49] So, yeah, like, the next. I know. I know. And that was not all, like, three of those things came out, like, very recently. So it was not originally supposed to be that [00:14:00] hectic, but things were, like, added on to my plate kind of last minute. And honestly, I was like, fuck it. Let’s do it. Like, when I had the, um, opportunity last week when I found out that I would potentially be going to Seoul and it was confirmed this week, I, I, I didn’t have to go.

[00:14:16] And given all my other travel, like. Honestly, it’s kind of a mixed bag whether I should do it or not, but you asked for coping strategies and I did have the thought last week, I was like, depending on how things go, I might really want a distraction, you know, where I’m just go, go, going and, and I know from, um, you know, when I used to travel like this all the time, so this is going to be like.

[00:14:41] Uh, uh, back to pre pandemic Christina a little bit, um, uh, I, I know that it’s a real good way of, of avoiding things you don’t want to think about or focus

[00:14:52] Jeff: sure is.

[00:14:53] Christina: It’s, it’s just to be, as you know, from somebody who’s, who’s traveled a ton and been a bunch of places and, you know, [00:15:00] uh, during, you know, times of, you know, kind of domestic crisis, it’s nice to just be busy, you know?

[00:15:09] Jeff: Yeah. And I mean, I feel like it’s, it can be a great way to, uh, avoid things you need to avoid. And it can also be a great way to metabolize things, just to not be, uh, in your own four walls, moving, moving, moving, while also metabolizing who he’s going to pick for this post or what he’s promising now is actually like, for me, a better way.

[00:15:31] I can hold it better. Yeah. Yeah. Then if I’m sitting at home,

[00:15:34] Christina: totally. No, that’s the thing, right? Like, and I think that.

[00:15:37] Comparing 2016 and 2020 Elections

[00:15:37] Christina: Um, I want to, I want to, uh, talk to you about how you’re coping and what your mental health is like, uh, first, but one thing I do want to, I think would be interesting for us to talk about would be, um, Like, I guess maybe comparing and contrasting, like, how this feels versus other, like, election, you know, like, losses that, you know, we’ve kind of gone through, [00:16:00] um, because when I think about 2016, that was hard for so many reasons, and it was very different than how I felt then is very different from how I feel now.

[00:16:10] But part of what made that both harder and easier was the fact that I was a journalist. And so it was, it was harder in the sense that, like, you couldn’t disconnect from it. Like, there was nothing I really could do. Like, I, even not being a political journalist, you know, being like a technology journalist still, like, there was something about it all the time.

[00:16:26] And, and, you know, and I worked in a newsroom and I couldn’t get rid of it, right? It was, it was in your face and you could not ignore Like the, the, the news dump that happened literally, you know, from the day he was elected up until, you know, and then it got only bigger, you know, once he was inaugurated and all that.

[00:16:42] Whereas, whereas this time, you know, but, but, but, and so that made it suck, but at the same time, there was also like that busyness of like, okay, well, there’s always a story to write. There’s always a thing to do. And so you didn’t have to like think about it too much. And, and I’m curious from like your perspective, like.

[00:16:59] You know, [00:17:00] um, uh, as somebody who, you know, is a journalist, but not like in, in a newsroom quite the same way. Like if, if, if it, if it makes you, if it’s easier or harder, like when you have to think about it all the time, right? Or if it’s better to have a distraction, I guess that’s what I’m trying to get at, right?

[00:17:17] Like in some ways, like the, the day to day news stuff could be a distraction even if it was about him. Whereas almost like it’s harder, like, Um, once I was no longer in journalism and I was having to, like, actually follow everything that happened, like, as a layperson, like, in some ways that was almost harder because I was like, you know, the, the, the, the Mueller investigation and all that.

[00:17:37] I was like, okay, I, I have to either choose to engage or not because, you know, this is gonna, like, I, I, I have to find something else to distract me or else this is just gonna be a thing that, like, overtakes my brain and, That’s not, that’s not helpful.

[00:17:52] Jeff: Yeah. Well, actually my, I have an answer to that initially that it ties into kind of my own coping strategies or like the [00:18:00] challenges in this election. Like I didn’t, when I was a journalist, I managed to, I managed to convince my editors that I would be not only no good at, but deeply resentful about having to do any kind of in the moment coverage of any kind of in the moment politics thing at all.

[00:18:18] Christina: Mm hmm.

[00:18:19] Jeff: I’m not the best person for it, and I kind of despise it. I despise the coverage that comes out of it most of the time. Not despise, but like, I just wonder why.

[00:18:28] Um, and I know I just feel like I was throwing my life away in dramatic, which is not what I feel about the people who are doing it. I literally, that will, is what would happen inside of me if I were doing it. Um, and, And so it’s, it’s much better for me to be able to fully manage the way that I follow and metabolize and everything, this stuff. Um, though I have really good friends who are journalists where it’s like, that is, they would never say it cause you’re not supposed to say stuff like that, but that is how they metabolize it

[00:18:56] and they need it and is their coping strategy.

[00:18:58] And I thousand percent [00:19:00] respect that. And they do great work with, um, but for me, like, even So we had some really great friends. These two couples that, um, my wife and I have been close with through getting to know through our kids were friends. And then we’ve just been like friends since our kids were in kindergarten.

[00:19:14] So I love them. I love being around them. And they were, one of them was hosting kind of just us and, and, and them basically to, to watch the election results and, and have a dinner. And I knew instantly, I don’t do those things. Um, but I also, you know, knew that it’s really good to be with people you love, uh, on a hard night.

[00:19:33] And so I was like, I’m just going to do the dinner. And, um, which is what I did. But like, even there doing the dinner, what is, what is so difficult to me, and it’s not unlike the journalism thing, and why that doesn’t work for me is like, I am managing my own kind of anxiety, my own hopes, my own fears, all that stuff, and I’m doing it in whatever way is like very much me, and the way I do that stuff is, it’s very inward, it’s very like in my head, so I can actually, you know, I can be [00:20:00] scrolling back in the day, I could be scrolling Twitter, but I needed to be doing it alone, um, and, and have like utter control, because as soon as I have other people in my ear processing in their way, um, and some people process by, you know, constantly looking up information and sharing it out while you’re watching the TV, which is already putting all this like useless information, graphics that make it look like something big has just happened, but nothing’s just happened. Um, and so like, I can’t, that stresses me out so much. So I actually did something this year that I have never done. And, I’m really glad I did, and I’m not putting it out there as some like, this is what we all should have done, this is a wise thing, because often when people suggest what I’m about to suggest, it comes in a very fucking annoying package. Um, but I got home from that election party thinking I was going to turn on the TV and just watch it with my wife and, you know, whatever. I actually got home and I’m like, I’m not turning anything on. Like, I’m really fucking tired, I haven’t been

[00:20:53] sleeping well, probably not unrelated to this. There’s nothing I can do, but hit my nervous system over and over [00:21:00] again.

[00:21:00] And it, and it doesn’t help me process. Like it does, again, I totally respect it helps people. I know process just be watching it with someone, whatever, talking, but I was like, I think this time I got to be no, no, nothing. So I didn’t watch anything. I fell asleep and I woke up at like three, uh, central. And so I was like, look at the phone.

[00:21:21] I was like, no, don’t look at the phone. Try to go back to sleep. And then I, I stayed in, don’t look at the phone, try to go back to sleep for an hour and a half, and at 4. 30, 5. 30 Eastern, um, which is when he did his victory speech basically, or started it, that’s exactly when I turned my phone on, it’s like, Trump is about to begin his victory speech, and I was like, holy shit. And so anyway, I took that in, got up, couldn’t sleep, obviously. Got up, went into my workshop at like 5 a. m., sorted work gloves, and then just was like, I’m not taking in any news for the first half of the day. And I didn’t. And then I started, and I was ready. And I, so one coping strategy, pre coping strategy was [00:22:00] just to like, totally unplug, which is not my

[00:22:02] nature.

[00:22:03] Um, and, and, oh my God, I needed to, but then To your point, and to some of the points of your Macedon post that I appreciated, as soon as I logged in, it was like, now we fight, now we fight. And I was like, you know what? No, I’m gonna go ahead and take a rest. I’m not like I, I’ve known fighting in my days. I’m not, I’m not averse to fighting.

[00:22:22] I’m not a complacent person. But I also know that I know what it’s like to destroy yourself. And I’ve watched other people destroy themselves. And I’ve watched people figure out that rest is a really important part of being in any kind of fight. And that’s it. This is the time. We got a minute. We got a minute to rest.

[00:22:40] It’s over. That’s we’re not contesting this thing, right? Like, um, we got a minute and it is, and to your point, however, anyone needs to do this need to do it. And so when I see people saying fight, fight, fight over and over, I’m kind of like, there’s a part of me that’s like, I mean, I get it. I respect it. I’m not, again, there’s no way of responding to this [00:23:00] thing that I disagree with exactly because I think everyone’s doing it the way they need to.

[00:23:04] But social media is different because you’re being told things all the time,

[00:23:06] people telling you. And so it’s just like, I tuned in for like, an hour. First thing I saw was actually your post being like, you know what, no, you can just feel what you’re gonna feel. You don’t have to fucking fight right now.

[00:23:17] Like you had a great, you had a great post, which I’ll link to in the show notes. That was the first thing I saw when I came on. And then I saw all the fight things. I was like, Christine, I think you’re the only Social media posts I liked in that entire, like, hour that I was on. Um, so yeah, I mean there was that also just that part of like, you, you really have to trust yourself, like really have to trust yourself.

[00:23:37] Like if people saying now we fight doesn’t feel good right now,

[00:23:40] it’s fine. You’re not complacent, you’re

[00:23:42] not anything. You just, you, you can’t actually fight good if you’re not in a good place. Anyhow,

[00:23:46] Christina: No, no, and it’s not a failure to be like, no, I’m, I’m taking a breath, right? Like, like the, the, the, the, the, that’s not, that’s not a moral weakness or, or, or anything. And in fact, I think some people would say, when you lose, [00:24:00] which like, to be clear, like the Democrats like lost, lost, lost, lost, like, like lost, like, like, like, like, like, this was, you know, like a repudiation and a referendum, right?

[00:24:10] Like this was, this was a, this was a loss. There was like, 2016 was. I guess now I can talk about like my theories about like how this is different from

[00:24:19] Jeff: Yeah. Do it.

[00:24:20] Christina: But like, um, but, but just, just to, to, to close the thought here, like when you lose like this, like for anything, whether it’s like a sports team or it’s like you get, you know, you, you, you lose a job or like something happens like in, you know, league ship or whatever, like, you know, like you lose a big deal, whatever the case may be, like the, the normal thing to do is to like reassess and I’m not saying we need to have the whole post mortem now, but like, sure.

[00:24:48] Don’t give up and continue keeping on. I, I can, I can be down with that idea, but I’m also kind of being like, okay, if the same strategy has not worked for, let’s say, [00:25:00] Um, just, just, just putting that out there. I don’t know.

[00:25:04] Jeff: Yeah, yeah,

[00:25:05] Christina: I love, just, you know, I, I, I don’t know, like, let’s, let’s just say that.

[00:25:09] If that has, if, if something isn’t working, maybe it’s time while you’re, like, before you get back up and fight to reassess, like, what you want your tactics to be. And that, to your point, I think, does require some, like, reflection. And look, if people feel better because they want to, you know, express the platitudes of fighting than doing whatnot.

[00:25:30] I’m not going to tell you how to feel, I’m not gonna tell you what to do. I’m just not going to be shamed into immediately jumping on the toxic positivity rhetoric of being like, oh we got this, everything will be fine. No, we don’t actually know, right? And that’s the point. It’s okay for people to be fucking mad.

[00:25:48] Um, I got so pissed off. I mean, this was some motherfucker on Twitter, so what do you expect? And I, and, and I, I didn’t engage other than like my one response, but like when I, I did tweet like Tuesday night, I was like, people are allowed to, you [00:26:00] know, be mad, you know, let them feel how they feel. And he was like, you know, anger is one thing or whatever.

[00:26:04] He was like, you know, but, um, he said, you know, like, um, uh, you know, burning buildings and, and, and some other thing is, is another. And I was like, What the fuck are you talking about? I was like, already, already, this was like Tuesday night, I was like, what the f I mean, if I

[00:26:19] Jeff: from Minneapolis.

[00:26:20] Christina: right, exactly, what I wanted to be like, is I wanted to be like, we’re not the group of people who refuse to accept results.

[00:26:28] And we’re not, we’re not the people who like, you know, like, stormed the Capitol, um, because I know what, I knew what he was dog whistling to, but I was like, actually, what that really made me think of was January 6th, and we will not do that. But I was like, what kind of bullshit escalation is that, right?

[00:26:42] Like, no one’s saying that, right? Like, that’s, that’s the thing, right? Like, but, but that honestly kind of like put me in like a, a. Fucked up sort of even notion to just be like, this is how fucked up the world we live in is, is that there are people who, to be clear, this guy sucks, but like, and it was a dog [00:27:00] whistle and the whole thing was, was bullshit, but like, you know, where the rhetoric is such that saying something as simple as like, you’re allowed to be mad, people can, for him it’s not in good faith, but for some people it could be, be like, yeah, so a way some people respond to that is to try to burn it down and, and, and have a coup.

[00:27:22] Like, that’s fucked up, right? But like, you know, but like, unfortunately, that’s the reality we’re in. Um, okay. So anyway, here’s my theory about how like this is different from like 2016. So 2016, I think for a lot of us, for most of us, was a shock. And, and even if you had like a sinking feeling that Trump might win, and even if you’d like thought that he was more, you know, So they’ve had a false impression that, like, Hillary Clinton is more, um, competitive than, um, the, the, the media, uh, mainstream media, especially political media gave him credit for, for a long time.

[00:27:50] And that, you know, like, he was a real, like, force to be reckoned with. Like, even if you had a bad feeling, the polling, um, everything indicated that, that Hillary [00:28:00] was going to win. And, and then when she didn’t win, but she did win the popular vote, right, which, you know, uh, was, was similar to like a Bush v.

[00:28:10] Gore thing. But In this case, it was like decisive, like it was obvious, like that. was almost like there was this huge shock, right? Um, and, and how did this happen? But there was also this, um, not comfort, but like this, I guess, additional kind of like sense of kind of like outrage, which is like, okay, but the Electoral College is, you know, should not be a thing that we do anymore.

[00:28:34] And like, this is the second time now in 16 years that we have a different outcome from the different popular vote and, and, um, you know, electoral college makeup. And like, this is clearly not the will of the people, you know, collectively, right? Like, like, I don’t remember the number, but like millions more people have voted for her than for him.

[00:28:50] Jeff: gap. Yeah.

[00:28:51] Christina: Yeah, exactly. And, and so, you know, so it came down to, you know, the, the bullshit electoral college system. And, and so, [00:29:00] That, like, you had the shock, but then you also had, like, in a sense, you were like, okay, but this is not the will of the people, right? This is not, this is not, um, what, um, the, the, the majority

[00:29:10] Jeff: less confusing.

[00:29:11] Christina: Right. Well, right. In some ways it made it like that much more shocking and like upsetting, but at the same time you were kind of like, okay, well this is, this is not the will of people. And then in 2020, you know, again, like, you know, won the popular vote by a large margin. And um, obviously it became very, very close and came down to a couple of states.

[00:29:28] And, you know, Georgia really did come down to the sand votes. But, um, although we even in like, you know. There wasn’t a buffer or whatever, uh, you know, like if Georgia or Arizona had been lost, like, you know, uh, Biden still would have won, but like, you, but you still had that thing, you’re like, okay, the people did not vote for, for, for this, right?

[00:29:47] Like, um, from an electoral point of view, uh, from, from a, um, you know, like populist, whatever, uh, you know, um, any popular vote point of view. But this time, A, [00:30:00] It, it wasn’t the same shock, at least for me, um, because again, like, I felt the spidey sense. I was like, I know what this feeling is like. I’m having deja vu.

[00:30:08] Like, this is what’s happening. You can see the, the, the things come in when I saw every single swing state, every single one, you know, come in, um, for, for him and, and, and, uh, demographics coming out stronger. Like, the big thing is, is that like with 2020, I think that we had a little bit of a false boost where way more people did show up to vote, which is great.

[00:30:30] That did not happen this time. And on the contrary, where you saw an uptick and an increase in voters was, was, you know, on the Republican side. Um, so their ground game was better. Um, uh, they, they got more people out. They got younger people out for them, which, which, you know, um, uh, the Democrats did not. Um, and then, um, more of them.

[00:30:48] More of them voted, right? Like for, for him. And, and to me, I was like, what made that, um, like, I’ll, I’ll find a thing that I sent to a friend of mine who’s Australian. Um, let me find this. If we want to put

[00:30:59] Jeff: Ooh, [00:31:00] Engaging the Australians. That’s always good for, for like, uh, balancing out any feeling. I love the Australians.

[00:31:06] Christina: Me too. Well, my friend, um, was lovely and like reached out to me at like, um, uh, you know, midnight my time. And so, um, I, I don’t even want to know what time it was, you know, for, for him, um, uh, the next day, you know, and so, so it was like 2 AM your time. And so, you know, very early or very late for him. Um, and he was, he was like, he was like, um, he’s like, Hey, I’m really sorry.

[00:31:29] I hope you’re doing okay. And I said, thank you. And he says, you know, um, he was like, uh, he was like, I don’t even know what to say. And I said, um, Uh, I said, I don’t either. I wish I did. So I wish I was more surprised. I thought it would hurt less this time. The shock value of 2016 isn’t there, but it’s still just as depressing this time.

[00:31:46] We know some of the outcome and it’s not good. And it’s like, what do you even say? We can’t even blame the electoral college this time. This was the will of the electorate, full stop. And that’s almost as upsetting as these people winning again, [00:32:00] that this was such a decisive blowout. And, and so. That was, that was the real thing for, for me.

[00:32:06] I was like, this, this was the will of the electorate. Um, you know, it was. Um, and so what it reminded me more of and like how I felt both Tuesday night but especially Wednesday when I kept feeling like, and I think I, I posted about this as well, I felt exactly the same way I did when I was, um, I just voted in my first election in 2004.

[00:32:30] And, and John Kerry lost. And he lost badly, right, like he, he lost about as badly as,

[00:32:36] Jeff: