338: The Curse of Best New Artist

The Curse of Best New Artist

[00:00:00] Brett: Welcome back to Overtired this episode is sponsored by Notion. Stick around to learn more. The three amigos are back in the house. Amigos. Um, we have Jeff Severance Gunsel, we have Christina Warren, and we have me, Brett Terpstra. Uh, the gang is back together for the first time in quite some time. Uh, good to see you guys.

[00:00:24] Christina: Good to be here.

[00:00:26] Jeff: you too. You know, I just watched, I don’t know why, the Siskel and Ebert review of Three Amigos the other day on YouTube.

[00:00:33] Christina: Now, now, did they like it or not? Cause I could see it going either way. I could see like,

[00:00:37] Jeff: They did not, but

[00:00:38] Christina: I figured that Cisco I knew would hate it. Ebert, I was like, I could see it go either

[00:00:42] Jeff: exactly, no, Ebert was the warmer to it, but what, so what I loved about that is I forgot how, um, I forgot how like cruel they could be to movies and to each other, which I kind of love. And also I, what I love about Ebert is like, he’s like, No, I get it. [00:01:00] This movie’s terrible, but you know what? There were two amazing moments, right?

[00:01:03] Jeff: Like, like, I like that kind of like that nuance that you don’t really get on TV anymore, right? Where like, yeah, but anyway, I don’t know why I was watching. I can’t remember why I

[00:01:12] Christina: That’s amazing. So, so, uh, very quickly, I will, I’m gonna give a plug to two books, um, of Ebert’s that are, uh, compilations of some of his reviews of his most hated films. So the first is called, I Hated, Hated, Hated This Movie. And that title is from the 1994, I wanna say Elijah Wood, uh, movie called North.

[00:01:33] Christina: And I remember this because I remember reading this review when I was like 10 years old. ’cause I, I liked Elijah Wood, uh, because 10, um, and, uh, um, but, but that it is a truly terrible movie about a kid who tries to divorce his parents and then goes around the world trying to find replacement parents.

[00:01:48] Christina: It’s a bad movie and.

[00:01:50] Jeff: you gotta go all over.

[00:01:51] Christina: and, uh, and then the next, uh, one, uh, which was published, um, a few years later, um, it’s called Your Movie Sucks. And so, um, [00:02:00] there, uh, again, like, there are a number of compilations of all of his reviews, but Your Movie Sucks, and I hated, hated, hated this movie, two of my favorites. Um, he also has, I think, five volumes of, uh, The Great Movies, which is, like, all of his, uh, movies.

[00:02:15] Christina: Stuff. And then there’s also, um, like a thing of it’s four star reviews. I’m looking through Amazon right now and I’m like, how many of these things do I fucking have? And I have a lot of them, um, in print or in digital form. Um, uh, small Roger Ebert fan as a kid, as, as you and an adult, as you can tell. But anyway, if you ever want to read his, his very funny, uh, not as good as maybe the TV show.

[00:02:37] Christina: Cause like you said, they were mean to each other. Um, but, uh, but they loved each other, but they were mean to each other. Um,

[00:02:43] Jeff: they were mean.

[00:02:45] Christina: One of their best appearances was on The Critic, incidentally, and they, when Siskel died, like Ebert even called that out as like one of their most fun experiences because they kind of liked each other, but they also kind of didn’t.

[00:02:59] Christina: But anyway, [00:03:00] I, I, I, which you can tell watching the show, but, but, uh, if you want to read just excorciating Uh, Bad Movies, um, like this is, this is a, this is from his, um, One Star Review of Armageddon from 1998. The movie is an assault on the eyes, the ears, the brain, common sense, and the human desire to be entertained.

[00:03:19] Christina: No matter why they’re char uh, no matter what they’re charging to get in, it’s, it’s worth more to get out,

[00:03:26] Jeff: That’s awesome. That’s awesome. Well, okay, so before we move on from this very amazing random topic that was your fault, Brett, um, I realized what landed me at Siskel and Ebert’s review, which is that I ended up landing also inexplicably, also inexplicably on an episode of Johnny Carson where Roger Ebert is the guest and sitting next to him is Chevy Chase, who had been the guest just before him.

[00:03:52] Jeff: And Roger Ebert is just panning that movie with Chevy Chase sitting next to him. And it’s like this master class on how to be like, look, [00:04:00] I’m just going to be straight up about what I believe, uh, even though you’re sitting right here. And, um, and that is also amazing. And I put a link in the show

[00:04:08] Christina: Oh, I love that. And I respect the fuck out of that, man. Like, that, because genuinely, that’s a hard thing to do. I mean, I

[00:04:14] Jeff: That is a hard thing to

[00:04:15] Christina: I consider myself one of those people who, because it happens sometimes, right? Like you, you accidentally, um, insult someone or something that they’re doing to their face, and then like you have two choices.

[00:04:27] Christina: Like you can either, like, lie about it, um, and you can be like, Oh no, I don’t really think that, which I think is a coward’s way out. Or, you can just be like, I’m really embarrassed right now. And, and I don’t know what else to say. Or, you can do, I guess what, what Ebert did, which is to just kind of be like, Yeah, I’m just going to be completely, like, bashing your movie to your face with a smile on mine.

[00:04:48] Christina: Be like, what are you going to do? What are you going to do, Chevy?

[00:04:50] Brett: double down, just double down on it.

[00:04:52] Jeff: Right. Just double down. And the funny thing is for both of those, whenever they showed a clip, I was like, Oh, that’s really funny. Um, but[00:05:00]

[00:05:00] Mental Health Corner

[00:05:00] Brett: You guys got some mental health to talk about? Cause, oh my God, I have,

[00:05:05] Christina: You go for it. Or do you, do you want to go first? Do you want to go first? Or do you want to, uh, want one of us to go first? What do you want?

[00:05:10] Brett: No, I can, I can go first. Um, I’ll try to, I’ll try to not dominate it, but so last. Monday, I had a couples therapy session with my partner and an amazing therapist out of Minneapolis and we dug into some trauma around my parents and my family and the things that were expected of us over the holidays and It got me, like, angry.

[00:05:44] Brett: Like, by the end of the session, I was like, I don’t know what’s going on exactly, but I don’t like either of you right now, and I’m feeling very combative, and I just have to go. And immediately after that session, I got a stomachache. [00:06:00] And… That stomach ache lasted for three days. And I realized like, cause I, I put it together before that, like most of the times I’ve been to the hospital with heart or stomach trouble, uh, in the last few years has been within 24 hours of dealing with my parents, of seeing my parents.

[00:06:19] Brett: Um, and it turns out even when I talk about, Something like, what are we going to do for Christmas? Do we have to see your parents? Um, I like, I project myself into that situation to gauge how I’m going to react. And I like full on astral project into the situation and have all of the resulting emotions.

[00:06:43] Brett: So even just thinking about my parents can make me physically, uh, ill. I knew better than to go to the hospital because I knew it was happening this time. But. Yeah, that was rough.

[00:06:57] Jeff: It’s still real, though. I mean, you [00:07:00] know, even if you know what’s even if it’s caused by an emotional experience, it’s still a real

[00:07:04] Brett: it was,

[00:07:05] Jeff: bodily injury.

[00:07:06] Brett: it was, it was very, very real. It

[00:07:08] Jeff: We’ll hold off too long next time.

[00:07:10] Brett: painful. Um, and then I had my personal therapy on Thursday and that went, that was far less combative, but it dug up all this shit. And by the end of it, I realized all I wanted was drugs, loud music, and isolation, which are like historically my ways of dealing with And instead, I went out for pizza in a brightly lit, uh, uh, cool little shop called Muddled Time and, uh, went out with Elle and then went to an art fair and it was, uh, I, I got through it and the drug craving subsided and being social and out.[00:08:00]

[00:08:00] Brett: Was really good for me, but yeah, the therapy has been up there. The, the trauma has been up in force this last week.

[00:08:07] Jeff: That’s intense. I appreciate it. It’s really hard to go like when you’re feeling the like, I want this, this, and this to be like, I’m going to do the opposite. Like, I find it very hard. So it’s really impressive. Also,

[00:08:20] Brett: years of doing that under my belt. So

[00:08:23] Jeff: well, I guess, I guess is that part of essentially being in recovery or being having that?

[00:08:28] Jeff: Yeah, I

[00:08:29] Brett: making good choices at the age of 45, I’m adept at making good choices sometimes.

[00:08:35] Jeff: don’t think we grow into only good choices or something. I don’t think that’s really our North Star.

[00:08:41] Christina: I mean, I agree.

[00:08:44] Jeff: Um, I have a question for you. I know you may well have more to say. Um, I, I’ve done just a little bit of couples therapy and what I found was different and a little, and this may have just been the therapist, uh, a little [00:09:00] concerning was that, you know, when you’re in therapy one on one, there’s usually an opportunity or an intention on the part of the therapist to make sure that they’re dropping you back into your day as gently as possible.

[00:09:12] Jeff: Right. Even if that’s not always possible, but I mean, it’s like, there’s some kind of like, it’s a goal. Right. Um, With Couples Therapy, I think that must be nearly impossible. And, and I think what you experienced, like, I, I’ve been there where it’s just like, wow, I got dropped off the

[00:09:28] Brett: Yeah. There was, there was one session where as we’re, as we’re like talking about, like. What we’re going to do for the week, what we’re going to do for next time, getting ready to go. Uh, she just casually drops the idea of a threesome with no context or explanation and Like we, we ended the call and we look at each other and it led to some, it led to some problems.

[00:09:56] Brett: Like I won’t, I won’t, I won’t name names, but one of [00:10:00] us was like, okay, I would consider this seems, it seems potentially cool. And one of us was like, no, never. I

[00:10:07] Jeff: Wait, okay, hold on. I need, um, I need to be, uh, I need to be carried along a little better here. I, uh, which is that this was like a parting joke. Like, what are we going to do next week? It’s like, well, we can have a three scene. We, so what is it, help me out. Cause I don’t know how to interpret it.

[00:10:24] Brett: it was, it was, uh, here’s something we might consider talking about in the future kind of comment. Um, based on, based on what she knew about us and, and what we wanted out of our

[00:10:38] Jeff: I know what I missed. I know what I missed. I thought the therapist was suggesting that you have a threesome with the

[00:10:43] Brett: God, no,

[00:10:45] Jeff: what I missed. That’s what I missed. I’m like, what

[00:10:48] Brett: Yeah, no, that would be, that would be a serious breach of protocol.

[00:10:52] Jeff: Okay, I’m back. I’m sorry, Brett. I’m back. I’m back.

[00:10:55] Brett: Okay,

[00:10:55] Jeff: You’re all like, well, we thought about it! I was like, what is happening?

[00:10:58] Brett: yeah, I want to talk about [00:11:00] all of the fun queer stuff I’ve been doing lately, but I feel like that’s actually a separate segment from the mental health corner, so I will pass the mic.

[00:11:12] Jeff: Oh man, you just put the Beastie Boys in my head. That’s gonna take a while to get it out.

[00:11:16] Christina: Um, well, I mean, I can go. I think I talked about this last time. Um, you weren’t on, uh, Jeff, um, but, um, I am now for the first time in six and six plus years, uh, not on any antidepressant at all. I’m only on my dexedrine because the antidepressant I was on was that I thought was going to work. Absolutely did not.

[00:11:37] Christina: And so there were some side effects that were just completely nontenable. Um, and so I had to come off of it. Um, the withdrawal process was worse than I thought that it was going to be, because it’s supposed to not be one that has a lot of withdrawal. Um, it did. Uh, I got brain zaps for the first time, which I’ve never had before, which are not fun.

[00:11:55] Christina: Um, So, a lot of people had them coming off of [00:12:00] typical SSRIs. I’d never had them before. Um, and this is not supposed to be a typical SSRI, so I was a little bit surprised. But basically what it feels like is that somebody has like static electricity. Um, and you know, like when you get like a shock like on your finger or something.

[00:12:14] Christina: It’s like that, but on your, in your brain.

[00:12:16] Brett: hmm. Ow. Whoa.

[00:12:18] Christina: So it’s fucked up. And so the thing is, is that it can happen anytime. And so inside your head, like you will like feel a little something and it’s almost like somebody who’s like, like shaking maracas or something like, or shaking sand, like inside your ears is, is it’s kind of the best way I can kind of describe it.

[00:12:32] Christina: So it’ll kind of come out of nowhere. Like I could be moving around and it could happen, but I could also be like. Completely still and just be like, hit me. Um, it’s not great. Yeah, it’s pretty shitty and a lot of people have them. Some people claim that they have them for like years after getting off of antidepressants.

[00:12:50] Christina: I’m personally a little skeptical of that. Um, as I am skeptical of most. Symptoms of that nature. I think there’s a lot of hype.

[00:12:58] Brett: symptom reports.

[00:12:59] Christina: Yeah. I mean, [00:13:00] I just, I’m, I’m, I’m a, I’m a strong believer in hypochondria being like, not to say people don’t think they experience things, but hypochondria is a real fucking thing.

[00:13:08] Christina: Um, uh, but, um, and, and so I’m, I’m not going down that rabbit hole of like, oh, I’m never gonna. Get rid of this stuff. It’s gotten significantly better. It’s, it’s pretty minimal now, but it does still happen like at night sometimes, like it’ll just kind of hit me, but it’s not all the time during the day. I wouldn’t just be randomly hitting me, you know, um, while I’m trying to do something, which completely takes you out of whatever your thought process is.

[00:13:28] Christina: So, um, fun withdrawal, uh, fun meaning not, but now I’m not on anything but my dexedrine and my, my doctor agreed that this is a good idea. Um, his, Theory had been for a long time. I think it’s a good one because I’ve had so many. major depression episodes in my life. The more that you have, the more, the higher the likelihood is that you will have another one.

[00:13:52] Christina: And so like if you’ve had one, there’s like a 40 something percent chance you’ll have another. If you had two, there’s like a 70 [00:14:00] something percent chance you’ll have a third. If you have three, there’s, you know, like it just goes up and up and up. Um, and I’ve probably had in my life if I’m Like, being completely honest and going through it, I probably had five.

[00:14:12] Christina: And so, and, and I might not even be counting all of them, because some of them have been extended. So, I, um, for that reason, he has wanted me to basically, like, he told me when I was, like, 21, he was like, you’ll probably never be able to go off of antidepressants. That’s just like a reality in your life. Um, and other than like the, the two and a half year period that I, I ghosted my shrink, that has been the case.

[00:14:36] Christina: Uh, basically since I was 14 years old, um, I’ve been on some sort of antidepressant or another. Uh, I’m not right now. Um, we’re trying to see kind of what my baseline is and where things are. The good thing about the Ovelaty, even though it didn’t ultimately work for me, was I think that it got me out of at least the like Suicidal, life ending, unable to get out of bed, like depression, right?

[00:14:58] Christina: Like it got me past that [00:15:00] point, right? And, and, and, and to be clear, as I talked about before, it was bad enough that, you know, like when I look back on it, I’m like, okay, this might, if I ever have anything like this again, I’m, I’m not, not treating this. I’m not like, I will fucking go on disability leave before I will, um, uh, A, try to deal with the medication changes while working ever again, or B, um, I’m going to actually for the first time in my life, like, prioritize my health over my career.

[00:15:26] Christina: Um, which are all good things. Um, so I, I think that the good thing about it, even though it ultimately didn’t work and ultimately has some side effects that were completely non tenable, I think that it got me out of Like that place. So that’s good. So now we’re just going to kind of evaluate, you know, where our base levels are, watch things, um, look at some other stuff, see how things kind of come back and then, you know, maybe after the first of the year or whatever, we can, you know, talk about.

[00:15:56] Christina: Um, and then there’s, you know, he has questions and I do too about like, okay, [00:16:00] how proactive do we want to be? Because if I’m not actively depressed and then do I need to be seeking out treatment? Um, if that, especially if that can cause, you know, the, the side effects and, and finding the right med balance and all that shit.

[00:16:10] Christina: Right. So, uh, it’s, it’s just kind of a balance now I think of watching things, paying attention, and then like trying to like, you know, um, ensure that, uh, I definitely don’t want to go back into a place where I’m falling into a depression again. And, and this is where I am very, very grateful. As much as major depression sucks, I am very grateful that I don’t have bipolar because I don’t know how I would deal with, like, I don’t even, I can’t even imagine what it would be like to like feel okay and then immediately be like pitted back into, you know, feeling depressed again, or even feeling, you know, like mania or whatever.

[00:16:44] Christina: Um, With, uh, with very little, you know, like, preparation. So, that’s, that’s sort of my update. I’m, uh, I’m only on Dexedrine. Things are going well so far. I was at, uh, I was in San Francisco for ten days. And so, um, [00:17:00] I, uh, uh, I got back on Sunday, which is like a week ago. Basically, six days, no, I got back Saturday.

[00:17:05] Christina: So I got back a week ago, uh, as we’re recording this. But I was there previously for ten days. And, um, GitHub Universe was fun. And now I’m just kind of, you know, trying to pick up the pieces of, of my life over the last four months. Yeah,

[00:17:23] Brett: That’s so long.

[00:17:24] Christina: it is so long. Yeah, no, I was, I was fortunate that the Hotel A had a good rate for like long term stay and B, that they gave me an upgraded room.

[00:17:34] Christina: It wasn’t like a massive room. It wasn’t like the, the room that I got when I stayed at the W and um, Uh, uh, Westwood or West Beverly Hills or whatever, um, last month where I got like a two bedroom suite that was like 785 square feet. It was ridiculous. I’ll have to put the video on, on Instagram because I forgot, um, with all my weird mental health bullshit.

[00:17:56] Christina: Um, uh, my, my social media postings have been bad, but, uh, [00:18:00] but yeah, I was there for 10 days, which is a long time and I lost my voice, which is why my voice is. The way it is. Oh, one, one quick thing, uh, and then I’ll shut up, because this is, speaking of social media, I do want to bitch about this for a minute.

[00:18:12] Christina: Because it’s, it’s impacting me and it’s not. So, on the 7th, November 7th, which was the day before GitHub Universe kicked off, I sent a tweet. A, I quote retweeted my boss who was showing off our badges, which are Raspberry Pi based. And, and I was like, I can’t wait, you know, to do so many cool things with my badge.

[00:18:30] Christina: And then I also like took a photo of my laptop keyboard that had my badge on it and a sticky. And I was like, get ready for GitHub Universe. You know, go here, you know, follow along with us. It kicks off in 20 hours or whatever. Then I tried to change my display name to go like from Christina Warren to Christina Warren is back at GitHub Universe. Something about that, I think. Tripped up one of Twitter’s automated systems and they were like, we think you’re a bot or this is an automated account or this is being spammed [00:19:00] or whatnot. And so first they locked me out of my account and then I reset my password. I was able to get back in, but I can’t. I can’t tweet, I can’t retweet, I can’t like, I can’t bookmark, I can’t DM, I can’t do anything at a very important time.

[00:19:14] Christina: Not only that, but if you go to my Twitter profiles, if you go to twitter. com slash film underscore girl, it will be like, this account may have violated rules and has been restricted. View, you know, are you sure you want to view your, view these tweets? And you have to click on yes. Again, I’ve tweeted lots of fucked up shit over the years, I did not violate any rules, not even by Elon’s current standards, right?

[00:19:37] Christina: Like I literally did nothing, but I’m caught in some sort of automated system trap. The problem is, when you file a support request, there’s no one apparently there to

[00:19:46] Jeff: That person that person doesn’t

[00:19:48] Christina: Right, right, and then it gets worse because for a while, this is at least sort of fixed, but not that it changes anything. For a while, I would, I would file a ticket and then they would be like, okay, we filed [00:20:00] this ticket.

[00:20:00] Christina: If this doesn’t solve the problem, they’d give me an automated thing, reset your password. If this doesn’t solve your problem, reply to this email. Then I’d, to add to the ticket, I’d reply to the email and they’d be like, yeah, this ticket’s closed, file another ticket. Then I would try to log into my account, it wouldn’t let me log in, and then I couldn’t file a ticket because I couldn’t log in.

[00:20:17] Christina: So, I’m in this Kafka esque situation where I cannot reach anyone in support, I cannot get anything with my account unlocked, and I didn’t do anything wrong. And, uh, yeah, and of course it happened at the most inopportune time when, like, I actually need Twitter. for my job. Um, so if anybody out there just on a lark, I seriously doubt it at this point because everybody who has the opportunity in most cases have left the company.

[00:20:40] Christina: If anybody works at Twitter and can somehow put eyes on this, because I’ve talked to, I back channeled with some Twitter employees who are like, yeah, I can’t even view your account. I’m like, okay, but you have to know somebody who can like, come on now. Uh, but, but, but I’m back channeling through like.

[00:20:55] Christina: Other people, I’m not having a direct conversation. So if anybody out there has any connections at Twitter [00:21:00] whatsoever, like, I will pay people, like, Twitter employees. I will bribe you with gift cards or with whatever if you can just fucking unstick my account so that I can tell people to follow me on Mastodon.

[00:21:11] Brett: Ha ha

[00:21:11] Jeff: First, first, uh, Twitter employee I see tweeting about being in the first row to Taylor Swift concert. I’m going to know who helped.

[00:21:18] Christina: mean, totally. I mean, I’m not gonna pay you 10 grand, but like, uh, I, uh, I will,

[00:21:23] Jeff: Not Portugal.

[00:21:24] Christina: Yeah, uh, that was from our pre show banter that didn’t make it. We were talking about potential, um, um, uh, gift guides for, for, uh, like, money is no object things. I don’t have that kind of money. Uh, but, but I will, like, buy you a gift card or something.

[00:21:37] Christina: Anyway, that, that, that’s me, and I’ll, I’ll stop, I’ll stop talking now.

[00:21:42] Brett: So, uh, about this hypochondria, I think I, I think I, I think I might have that. What are the symptoms? I’m just kidding.

[00:21:51] Christina: That’s good.

[00:21:54] Brett: Jeff, what you got? How’s your mental health?

[00:21:58] Jeff: don’t know. I, it’s a, it’s, [00:22:00] you know, I’m paying attention to it. I don’t know. I feel like I’m in a phase that’s, I mean, good in a way, which is like, I feel like I’m, I have a sort of a, like a self awareness, uh, that I, don’t always have when I’m having any kind of mental health change or shift or whatever.

[00:22:22] Jeff: And, um, and, um, and I’m able to like, I don’t know if calibrate maybe to, um, that sounds like bluster to say that I can calibrate it quickly, but like, um, I’ve just had some luck kind of noticing and being like, huh, you know what, I think this is, and then being able to do something that sort of re grounds me a little bit.

[00:22:49] Jeff: Um, and that’s been nice, so it’s, you know, I’ve been kind of all over the place, uh, but. Uh, that’s been the, like a common thread, which is [00:23:00] really great. Um, I had like a really long October. Um, October has always been full of weirdness for me. It’s the month that I found my mom in a coma in her apartment.

[00:23:12] Jeff: It’s the month that I had the manic episode that led to a bipolar diagnosis. Like it’s, and there’s, and it’s the month that my son was diagnosed with MS. By the way, these are three years in a row. Um, and, uh, and this one wasn’t, you know, nothing like that exactly. It was just. It was just a lot. There was just a lot that happened, a lot going on.

[00:23:35] Jeff: I had, you know, we had a trip when I wasn’t quite ready for a trip. We had a, part of that trip was my son looking at a college he’s interested in, um, in, in LA and I don’t, I don’t particularly want him to move out of the state and I definitely don’t want him to move to LA, even though I thousand percent support it.

[00:23:53] Jeff: Um, cause you gotta go where you gotta go and I, I get it. I lived that, but I… You know, it’s like, but we like each other. You don’t have [00:24:00] to go that far. Um, and, and then it was just like some family. Stuff and just whatever my, my grandmother died, which was, you know, honestly, fine. She was 96, she was 96. She had six kids who still liked her, um, and, and all of her faculties.

[00:24:17] Jeff: And so I, I wasn’t, I wasn’t feeling like a ton of grief about it. Cause I was more kind of like, that’s a hell of a finish line. And she, she would say the same thing. Like she was. She lost one of her close friends the week before and was like, well, she lived a good long life. Um, and I think if she were to speak to us from the afterlife, she would say the thing she misses most is bingo.

[00:24:42] Jeff: Um, and, and some of her prizes in the, in the assisted living facility had to be returned to the bingo, uh, kitty actually after she died, which is really sad and kind of funny, but she lived to go, anyway, but that’s still like a disturbance in the force, right? Like, and, um, There are just so many things at once.

[00:24:59] Jeff: It was like [00:25:00] work stressors and everything, a whole October. It was like, not one thing, but it was like, I came out of it. Just like, just completely fried in every possible way. And I’m feeling like I’m getting kind of, uh, backgrounded again, which is, um. Nice. Although I still don’t want my kid. He’s applying for schools, getting accepted to schools.

[00:25:21] Jeff: And it’s like, I realized I’m not ready to lose what is essentially just a great roommate. Um, which I realize is not normally or always the case with a 18 year old in your house. But we, uh, we got really lucky. And, uh, and I will just say that that. That experience and knowing that that’s coming or like doing kind of lasts, which is like last night there was like a banquet for his, the end of season for his cross country team.

[00:25:47] Jeff: And like, that’s the last time we’ll do that. Like you’re done with that. And like, every time we hit one of those, it’s like, I definitely am like, I have a hard day, like more just like a really melancholy day. Um, and so that’s just [00:26:00] another. Another piece that’s going on right now, but we were blessed, not to talk about the weather, but it isn’t irrelevant in a mental health conversation.

[00:26:10] Jeff: We were blessed in Minnesota with, um, some extra warm and sunny days, uh, beyond what we deserve for having decided to live here, for at least our, our, uh, ancestors having decided for some fucking reason to stop here and not go a little further west or south. And that has helped me a ton to just have those like sunny days.

[00:26:30] Jeff: It’s like a really, cause the first couple, man, when it snowed the day before Halloween and then it was gray and dark, I was like, I was feeling, I was not feeling good. I was like, a long winter. So anyway, long winters. Hi, John Roderick. Um, that’s what I got. That’s kind of a ramble. That’s what I got.

[00:26:51] Brett: that’s perfect. Um,

[00:26:53] Jeff: therapist did not suggest a

[00:26:55] Brett: Hehehehe

[00:26:57] Jeff: loud, I didn’t want to say that out loud.

[00:26:59] Brett: [00:27:00] Heheheheheheheheh

[00:27:01] Jeff: I can’t believe I thought, even for the few seconds that I thought that’s what was happening, Brett, I was like, Okay, hold on, pause the

[00:27:08] Christina: Right.

[00:27:10] Jeff: We got a, we got a problem, but that’s, that’s, We’re all good, we’re all good. My wife is a therapist, you know, I’m, I’m like slightly familiar with the professional, you know, boundaries

[00:27:20] Christina: my, my, my mom is too, my mom’s not a sex or relationship therapist, so I was like, well, maybe in that thing, but that’s still, yeah, I was with, I

[00:27:27] Jeff: they roll.

[00:27:28] Christina: this doesn’t seem right, but also, I don’t know. Yeah.

[00:27:35] Jeff: Alright,

[00:27:36] Brett: So,

[00:27:37] Jeff: What do we got?

[00:27:38] Brett: so, this I can segue into this. Um, as part of my, like, mental health I’ve begun realizing that despite identifying as pansexual, I also have some serious internal homophobia that I don’t apply to other people. I only [00:28:00] apply to myself. Um, it’s a, there’s like a lot of self hate around it. Uh, so I have been, uh, making an effort

[00:28:09] Christina: Probably from your religious trauma.

[00:28:11] Brett: Oh, absolutely. 100%. Um, yeah, absolutely. Um, I’ve been making an effort to be in more queer spaces and just, uh, be comfortable with myself in those spaces. Uh, so last week, Elle and I went to a queer dance night and hung out with like 100 percent queer people all night. and had a great time. Um, then we went to a queer art market in Rochester, Minnesota.

[00:28:46] Brett: Um, I got a great Barbie colored ACAB rug. It’s like a welcome mat. Um, and, uh, and then for Thanksgiving, We’re going to, uh, the [00:29:00] only gay bar in La Crosse, Wisconsin, the only official gay bar. There’s another one that’s been adopted by the gay crowd, but doesn’t bill themselves as a gay bar. Chances

[00:29:12] Jeff: Does that mean… Go ahead.

[00:29:14] Brett: What’s that?

[00:29:14] Jeff: Does that mean that the closest gay bar to you is La Crosse, Wisconsin? Wow!

[00:29:19] Brett: hour away. Uh, but we’re going to, we’re going to their Thanksgiving brunch, even though there would likely not be any food that’s too vegan. Um, or pescatarian, uh, gluten intolerant people can eat. Uh, but go first a little bit of day drinking maybe, and I’m gonna meet up with a couple of people that I’ve met online and have never had the pleasure of talking with in person.

[00:29:46] Brett: Some very weird people that I’m excited to, like, talk to you in person instead of just… The slow, the slow progress of Snapchat and messages, conversations. [00:30:00] Um, but yeah, so I’m really, I’m enjoying this space. It’s a lot of fun. I actually feel more comfortable in these spaces than I ever do in, uh, ostensibly straight places that obviously have queer people in them, but they’re not there to be. They’re there to mask and to fit in with everybody else and to go to a queer dance night where there’s just no question. If you walk in the door, it’s assumed you’re queer and you might have to prove you’re straight. But like, it’s, it’s like, it’s an opposite environment that I’m used to and I like it.

[00:30:44] Jeff: Let’s talk about what it would look like to prove you’re straight in such a context.

[00:30:48] Brett: I think you, you’d have to be a real asshole in that context. Um, I don’t know. I

[00:30:58] Christina: I mean,

[00:30:59] Jeff: you’re saying more [00:31:00] like what would, what would make, I think you might be, I don’t mean so much like what would make it obvious that you’re straight, but if someone were to literally say, I need you to prove you’re

[00:31:07] Brett: Yeah, no, I, I think I, I, I misphrased that. That was phrased poorly. I’m

[00:31:12] Jeff: And I say that for fun. That’s a fun thought experiment

[00:31:15] Christina: No, no, I don’t know if this is what your experience is, but my experience in those, in those spaces is that there’s very little you can do, right? Like, there are some people who, and stereotypes are often wrong, um, who might just like give off a vibe and will be like, okay, well, clearly this is like the random straight person who, you know, was an ally and was invited along and we’ll, we’ll accept that.

[00:31:36] Christina: But, but it, and weirdly, I think Okay, this is how it was historically. I think this has actually changed now. But historically, you could get away with being a quote unquote street woman and having that be believed in queer spaces, like what you’re talking about. But if you’re a man of any type, it is just assumed that you are in denial.

[00:31:53] Christina: Um, and uh, uh, at least, at least 20 years ago, you were not even [00:32:00] bisexual. You were, you were gay and, and you were lying

[00:32:02] Brett: and yeah, exactly.

[00:32:04] Christina: Um, uh, that I think has changed a little bit, although biphobia, biphobia is still very real and, uh, especially towards men. Uh, women, it’s assumed, but towards men, it is absolutely assumed that if you have any interest in a guy at all, that you are actually all homosexual, and that you are a complete liar, and you don’t actually like pussy.

[00:32:22] Christina: And, which is

[00:32:23] Brett: frustrating, what’s frustrating about that is that came just as much from the gay community.

[00:32:29] Christina: know, I’m, oh, I,

[00:32:30] Brett: from the straight community.

[00:32:31] Christina: I want to be very clear. What I’m talking about right now, that attitude, I’m sorry, I, I, it’s not even clear. That attitude, I was specifically speaking about queer spaces. I was specifically talking about the attitude from gay spaces, predominantly, uh, specifically largely male gay spaces, because I spent a lot of time in, in, um, largely like male queer space, like gay spaces.

[00:32:53] Christina: They wouldn’t even use the word queer, um, uh, in, in, in high school and college. And any [00:33:00] guy who would, you know, express anything, Oh, you’re just in denial. You’re actually, you, bisexuals don’t exist, you’re gay. Um,

[00:33:09] Brett: you can’t like dick and even have a whiff

[00:33:12] Christina: No, right.

[00:33:13] Brett: Like

[00:33:14] Christina: exactly. It, it, it is not a thing. Now that might’ve changed some, I think that there’s still some of that in the gay community. Women, though, you used to at least get a pass where they’d be like, oh, okay, yeah, she’s straight. Now I think that there’s more of an assumption there, which is like, oh no, you know, you’re, you’re, you’re bi or whatever.

[00:33:30] Brett: yeah, well it used to be like in straight circles, it was this general assumption that all women were a little bit bi just because guys sexualized.

[00:33:41] Christina: Oh, just because, just because we’ll, we’ll, we’ll, we’ll make out when we’re drunk. I

[00:33:44] Brett: right,

[00:33:45] Christina: mean, that’s really what it is. College girls make out when they’re drunk. Yeah.

[00:33:47] Brett: easy for people to say, Oh yeah, all women are a little bit bi. Give them enough alcohol, give them the right environment, and they’ll go for it.

[00:33:55] Brett: But guys were like, so,

[00:33:57] Christina: Completely not. Right.[00:34:00]

[00:34:00] Brett: homo.

[00:34:01] Christina: Absolutely. Absolutely.

[00:34:03] Brett: and I’m talking about straight spaces

[00:34:05] Christina: Oh, no, I know. I know. I know.

[00:34:06] Brett: I had, I had gay friends in high school. Um, and they, they had that mentality. Like I, I began to realize I had bisexual feelings in high school. Um, and, and they would not accept that. Uh, if I had any bisexual feeling, obviously I was gay