Lunch Hour Legal Marketing

Why is it SO difficult to track success in AI search? You want to rank, AI is a beast, your agency might be full of it, and we want to help. Then, we know people are going to lose their jobs to AI, but whose heads will be the first to roll? --- If the chaos of AI search is making your head spin, let’s see if we can get you off the merry-go-round. The lack of understanding and transparency from digital marketing agencies is bonkers right now, so you might be getting bad info about your AI search data. Gyi and Conrad get into the realities of how these AI results really work and how to approach your law firm growth tactics in this environment. Later, it was fascinating to see the heavily AI-centric startup alley pitches at ABA Techshow. Tons of law firms are building their own tools with AI, so what does this mean for legal tech, marketers, agencies, etc.? Let’s discuss whether we’re all losing our jobs… The News: Smokeball and Thomson Reuters are dating. Is it love, or do they just want each other for their data? – Smokeball and Thomson Reuters Partner to Create the Premier Legal Technology Ecosystem Wanna chat about the ins and outs and heres and theres of the private equity landscape? Join us at A Seat at the Table May 6-7 at the Baltimore ballfields. You know what they say, Astroturfing is the best form of flattery. Also, come hang out at r/LHLM! Listicles have never been classy, but did you know that they could also be illegal? Lily Ray explains it well: Promotional listicles: in some cases, they may actually be *against the law,* according to FTC rules. Come to the LHLM Summit! Join us 8/11-13 for some killer talks on law firm growth. Lee Rudin will be there to tell you why your merch sucks, and we know you don’t want to suck. Kerri Coby White is gracing us with an in-depth talk intake, and we know you need that, too! So much good stuff—be there. Listen Next: How to Rank in Google AI Mode Connect: The Bite - Lunch Hour Legal Marketing Newsletter! Leave Us an Apple Review Lunch Hour Legal Marketing on YouTube Lunch Hour Legal Marketing on TikTok r/LHLM Chapters 00:00 Go Blue! 01:51 Legal Marketing News 02:05 Smokeball and Thomson Reuters Getting Cozy 03:21 Private Equity in Legal: "A Seat at the Table" Event 04:18 We Got Astroturffed! 04:50 Promotional Listicles May Be Illegal (FTC Rules) 08:23 LHLM Summit: Your Merchandise Sucks (Lee Rudin) 09:07 LHLM Summit: In-Depth Intake Talk (Kerri Coby White) 09:38 How to REALLY Rank in AI Search & ABA Tech Show Recap | Segment 1 11:13 The Impossibility of Tracking AI Search Success (Why Agencies Lie) 18:26 Tactical AI Search Optimization: Data Infrastructure & Tracking 24:01 Why It’s Still a "Google Most World" & The Importance of Digital PR 37:21 Who Will Lose Their Jobs to AI? (ABA Tech Show Startup Alley) | Segment 2 42:56 The Race to Bespoke AI Software and Headcount Reduction 48:56 Join us for Office Hours

Conrad and Gyi are live from ABA TECHSHOW 2026 at McCormick Place in Chicago, and they've got a big announcement. Lunch Hour Legal Marketing is going all-in on AI with the debut of Claudia, the podcast's new AI co-host. Trained on the most authoritative legal marketing sources (including this very podcast), backed by private equity from Amazon's Alexa Fund, and equipped with her own proprietary accuracy-testing model... What could possibly go wrong? The guys break down the news: A landmark social media addiction verdict against Meta and Google The epic police accountability case starring Afroman A lawyer whose social profiles were hijacked by a Morgan & Morgan slogan Thanks to our sponsors: Thyme, Alps, LexReception, CallRail, and our new sponsors, Lawmatics and Juvo Leads!An additional thank you to the hosts of this week's events, Smokeball and 8AM! Chapters 0:00 Welcome from ABA TECHSHOW 2026 0:43 Thank You: Smokeball & 8AM 1:54 Why TECHSHOW Is Different 2:42 Big Announcement Coming 3:26 New Format & Weekly Episodes 3:53 Going All-In on AI 4:17 News: Afroman's Civil Rights Case 5:29 News: Meta & Google Social Media Addiction Verdict 6:27 News: Attorney's Social Profiles Hacked 7:29 ALPS Insurance Ad (Read by Claudia) 8:56 Introducing Claudia, AI Co-Host 11:04 What Claudia Does for LHLM 11:19 How Claudia Was Trained 12:37 Hallucinations & Accuracy — How Claudia Handles It 13:35 The Self-Serving Training Problem 14:34 Claudia as Agency Secret Sauce 15:20 Three Firms Per Market — The Business Model 16:02 Claudia's... Unconventional Capabilities 16:56 Things Get Weird 17:22 Budget AI Problems

We love answering your questions, folks! Gyi and Conrad have collected a series of queries from a variety of LHLM listeners, and they’ve got plenty of tactical insights to share. ----- Mail time! When we know what’s on your mind, we can bring you the focused, valuable guidance you need to keep growing and improving your law firm business. So, what questions & answers do we have for you today? They guys address marketing mindset shifts (think like a CEO!), seemingly dubious PPC data, visibility tips, 2026 conference recommendations, and more. Also, things are a’changing at Lunch Hour Legal Marketing. Gyi & Conrad take a moment to explain the new partnerships they've been developing, and the next step in the evolution of the podcast. The News: Greater personalization seems to be the driving force behind the expansion of Personal Intelligence across AI Mode in Search, the Gemini app, and Gemini in Chrome. Is this good? Bad? Another step toward hyperdependency? We’ll see: Bringing the power of Personal Intelligence to more people Anthropic has done an extensive study on What 81,000 People Want from AI. Give it a read. Users can now ask AI about the businesses they see in Google Maps, and we think this promises to bring some significant user behavior shifts over time. Think about it: How we’re reimagining Maps with Gemini. OpenAI updates: Introducing GPT‑5.4 mini and nano. Find Conrad and Gyi at ABA TECHSHOW! Listen Next: BS You Hear at Legal Conferences Connect: The Bite - Lunch Hour Legal Marketing Newsletter! Leave Us an Apple Review Lunch Hour Legal Marketing on YouTube Lunch Hour Legal Marketing on TikTok r/LHLM Chapters 00:00 Intro: LHLM at ABA TECHSHOW 2026 02:23 The News: Google's Personal Intelligence & AI 03:16 The News: Anthropic’s Massive AI Study 04:10 The News: Google Maps Re-Imagined with Gemini 05:10 The News: New ChatGPT Release 05:31 Find LHLM at ABA TECHSHOW 06:43 An Evolution for Lunch Hour Legal Marketing (Sponsored Endorsement Model) 13:50 Listener Review: Invaluable 5 Stars 14:58 Opening the LHLM Mailbag 15:15 Mailbag Q1: Helping Marketing Operators Think Like a CEO 22:54 Mailbag Q2: Turned Off PPC, No Drop in Leads - Why? 29:57 Mailbag Q3: Top 3 Trends to Increase Visibility/Growth 36:20 Mailbag Q4: Legal Conferences to Attend in 2026 39:10 Wrap-Up

Paralegals might not wear capes, but they’re often the ones keeping your law firm running and making sure your clients are happy. Conrad and Gyi dive into the unsung, everyday heroes of your practice, your paralegals, and how the right team can make or break your client experience. We highlight a few key clips from a full-length interview Conrad had with Ryan McKeen and Marisa Rua from Para Era about building better paralegal training programs, hiring talent from unexpected industries like food service, and creating systems that let paralegals thrive. Your paralegals are often the first face of your firm, the first voice clients hear, and the first impression that shapes your brand. Ryan and Marissa discuss how to turn that reality into a competitive advantage.📺 Want to hear our entire discussion with Ryan and Marisa? Watch on YouTube The News Congratulations to Neil Katyal for overturning Trump’s unconstitutional tariffs. Big law firms like Jenner & Block, WilmerHale, Perkins Coie, and Susman Godfrey stand strong, proving that not all big law groups are wusses. And yes, your paralegals are still more important than you thought. Chapters: 00:00 Dirty Hands and Native Berries 02:34 News: Legal Wins and Law Firm Backbone 04:07 Why Paralegals Matter for Marketing 06:07 The Paralegal Training Gap 06:33 Hiring Great Paralegals (Even with Zero Experience) 08:45 Marketing Law Firm Jobs to Non-Legal Talent 09:18 When It’s Time to Let a Paralegal Go 10:14 Operational Tips for Better Paralegal Performance 10:18 Let Paralegals Schedule Their Own Calls 11:47 Send Paralegals to Conferences Too

A real Olympian on our little podcast?! Athlete and lawyer Rich Ruohonen shows us all how excellence and commitment are good for business. And, more importantly, how standing up for what’s right as both a citizen and a representative of the law is so necessary in our current cultural climate. ---- Okay, so maybe you can’t be an Olympian, but you can grow your business by pursuing your passions, investing in your community, and showing genuine care for those around you. Gyi and Conrad are honored to welcome Rich Ruohonen, the oldest-ever American winter Olympian, to talk about his experiences with the American Curling team in the 2026 Milano Cortina Olympic Games. Oh, and for all you lawyers out there, Rich shares down-to-earth insights on how his personal injury law firm engages with their community. Later, in the wake of the killings of Renée Good and Alex Pretti, Rich was compelled to use the Olympic stage to speak out about ICE violence in his home state of Minnesota. He shares what that experience meant for him as both a lawyer and a citizen of our great country. Thank you to Rich for representing our country and the profession so well. 📺 Watch: Rich's Olympic Speech The News: Guess this wasn’t a no-brainer—don’t be a dummy and talk about sensitive information with public AI chatbots. This case shows us why: United States v. HEPPNER And, in more AI nonsense: Lawyer apologizes for fake quotes, fabricated judgments generated by AI in murder case. Yikes. And, some lawyer skulduggery in South Carolina: Lowcountry Attorney Charged with Defrauding $1.5M from Mt. Pleasant Law Firm and Clients. Eesh. On a lighter note, get your tickets for the LHLM Summit! Yay! Listen Next: The One Where Gyi and Conrad Rock the Boat Connect: The Bite - Lunch Hour Legal Marketing Newsletter! Leave Us an Apple Review Lunch Hour Legal Marketing on YouTube Lunch Hour Legal Marketing on TikTok r/LHLM In This Episode: 00:00 Fit Check 02:24 Starting with the News 07:50 Introducing Olympian Lawyer Rich Ruohonen 08:18 Rich's Olympic Journey in Curling 15:15 Curling, Law, and Business: The Intersection of Being an Athlete and a Trial Lawyer 29:11 Making a Stand: Rich Ruohonen's Olympic Speech on the Rule of Law in Minnesota 41:18 Closing & Final Thanks

Business feeling stagnant in your smaller market? Contradictory to our previous claims, adding a new practice area might be just the thing. But first, new Direct Business Search data just dropped—what do you do now? ----- Fantastic news, everybody—Google has finally segmented out your Direct Business Search results. What does that mean for you? Gyi and Conrad hash out the details to help you understand how this new data could affect your tactics and budget, ultimately bringing better focus to your marketing efforts. Later, we’ve often said that finding your niche area in legal practice can be a very effective way to capture more business in your market. Buuut… is that always true? Could there, perchance, be a situation where adding new practice areas is the best move for your business? Gyi and Conrad discuss the pros and cons of practice expansion and how to stay tactical and competitive in the process. The News: Very clever PR stunt, folks. – Cheeky law firm offers to help Native American tribe evict Billie Eilish from their land after smug Grammys rant. Just want to offer our appreciation to Rich Ruohonen for being an awesome athlete, lawyer, and citizen of our great country – A 54-year-old personal injury lawyer from Minnesota just became the oldest US Winter Olympian Google Direct Business Search data now showing in LSAs. Fresh Near Media Research is on its way. Stay tuned! Listen Next: LHLM Office Hours Connect: The Bite - Lunch Hour Legal Marketing Newsletter! Leave Us an Apple Review Lunch Hour Legal Marketing on YouTube Lunch Hour Legal Marketing on TikTok r/LHLM

Hey, friends. The hard truth of it is—It’s bad for business if there’s no rule of law. We’re grateful for the voices in the profession that have shown a willingness to defend our nation’s laws in the midst of uncertainty. Later, Conrad shares tips for making friends. ----- We’ve been heartened to see a variety of voices standing up for the rule of law in recent weeks, and working in legal, we know the pressures firms feel as they consider how to engage in our current political climate. But, on this we can all agree: The rule of law is essential for the health and prosperity of our nation. Gyi and Conrad take a moment to share stories and amplify the voices of those who have shown their commitment to uphold the Constitution. Next, Conrad really opened a can of worms on Facebook this week. Come for the drama, stay for the tactical tips on standing out in a world of private equity-backed agencies. Grab some popcorn. The News: Bob Ambrogi digs into the hopeful thought that legal-specific tech platforms can do a better job for lawyers’ AI needs – Anthropic’s Legal Plugin for Claude Cowork May Be the Opening Salvo In A Competition Between Foundation Models and Legal Tech Incumbents Multiple clients have seen a 40% drop in their local visibility. Seems shady, eh? If you don’t control your WordPress site, there’s a problem, folks. Gyi & Conrad explain how to own your stuff from the get-go. Announcing the Lunch Hour Legal Marketing Summit in Nashville, Tennessee! It’s gonna be a great time, everyone. Get your tickets before they’re all gone! Mentioned: NCBP discusses the rule of law: Presidential Check-In – A Conversation with Patrick Palace Sign the Pledge! Listen Next: Local Love, Review Realities, and the Truth about Google’s PMax Campaigns Connect: The Bite - Lunch Hour Legal Marketing Newsletter! Leave Us an Apple Review Lunch Hour Legal Marketing on YouTube Lunch Hour Legal Marketing on TikTok r/LHLM

As you advertise locally, advertise your localness! Then, what's a small firm to do in the sea of reviews? And, we really hate Google’s Performance Max nonsense. ----- Lots to cover today, folks! Being connected to your community matters, and consumers respond with notable positivity to ads that emphasize all the local feels. Gyi and Conrad have plenty of insights on making the most of where you’re planted. Next, fake reviews keep pouring in, and you need a clear strategy to rise above the flood. The guys share tactical tips for directing your resources to become a strong competitor in your marketplace. And, lastly, Google’s PMax campaigns are a mighty unfunny joke. Ugh. The data is in, and—surprise, surprise—Google might not have your best interest at heart. Gyi and Conrad pick apart the latest data to help you understand what these campaigns are (not) doing for your law firm. The News: OpenAI put this out there: Our approach to advertising and expanding access to ChatGPT. And, just to remind you all, at one point they told us ads were definitely not in the game plan. But… qué será, será, eh? Near Media’s “Near Memo” podcast welcomed our very own Gyi for a chat you should definitely go listen to: AI Is Breaking Local Search—But Google Still Decides Who Gets Chosen Mentioned: Al Ludwig's LinkedIn post Listen Next: Conrad’s Crystal Ball V: Lawyer Marketing Predictions for 2026 Connect: The Bite - Lunch Hour Legal Marketing Newsletter! Leave Us an Apple Review Lunch Hour Legal Marketing on YouTube Lunch Hour Legal Marketing on TikTok r/LHLM

How did our delightful little pod become what it is today? Gyi and Conrad chat with Ben & Brian Glass at The Great Legal Marketing Summit about their respective entrances into the legal marketing world and the story of the podcast’s growing-up years. They discuss what podcasts can & can’t do as a marketing tool for your business and how to create a conversation worth listening to. Father-Son duo Ben and Brian Glass are prominent personal injury lawyers and business partners at BenGlassLaw in Fairfax, Virginia. They are known for their trial work, business acumen, and innovative marketing.

Mystic for hire! Conrad dusts off the ol’ prophetic orb for a look at what 2026 has in store for lawyers and legal marketers. ----- We know you’re itching to hear those future fortunes, but hang on a second! First, Gyi and Conrad look back at their previous predictions to see how well they forecasted 2025. I mean, you want to know whether you can trust these guys, right? And, well, those results aside, the guys then gaze into the depths to pick out the important marketing trends to watch in 2026. More AI stuff, new law firm business structures, anybody who could do anything about fake reviews will do absolutely nothing about it… and more! Cheers to a New Year! The News: Quite the play, Google. - Official: Apple Intelligence & Siri To Be Powered By Google Gemini Better pay attention to this one, folks. Commercial environments are changing, but watching this trajectory should help us wrap our heads around it: New tech and tools for retailers to succeed in an agentic shopping era. And, Jay Ruane wrote a stellar book! - Analog Marketing in a Digital World: A Blueprint for Attorneys to Dominate Local Markets by Being Human Suggested LHLM Episodes: Conrad’s Crystal Ball IV | Lawyer Marketing Predictions for 2025 - Legal Talk Network Connect: The Bite - Lunch Hour Legal Marketing Newsletter! Leave Us an Apple Review Lunch Hour Legal Marketing on YouTube Lunch Hour Legal Marketing on TikTok r/LHLM

First—watch out, Ohio. The guys are sore losers, so they’re taking it out on one of your websites. Later, what should law firms be doing during the honeymoon phase with new clients? ------ Sour grapes, for sure: Following Michigan’s painful loss to Ohio State, Gyi and Conrad take revenge on Ohioans with a teardown of the Buckeye Law Group’s pathetic website. (Eesh—harsh, guys.) From ineffectual “Buckeye” branding to affinity-building misses to a phone number that leads to SOMEONE ELSE’S LAW FIRM, it’s not great. So, basically, Ohio drools, Michigan rules. Later, Gyi and Conrad want you to have a long and happy marriage with your clients, so you’d better not bungle the honeymoon. During this new, formative time, there are certain things you should and shouldn’t do! The guys talk about building trust through great first impressions, exceptional communication, clear expectations—all the things that create a delightful customer experience for your new clients. A Wee Bit o’ News: Huh, Google is now allowing anonymous reviews. So, we’re wondering hard about whether this might encourage a mass influx of fake reviews… ya think? A few silver linings might exist, but let’s all just plan for the worst, shall we? LHLM’s Top 5 Episodes of 2025! Clio’s All-In with Scorpion – Who Gets Stung? Not All Leads Are Created Equal Tasty Tactical Tidbits || Don’t Call It a Rebrand Conrad’s Crystal Ball IV | Lawyer Marketing Predictions for 2025 r/LHLM: Reddit Feeds the AI MACHINE Listen Next: Does My Website Suck? | Law Firm Website Teardown Connect: Lunch Hour Legal Marketing Newsletter! – The Bite Leave Us an Apple Review Lunch Hour Legal Marketing on YouTube Lunch Hour Legal Marketing on TikTok r/LHLM

Authenticity can be a powerful differentiator in legal marketing. Many lawyers hesitate to share their personal story, but doing so can create real connection and trust with the right clients. Gyi sits down with Chris Earley to talk about his marketing journey and why authenticity matters. They also dive into Chris’s involvement in masterminds and coaching programs, his commitment to integrity and positive firm culture, and how those values show up in the way he connects with clients. Sign up for Chris’s weekly email: practicetipoftheweek.com Read Chris’s book! - Scaling the Wall: One Man's Journey of Healing Childhood Trauma to Find Fulfillment and Success: Earley, Christopher Chris Earley is the founder and CEO of the Earley Law Group Injury Lawyers in Boston, Massachusetts.

Where are your competitors spending their marketing money? Gyi and Conrad’s insights into this valuable data can help you stay ahead of the rivals in your market. ----- Competitive research is an oft overlooked marketing activity, but you should definitely be focusing on this valuable information to make smarter decisions for your law firm’s marketing efforts. However, getting your hands on this research might not be as easy and obvious as you’d like it to be. So, how do you find out what you need to know? The guys talk through what to keep in mind as you pursue your research. The News: This is looking like a smart new venture: Rankings.io has acquired Gladiator. Aw, shucks—Chris Dreyer named us as top SEOs. Thanks, Chris! Aaaaand, another acquisition, if you care to know — SEMRush (an SEO tool) was purchased by Adobe. Still steadily sinking toward the inevitability of your AI overlords? Welp, with new updates from both ChatGPT and Gemini, we’ll all get there eventually. Conrad’s spidey senses are tingling… Floyd Mayweather got into the law through The Money Team Law Firm, and is now entering the legal marketing realm. Hmm. Last, more thoughts on exclusivity with Gyi and Conrad. And, we want to know what you think! Leave us a comment on LinkedIn or YouTube. Suggested LHLM Episodes: Local SEO 2024: How to Rank with Local Falcon Connect: The Bite - Lunch Hour Legal Marketing Newsletter! Leave Us an Apple Review Lunch Hour Legal Marketing on YouTube Lunch Hour Legal Marketing on TikTok r/LHLM

Craving a sneak peak of our live recording from Filevine's Lex Summit? This year, Filevine’s Josh Hostilo and Stefanie Minter joined us at the table table to tackle one of the most confusing—and most important—topics in legal marketing: accurate attribution. Gyi and Conrad dig into how Lead Docket approaches first-touch, last-touch, and dual-source attribution, why “How did you hear about us?” still matters, and how UTMs, web forms, call tracking, and client feedback all get folded together to give firms real visibility into ROI. We even get into Google Ads optimization, Zapier webhooks, and the surprising disconnect between what clients say and what the data actually shows. This is just a small appetizer. Check out the extended interview on YouTube!

It’s surprisingly easy for a marketing agency to make underperforming campaigns look like wins. How do you guard yourself against marketers who exaggerate your results? Also, NAP consistency—the definitive answer! ------ Yeah, it’s scummy, but not all marketers have your best interests at heart. More perniciously, data can be spun and credit can be misattributed. Less so, inexperienced consultants misinterpret your campaign data and draw the wrong conclusions. Either way, bad insights lead to bad decisions—and those decisions can cost your firm big. You, dear lawyer, need to know enough about your marketing data to avoid being taken advantage of. Gyi and Conrad are here to help. Later, the guys answer a YouTube question on NAP (Name-Address-Phone) consistency. So, is your NAP consistency negatively affected by using a call tracking number along with your primary phone number? Usually, no! Unless you screwed something up on your site—Gyi tells you how to make sure everything’s as kosher as a pickle. The News: Darnit—the robots aren’t supposed to solve your legal problems anymore: OpenAI is no longer giving legal advice. To retract, or not to retract… For now, we’ll call it a news update: Scorpion confirmed that they do break out branded vs. non-branded campaigns in their reporting, so that’s good. 🎧 Listen Next: Mindful Gifting || Resolutions Past and Future Connect: The Bite - Lunch Hour Legal Marketing Newsletter! Leave Us an Apple Review Lunch Hour Legal Marketing on YouTube Lunch Hour Legal Marketing on TikTok r/LHLM