In The Thick of IT

What does it really take to build trust, community, and resilience across an entire state’s cybersecurity ecosystem? In this episode, we go deep with Ryan Murray on how showing up matters more than titles, and how long-game relationships make or break vendor partnerships. We also dive into personal stories around growing up in Yuma to how a three-piece suit became part of Ryan’s brand. Along the way, we hit on why education gaps persist in cyber, what happens when vendors fail to play the long game, and how AI and deepfakes are rewriting the threat landscape. This episode brings humor, honesty, and hard truths about the work ahead. I hope you enjoy listening as much as I enjoyed recording this one! 00:00:00 — First impressions, podcast setup, and showing up for community00:15:31 — How showing up builds statewide trust in cybersecurity00:33:01 — Growing up with limited means, education gaps, mentors, underserved communities00:51:01 — Why being accessible matters01:08:01 — Vendor vs. Partner: How vendors lose when they don’t play the long game01:26:01 — The hidden power of statewide purchasing01:48:01 — Training users vs. securing systems; why humans still click the link02:13:01 — AI risks, deepfakes, and why modern users can’t keep up with threat evolution02:30:01 — How early career experiences shape today’s leadership02:51:01 — Building relationships that last;03:10:01 — Personal stories: growing up in Detroit, loss, manifesting success, learning from mistakes03:28:01 — The culture of technology adoption vs. security maturity — why we’re wired to chase shiny new tools03:45:01 — AI risks, human nature, the speed of tech vs. the speed of wisdom; why building trust and empathy matters more than ever

Ever feel like you're playing a game without knowing the rules? This episode dives into the behind-the-scenes world of tech sales, vendor relationships, and the unwritten codes that shape your security and budget decisions. With some transparency, humor, and a touch of whiskey(Fern only), we pull back the curtain on renewals, sales incentives, and the "circle of trust" that gets you access; or possibly keeps you locked out. From burnout to betrayal, to building trust the long way, this one's for the leaders asking: "How do I actually win?" in a matrix built by sales.00:00:00 - Intro00:15:01 - Renewals, reseller games & playing a game without written rules00:30:01 - "Fill the bucket": Aligning incentives with sales00:45:01 - Brokers of knowledge, ethical sales, and the trust equation01:00:01 - When relationships fall apart: Burnout, betrayal & rebirth01:15:01 - Circles of trust & gatekeeping in the sales world01:30:01 - The CactusCon panel, good moderation & real curiosity01:45:01 - Golf, grit & unexpected career paths02:00:01 - The security startup hustle02:15:01 - From SRP to Phoenix Children's: Scaling security programs02:30:01 - Inner circles, silent wins & lessons from the shadows02:45:01 - Guardrails, curiosity & defending03:00:01 - Fighting the uphill battle in cybersecurity03:15:01 - Building a trusted peer network & free resource ideas03:30:01 - Circles, advocacy & the closing toast

Trevor Costanzi pulls back the curtain on what it really takes to thrive in security—from burnout and certifications to why the best engineers don’t always wear suits. We dig into hacker origins, secure-by-design philosophy, and how relationships—not just résumés—build lasting tech careers. Whether you're trying to break into cyber, pivot from helpdesk, or finally make sense of DevSecOps, this one hits like a late-night Slack message that changes everything. Buckle up.00:00:00 : Why most security teams are misunderstood, and how some non-technical leadership breaks trust00:15:01 : From hacking middle school servers to burnout-proof job advice. Why security isn’t for everyone00:30:01 : Certifications vs. reality: what the industry doesn’t want you to know about getting hired00:45:01 : The power of showing up: why building real-world relationships trumps LinkedIn hype01:00:01 : DevSecOps decoded: building secure products without killing team velocity01:15:01 : In the trenches and at the top: bridging the trust gap between engineers and execs01:30:01 : The mindset shift from paycheck collector to legacy builder01:45:01 : Career roadmap for new security pros—and why coding is the ultimate unlock02:00:01 : Late-night failures, university rants, and the boldest take on GenAI yet

I sat down with someone whose work lives far from the spotlight but impacts everything from intelligence strategy to leadership systems. In this nearly three-hour conversation, Frank shares what it takes to lead when stakes are high, decisions are gray, and systems are bigger than any one person. We unpack how influence is earned, what happens behind the scenes in real-world operations, and how trust, precision, and humility come together to drive real progress. If you're someone who likes to think about leadership at the systems level—this one's for you.00:00:00 - 00:10:10 — Building a career rooted in trust00:10:11 - 00:20:36 — Influence built through relationships, not titles00:20:37 - 00:31:18 — Crisis, trust, and real-time leadership00:31:19 - 00:41:43 — Surveillance ethics and threat assessment00:41:44 - 00:52:15 — Navigating transparency vs. duty00:52:16 - 01:03:07 — Perception vs. operational reality01:03:08 - 01:13:33 — Innovation inside government red tape01:13:34 - 01:24:17 — Healthcare shows systemic failures01:24:18 - 01:34:46 — Leadership when seconds count01:34:47 - 01:45:17 — Systems that quietly break trust01:45:18 - 01:56:04 —Tech waste and procurement dysfunction01:56:05 - 02:06:21 — Infrastructure, targeting, and resilience02:06:22 - 02:16:35 — Deepfakes and digital identity erosion02:16:36 - 02:27:15 — Burnout-proofing digital transformation02:27:16 - 02:37:39 — Compliance vs. practical progress02:37:40 - 02:47:47 — Humanity and humor in leadership02:47:48 - 02:54:52 — Franks final reflections on legacy, courage, and why clarity matters more than confidence.

Graham shares his career journey from PHX Suns ticket sales to CEO, the lessons he learned from both sides of the table, and how he built HireRising into a powerhouse in tech staffing and consulting.🔹 Was he crazy to take the risk? (Even his friends thought so.)🔹 The biggest hiring trends for 2025 : who’s in demand & what’s changing?🔹 How sales experience can transform your career🔹 The secret to building high-value relationships that fuel success.🔹 Graham’s daily routine for peak performance—cold plunges, meditation & mindset shifts.If you’ve ever thought about taking a leap in your career or business, Graham has the story you need to hear. 0:00 | From Sales to Business Ownership7:01 | Understanding Both Sides in Business14:31 | Overcoming Doubt & Taking the Entrepreneurial Leap20:51 | Hiring Trends for 2025 & Business Growth29:16 | Work-Life Balance & Personal Success Habits38:01 | The Power of Business Relationships44:21 | Future of Hiring & Industry Shifts51:31 | HireRising’s Vision & Expansion into Consulting58:41 | Final Takeaways & Career Advice

I am not certain any person actually has the life they expected. I would argue, a number of unexpected events lead us down a path we might not have imagined. In the episode, Paul Wolf opens up about an early dream of becoming an actor, a surprising detour into radio, and the financial hardships during a tech layoff. Through his storytelling, we explore the struggles of finding our footing, career pivots, and the emotional toll of losing your source of income. From being “voluntold” into cybersecurity to navigating financial survival, this episode covers resilience, personal growth, and how security roles have evolved in the business world. If you're unsure of what your future looks like, find yourself at a career crossroads, or looking for some inspiration, Paul is just to person to learn from. Listen to his story about overcoming setbacks, adapting to change, and finding purpose. This episode is a reminder that the toughest moments can lead to the most unexpected opportunities.00:00:00 - The Accidental Path to Cybersecurity00:10:23 - Chasing Dreams: From Acting to Tech00:22:46 - Breaking into Radio & Early Tech Experiences00:34:16 - The Reality of Low Salaries in Radio00:47:31 - Transitioning from Radio to IT01:02:01 - The Evolution of Security Roles01:17:46 - When Your Career Chooses You01:31:01 - Struggles of Building a Security Program01:43:51 - Getting Laid Off and Facing Rock Bottom02:00:11 - The Emotional Toll of Financial Struggles02:20:00 - The Evolution of Security in Business02:40:00 - Rebuilding and Finding Purpose in Security02:57:36 - Final Reflections & Career Advice

In this episode, we dive into the origin of a CISO, how they handle challenges, and how professionals integrate work and life to be successful. Using examples from family life, the conversation shows why trust, teamwork, and doing the right thing are important for a strong workplace culture through CISO leadership. You’ll also hear about how professionals deal with topics around AI and privacy, but also how they help future leaders grow. This episode is full of great tips and stories that will make you think about how to be a better leader and a better version of yourself with different perspectives from the host/guest. Tune in to learn about the ups and downs of leadership and what the future might look like for you. 00:00:00 - The Role of CIOs and CISOs 00:10:23 - Security in Leadership: Lessons from Family Life 00:22:46 - Managing Risks in Corporate Culture 00:34:16 - Building Trust in Teams and Technology 00:47:51 - Personal Growth Through Professional Challenges 01:02:01 - Balancing Work, Life, and Innovation 01:17:16 - The Ethics of Cybersecurity and Privacy 01:31:01 - Empowering Future Leaders in Cybersecurity 01:43:51 - Facing the Future: Challenges and Opportunities 02:00:11 - Hypothetical Risk Scenarios and Leadership Responsibility 02:20:00 - Adapting Security Practices and Tools 02:40:00 - Building Connections and Sharing Expertise 02:53:00 - Final Reflections and Future Plans

Time Stamps 00:00:00 - Breaking Down Barriers: Early Career Lessons00:10:05 - Navigating Leadership in Tech00:20:42 - The Power of Storytelling in Cybersecurity00:34:35 - Fostering Trust Through Collaboration00:47:50 - Personal Growth Through Professional Challenges01:02:20 - Balancing Work, Family, and Self01:18:05 - Innovation vs. Legacy: Making Strategic Decisions01:31:10 - Empowering Teams with Purpose-Driven Leadership01:44:05 - Lessons from Mistakes: A Personal Reflection02:00:35 - Facing the Future: Tech and Trust02:20:25 - The Importance of Diversity in Tech Leadership02:35:10 - Closing Reflections and Future Visions

Every CISO has war stories, but Mike is different. His 26 years of experience of client and vendor roles has provided perspective to the stories people rarely speak about. The darker side of security where corporations lose more through Business Email Compromise than the recorded ransomware attacks you might read about in the news. Take a seat and buckle up. I guarantee these stories will blow your mind and provide a perspective into the things we all wonder about, but rarely hear of.00:00 - Intro 05:38 - Homeschooling and Pandemic Adjustments12:14 - Parenting Challenges and Work-Life Balance20:23 - Fitness, Hobbies, and Routines29:29 - Yoga, Weightlifting, and Self-Care38:01 - Life Experiences Shaping Professional Growth45:01 - Business Practices, Sales, and Security01:00:01 - Leadership and Decision-Making in Tech01:12:01 - Innovation and Balancing Tradition with Modern Ideas01:25:01 - Security and Compliance in Different Industries01:37:01 - Corporate Culture and Ethical Leadership01:45:16 - Workplace Ethics and Security Challenges02:00:01 - Emerging Threats and AI in Security02:15:01 - Corporate Risk Management and Leadership02:30:01 - Blending Traditional and Modern Security Approaches02:45:45 - Career Growth and Leadership Insights02:55:01 - Changes in technology, business strategies, and leadership approaches03:10:01 - Personal and Professional Development Takeaways

Through mentorship, on the job coaching, and most recently through his Security Sam Series of books promoting Cybersecurity for today's youth, Rich has established himself as a Cybersecurity Legend. His 50 years of experience and mentorship of countless CISOs in todays market has provided the wisdom a significant number of organizations can attribute to their security practice foundations.Through all the years, processes, controls, frameworks, equipment, software and technology breakthroughs, one thing has and will always be true about Cybersecurity:Its All about people. Learn from the living legend in this 3+ hour conversation where we talk NASA to AI and technology from 1970 to 2024. If you are interested in reading more about Security Sam or the books discussed in this episode, please use the following link:https://store.bookbaby.com/profile/RichOwen10% Promo Code: "JSS1"Guest Info: https://www.linkedin.com/in/rwowen/

If you have ever wondered how successful leaders build authentic connections to create a thriving workplace, this is for you. In this episode we sit with Chris Lawrence to discuss his insights on navigating these challenges with the optics of being an engineer early in his career to a standing CISO. Our conversation jumps into being reflective on stories of personal growth through tragic loss and the renewed purpose we find through our desire to create the legacy we were destined for. Whether you are leading a team, aspiring to lead, or struggling to find the flame within, this episode will provide the words of encouragement you might need. Tune in for this weeks episode.

Lester and I sat to discuss how his unique experiences forged his beliefs on leadership, building teams, and finding success in Cyber. We captured the stories where his confidence in himself allowed him to transfer from a music background to being responsible for one of the largest counties in the US. Things are not always as they seem, and Lester gave us his opinion on how there is a place for everyone in Cyber regardless of what people might have heard about qualifications. Everyone can make a positive impact with securing our community. Find out how with this episode. Guest: Lester GodseyCISO of Maricopa County. https://www.linkedin.com/in/lestergodsey/

I sat with Kim Jones, a Cyber Professional with nearly 40 years of experience, to get his take on leadership. I learned personal accountability and communication are key components to his success, but there are plenty of other characteristics we must develop before we can expect to make an impact. Through impact, we leave a legacy for the next generation to carry the torch on. Listen on and enjoy a snippet of 38 years of experience broken into 23 chapters.

Have you wondered what the journey from Cyber Consultant to CEO might look like? If so, this is for you. Andy Jordan successfully made the transition from frustrated employee to inspired CEO with his guiding light coming from prior experiences he sought to improve. He is on a mission to build an company where employees love their work and the appreciation they receive, but also an organization where clients love the transformational results they achieve. Listen in for the inspiration you might need to take a leap of faith. Guest: Andy Jordan, CEO New Genesis SolutionsAndy's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/andyjjordan/New Genesis Solutions: https://www.newgenesissolutions.org/

MIke Manrod is a pillar in the AZ Cyber community. I was fortunate enough to meet him at a local event where he encouraged me to start a podcast during our first conversation. 6 months later, here we are. I could not be more excited to sit with one of the most respected and accomplished professionals in our local market.I hope you enjoy our conversation and take a few lessons for your tech journey. Thank you for your support! Guest Info: https://www.linkedin.com/in/manrod/Host Info: https://www.linkedin.com/in/fernandojrojas/Podcast Info: https://www.linkedin.com/company/in-the-thick-of-it/?viewAsMember=trueYouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@InTheThickofIT-