Circle of Fellows #118: Communication Leadership

Communication leadership takes many forms, each requiring its own set of skills and vision. At its core, it involves leading a communication team—setting direction, fostering talent, and ensuring excellence in execution. On a broader scale, communication leaders play a critical role in guiding the entire organization’s messaging, advising executives, and shaping the narrative both internally and externally. Beyond the organization, communication professionals often step into industry leadership, setting standards, sharing best practices, and elevating the profession as a whole. Whether managing teams, advising the C-suite, or championing industry progress, communication leaders are essential in building trust, driving alignment, and advancing both organizational and professional goals.

Four Fellows of the International Association of Business Communicators (IABC) discussed the qualities of communication leadership during the most recent Circle of Fellows panel. During the hourlong conversation, you’ll discover how communication experts drive alignment, build trust, and shape culture from the inside out. You’ll gain practical strategies and fresh insights from industry leaders, equipping you to influence decisions at the highest levels and make a measurable impact on your organization’s success.

About the panel:

Russell Grossman, DipPR, ABC, FRSA, FCIPR, FCIM, IABC Fellow, has been a communications practitioner for nearly 40 years and a UK Senior Civil Servant since 2006. He recently stepped down from his position as the Director of Communications at the UK Rail Regulator, the Office of Rail and Road, and head of the Government Communication Service (GCS) internal communications profession. He’s a non-executive director of the “Engage for Success ” movement, which aims to advance employee engagement, and a sponsor for both the GCS Fast Stream and GCS Talent. Russell and his long-suffering wife of 38 years are blessed with four children (one of whom also works within GCS) and five grandchildren.

Sue Heuman, ABC, MC, IABC Fellow, based in Edmonton, Canada, is an award-winning, accredited authority on organizational communications with more than 40 years of experience. Since co-founding Focus Communications in 2002, Sue has worked with clients to define, understand, and achieve their communications objectives. Sue is a highly sought-after executive advisor, specializing in leading communication audits and strategies for clients across all three sectors. Much of her practice involves a strategic review of the communications function within an organization, analyzing channels and audiences. She creates strategic communication plans and provides expertise to enable their execution. Sue has been a member of the International Association of Business Communicators (IABC) since 1984, which enables her to both stay current with and contribute to the field of communications practices. In 2016, Sue received the prestigious Rae Hamlin Award from IABC in recognition of her work to promote Global Standards for communication. She was also named 2016 IABC Edmonton Chapter Communicator of the Year. In 2018, IABC named Sue a Master Communicator, the Association’s highest honor in Canada. Sue earned the IABC Fellow designation in 2022.

Mike Klein is a communication leader with experience spanning corporate, political, and NGO communication, focusing on internal communication and the social dynamics of organizations and societies. Mike is the founder of #WeLeadComms, the world’s largest recognition program for communication leaders, a former IABC EMENA Regional Chair, and the author of “From Lincoln to LinkedIn”, a guide to understanding and influencing social communication in enterprises and communities. He is based in Reykjavik, Iceland, and has lived in seven countries. He has driven communication programs in major organizations, including Shell, Maersk, and Cargill, and holds an MBA from the London Business School.

Robin McCasland, IABC Fellow, SCMP, is Senior Director of Corporate Communications for Health Care Service Corporation (HCSC). She leads the company’s communications team and the employee listening program, demonstrating to senior leaders how employee and executive communication add value to the business’s bottom line. Previously, Robin excelled in leadership roles in communication for Texas Instruments, Dell, Tenet Healthcare, and Burlington Northern Santa Fe. She has also worked for large and boutique HR consulting firms, leading major communication initiatives for various well-known companies. Robin is a past IABC chairman and has served in numerous association leadership roles for over 30 years. She was honored in 2023 and 2021 by Ragan/PR Daily as one of the Top Women Leaders in Communication. She’s also received IABC Southern Region and IABC Dallas Communicator of the Year honors. Robin is a graduate of The University of Texas at Austin and a Leadership Texas alumnus. Her own podcast, Torpid Liver (and Other Symptoms of Poor Communication), features guest speakers addressing timely topics to help communication professionals become more influential, strategic advisors and leaders. She resides in Dallas, Texas, with her husband, Mitch, and their canine kids, Tank and Petunia.

Raw transcript

Shel Holtz: [00:00:00] Well, hi everybody and welcome to episode one 18 of Circle of Fellows. I’m she Holtz. I am an IABC fellow. I am also Senior Director of Communication at Webco in San Francisco, and I am joined today by four of my colleagues in the, uh, college of Fellows at IABC, uh, to talk about leadership, uh, in the communication profession, which, uh, is one of those topics that’s both a, a mile deep and a mile wide and cover a lot of ground here.

Uh, so, uh, I’m gonna ask each of our participants today to introduce themselves, uh, going walk wise as I see you on the screen. Um, Mike, uh, we’ll start with you and welcome to your first, uh, livestream Circle of Fellows, one of the 2025 class. [00:01:00]

Mike Klein: Thank you very much. She And indeed, I am a newly minted IABC fellow.

Um, I am based in Revic Iceland, where I have a practice mainly focused on internal and nonprofit communication. Um, used to do political campaigns in the States before I went an internal, um, back in the nineties, um, working mainly across the Atlantic with different clients and groups there. And I’m also the editor in chief of Strategic Magazine, which can be found at Strategic Global.

Shel Holtz: Great. Thanks, Mike. Uh, Sue, you’re up next.

Sue Heuman: Hi everybody. Good to see you all. Just to underscores the I in IEBC with the crowd that’s here today, Bruce. From all over the place, Sue Human from, uh, Edmonton, Canada. I am a co-owner of a little boutique, uh, communication agency for the past 23 years. Uh, we do work [00:02:00] mostly in, uh, all three sectors, but mostly in, um, websites, strategic communication.

Um, we organize a lot of conferences too, which is just a, an interesting side gig. Um, but ha, happy to be here and especially with the esteemed group.

Shel Holtz: Thanks, Sue. Uh, Robin. Hi. Good to see you. Hello.

Robin McCasland: Hi everybody. Uh, I’m Robin McCaslin. I’m senior director of Communications for Healthcare Service Corporation.

We are the largest customer owned health insurer in the United States. We now have more than 26 million members across the country. Um, and in addition to our, uh, typical health products, we also, uh, are in the Medicare and Medicaid space. We offer through some of our subsidiaries and other entities, life insurance, dental, vision, you name it.

So we are got the health space covered and I am in Dallas, Texas, USA.

Shel Holtz: Great. And that leaves Russell.

Russell Grossman: Hey there. Well, uh, so I’m Russell Grossman. Uh, [00:03:00] I’m in London. That’s London, England. Uh, and I’m the director of communications at the UK Rail Regulator. I’m also director of the Government Communication Service.

And in fact, I’ve just also stepped down, uh, after 12 years as the head of profession for internal communications across the UK government. Um, never a dull moment here in, uh, government as you would expect from, uh, any government. But my specializations, I suppose, uh, tend to be towards a topic today, communications, leadership, internal communications, and organization development.

Shel Holtz: Excellent. So I do want to, uh, let those of you who are watching, uh, in real time, and I can see that there are some. Some of you out there that you are invited and, uh, encouraged to participate in this conversation. There is a field where you can enter a question or a comment or an observation, uh, and I’ll be able to display that on the screen and the panel will be able to weigh in on it.

[00:04:00] Uh, always, uh, fun component of. These conversations is, is bringing in the folks who are watching. Uh, so let’s start this conversation from a, a, a, the, the 40,000 foot perspective. Uh, when we talk about leading communication, this could be the chief communication officer leading the entire communication function in an organization.

It can also be a manager who has two people reporting to them and multiple layers above them. Part of a larger organization, uh, handling communication in a function. It could be leadership at an agency. Uh, you could be leading your own consultancy as, uh, some of you are, uh, and as I did for 21 years. Uh, but, um, all of these require certain.

Traits, uh, certain characteristics for people who are aspiring to leadership [00:05:00] in communication. What traits should they be nurturing, uh, and, and building?

Robin McCasland: Oh, uh, start with emotional intelligence. If, if that’s not something that comes naturally to you, cultivating that, um, being able to demonstrate authenticity, a sense of humility, um, all of those things will help, um, will help the people who report to you or the people who are paying attention to you to feel a sense that you are honest, that you sincerely care, um, and that you have their best interest in mind.

Sue Heuman: Yeah, that’s an interesting point, Robin. I feel like there’s two sides to this question. One is the people leadership, which you’ve touched on, but then there’s also the communication practice leadership where you’re staying abreast of the latest, uh, innovations in technology and practice. And you are helping to guide your team toward being their [00:06:00] very best every day.

So I feel like there’s two sides to this question. Perhaps agree. I say

Mike Klein: there are three sides.

Russell Grossman: Uh, I would say one of the interesting things about communications, I think is that. It’s a discipline or, or a practice that most people, even if they’re not in the discipline or practice, think they know a lot about.

Uh, and in some cases that is true and in other cases it’s not. But just picking up on Robin’s humility point, I think it is important for people aspiring to communications leadership to be able to spot whether others in their organization who are non communications practitioners actually know a lot about the practice.

And if that’s the case, to respect that and to have the good grace, uh, to, to, to, to look at that, uh, particularly, uh, regard that as important if you’re looking, uh, with leaders, many leaders achieve their leadership, be in, in an organization because they are good communicators. And if they’re good communicators, they probably [00:07:00] know something innately or otherwise about communications.

So that humility point and good grace, I think is really important in terms of the kind of skillset that you should be aspiring to.

Mike Klein: Mike. Any thoughts? I think there’s actually three elements to it. One is, you know, the extent to which we can develop ourselves as leaders in a, in, in a corporate context. You know, leading a function, interacting with leaders, those relationship piece. But there’s also a separate piece around what I call communicational leadership, which really focuses on maximizing the value and impact that we can deliver uniquely as communication professions.

And, you know, we can talk about that in some length, like later in the conversation, but I think there’s, you know, a clear distinction be made about, about leadership within the hierarchical context and then the leadership role that we [00:08:00] have through the work that we do.

Russell Grossman: I’ve always seen communications leadership as pointing it in kind of four directions.

Um, you’re obviously, you know, if you have a team, you’re obviously leading that team. Um, if you are counseling seniors, then you are leading them in the practice. Uh, if you are part of an organization like A A, B, C, when you have a leadership out to the profession. And then I think for peers who are non communications practitioners, there is a leadership role there, which allows them to understand the value of communications, uh, which is a leadership role that we often need to pedal.

I would say, um, in order that people do understand that the value of our practice, um, has, has value.

Robin McCasland: And I had another thought related to what you were talking about, Russell, which is. Many people who are not in our profession, but many people are promoted into roles in their organizations because of their technical [00:09:00] skill or what engineering, whatever it might be that they do.

But if they don’t have the other skills, then that be, can become a weakness for them. Um, and it, I’ve been talking about this with my own leadership and some others that I work with in my own organization and my team where there’s an opportunity to help that because communication in my estimation, and there are a lot of research studies and white papers and whatever, and it’s like, it’s so critical to ultimately how successful you can be.

Um, and so I just, I’ve seen it happen and I’m sure you all have as well, where somebody got promoted ’cause they were brilliant in one area, but when it came to communication, they were not, it was not, it did not come innately. They were introverted maybe, or maybe they’re just like, that’s not part of my role, that’s not why I was promoted.

And it’s like, oh, but it is part of your role now. And I think that’s something that they need to develop.

Shel Holtz: Well, as an interesting point, Robin, I’ve long wondered about the, the issue of, [00:10:00] of managers as communicators in organizations, as, as part of the process. Uh, I mean, I think they’re vitally important, but most managers were promoted based on their achievements as individual contributors.

They don’t necessarily have management skills, uh, which would include communication, which makes it a challenge to communicate consistently, uh, through managers. So, so I’m, I’m, I’m wondering how y’all think about the notion that being a communication leader means taking some accountability, some responsibility for the cultivation of, of managers, or a culture of managing in an organization.

Russell Grossman: I think that’s spot on shell. Uh, I think one of the things that we ought to be doing in communications leadership is understanding where individual managers in the organization are or, or are not [00:11:00] in their own communications leadership. The further up the, the, the, uh, the management entry you go, uh, the more likely it is that you need to be a good communicator.

Uh, incidentally, I, I’ve never described myself or people in my practice as communicators. Uh, my own view view is that the communicators are the managers. And as you observe in an organization, those people who have, if you like, being promoted for technical reasons, but not for their managerial ability, spotting those people out and if you like, triaging them, uh, based on the needs of the organization and reaching out to them to see how they can be assisted by you, I think is really quite important.

Yeah, teach ’em those soft

Shel Holtz: skills. Uh, any other thoughts on that from, from anyone? Sure. I mean,

Robin McCasland: no, go ahead, Mike. Go ahead.

Mike Klein: No, you go ahead. Okay. So I’m somebody who’s [00:12:00] always been a bit skeptical about the emphasis placed on the communication role of managers, because I often see, particularly in internal communication circles, a desire to default to management communication, because a lot of people believe that there’s research that says that managers are the preferred source of information.

Now, managers are a critical source of communication, particularly when employees feel insecure about certain things, about their jobs, about their work arrangements, about, you know, what’s going to impact them based on, you know, different agendas that they’re hearing about. But at the same time, I think. As much as it’s important to support managers in becoming more effective at communication, one of the key ways we do that, and it’s not emphasized nearly enough, is the extent to which we try to reduce the communication burden on managers to the absolute [00:13:00] minimum so that they can be used as effectively as possible.

And, you know, the stuff that’s not requiring a manager’s involvement gets shifted to other channels that are better safe for that.

Robin McCasland: That’s a, that’s a key point, Mike. And, and yeah, I understand and, and agree with what you’re saying. We also have looked at, like in my own organization, it’s a pretty large company.

We look at different surveys that are conducted, um, periodically throughout the year, and we look at. The how senior somebody is. So you’re an individual contributor, you’re a manager, you’re a director, you’re a vice president, whatever. We look at all these different things, um, and then we look at employee feedback about where you see a dip, where you see those leaders not buying into something or complaining about something.

And then we see same thing with individual contributors and in the open-end con uh, comments and how they’re responding to questions. It’s like there’s a gap. So you’re right. Maybe part of it is, is that the burden needs [00:14:00] to come off him. On the other hand, there’s still a very strong, uh, belief among rank and file employees that it’s like, I want more from that.

I need more from my supervisor or my leader. I’m not getting that. And it’s not, or it’s not being communicated. News is not being communicated consistently from that leadership level.

Sue Heuman: And so what you all are describing in my view, is really the role of the strategic communication leader within an organization.

You’ve picked up on those little pieces that need work, perhaps in the organization, individuals who need support, um, you know, corporate materials and things that can be used as templates and, and guidelines for them, whether or not you’re going to use the cascade method, which is a much debated, um, and time honored method of communication in an organization.

But all of these tactics in my mind really underscore the role of a pr, uh, strategic communication leader within an organization. [00:15:00] And that’s what we do. We assess the situation, we find the right tools and methods, we support people in leadership. That is the job of our strategic communication leader in my view.

Shel Holtz: I would, I,

Russell Grossman: go ahead, Rustin. And I was just, I’m just reflecting, uh, on what is the defactor role of that strategic communications leader to point out to the c the C-suite, perhaps managers a little bit further down the organization who could become even better leaders if they were better communicators.

Not necessarily with their teens, but perhaps for the organization, senior spokespeople, for example. Uh, or the way that they may interpret change, um, in transformation programs within their organization. Um, and I, I think one of the things about communications practitioners is we often have, particularly at a morethe level, but not necessarily so, not exclusively.

So we often have the run of the organization to be able to do that rather than if in a sense just, just be stood in our [00:16:00] box. And I think since we’re talking about communications leadership, I think that that proactive. Leadership from communications practitioners into the C-suite, I think is an a value add that we bring, even though we may not be asked for it all the time.

Shel Holtz: Yeah. My, my view on managers as communicators is that they are interpreters. Uh, they understand the situation on the ground where they work, uh, better than anybody else, uh, and are better positioned to explain change, for example, to their employees. How is this gonna affect us in this team? Uh, and they need to be equipped with the resources to help them do that.

Not just the training to help them communicate effectively in general, but the resources to help ’em communicate this. Change. Uh, for example, we have two manager publications that come out of the department where I work. One is monthly, [00:17:00] uh, and it’s called Manager Talking Points. And it starts with three or four bullets saying these are things that we would like you to emphasize with your teams in the month ahead.

Uh, and the other is, uh, is called manager briefing. Uh, they come out as needed and they’re single topic FAQs to help them answer questions that their employees may bring to them around, uh, a given change. Um, and I think. That if we’re going to be asking our managers to service translators or interpreters of messages are, are, are delivered, uh, from the, the top down, we need to be adept at doing that ourselves.

Uh, if you are the manager of, say, the intranet and you have two or three people who report to you, uh, isn’t it just as important that you be good at translating these messages, interpreting what’s coming from above so that people know how it affects them? [00:18:00] Uh, having those soft skills, uh, in, in your toolkit,

Russell Grossman: it’s even more important because actually it’s difficult to be a light unto others if you’re not a light unto your own un your own team.

I think it’s really important. Yeah.

Shel Holtz: By the way, uh, du Martin, whom I met at conference, uh, in, um, Vancouver, uh, in, in June, says, uh, love the idea of manager talking points and employee FAQ sent frequently, not just as is needed or when there’s a crisis. So there’s

Russell Grossman: that. You knew you knew when you’ve met Du Martin.

Martin.

Shel Holtz: That’s right. No question about that. Um, Sue, I, I, I, I wonder based on some conversation we had had before, uh, about how important it is if you are aspiring to a leadership role to, to speak the language of, of leaders. Uh, you know, I, [00:19:00] since we all come up as individual contributors and what we do is sort of a, a crafty, um.

Uh, occupation. By that I mean we’re engaged in the craft of writing and producing collateral and things like that. Uh, we tend to speak the language of that craft. Um, and, and when promoted, you know, you go into leadership and you talk about hits and, and views and, you know, letting and kerning and what have you, uh, that does not resonate, uh, or inspire a lot of confidence in, in your leadership abilities with, with leaders.

So what do. Communicators need to understand about speaking that language of leadership.

Sue Heuman: Yeah, absolutely. Shell, you know, I started going to IBC World conference, I don’t know, like 25 years ago. And, and even before then, the, the topic of, you know, how do we get a seat at the table? I mean, my goodness, it’s still.

Is discussed today. Um, and the [00:20:00] real answer is demonstrating your value to senior leadership. And then to do that, you need to speak the language of business. So you need to be able to talk about, uh, performance metrics and measurable objectives that actually contribute to the organization, not just to your comms plan outcome, right?

You have to be able to say, this is how we’re gonna move the needle on important issues for the organization. You need to talk about ROI, you need to talk about investment. So using the language of business when you’re in those boardroom meetings or in your correspondence with senior executives really demonstrates that you understand.

What keeps them awake at night and the, how communication is contributing to solving those issues.

Robin McCasland: And the, the thing I would add to that, um, I coach some other organizations that come to me in various ways within the company. ’cause they wanna understand that better. So they’re not people in my own organization necessarily, but what I always remind him is too, is [00:21:00] beyond everything that Sue said, which I agree with wholeheartedly, is leaders are different.

Um, maybe they’re not, but I mean, they’re, they have their own responsibilities and things that they have to deal with on a daily basis. And so when I’m coaching people on how you’re gonna approach this, I’m like, okay, if they tell you, you. Their assistant or what tells you you have 30 minutes, assume you have 15 and you better get to the point out front.

Like, like in our organization, I’ve said this before, we use Axios Media Smart brevity for how we communicate with employees works really well. They’re, they are totally down with it. We’ve been doing it for almost six years. Um, but when you’re presenting it’s the same thing. It’s like, don’t go in shelter.

Your point where it’s like, you know all the stuff and you’re so involved in it and you’re so passionate about it and you’re like, I wanna tell you everything and all the back step to how we got to this recommendation. And it’s like, no, tell me up front what your recommendation is and then gimme the key points about how, why this is gonna matter to a senior leader, how it’s going to impact the organization cost.

All those things that are critical. [00:22:00] And then you have all that detail in the back of your head. So when you only have this few minutes, ’cause you wouldn’t inevitably get cut short. You can answer those questions, but it’s like you have to learn to think differently about how you are when you are in the presence of a senior leader.

Sue Heuman: This is so true, and I can recall a few years ago I was asked by, by, uh, someone in the C-suite who had to make a presentation to their colleagues at the boardroom table, and they were told they could only have six slides. They came to me with like 30 slides and I helped them edit it down to six slides.

Got to a point, the, the manager had all of the detail, to your point, Robin, as as sort of back pocket notes. But when you are presenting to senior leaders, get to the point, get to what’s, what’s in it for me from their perspective. Um, and, and don’t talk a lot about hits and, you know, communication metrics.

Talk about how you’re gonna help them solve their problems.

Russell Grossman: In order to do that and assume, uh, Robin, [00:23:00] absolutely. Right. Of course you need a good insight into what their problems are, and particularly if you are in, say, a technical business, um, one similar to mine, I suppose, uh, which is mostly focused on a kind of engineering and regulation and the like.

You need to understand the language of that business specifically. And the earlier that you can do that, the earlier you can make an impression. Uh, and, uh, it is interesting to see how people do respond much more positively when you talk to them in their own jargon, uh, but obviously in a way that you understand it,

Mike Klein: acknowledge in your own.

Managing your own onboarding is absolutely critical in that, in that type of situation, because no one’s necessarily going to teach you that lingo. And particularly if you’re coming in from another organization, you may be very well trained in standard business terminology or, you know, standard KPIs or standard issues.

But if you’re moving into something [00:24:00] that’s, you know, for example, rail regulation as, as Russell’s been involved with, you’ve gotta be able to learn those specifics quickly and you can’t necessarily expect the person above you to train you in all.

Shel Holtz: Yeah. Although, you know, with the, the, the coaching trend in management, uh, I think there’s an increasing expectation that a manager will do that.

Uh, but, uh, two, two quick thoughts. One, uh, and this. I, I was glad to hear you say this, Sue. Uh, I was just listening to a podcast, uh, on my drive home yesterday, uh, in which Christopher s Penn, I don’t know if, uh, you all know Chris Penn, uh, just sort of casually mentioned, uh, ROI and, and made the point that if you’re talking about ROI, you’re talking about money, uh, don’t use that term if you’re not talking about money.

And I think a lot of, uh, communicators tend to use it very generically as this is the benefit that is accrued as a [00:25:00] result of what we have done. This is the ROI of our campaign. And if you say that at a board table, uh, when you leave, uh, they’re gonna go, he doesn’t know what ROI is. Right? Is there a very specific accounting formula for, for ROI, uh, and uh.

The other thought was just a, a quick story that I, I feel compelled to share, uh, based on the, the, the conversation about CEOs and what they want to talk about. I did have a CEO once where, uh, and this was many, many years ago, um, but it was a Fortune 400 company. And I took in the, the tissues for the design of the annual report that year.

Uh, and what we were looking for was his, uh, buy-in into the theme, uh, and the concept, uh, that was going to anchor everything that we were going to write in the annual report. And he put on his reading glasses and he looked at it very carefully. I was sitting there with the designer next to me and he looked [00:26:00] up and he said, there’s too much space between the lines.

This, this was the CEO who actually did care about the wedding. Uh, there, there was one.

Sue Heuman: I, uh, I actually had somebody try and re read Lauren Ipsum once, uh, presented a concept. So, yeah. What language is this? Um, it’s not,

Robin McCasland: yeah, we, I worked with the CEO once a long time ago. Well, when, that long ago. Uh, where, um, and he literally said this, when communication was written for him, um, you know, we would do, you know, single space, da da da, da da.

And he’d go in and he’d be like, I don’t know who’s writing this, but there needs to be two spaces between sentences. And we politely tried to explain that. That ended a long time ago. And he goes, no, no, no. I was in the AV club in high school and I, and I learned about journalism too, and I know, and we were just like, oh my God.

So we literally, I love that word. Literally, we sent out his messages with two spaces. We didn’t do it in anything [00:27:00] else, but that’s what he wanted. And we could not convince him otherwise. So.

Shel Holtz: That’s amazing. And,

Russell Grossman: and that also points to the issue. We, we talked quite rightly about, you know, understanding the language of your business and the language of business, but also if you are canceling senior leaders, CEO, the managing director, you need to know what also is bugging them at the, at the minor level, whether it’s the letting on the paper, whether it’s the font, whether it’s the color.

I once worked for a gentleman, uh, I wouldn’t say who it was, but he was a very senior person, uh, who insisted on a two and a half inch margin on the left hand side of all scripts that were presented to him so he could put what were called in the business inky blues together. And that’s how it was, and that’s what he wanted.

The point here being that if you, although these may seem minor irritants, if you don’t overcome those, you’ll never get to the bigger stuff that you want to cancel or advise on, because they will always be irritated by something that happens to be in their little [00:28:00] set of foils.

Shel Holtz: Important to get to know them and what their preferences are, uh, in, in terms of being strategic.

Uh, how important is it to accommodate what you know about executive biases and preferences, uh, versus being bold and, and going in with what you know will work as you’re aspiring to that seat at the table, which is a whole other conversation that we can have, uh, maybe we will. Uh, but if that, if that is the aspiration, uh, how, how do you treat your, your, your proposals, your strategic plans, uh, for the business?

Sue Heuman: I like to, uh, I like to present my very best work. Um, and then see if. It matches with the expectations of the leader. If the leader has something specific in mind, I try and understand why, what outcome are we [00:29:00] trying to achieve with that particular, whether it’s a tool, whether it’s a, a color of the rainbow, God only knows what is it you’re trying to achieve.

And then see if we can either compromise or at least have that person hear me. Um, you know, at the end of the day, it’s their money, honey. So, um, you know, if they really want you to do something, you know, and, and you’re, it’s not the best practice from your view and you’ve made your case, then you just kind of have to, you know, do it.

But I feel like you have to at least be heard, uh, and present things in a way that they will hear you and respect your expertise and give it full consideration before they make a decision

Robin McCasland: and everything aligned with the business direction and the prior, like everything you do. 99% of the time is tied to what the company is trying to achieve.

What’s the, what’s the business trying to achieve? What is this division trying to achieve? And showing that your communication is focused on those [00:30:00] opportunities to help support whatever it is they’re trying to achieve. Any, I won’t say anything else. There are times when you’re doing other things, but most of the time it’s aligned with what the business wants to achieve and that usually gets their attention.

Russell Grossman: I think this is a fundamental point. Um, actually, so the first rule of communications is to listen and, uh. Then to apply and through that to influence. And ultimately where I think you want to get to here is to influence your C-suite or your managing director or whoever it is, in what you believe is right, but also recognize from what I was also said earlier and the bit about good grace, that they may have some ideas which are possibly worth incorporating as well.

And so particularly if I go into a room and I have the opportunity to listen first rather than talk, I’ll always do that. ’cause it allows you to tailor your comments, remarks, approach to the audience, and through that come, come [00:31:00] at it to with them as a partnership. Uh, and through that then influence their influence, that partnership through your own ideas, what you believe is right, et cetera.

Uh, but I, I think it, it’s a, it is a fundamental issue in strategic communications that I don’t believe that we should go in and, uh, insist on an idea just because we think ours is the only idea.

Robin McCasland: I’ll add one thing of it, while Shell was saying was asking about it, but if you’re asked, so you’re doing what you’re doing right and you’re sharing what you’re sharing, um, and I’m sure you’ve all had these opportunities as well.

If somebody says, well, what about this? I have some off the wall. And it’s like, you have an idea. That’s when you speak up with that, you know, it’s not that you don’t have other opportunities, but it’s like they just opened the door for you. And if you have that idea you wanna push that you didn’t think would fly before, and it’s well articulated and again aligned with business, but maybe it’s a little atypical for what you would typically do, that’s the time to do it.

They’re [00:32:00] asking you, they’re inviting you for that feedback. Generally. I have found that’s a good time to do that.

Mike Klein: Well, there, there’s, there’s another way to go about it, particularly if you don’t have a lot of face time or conversation with, with the leader or with the leadership group. What I use sometimes, and I’ve, I’ve often had decent success with this.

Is draft something or prepare something from two different angles, angle one being what you think the leader will accept, what you think, you know, where you think their, um, same threshold is if you will, um, their comfort zone on a particular topic. So provide that version, but also provide an alternative version, which would be what I call the what would you do if you had that person’s role version, which would be a bit bolder, a bit more ambitious, and in a potentially could, um, in a provoke some sharper thinking or, [00:33:00] or or more ambitious positioning on their part.

What I found is when they see, and I wouldn’t do this all the time, obviously, but where they see the gap between the two. Either they’ll go in another direction or they’ll go at least somewhere between the more conservative version and the more ambitious version. Occasionally they’ll go with the more bitch ambitious version, in which case you as a communication leader have actually moved the needle in the organization.

Shel Holtz: Uh, we have a comment from, uh, Miko, uh, one of our regular viewers. Uh, good to see you Miko. Uh, thanks for all the great advice. Can you share your top communications tip for business leaders who are trying to forge partnerships with other organizations, whether businesses, schools, or community groups?

Community

Mike Klein: outreach,

Shel Holtz: each

Sue Heuman: I, you know,

Mike Klein: so comment about [00:34:00] listening is a really good starting point. What is it? They’re, they want get out of that partnership. Um, is it money? Is it sponsorship? Is it. Um, political clout, what have you. Um, because you know, once you get what they’re interested in, then you could figure out what it makes sense for you to contribute to, um, to help them achieve their goal in a way that forwards your agenda as well.

Robin McCasland: I would say also you meet a need that, you know, that maybe they haven’t even brought up. So, for example, I, and I realize healthcare is, is handled very differently in different countries, uh, in my organization because we’re in the health insurance space. Um, and I’m really proud of this. Our company has invested millions and I mean.

Millions of dollars in things that will support the community for people who, um, are underserved, who may not have access to health insurance or the opportunity to even have an annual physical or just get their vital [00:35:00] basic blood work, the basic stuff checked. We invest in areas where they have food deserts in other, to try to get more nutritious foods into areas where that’s a problem.

Um, we have. Spent a lot of money in the, in the states that we serve on free fitness courts that anybody can go to in a city park. We do. And we, and we mean what we say when we do that. Um, we, uh, our own government relations people go into the communities because they wanna understand if they’re trying to represent us at the federal level, they wanna understand and hear from people directly.

And they have good relationships with our, um, our, uh, plans that have relationships there. So, um, I think that’s someth