Adventist Voices by Spectrum: The Journal of the Adventist Forum

The president of Seventh-day Adventist Kinship International talks about what pride means to him. We discuss how it’s different from the biblical vice of ego and about how some Christians don’t understand what conversion means in terms of sexuality, orientation, and spiritual maturity. See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

An interview with Marianne Thieme, Dutch political leader, convert to Adventism, and environmental activist. With others, she founded the Party for the Animals in 2009 and was its chairwoman from 2002 to 2010. An attorney who has studied at the Sorbonne and recently at Newbold College, she won election every two years allowing her to serve in the House of Representatives from 2006 until she resigned in 2019. Marianne is now working on a PhD with the goal of drawing on biblical social ethics and Adventist vegetarian thought as she expands her eco advocacy around the world. See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Filmmaker Kyle Portbury talks about his film, The Hopeful, which tells the early Adventist story for any audience. The film premiered on 900 cinema screens across North America. In this second part of our conversation, Kyle shares his creative vision and discusses why storytelling matters. See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Filmmaker Kyle Portbury talks about his film, The Hopeful, which tells the early Adventist story for any audience. The film premieres on 900 cinema screens across North America on April 17 and 18. Kyle shares how the film came to be and some details about the aestheic and narrative choices he made. The Hopeful is the true story of a community whose lives were transformed as they learn what it means to truly wait for Jesus. This sweeping drama, set in 19th century New England, invites audiences of all ages to imagine how hope can change the world. In this story the audience sees blossoming the seeds of a new global movement of faith—the Seventh-day Adventist Church. Get tickets here: The Hopeful See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

On March 27, 2024, “Testament: Story of Moses” premiered on Netflix. Spectrum correspondent Kevin McCarty interviews series producer Kelly McPherson about the docudrama approach. By using a docudrama (documentary and drama) approach, the viewer is led through the Exodus account in a vivid fashion, while also receiving wisdoms and insights from passionate scholars, theologians, and historians. These speakers represent all three traditions that hold Moses as a prophet, being the Jewish, Christian, and Islamic faiths.By engaging with the story in this manner, McPherson hopes to cause emotional responses in the viewer. For those who may not already know the story to see the enduring quality of it, showing why it still speaks to something within us to this day. And to add new layers and surprises for those who think they might know this epic story.Grounded in the humanness of Moses, this fresh look into one of the most epic stories of all time brings together many elements of storytelling in a new way. The result is an incredible journey for both newcomers and those returning to Moses’ story. See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Historian and retired university president Eric Anderson discusses next steps after the Ellen White working conference last fall at Pacific Union College. He discusses the meanings behind the joint statement and makes an argument that appreciating her writing as devotional offers Adventists a way forward. See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is the third in a three-part series on Sex, Love, and Purity Culture. This episode focuses on next steps in growth and development past Purity Culture. Sofia, Ari, and Kendra are joined by Ezrica Bennett, who graduated with a BS in Biology from Oakwood University. She recently received a Princeton University grant for her ministry work with young adults at Loma Linda University Church. See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is the second in a three-part series on Sex, Love, and Purity Culture. This episode focuses on the creation of purity culture as well as the history and political ideology behind it. Sofia, Ari, and Melodie are joined by Christina Cannon, who studied at Wycliffe Hall/ University of Oxford and graduated in 2023 in the Scholars Program at Southern Adventist University with a BA in History. See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This begins a three-episode conversation about the history, theology, and personal impact of purity culture. Although rooted in socioreligious mores that pre-date the term, purity culture emerged in the 1990s as an evangelical Christian cultural movement. It continues to influence Seventh-day Adventist understandings of dating and marriage, sexual expression and gender identity as well as female modesty and male headship.This limited series, “Sex, Love, and Purity Culture,” introduces our next-gen video podcast called Youth Group which seeks “to look without prejudice at all sides of a subject, to evaluate the merits of diverse views, and to foster intellectual and cultural growth.” That is also a quote from the founding mission statement written on the opening page of the inaugural issue of a journal named Spectrum over fifty years ago. That commitment to creating community through conversation continues today with:Kendra Arsenault, who studied International Development & African American Studies at UCLA and earned an MDiv in Professional Chaplaincy from the Seventh-day Adventist Theological Seminary at Andrews University. She has created several popular podcasts and works at Stanford University Medical Center.Ari Bates studied film at Southern Adventist University and is the Creative Director of Aberration Film Studios in Portland, Oregon.Sofia Lindgren graduated in 2023 with a BA in Business Administration from Pacific Union College. She is Spectrum’s Office Manager.Melodie Roschman earned her PhD in English from the University of Colorado, Boulder. Her dissertation is on “Identity, Counternarrative, and Community in Progressive Christian Women’s Memoir.” She was editor of The Student Movement at Andrews University and graduated with a BA in English and Journalism in the J. N. Andrews Honors program. See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Seventh-day Adventist judge Daniel Nsereko has lived a remarkable life: from humble beginnings in a small rural village in Uganda, to the highest levels of international law in The Hague where he served as a judge on the International Criminal Court (ICC). In this interview he shares his educational and professional journey as well as the moment his ethical consciousness was awakened. See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Pastor Claval Hunter leads the Berean Transformation Center, a Seventh-day Adventist Church in South Bend, Indiana. He shares how engaging his community on social and political issues transformed his congregation and added missional energy and baptisms.Born in the Bahamas, Pastor Hunter served as the Director of Urban Ministries for the Lake Region Conference of Seventh-day Adventists. He is currently serving as Associate Director of the Andrews University Center for Community Change. He holds a BA in Ministerial Theology from Oakwood University and a MDiv degree from the Andrews University Seventh-day Adventist Theological Seminary. See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

I interview Hanz Gutierrez about his retracted theological teaching endorsement by the General Conference’s International Board of Ministerial and Theological Education. Gutierrez is a longtime Spectrum columnist and chair of the Systematic Theology Department at the Italian Adventist Theological Faculty of Villa Aurora. He recently wrote about the lack of communication and process in this surprising move by the IBMTE and we discuss his experience and his ideas in this special episode. See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

In the gritty neighbourhoods of Sydney, Australia, Nimrod faced the stark challenges of racial discrimination. Battling racial profiling and mistreatment by white law enforcement, his refuge came when he was invited to his white girlfriend's church. It was within this community that Nimrod discovered God hadn't abandoned him; instead, the church embraced him completely. Fuelled by these transformative experiences, Nimrod dived into theology, ultimately becoming a pastor and currently leading at Church in the Valley. “They bought into my leadership because I learned in university that you can’t truly be who you are when you get out into ministry. Because it’s governed by white men, it’s led by white men, and as a Samoan, there’s no conference where I look at and there’s been a Samoan president, we’re rare, so you can’t dream for that because you don’t see it [in Australia].” See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Elizabth Pule started her career journey aimed at becoming a lawyer, when an unexpected mission call changed her mind. With support from the Ontario Conference she attended Andrews University to then return to her home church as a pastor. Having had various opportunities as a chaplain, and ministry director, Elizabeth now pastors at the College Heights Church located on the Burman University campus. “I do believe the inclusion of all individuals who are neurodiverse is so important to the body of Christ. We can’t ignore what the Bible says about every single one of us has been gifted a specific role and gift, and we all matter in that body of Christ. I do believe there are forgotten parts in the body of Christ. We need to amend that.” See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

The Iron Claw (2023) director and writer Sean Durkin talks with Alexander Carpenter about the meaning in his film. In theaters now, the saga of the Von Erich professional wrestling family stars Zac Efron as he seeks to break the tragic curse of his name. The film includes a heaven-like scene of fraternal reunion, and Durkin discusses the mythological references as well as why he thinks wrestling helps us understand the human condition. See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Born and raised in Washington, D.C., Alex now serves as Sligo Church’’s senior pastor. He came to understand God from among diversities of cultures around him while seeing church as a community of God in location. In his academic work and leadership role, Alex seeks to celebrate his past and honour his mother as sources of identity. “Part of being human gives us the complexity to say maybe religion isn’t just reading something or understanding it, but it’s smelling it, it’s tasting it, it is moving or non-movement and that the world is truly such an enormous neighbourhood.” See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Growing up in Kenya, Jeanne was confused by God’s calling into pastoral ministry, as she never knew women could be any kind of church leader. With time spent in the USA during her university years, Jeanne came to see the unique ways God equips people for the work He has planned. Returning to Kenya with her Ph.D in urban planning and development, yet choosing instead to be known as pastor Jeanne. “I’m so grateful to God that He took me out of the environment in which I was raised. I loved the environment I was raised in, because it created a wonderful, strong foundation for me in my Adventist faith. However, I was a good Adventist, but I was not a good Christain, and there’s a great distinction between the two.” See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Growing up in Washington State, Anthony saw two very different cultural sides to Adventism. With a move to Seattle so his father could pastor a mainly black church, Anthony realized how much of his image of church was based off of “white suburbia.” This awakening forced him to search out his own blackness and what it might mean to be Caribbean. “I think this is a borderline universal fear, it’s that fear, like what if I’m myself in front of this new group of people and they don’t accept me? What if I bring my true self, as I actually am, not a projection, but the real me, will I be accepted? Will I be loved? Will I be enough?” Check out Anthony’s podcast as they ask “What is an Adventist?” Seeking What They Sought Link Tree: https://linktr.ee/seekingpodcast See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Dr. Courtney Ray started her academic career with a double major in theology and psychology, becoming an ordained minister of the Adventist church. She now works as a neuropsychologist with her private clinic in the Eastern United States, along with leadership roles within her local church and the Society for Black Neuropsychology. “I think that you honestly have to disconnect yourself from logic to both be an Adventist and say that women cannot be in ministry. There’s no coherent argument that allows you to hold both those things at the same time.” See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Greg Hoenes is a career pastor with more than 25 years of ministry experience in the Central and Southern California Conferences. He became the West Region Director of the Southern California Conference in 2015, where he still serves. Since 2013, Greg has also served as an Adjunct Professor of Pastoral Studies at La Sierra University. He earned a PhD in Practical Theology at Claremont School of Theology in 2021, focusing in the area of food, ecology, and religion/spirituality. He also studies the ways that racial categorization, racism, and the construct of “whiteness” connect to ecologies of land and environment, humans, and animals. See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

I grew up watching Mutual of Omaha’s Wild Kingdom TV shows featuring Stan Brock. In this Adventist Voices conversation I talk with Paul Michael Angell, the director of Medicine Man, a new documentary on Brock’s adventurous life and later altruistic work leading Remote Area Medica providing free medical care for underserved communities. I also interviewed the RAM CEO Jeffery Eastman about the incredible work the organization and how they translate Brock’s radical values into a sustainable model for connecting volunteers with people in need. The 1 hour and 36 minute award winning film premieres on November 14 in theaters across North America See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Hailing from Eastern Canada, with time spent as a chaplain in Western Canada. Ben now works as the youth pastor at La Sierra University Church. By being connected to and inspired by, his Ghanaian roots, he creates safe spaces for cultural minorities. “The reality of humanity, that we can be part of an organization, Christianity or Adventism, that is Christ centered and yet does not prioritize people … We can have a cognitive dissonance between being Christian and following the sacraments, or the flow of tradition and also never really care about all people at all times.” See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Pastor Iki currently serves as the first lead pastor of colour for the La Sierra University Church. With his Tongan background & stories of being an undocumented immigrant, he boldly expresses his full self so others may likewise do so. “I don’t know that it’s said out loud, but white church, white academics is seen as very high. Sometimes, ethnic churches are seen as secondary or not quite as, right? And that’s problematic.” See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Alaska Region Director of Ethics for Providence Health & Services, Mark F. Carr, MDiv, PhD, studied with James Childress, PhD, one of the world’s premier “principles-based” bioethicists at the University of Virginia. He mastered competencies in Jewish, Christian, Islamic, Philosophical, and Bio, ethics, focusing his dissertation on moral decision making methods in clinical contexts. In addition to the chapter he contributed to A House on Fire, he wrote and helped edit a number of books including, Passionate Deliberation: Emotion, Temperance, and the Care Ethic in Clinical Moral Deliberation and World Religions for Healthcare Professionals. As a professor at Loma Linda University he directed the Master of Arts degree in Clinical and Biomedical Ethics and served as the Theological Co-Director for the Center for Bioethics.ReplyForward See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Manuel is the founding pastor of Kalēo Adventist Church, a Spanglish congregation in the Glendale, California. He has a degree in Business Administration and MTS from La Sierra University, and is working on his DMin in Urban Ministry at Fuller Seminary.We discuss why being a Spanglish—mixing languages from the platform was a needed correction, how thinking theologically about “familia” helps grow congregational identity, and how Pastor Arteaga is able to preach social justice with boldness. See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Janice De-Whyte reflects on God’s priorities by looking at the failure of the religious community in Bethel. The conversation is based on her chapter in the book, A House on Fire: How Adventist Faith Responds to Race and Racism, which was edited by Nathan Brown and Maury Jackson. Nathan Brown and Lisa Clark Diller join Janice to explore these themes together.Janice De-Whyte, PhD, is Associate Professor of Hebrew Bible/Old Testament at the School of Religion, Loma Linda University. She is the author of Wom(b)an: A Cultural-Narrative Reading of the Hebrew Bible Barrenness Narratives. As a biblical scholar and clergywoman, Dr. De-Whyte’s research and teaching engages Scripture and its intersection with gender, race, economics, and health. She’s attended Newbold College (Bachelor of Divinity), Andrews University (MA Old Testament) and McMaster Divinity College (PhD Old Testament). See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

In the novel, Stillwater, by noted Canadian writer, Darcie Friesen Hossack, sixteen-year-old Lizzy is trapped, caught between her passion for science and the teachings of her Seventh-day Adventist father and Mennonite mother. In this conversation with her, profound Adventist author Trudy Morgan-Cole, joins me as we explore food, religion, Canadian regional lit, and what it’s like to create Adventist characters. Darcie Friesen Hossack is a graduate of the Humber School for Writers with roots in the Mennonite and Seventh-day Adventist communities. A career food writer and editor of the online WordCity Literary Journal, her short story collection, Mennonites Don't Dance (Thistledown Press), was a runner-up for the Danuta Gleed Award, and was shortlisted for the Commonwealth Writers Prize and the Ontario Library Association's Forest of Reading Evergreen Award for Adult Fiction. See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Drawing from his research for the first scholarly biography of this Adventist pioneer, historian Brian Strayer details the rise, decline, and mythology of Hiram Edson. He didn’t have visions, but “presentments.” Also, despite being the man who saw the heavenly sanctuary on October 23, 1844, Edson focused his interests elsewhere. He even quit going to church for a while late in life. Strayer grounds all this in the larger mid-1800s New York religious context where innovation, ecstatic expression, and social change were influencing what became the Adventist Church. See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

I interview Larry Geraty, president emeritus of La Sierra University, about the passing this week of Ron Numbers, historian of science, and Fritz Guy, professor of theology and philosophy. Larry reflects on each man’s legacy and shares anecdotes about what drove Numbers out of Adventism and what kept Fritz committed to the denomination. See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Bob Smietana has been senior editor of Christianity Today, religion writer at The Tennessean, correspondent for Religion News Service, and contributor to OnFaith, USA TODAY, and The Washington Post.In his conversation with Spectrum, he discusses his interactions with Adventism and what we could be going better. We also discuss the current landscape of Christianity that he researched for his new book, Reorganized Religion: The Reshaping of the American Church and Why it Matters. See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Michael Campbell discusses the connections between Adventism, fundamentalism, and race. He earned his PhD in Adventist history from Andrews University and currently serves at the North American Division as the Director of Archives, Statistics, and Research. He recently published the book, 1922: The Rise of Adventist Fundamentalism by Pacific Press. He is the founding editor of the forthcoming Oxford Handbook of Seventh-day Adventism. See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

I talk with best selling author Hugh Howey about the Silo TV series based on his novel series Wool. We discuss philosophy, apocalypse, and ways that stories can explore the human condition. See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Hosts Nathan Brown and Lisa Diller talk with Angela H Li, the Assistant Director of Adventist Chaplaincy Ministries (Pacific Region) for the North American Division of Seventh-day Adventists. She holds a PhD in Practical Theology and leads the Women in Chaplaincy Project. She is married with two young-adult children. See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Kayle de Waal taught New Testament studies at Avondale University College in Australia for many years. Before that de Waal served as a minister in the Kwazulu Natal Free State Conference in South Africa and the North New Zealand Conference where he earned his PhD from the University of Auckland. In 2021, he was named Director of Education and the Disciple Making Coordinator for the Trans-European Division. In this episode, he and host Nathan Brown, Book Editor for Signs Publishing Company, discuss de Waal's chapter, "Christ, Race, and Grace." See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Hosts Nathan Brown and Lisa Clark Diller talk with Maury Jackson about his contribution to the A House on Fire book. Jackson earned his DMin from Claremont School of Theology. He is Associate Professorof Practical Theology at the HMS Richards Divinity School at La Sierra University. He studies the intersection between theology in the public square and Christian witness, participation, appreciation activism and critical reflection. The tools of theological reflection, moral evaluation, and cultural investigation inform his study of ministry practice See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Ted Wilson’s nephew, noted writer Matthew Vollmer, discusses his 2023 book, All of Us Together in the End. In it he explores loss, family, and his own connections to Adventism. The chapter, “A Peculiar People” from Vollmer’s book, appears in the latest issue of the journal and on the website. A review of his work by Sari Fordham is also on the website. Vollmer holds a BA in English from the University of North Carolina, an MA in English from North Carolina State University, and an MFA in fiction writing from the Iowa Writers’ Workshop. A Professor of English, he is a faculty member of the MFA in Creative Writing program at Virginia Tech. See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Along with host Nathan Brown, guest Yi-Shen Ma discusses his chapter, "The Beast and the Matrix of Power" in A House on Fire: How Adventist Faith Responds to Race and Racism (2022). Yi Shen Ma earned his PhD from Claremont School of Theology and is an assistant professor of Religion and Ethical Studies at Loma Linda University. Ma is the co-director of the Center for Christian Bioethics and focuses his teaching and research on health equity, trauma-informed care, racism, and the social impact of economic inequality. See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Guest Matthew Korpman talks with hosts Nathan Brown and Claudia Allen about his chapter in A House on Fire, “Preaching a Black Christ: Doing Black theology with Ellen White.” Korpman has a Master of Arts in Religion (M.A.R. in Second Temple Judaism) at Yale Divinity School and is an adjunct professor of religion at La Sierra University. He is working on a PhD program (focused in New Testament) at the University of Birmingham. See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Claudia Allen serves as the Community Outreach Supervisor for the Howard County Office of Human Rights & Equity in Columbia, MD. After earning her BA in English and her minor in Leadership in 2013 from Andrews Iniversity, Claudia went on to Georgetown University where she subsequently graduated with her Masters in English in 2015. In addition to contributing a chapter to this book, she was the Online Content Manager for Message magazine and was a contributing author to Rev. Dr. Gayle Fisher-Stewart’s latest book, Preaching Black Lives Matter. See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

A graduate of La Sierra University, Matthew E. Burdette is a theologian and an editor at Convergent Books, an imprint of Penguin Random House. He holds a PhD in theology from the University of Aberdeen, having researched the theology of Robert W. Jenson and James H. Cone. He talks with book editors Maury Jackson and Nathan Brown about his contribution to the book. See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

In a collaboration with Spectrum and Adventist Peace Radio, Maury Jackson, DMin, Nathan Brown, and Lisa Clark Diller, PhD, launch a new series about Adventists and racism based on the book, A House on Fire: How Adventist Faith Responds to Race and Racism. Maury Jackson and Nathan Brown edited the book, which brings together a number of writers to analyze these critical themes. We are also excited to be distributing the series with Adventist Peace Radio which is doing the production work. See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Guest host Jeremy Gray talks with the team conducting research on ex-Adventists. They explore the survey process and preliminary results. Connected to North Carolina-based Elon University, the sociologists and psychologists share their findings on the experience of leaving as well as the perspective of those who no longer believe, but remain connected to Adventism for other reasons. https://blogs.elon.edu/eighthdayfreedom/sample-page/https://www.surveymonkey.com/r/6V63JBN See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

I talk with Academy Award nominated filmmaker Gianfranco Rosi about his new documentary on Pope Francis. It chronicles the first decade of the pontiff's travels in 53 countries as he represents his values on issues such as poverty, migration, environment, solidarity, and war. We discuss the definition of the contemporary prophetic voice and how the film explores how words and physicality convey spiritual power. See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Concluding a 5-part series with Don Casebolt on his book Father Miller's Daughter, we discuss Ellen White's statements about the papacy and Casebolt presents evidence for White's dependence on discredited historians for her statements that the Pope changed the Christian day of worship to Sunday. Casebolt also critiques Samuel Bacchiocchi's contributions to this belief. We conclude by exploring White's idea that masturbation (solitary vice) caused tuberculosis among many ills and was directly responsible for "killing tens of thousands" a year. See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Alex Aamodt shares insights from his week of watching the National Labor Relations Board hearing on the unionization efforts at Loma Linda University Health. He talks about the role played by representatives from the General Conference (David Trim and Bill Knott) who were sworn in to explain institutional structure and Adventist policy on unions rooted in Ellen White's writings. Drawing on the proceedings and his legal and historical research, Aamodt also details key definitions (students or employees), explains the difference between LLUH and LLUHEC, and provides perspectives from both sides: the physician residents/fellows and the arguments made by the lawyers representing LLUH. See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Don McAdams, PhD, discusses his legendary embargoed paper documenting Ellen White’s literary and narrative dependence on Protestant historians. After 50 years it has been published as part of a book titled Ellen White and the Historians: A Neglected Problem and a Forgotten Answer (2022). McAdams discusses how he discovered this issue in the 1970s, how the Ellen White Estate reacted, and why it is finally time for the Adventist Church to openly confront its “founding myth—not the inspiration of Ellen White, but her authority in all matters.” See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Japanese American writer, poet, culture critique, David Mura discusses his new book The Stories Whiteness Tell Itself, published by University of Minnesota Press, 2023. Mura grounds his work in historical and fictional narratives that whiteness tells society in order to uphold systems of Black oppression. We discuss his own family history of internment during WWII, James Baldwin, spirituality, as well as how the stages of grief connect to anti-racist awareness. See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Former Spectrum journalist, Adventist pastor, and then defense attorney, Thomas L. Dybdahl talks about his life and his new book. Published by The New Press, When Innocence Is Not Enough: Hidden Evidence and the Failed Promise of the Brady Rule tells several gripping tales of crime and the wrongs done to the falsely accused when prosecutors don’t share evidence. See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

We talk about Millerite O. R. L. Crosier who helped create the Sanctuary Doctrine. He later rejected it, Ellen White, and Adventism. This is part three of this Adventist Voices series with Donald Casebolt about his book, Father Miller’s Daughter (2022). See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Paul Mugane grew up in Kenya in a family that valued independent thought and Adventist faith. In Minnesota he received his MDiv from an ecumenical seminary and spent time teaching and pastoring in Adventism. Now he is an award-winning chaplain for Sharp Grossmont Hospital in Southern California. In this first of two conversations we explore his political and spiritual heritage and why he calls Adventism a mother. See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.